2014 Vizio Thread All models - Page 147 - AVS Forum
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post #4381 of 5936 Old 06-27-2014, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by venus933 View Post
The M552i-B2 is $899 on Amazon, not the E550i-B2 that Ronzo3 is referring to
oh jesus i was so excited for the price i didnt even look at the first letter. I agree about bigger size but the m series is just compelling. something about i need.

so should i just suck it up and get the m49?
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post #4382 of 5936 Old 06-27-2014, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by curiousmileo View Post
oh jesus i was so excited for the price i didnt even look at the first letter. I agree about bigger size but the m series is just compelling. something about i need.

so should i just suck it up and get the m49?
You can wait to see how TheCrow1994 likes his 49" M series, he just got his

Official 2014 Vizio Mxxx-Bx Series owners thread - Post 946

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post #4383 of 5936 Old 06-28-2014, 07:08 PM
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m65 vizio 2014, is the screen matte, semi gloss, or glossy?

thanks
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post #4384 of 5936 Old 06-28-2014, 10:57 PM
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The 70" P (P702ui-B3) is $2,599.99 (MSRP)

http://store.vizio.com/news/vizio-an...y-led-smart-tv
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post #4385 of 5936 Old 06-28-2014, 11:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Canaria View Post
The 70" P (P702ui-B3) is $2,599.99 (MSRP)

http://store.vizio.com/news/vizio-an...y-led-smart-tv

Was there some point in your linking to a PR from January that we've discussed in this thread long, long ago? (As in this 5-month-old post, for instance).

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post #4386 of 5936 Old 06-29-2014, 01:21 AM
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
Was there some point in your linking to a PR from January that we've discussed in this thread long, long ago? (As in this 5-month-old post, for instance).
Yes, someone was asking for the direct Vizio link with the price a few pages back and I inadvertently left out the quote link.

Edit, I tried to find the post I was responding to and I must have replied to a very old post as you pointed out.

Sorry for the confusion.

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post #4387 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 07:00 AM
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Farewell to Vizio

I purchased my 60” M series Vizio about a month ago, and since that time I have been trying to come up with color settings that give me accurate skin tones. I tried the CNET settings but found them to give everyone a sunburned look. So I have spent hours trying various combinations of adjustments to get the skin tones right. Although they might look good on one channel, changing to another channel they could be completely off, usually with a greenish tint. If I adjusted that to get the greenish tint out, the skin tones on other channels would have a reddish tint. Even on the same channel watching the same program I could see one person with good skin tones and another with unacceptable skin tones. I ended up using CNET’s 11-point white balance settings, but I didn’t use their Color Tuner settings, and tried making subtle changes to try and fix the problem. I ended up with settings that were decent, but not great, and that was still with my tint setting at -10. But there was still a significant difference from one channel to the next.

I have posted a number of times on these forums, hoping that someone would post settings that would fix the problem. On paper the specs for these sets are excellent, and I really hated to give up on it, especially knowing that it would be very difficult to come up with another set with a full array backlight. I even returned the first set I bought, hoping I just got a lemon, but the second set was the same.

I have a Sharp Elite that I purchased last year (before they stopped making them), and I realized that I had perfect skin tones on that set, regardless of what channel I was on. I also have had a number of Samsungs and have been able to get excellent skin tones. So I know it is possible. I just don’t know why it seems not to be possible on this set. Maybe a professional calibration could fix it, maybe not. Obviously the Sharp Elite was a much more expensive set, but I still expected the Vizio to be able to be adjusted to give me consistent skin tones.

But having spent way too many hours trying to get this color right, and finding myself about to settle, I noticed that Best Buy was selling out last year’s top of the line Samsung UN60F8000 for $1,800. Obviously this was a lot more money than I paid for the Vizio, and maybe it’s not a fair comparison since that set typically sold for almost $3,000 when it was an active sku, But I managed to get the last one in my local Best Buy and I set it up last night. With no tint adjustment at all and 5 minutes of minor picture adjustments I had perfect skin tones on all channels. After putting in CNET’s calibration for that set I’m getting a picture and skin tones that are absolutely perfect, and do not vary noticeably from channel to channel. And my tint setting remains at 0.

