Panasonic Claims New LED-lit LCDs Match Plasma Quality at CES 2014 - Page 4 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #91 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 10:36 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Artwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Hoover, Alabama
Posts: 4,832
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 207
Everyone knows picture quality is worse than Plasma but we have experts around here trying to sell the new Panasonic LCD garbage!

The SALES FORCE at AVS never goes away--for many this is not an enthusiast's forum but a mediocrity laced Sales forum!

The same people try to sell SUB Edge Lit quality with the NEW LED Direct paltry 8 zone quality.

How bad does LCD have to get before even the SALES FORCE can smell it?
5150zx, francisford, ATC7 and 1 others like this.
Artwood is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #92 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 10:45 AM
AVS Special Member
 
mo949's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 3,010
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 408
I'm sensitive to sales bs and I don't see Mark trying to sell anything here...

I'm happy he's reporting things as he sees them while he's there (i wish he'd report even more, but he's reporting on a LOT - it takes time to write these)

Keep up the good work Mark.
mo949 is offline  
post #93 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 10:55 AM
AVS Special Member
 
smurraybhm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Down South
Posts: 1,743
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 235 Post(s)
Liked: 450
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artwood View Post

Everyone knows picture quality is worse than Plasma but we have experts around here trying to sell the new Panasonic LCD garbage!

The SALES FORCE at AVS never goes away--for many this is not an enthusiast's forum but a mediocrity laced Sales forum!

The same people try to sell SUB Edge Lit quality with the NEW LED Direct paltry 8 zone quality.

How bad does LCD have to get before even the SALES FORCE can smell it?

Surprising post/claim which seems out of character for you - still upset about the last two Alabama games? Dido on a job well done by Mark, it is helpful to have someone gathering information about A/V equipment at CES instead of connected crock pots and stoves that communicate with you which is the focus of other websites. How many fitness wearable devicies can be introduced at one show?

Panasonic 60VT60 (cal by DNice)
Denon 5200 w/ Outlaw 2200 Amps (3)
Ascend Acoustics Sierra 2s F/R & Horizon w/ RAAL Center; Sierra 1s Surrounds; HTM-200s Top Middle and PSB S5 Rear Surrounds; Dual SVS subs
Oppo 103; Onkyo HD-DVD; Apple TV & Roku Stick
Atmos coming soon and Dolby Surround isn't too shabby either.
smurraybhm is online now  
post #94 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 02:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Artwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Hoover, Alabama
Posts: 4,832
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 38 Post(s)
Liked: 207
I guess it's out of character for me not to be with the Sales Force?

Look--I'm not against anyone at CES relaying whatever information they can--I'm just against the sales force trying to sell LCD garbage that's getting worse and then acting like it is better--ALMOST Zt-60 or Kuro quality! What a joke!

I wish the Crimson Tide would have won but that doesn't make me blind to LCD or its sales force here.

Really Sales Force--do a little bit better job of deception--the pro LCD claims here are really getting ridiculous!
Artwood is offline  
post #95 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 04:18 PM
AVS Special Member
 
WaveBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 1,982
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinghai View Post

Hey guys don't you get it? They proudly make the claim because their new CEO cannot tell the picture quality difference between LCD and Plasma; and that's the reason he decided Plasma should go away! Ha Ha!

I watched one of the interviews, and the CEO(or whoever it was) didn't seem too confident in the beginning when asked about the LCD-plasma matching claim panasonic made earlier. then he went out of his way during the later portion of the interview saying that they CAN match plasma and that they're better.lol I have a feeling that Panasonic HAS made strides with LED, i'm sure the blacks will be fantastic and there being an improvement in motion resolution, but i don't think it will be 'quite' on par with last years ST60's blacks & motion, close, but not quite. And you know, if that's the case then i may be cool with that...

I read an article that these new 4k Panasonic sets have extremelely deep inky blacks and the motion from what the guy seems was an improvement over your typical LCD technology.....Not sure if motion interpolation was used in the footage though.