So although I’m not thrilled about spending an additional $700, there is just no comparison between the color accuracy I’m getting on the Samsung vs. what I was able to get on the Vizio. It really hurts to give up on this, not only because of the extra money I had to pay, but also because of an otherwise bright and sharp picture that the Vizio had. I don’t understand why I was unable to get consistent and accurate skin tones, but at some point you need to throw in the towel.

I expect that this will be my last post on this forum. I wanted to post this just in case there is anyone else struggling to get the color right on this set, and to let them know that, at least in my experience, it really isn’t you; it is the set. Maybe their P or R series will correct this, or maybe even a firmware fix could do it. But I knew that I would never be satisfied with the Vizio color, and I am even more convinced of that now that I have seen how good it really can be. I am sure that one of these days Vizio will come out with a set that solves this problem, and I have no doubt that one day I will be a Vizio customer again. But until then I’m going to have to pay a little more to get the color accuracy that I need.
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post #4388 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 07:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenatug View Post
I purchased my 60” M series Vizio about a month ago, and since that time I have been trying to come up with color settings that give me accurate skin tones. I tried the CNET settings but found them to give everyone a sunburned look. So I have spent hours trying various combinations of adjustments to get the skin tones right. Although they might look good on one channel, changing to another channel they could be completely off, usually with a greenish tint. If I adjusted that to get the greenish tint out, the skin tones on other channels would have a reddish tint. Even on the same channel watching the same program I could see one person with good skin tones and another with unacceptable skin tones. I ended up using CNET’s 11-point white balance settings, but I didn’t use their Color Tuner settings, and tried making subtle changes to try and fix the problem. I ended up with settings that were decent, but not great, and that was still with my tint setting at -10. But there was still a significant difference from one channel to the next.

I have posted a number of times on these forums, hoping that someone would post settings that would fix the problem. On paper the specs for these sets are excellent, and I really hated to give up on it, especially knowing that it would be very difficult to come up with another set with a full array backlight. I even returned the first set I bought, hoping I just got a lemon, but the second set was the same.

I have a Sharp Elite that I purchased last year (before they stopped making them), and I realized that I had perfect skin tones on that set, regardless of what channel I was on. I also have had a number of Samsungs and have been able to get excellent skin tones. So I know it is possible. I just don’t know why it seems not to be possible on this set. Maybe a professional calibration could fix it, maybe not. Obviously the Sharp Elite was a much more expensive set, but I still expected the Vizio to be able to be adjusted to give me consistent skin tones.

But having spent way too many hours trying to get this color right, and finding myself about to settle, I noticed that Best Buy was selling out last year’s top of the line Samsung UN60F8000 for $1,800. Obviously this was a lot more money than I paid for the Vizio, and maybe it’s not a fair comparison since that set typically sold for almost $3,000 when it was an active sku, But I managed to get the last one in my local Best Buy and I set it up last night. With no tint adjustment at all and 5 minutes of minor picture adjustments I had perfect skin tones on all channels. After putting in CNET’s calibration for that set I’m getting a picture and skin tones that are absolutely perfect, and do not vary noticeably from channel to channel. And my tint setting remains at 0.

So although I’m not thrilled about spending an additional $700, there is just no comparison between the color accuracy I’m getting on the Samsung vs. what I was able to get on the Vizio. It really hurts to give up on this, not only because of the extra money I had to pay, but also because of an otherwise bright and sharp picture that the Vizio had. I don’t understand why I was unable to get consistent and accurate skin tones, but at some point you need to throw in the towel.