Now, lets say that the 4k Panels CAN match last years S60 in terms of blacks and motion, wouldn't 1080p content look worse being upsaled to a native 4k res? I don't WANT a 4k set, i don't need it, it's absolutely useless for me at this point until the next gen of videogame consoles hit in 5 more years.lol The thing is, in order to get the best core PQ you have to always get the best of the best models. I'd want the best 60" '1080' LED 2014 LED they have with 35ms of lag or less. I'd imagine a 4k set would cost an arm & a leg anyways.
WaveBoy is offline  
post #96 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 05:34 PM
Senior Member
 
Hawkmoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 419
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Mark-

Did you talk to them about the issues that plagued their first attempt at a 4k set? The 4 vertical banding lines that many felt was the support beams showing through the set? I LOVED the picture quality of the Panasonic 4k and compared to my Sony 4k I thought it looked a lot better, but those 4 vertical bands were too much of an issue that whenever the screen moved (sports, gaming, basically anything that caused the screen to move left or right) these lines would be very apparent. I went through 2 sets and others here on the forums also reported the issues.

I mainly am looking for a 4k that has Display Port for PC gaming on it. Panasonic seems to be the only company to offer this and if they fixed the banding issues and made improvement to color reproduction, motion then it looks like the set for me. The new Sony's will have HDMI 2.0, but no display port. I have 2 GTX TItans that cost me $1,000 each, I would rather invest only $1,000 more in the PC to make 4k at 60fps 100% feasible. As of today there is no GPU on the market or announced that supports HDMI 2.0, so for a PC gamer there is not option if you want a big screen 4k set up.

Thanks in advance for any input.

-Hawkmoon
Hawkmoon is online now  
post #97 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 05:38 PM
Senior Member
 
Hawkmoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 419
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

So lets just say that these new 4k Panny LED's CAN in fact perform just as good or extremely close to last years Top tier Panasonic plasmas in terms of black levels AND motion.....Yet wouldn't 1080p material look worse or slightly blown up being upscaled to 4k? I honestly don't want 4k, i don't need it since i sit 11 feet from a 60" and you have to be sitting closer than 8 feet at that size to even notice 4k. I'm already 3 feet farther away than the optimal1080p distance on a 60".lol 8 feet as it is, is wayyy too close for my liking. PLUS there isn't much 4K content available.

At this point, it's useless to me....It will come in handy with the Next generation of consoles no doubt because certain videogame genre's would be far more immersive when sitting pretty close to the screen(Think first person 'whatevers') so the higher resolution will make a land slide of a diffference. but for now 1080p is all that i need. and i fear, once again that their 1080p models wont match the core Picture quality of their 4K LED's and i also fear that it's going to be the lower end sets that have the least amount of lag with the crappiest picture. Us gamers get screwed over every year which equals to slim a** pickings.lol My choice of HDTV from last year would of been the Samsung 8500 due to it's LED-like Brightness, but it's 53ms is way too much lag for me. The ST60 would of been my second choice, but it's 70+ms is absolutely ridiculous. Meanwhile the VT60 boasts 47ms but even that is a little too much. So i settled with the S60 mainly because it does 34ms.

Panasonic Should make sure that their sets have some sort of dedicated mode or work around the extra processing to give us 2 frames or less of lag and ADVERTIZE it as a gamers set! yeesh.

If you are referring to the PS4/Xbox One, they both are really good system, but can barely handle 1080p as it is. Only a few games are 1080p and only one game, Forza Motorsport 5 on the Xbox One is 1080p/60fps. No way with the tech in those machines that they can pull off 4k.

-Hawkmoon
Hawkmoon is online now  
post #98 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 05:41 PM
Advanced Member
 
DamageMcRamage's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Wakefield, RI
Posts: 837
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 21
I will echo the sentiments in here as well: what a shame. In 2007 Panasonic launched their first 1080p plasma; the 50pz700u. I purchased it, and still use it to this day. While it can't compete with today's plasmas for features, it still rocks one heck of a picture. I did my part...I really tried to get everyone on the PDP bandwagon by clearing up misconceptions. Alas, we didn't try hard enough. Guess it's Samsung and LG for as long as they stay in the market.