I expect that this will be my last post on this forum. I wanted to post this just in case there is anyone else struggling to get the color right on this set, and to let them know that, at least in my experience, it really isn’t you; it is the set. Maybe their P or R series will correct this, or maybe even a firmware fix could do it. But I knew that I would never be satisfied with the Vizio color, and I am even more convinced of that now that I have seen how good it really can be. I am sure that one of these days Vizio will come out with a set that solves this problem, and I have no doubt that one day I will be a Vizio customer again. But until then I’m going to have to pay a little more to get the color accuracy that I need.
How, by guess and check? Buy a $200 meter if you are that particular about your colors. I don't see how you can blame the set for your inability to properly calibrate it. Reviews have shown that the color can be correctly calibrated. Enjoy your new set. As an owner of 2 years ago top of the line 8000, I promise you these sets have many issues as well.

My ES8000 settings, calibrated with an i1D3 and calman: Standard Mode, Movie Mode (out of date, will update soon)
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post #4389 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 10:41 AM
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You vs the Vizio

Quote:
Originally Posted by kenatug View Post
I purchased my 60” M series Vizio about a month ago, and since that time I have been trying to come up with color settings that give me accurate skin tones. I tried the CNET settings but found them to give everyone a sunburned look. So I have spent hours trying various combinations of adjustments to get the skin tones right. Although they might look good on one channel, changing to another channel they could be completely off, usually with a greenish tint. If I adjusted that to get the greenish tint out, the skin tones on other channels would have a reddish tint. Even on the same channel watching the same program I could see one person with good skin tones and another with unacceptable skin tones. I ended up using CNET’s 11-point white balance settings, but I didn’t use their Color Tuner settings, and tried making subtle changes to try and fix the problem. I ended up with settings that were decent, but not great, and that was still with my tint setting at -10. But there was still a significant difference from one channel to the next.

I have posted a number of times on these forums, hoping that someone would post settings that would fix the problem. On paper the specs for these sets are excellent, and I really hated to give up on it, especially knowing that it would be very difficult to come up with another set with a full array backlight. I even returned the first set I bought, hoping I just got a lemon, but the second set was the same.

I have a Sharp Elite that I purchased last year (before they stopped making them), and I realized that I had perfect skin tones on that set, regardless of what channel I was on. I also have had a number of Samsungs and have been able to get excellent skin tones. So I know it is possible. I just don’t know why it seems not to be possible on this set. Maybe a professional calibration could fix it, maybe not. Obviously the Sharp Elite was a much more expensive set, but I still expected the Vizio to be able to be adjusted to give me consistent skin tones.

But having spent way too many hours trying to get this color right, and finding myself about to settle, I noticed that Best Buy was selling out last year’s top of the line Samsung UN60F8000 for $1,800. Obviously this was a lot more money than I paid for the Vizio, and maybe it’s not a fair comparison since that set typically sold for almost $3,000 when it was an active sku, But I managed to get the last one in my local Best Buy and I set it up last night. With no tint adjustment at all and 5 minutes of minor picture adjustments I had perfect skin tones on all channels. After putting in CNET’s calibration for that set I’m getting a picture and skin tones that are absolutely perfect, and do not vary noticeably from channel to channel. And my tint setting remains at 0.

So although I’m not thrilled about spending an additional $700, there is just no comparison between the color accuracy I’m getting on the Samsung vs. what I was able to get on the Vizio. It really hurts to give up on this, not only because of the extra money I had to pay, but also because of an otherwise bright and sharp picture that the Vizio had. I don’t understand why I was unable to get consistent and accurate skin tones, but at some point you need to throw in the towel.

I expect that this will be my last post on this forum. I wanted to post this just in case there is anyone else struggling to get the color right on this set, and to let them know that, at least in my experience, it really isn’t you; it is the set. Maybe their P or R series will correct this, or maybe even a firmware fix could do it. But I knew that I would never be satisfied with the Vizio color, and I am even more convinced of that now that I have seen how good it really can be. I am sure that one of these days Vizio will come out with a set that solves this problem, and I have no doubt that one day I will be a Vizio customer again. But until then I’m going to have to pay a little more to get the color accuracy that I need.
>>...at least in my experience, it really isn’t you.

Yes it is you.
These sets cannot be calibrated properly by eye which appears what you have been trying to do. It has to be done using some type of equipment and S/W. Below is what I've been able to wring out of my 60" 2013 Vizio. It requires setting the RGB at each 10% interval. If you look at the bottom left number scale, anything below 3 is not visible to the human eye. The RGB is basically perfect across the gray-scale spectrum, hence excellent colors from scene to scene and channel to channel.
If a +$700 Samsung gets you proper flesh tones and you have the $'s to do so fine...By comparison, it would have only cost you around $200 for a pro calibration of your existing set...

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post #4390 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 11:39 AM
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I've been strongly considering an M-series (probably 55") but I'm also interested in the P-series. But since I expect to mostly use it with 1080P content I'm wondering how the 4K screen deals with it.

My understanding is that in general 4K displays will do some upscaling/upsampling, interpolating the 1080P pixels. However, is there ever an option to do straight nearest-neighbor scaling, such that one 1080P pixel becomes four (2x2) pixels on the display? Or for a 720P image, nine (3x3) pixels.

The reason that I ask is that in general, anything besides pixel-perfect nearest neighbor scaling results in blurring, which I try to avoid in games with pixel art. I would most likely want to connect a computer outputting 1080P (at 120Hz), so I would want to keep the image as sharp as possible. Basically I would prefer the "Blocking" outcome (left image) in this picture: https://s3.amazonaws.com/red_3/uploa...-artifacts.png

I realize the P-series isn't out yet so it's hard to say for sure, but my impression is that 4K TVs never allow this "blocky" scaling of 1080P content and always produce a blurrier image than a 1080P screen of the same size. However I also realize that the pixel density might be so high that the effect is hardly even noticeable.

I know this is a pretty obscure request, but does anyone have any thoughts or experience with this issue?

Along the same lines, I would expect 720P content to look better on a 4K display than on a 1080P display, due to the 3x integer scaling. Does anyone know if that's actually true?
I have not heard of any 4K TV that does not upscale from 1080p by doing linear 2x2 scaling.

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post #4391 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 01:23 PM
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I just bought the 42" M422i-B1 model from Costco. Right out of the box, the picture was nice enough not to require any immediate fiddling with the settings, although I don't consider myself a true audiophile. From viewing angle to motion blur, I have no complaints. App speed is acceptable to me, especially in comparison to the POS Charter cable box that sets the bar very low.

So far great ...

Until I hooked it up to my stereo through the RCA analog audio outputs. Whenever I turn the TV on or off, it sends a loud pop to my speakers. When I turn it off, a second pop is heard about 40-50 seconds after the first one! Do any of experience this with your Vizios, especially this model? I can't imagine this being a wiring issue with my setup. I suspect Vizio skipped on the circuit that supresses voltage spikes when power is turned on or off, or that circuit is defective in my unit. The second pop is perhaps from the TV "computer" powering off.

I could always mute the receiver whenever turning the TV on or off, but who wants that kind of daily annoyance? I am hoping one of you can tell me whether this is normal with Vizios, or at least this model, perhaps by trying out the analog audio outs. I am very tempted to return a TV that I find otherwise to be great
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post #4392 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 03:36 PM
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VIZIO 70 Inch M series 2014

Im ready to make a move on a large Vizio. I wanted to buy the 80 inch but decided not to when I learned that the 80 inch is still Razor LED as opposed to the Full Array. It seems that the only 70 inch Vizio's available are the 3D razor versions (BUZZER) Not...

I also seem to think the 65's are also out, at least according to Amazon...

And the M series lineup on the VIZIO site shows all the full array tv's AND the OLD 70 inch 3d...

HAS VIZIO DECIDED NOT TO MAKE A Full ARRAY 70 inch TV for 2014... BTW I did call vizio, the bumble head did not know was am M series was, so I hung up...
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post #4393 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by audiosanity View Post
I just bought the 42" M422i-B1 model from Costco. Right out of the box, the picture was nice enough not to require any immediate fiddling with the settings, although I don't consider myself a true audiophile. From viewing angle to motion blur, I have no complaints. App speed is acceptable to me, especially in comparison to the POS Charter cable box that sets the bar very low.