I like Ice Cream!
DamageMcRamage is offline  
post #99 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 06:30 PM
AVS Special Member
 
WaveBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 1,982
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawkmoon View Post

If you are referring to the PS4/Xbox One, they both are really good system, but can barely handle 1080p as it is. Only a few games are 1080p and only one game, Forza Motorsport 5 on the Xbox One is 1080p/60fps. No way with the tech in those machines that they can pull off 4k.

As somebody who has been gaming since the 80's, i'm not a big fan of most of these modern videogames(mindless Broshooters by the dozen, overly violent & childish zombie smashers, bloated hollywoodized flashy interactive movie-games with kindergarten difficulty ect), I've got zero interest at this point in the PS4 or XBOX 1 regardless of how(durpty durp) powerful they are. I'm a big nintendo fan, and i usually play nintendo games anyways. Capcom and konami have turned into complete sh** however, dark times indeed. It's all getting rather stale for me, playing the same crap over and over with a new 'skin'
I'm sticking with nintendo's 3DS & Wii U(heck i would also get a dreamcast 2 if sega were back in the game) and that' that. But the Wii U only has a select few 1080p games, but that's expected because the system itself isn't that much powerful than an xbox 360.

Anyways, I find it mind boggling that the PS4 and XBOX 1 haven't made 1080p standard AND 60fps for their games. it's complete BS, Sony tends to overhype themselves and make bold claims that never see the light of day.

But yeah....So would 720p & 1080p games look worse on a 4k set vs a 1080p set?
WaveBoy is offline  
post #100 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 07:41 PM
AVS Special Member
 
WaveBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 1,982
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Looks like Panasonic's new flagship 4k LED has outgunned(aside from Motion resolution and Viewing Angles.) the mighty ZT60....Check out the link below. wink.gif

http://www.trustedreviews.com/panasonic-studio-master-4k-lcd_TV_review



"The blacked out demo room for the new panel was laid out with the ZT60 on the left, the new panel in the center and one of last year’s WT600s over to the right. The screens were simultaneously fed a combination of Japanese anime and (in yet another example of extreme bravery on Panasonic’s part!) the remarkably dark sequence at the start of Chapter 12 of the Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2, where Voldemort surveys Hogwarts from a hill at night with his army behind him. And what we saw from the new LCD panel was actually pretty amazing.

Shock part one concerns black level response. The new panel really did seem to match the black level response of the ZT60/65 – a black level response which, let’s not forget, was the first we’d deemed good enough to finally oust Pioneer’s KURO plasmas from their black level throne. This is all the more hard to comprehend given that the new LCD panel uses an IPS panel design – a design that’s not generally been associated with spectacular contrast in the past. The WT600 by comparison looked very washed out and grey.Panasonic Studio Master LCD
The new panel also matched the ZT60 pixel for pixel when it came to shadow detail. This is if anything even more remarkable than the black level response achievement because it proves that the new panel isn’t just unsubtly and unintelligently taking out all light from dark areas of the picture to achieve its deep black levels. The WT600’s darkest areas, by comparison, look almost completely hollow.And then there’s the new panel’s color response. As promised colour tones really do retain their richness, balance and naturalism even during the darkest moments of the Harry Potter sequence. So much so that they actually look slightly more dynamic than those of the ZT60/65 – a comparison that holds good during bright footage, too.

It’s not just with colour saturations that Panasonic’s new LCD panel actually outguns the ZT60/65 either. It also delivers dark scenes less noisily, with none of the green speckling noise you can see on the ZT60/65 if you get up close. Talking of noise, the new LCD panel also runs essentially silently avoiding the fan noise output by the ZT60.Although we’re not sure what motion processing settings Panasonic was using for the TVs in its demo, from what we saw the new LCD panel reproduced motion – especially camera pans – with markedly less judder than the ZT60/65 did. On the flip side, the new panel lost a little resolution with fast moving objects while the ZT60/65 did not. The ZT60/65 also delivered a wider viewing angle without losing colour saturation or contrast than the new LCD panel, though the IPS panel in the new model provides a markedly wider effective viewing angle than the VA-type panel inside the WT600.

As we finally emerged blinking into the bright lights of the main Panasonic stand, our minds were reeling over what we’d just witnessed. Before entering the booth we’d thought maybe Panasonic might be able to match plasma in some areas with its new flagship LCD panel. But the fact that this panel had just seemingly not only matched but even outgunned the mighty ZT60/65 in most areas of picture performance was just not something we’d been prepared for. Obviously we must remember that what we were shown wasn’t a completely finished TV sample. But if anything you’d expect picture performance to improve rather than get worse in the coming months. In short, Panasonic appears to have given itself a fighting chance of genuinely delivering on its outlandish claims to have matched plasma quality with its latest flagship LCD TVs. In any case, if this is what Panasonic can do within just a year of focussing more of its R&D activities on LCD, hopes have suddenly become seriously high for what thrills the brand’s plasma-free future might hold."
ATC7 and mo949 like this.
WaveBoy is offline  
post #101 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 07:50 PM
AVS Special Member
 
comfynumb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Northeast PA.
Posts: 4,804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

Looks like Panasonic's new flagship 4k LED has outgunned(for the most part) the mighty ZT60....Check out the link below. wink.gif

http://www.trustedreviews.com/panasonic-studio-master-4k-lcd_TV_review



I doubt it's that close and I'm betting my ST60
has better motion, off angle viewing and just about everything else. Never "trust" a website that has trust in the address wink.gif
comfynumb is offline  
post #102 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 07:51 PM
AVS Special Member
 
robnix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 113 Post(s)
Liked: 260
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

Looks like Panasonic's new flagship 4k LED has outgunned(aside from Motion resolution and Viewing Angles.) the mighty ZT60....Check out the link below. wink.gif

http://www.trustedreviews.com/panasonic-studio-master-4k-lcd_TV_review



"The blacked out demo room for the new panel was laid out with the ZT60 on the left, the new panel in the center and one of last year’s WT600s over to the right. The screens were simultaneously fed a combination of Japanese anime and (in yet another example of extreme bravery on Panasonic’s part!) the remarkably dark sequence at the start of Chapter 12 of the Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2, where Voldemort surveys Hogwarts from a hill at night with his army behind him. And what we saw from the new LCD panel was actually pretty amazing.

Shock part one concerns black level response. The new panel really did seem to match the black level response of the ZT60/65 – a black level response which, let’s not forget, was the first we’d deemed good enough to finally oust Pioneer’s KURO plasmas from their black level throne. This is all the more hard to comprehend given that the new LCD panel uses an IPS panel design – a design that’s not generally been associated with spectacular contrast in the past. The WT600 by comparison looked very washed out and grey.Panasonic Studio Master LCD
The new panel also matched the ZT60 pixel for pixel when it came to shadow detail. This is if anything even more remarkable than the black level response achievement because it proves that the new panel isn’t just unsubtly and unintelligently taking out all light from dark areas of the picture to achieve its deep black levels. The WT600’s darkest areas, by comparison, look almost completely hollow.And then there’s the new panel’s color response. As promised colour tones really do retain their richness, balance and naturalism even during the darkest moments of the Harry Potter sequence. So much so that they actually look slightly more dynamic than those of the ZT60/65 – a comparison that holds good during bright footage, too.

It’s not just with colour saturations that Panasonic’s new LCD panel actually outguns the ZT60/65 either. It also delivers dark scenes less noisily, with none of the green speckling noise you can see on the ZT60/65 if you get up close. Talking of noise, the new LCD panel also runs essentially silently avoiding the fan noise output by the ZT60.Although we’re not sure what motion processing settings Panasonic was using for the TVs in its demo, from what we saw the new LCD panel reproduced motion – especially camera pans – with markedly less judder than the ZT60/65 did. On the flip side, the new panel lost a little resolution with fast moving objects while the ZT60/65 did not. The ZT60/65 also delivered a wider viewing angle without losing colour saturation or contrast than the new LCD panel, though the IPS panel in the new model provides a markedly wider effective viewing angle than the VA-type panel inside the WT600.