So far great ...

Until I hooked it up to my stereo through the RCA analog audio outputs. Whenever I turn the TV on or off, it sends a loud pop to my speakers. When I turn it off, a second pop is heard about 40-50 seconds after the first one! Do any of experience this with your Vizios, especially this model? I can't imagine this being a wiring issue with my setup. I suspect Vizio skipped on the circuit that supresses voltage spikes when power is turned on or off, or that circuit is defective in my unit. The second pop is perhaps from the TV "computer" powering off.

I could always mute the receiver whenever turning the TV on or off, but who wants that kind of daily annoyance? I am hoping one of you can tell me whether this is normal with Vizios, or at least this model, perhaps by trying out the analog audio outs. I am very tempted to return a TV that I find otherwise to be great

Haven't heard of people using RCA cables in awhile, so it may take some time to get a response. You may want to try and HDMI or Optical cable and at least that would tell you if it's the connection or not.


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post #4394 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by pr0230 View Post
Im ready to make a move on a large Vizio. I wanted to buy the 80 inch but decided not to when I learned that the 80 inch is still Razor LED as opposed to the Full Array. It seems that the only 70 inch Vizio's available are the 3D razor versions (BUZZER) Not...



I also seem to think the 65's are also out, at least according to Amazon...



And the M series lineup on the VIZIO site shows all the full array tv's AND the OLD 70 inch 3d...



HAS VIZIO DECIDED NOT TO MAKE A Full ARRAY 70 inch TV for 2014... BTW I did call vizio, the bumble head did not know was am M series was, so I hung up...

70" M series has not been released yet. No one knows of an ETA at this time. It could be days it could be weeks. The 65" should be making it's way to other retailers now as well. It's been available on Amazon
And Vizios site for the past week or two.


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post #4395 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 03:53 PM
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It's a little strange that the 70" hasn't shown up since they made the official "the M-Series is here!" announcement on the 10th; in it they said that everything was available now, except the 50" which would come "later".

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post #4396 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by michaeltscott View Post
It's a little strange that the 70" hasn't shown up since they made the official "the M-Series is here!" announcement on the 10th; in it they said that everything was available now, except the 50" which would come "later".

They could have dropped the 70 in favor of going only to that size in the P series. No one really knows


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post #4397 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 05:35 PM
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They could have dropped the 70 in favor of going only to that size in the P series. No one really knows


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I seriously doubt that. The June 21 public release had the 70 M series listed (as a FALD design) and as Michael Scott noted, Vizio pointed out to the media that only the mysterious 50" will come later. It should be noted the public release for the E series was out in February and certainly not all the sizes were out at that time.


Edit: I believe the 70" unit will have one more horizontal row (1x4) of zones for a total of 36 zones.

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post #4398 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 05:47 PM
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It should be noted the public release for the E series was out in February and certainly not all the sizes were out at that time.
Nor are all the E-series sets out yet for that matter.
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post #4399 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by ursa99 View Post
>>...at least in my experience, it really isn’t you.

Yes it is you.
These sets cannot be calibrated properly by eye which appears what you have been trying to do. It has to be done using some type of equipment and S/W. Below is what I've been able to wring out of my 60" 2013 Vizio. It requires setting the RGB at each 10% interval. If you look at the bottom left number scale, anything below 3 is not visible to the human eye. The RGB is basically perfect across the gray-scale spectrum, hence excellent colors from scene to scene and channel to channel.
If a +$700 Samsung gets you proper flesh tones and you have the $'s to do so fine...By comparison, it would have only cost you around $200 for a pro calibration of your existing set...

Ursa
Actually, there have been many reports from calibrators that the color accuracy is not able to be dialed in. What I've read mirrors my own experiences with my 39 inch E series, reds are too orange for example. The only way to alleviate it is to reduce color across the board (which de-saturates everything too much). The CMS appears to be hit or miss. I've come to live with the fact that my budget 39 inch TV simply isnt going to get good color accuracy. I was, however, able to easily calibrate grey scale using the 2 point adjustment:



I do however agree with you that dismissing a panel based upon eyeballing settings for flesh tones is not the way to go.