As we finally emerged blinking into the bright lights of the main Panasonic stand, our minds were reeling over what we’d just witnessed. Before entering the booth we’d thought maybe Panasonic might be able to match plasma in some areas with its new flagship LCD panel. But the fact that this panel had just seemingly not only matched but even outgunned the mighty ZT60/65 in most areas of picture performance was just not something we’d been prepared for. Obviously we must remember that what we were shown wasn’t a completely finished TV sample. But if anything you’d expect picture performance to improve rather than get worse in the coming months. In short, Panasonic appears to have given itself a fighting chance of genuinely delivering on its outlandish claims to have matched plasma quality with its latest flagship LCD TVs. In any case, if this is what Panasonic can do within just a year of focussing more of its R&D activities on LCD, hopes have suddenly become seriously high for what thrills the brand’s plasma-free future might hold."

Thanks for adding this, I'm REALLY intrigued by this panel now and what the pricing will be.

Looky here!
robnix is offline  
post #103 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 07:56 PM
Senior Member
 
Chris5028's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 289
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 62
Ironically I feel like I can trust Mark's impressions more than Trusted Reviews' article...
I would like to point out that if Panasonic is trying to sell this TV it would make sense for them to "Nurf" the ZT a little but for this comparison. If I looked at my ST50 (in standard mode) side by side with almost any current "LED" TV I would think the LED TV matched or beat the image quality too. Just something to think about.

Chris5028 is online now  
post #104 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 08:27 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Wetumpka, AL
Posts: 15,369
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 119 Post(s)
Liked: 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by robnix View Post

Thanks for adding this, I'm REALLY intrigued by this panel now and what the pricing will be.

You and me too.

Looks like I'll be waiting for yet one more flat panel shootout to decide what to buy.

Samsung 64F8500, Panasonic 65VT50, Oppo 95, Tivo Roamio for OTA, Dish VIP722, Marantz AV8801 preamp, Rotel Amps, Atlantic Tech 8200 speakers, Seaton Submersive HP, Calman 5, Chromapure, Accupel DVG-5000, i1Display3pro, i1pro2, eecolor colorbox.
JimP is offline  
post #105 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 08:50 PM
AVS Special Member
 
robnix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 113 Post(s)
Liked: 260
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post

You and me too.

Looks like I'll be waiting for yet one more flat panel shootout to decide what to buy.

I'm glad there are more people out there thinking this way. The reality is that Plasma is dead and OLED still isn't ready for mass sales. IMO 4K LED is our best hope at this time for large screens with the image quality we expect at a reasonable price.

Looky here!
robnix is offline  
post #106 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 09:00 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,751
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 195 Post(s)
Liked: 331
Quote:
Originally Posted by comfynumb View Post

I doubt it's that close and I'm betting my ST60
has better motion, off angle viewing and just about everything else. Never "trust" a website that has trust in the address wink.gif


Keep in mind that this is currently a studio monitor prototype, not a production model. Until this panel is introduced to their consumer line, it's true performance as a mass produced product, remains to be seen.


Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
post #107 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 09:31 PM
Senior Member
 
Hawkmoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 419
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

As somebody who has been gaming since the 80's, i'm not a big fan of most of these modern videogames(mindless Broshooters by the dozen, overly violent & childish zombie smashers, bloated hollywoodized flashy interactive movie-games with kindergarten difficulty ect), I've got zero interest at this point in the PS4 or XBOX 1 regardless of how(durpty durp) powerful they are. I'm a big nintendo fan, and i usually play nintendo games anyways. Capcom and konami have turned into complete sh** however, dark times indeed. It's all getting rather stale for me, playing the same crap over and over with a new 'skin'
I'm sticking with nintendo's 3DS & Wii U(heck i would also get a dreamcast 2 if sega were back in the game) and that' that. But the Wii U only has a select few 1080p games, but that's expected because the system itself isn't that much powerful than an xbox 360.

Anyways, I find it mind boggling that the PS4 and XBOX 1 haven't made 1080p standard AND 60fps for their games. it's complete BS, Sony tends to overhype themselves and make bold claims that never see the light of day.

But yeah....So would 720p & 1080p games look worse on a 4k set vs a 1080p set?