If the OP is in a light controlled environment - he made the correct choice moving over to plasma IMO.
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post #4400 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 07:00 PM
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I'm sorry, but this thread gives me a headache and has me reconsidering my decision to consider a Vizio.

Cheers, Dave
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post #4401 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by DoubleDAZ View Post
I'm sorry, but this thread gives me a headache and has me reconsidering my decision to consider a Vizio.

I'd hate to see how your fair in another thread then. If anything this thread has been slow and "uneventful" for the most part.


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post #4402 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 07:41 PM
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Actually, there have been many reports from calibrators that the color accuracy is not able to be dialed in. What I've read mirrors my own experiences with my 39 inch E series, reds are too orange for example. The only way to alleviate it is to reduce color across the board (which de-saturates everything too much). The CMS appears to be hit or miss. I've come to live with the fact that my budget 39 inch TV simply isnt going to get good color accuracy. I was, however, able to easily calibrate grey scale using the 2 point adjustment:



I do however agree with you that dismissing a panel based upon eyeballing settings for flesh tones is not the way to go.

If the OP is in a light controlled environment - he made the correct choice moving over to plasma IMO.
>>> Actually, there have been many reports from calibrators that the color accuracy is not able to be dialed in.

Hmmm, I must have missed those. Can you post a link or two?
I've had a very different experience. Too bad your E Series can't be dialed in properly.

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post #4403 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 07:45 PM
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To be honest, I was joking, at least about the reconsidering. But now that you mention it, I assume the experience would be pretty similar and still leave me wanting. So far, I don't think everyone has agreed on a single item other than value, and maybe not even that. I don't think I've seen a single post that hasn't been met with an opposing view and that's pretty exasperating. I guess I was expecting more consensus and I'm just not seeing it. Maybe I will when the 70" M-series finally gets released.

Cheers, Dave
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post #4404 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 07:53 PM
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Consensus and AVS don't go together if you've come looking for that this isn't the forum you've been looking for


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post #4405 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 08:39 PM
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Consensus and AVS don't go together if you've come looking for that this isn't the forum you've been looking for
Jeez, I've been a member of AVS for a long time and I find consensus all the time. Yes, there are arguments, but it doesn't take all that much to figure out who knows what they're really talking about. In that regard, the Vizio threads have been a bit of a disappointment, not that I'm unable to form an opinion I can live with after I buy. I'm just a bit surprised that there are so many folks participating who don't seem to know much beyond speculation. It's just a different experience than what I went through here when I bought my Hitachi 10 years ago. Of course, that could just be because everyone has an HDTV now and no one is afraid to express their opinion, informed or not. Like I said, after to 70" is released, maybe that part of the discussion will yield more than just speculation and arguments over the unknown.

Cheers, Dave
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post #4406 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 08:57 PM
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I think there is a different explanation. Hitachi wasn't a bargain brand.
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post #4407 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 09:01 PM
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You also have to remember Vizio has been considered "low" on the totem poll and this gets less of the "experienced" user feedback that Brands such as Sony and Samsung may get. I think "most" here are waiting for the P and R series. With those you may see more consensus and experienced user feed back. With the M and E I don't expect many users with meters etc giving is detailed "solid" feedback.

Give it some time and we'll probably start to see users slowly come out of the woodwork. With the cheap Plasmas still available these sets will also be in less demand from users as well.


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post #4408 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 09:39 PM
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Just a little off topic rant:
Do you think anyone actually gives a rat's ass if you're using Tap-A-Talk? Shut that #%^^%# banner off, please.

PS: That goes for you too!!!
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post #4409 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 09:40 PM
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C'mon man, he's got an iPhone! And he uses tapatalk!!!
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post #4410 of 5936 Old 06-30-2014, 09:56 PM
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2014 Vizio Thread All models

Actually NVM I'm just going to keep it on now since it gets your undies in a bunch.

Last edited by Ph8te; 07-01-2014 at 12:34 AM.
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