I currently have the Sony 4k and it does a great job at gaming and 1080p/720p games do look really good on them. While it does upscale, it is obviously not as good as native 4k, which I have seen using my PC albeit at 30fps, which is something I do not like at all. But for todays game consoles, upscaling to 4k looks pretty good and games do look a little better than they do on my Sony XBR-929 55" Set.

I am just intrigued by this new Panasonic because the first one looked really good, better than the Sony 4k, but they were plagued with the vertical banding issues, so I am hoping this set does not have those issues.

-Hawkmoon
Hawkmoon is online now  
post #108 of 368 Old 01-09-2014, 09:34 PM
AVS Special Member
 
fierce_gt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,863
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 547 Post(s)
Liked: 819
sounds like maybe I won't be screwed the next time I'm due for a new tv.

for my uses I would DEFINITELY prefer an LCD based display if it didn't have uniformity issues and mediocre black performance

Displays: Samsung PN64F8500/JVC X35
AVR: Pioneer VSX-1018AH, 5.1 audio
Sources: HTPC(Mediabrowser), PS3, XBOX360, Wii, Sony DVP-CX995V
Control: Harmony One
fierce_gt is online now  
post #109 of 368 Old 01-10-2014, 04:18 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Wetumpka, AL
Posts: 15,369
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 119 Post(s)
Liked: 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by robnix View Post

I'm glad there are more people out there thinking this way. The reality is that Plasma is dead and OLED still isn't ready for mass sales. IMO 4K LED is our best hope at this time for large screens with the image quality we expect at a reasonable price.

From what I've read written by those who seem to be "in the business", what is shown at CES often times are proof that it can be done (proof of concept), or the design has to go through others and get changed a lot.

We'd like to think we're coming out of this knowing what will hit the market in a few months. Past performance would indicate otherwise.

Samsung 64F8500, Panasonic 65VT50, Oppo 95, Tivo Roamio for OTA, Dish VIP722, Marantz AV8801 preamp, Rotel Amps, Atlantic Tech 8200 speakers, Seaton Submersive HP, Calman 5, Chromapure, Accupel DVG-5000, i1Display3pro, i1pro2, eecolor colorbox.
JimP is offline  
post #110 of 368 Old 01-10-2014, 04:57 AM
AVS Special Member
 
comfynumb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Northeast PA.
Posts: 4,804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 409
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post

Keep in mind that this is currently a studio monitor prototype, not a production model. Until this panel is introduced to their consumer line, it's true performance as a mass produced product, remains to be seen.


Ian



I have admit it looks promising I'm just in no hurry to jump back into LCD.
comfynumb is offline  
post #111 of 368 Old 01-10-2014, 08:50 AM
Advanced Member
 
SiGGy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Lenexa, Kansas
Posts: 736
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 88 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeclough24 View Post

I sure am gonna miss 600 hz =(

Not to rain on your parade... however when you really dig into Panasonic's recent drive system it isn't really a visual 600hz on the screen. Especially for the darker areas; in fact depending on the gradient (brightness) level certain areas of the screen can actually have different scan rates. The darker visual areas can end up being below 60hz (yes, sixty not a type-o); this is why some folks see flickering on the new panels depending on the content.

I'll be interested to see one of these displays in person myself. My vote is for OLED down the road, but any advancements in LCD are all good IMO smile.gif
JimP likes this.

-SiGGy
SiGGy is offline  
post #112 of 368 Old 01-10-2014, 05:38 PM
AVS Special Member
 
fafrd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,644
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 597
Quote:
Originally Posted by wtfer View Post

So far at CES, has Vizio been the only one to announce FALD sets for 2014 or has Sony/Samsung/LG/Sharp announced anything yet as well?

I believe also the Toshiba L9400 (4K) and L7400 (1080p) are FALD (Radiance Panel)...

It's amazing to me that Sharp, the father of the FALD-standard-setting Elite, is one of the few manufacturers to offer only edge-lit in 2014 (Samsung being the other).

-fafrd
fafrd is online now  
post #113 of 368 Old 01-11-2014, 05:57 AM
Newbie
 
Bobbylechat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10

guys, what about the AX900 series? Correct me if am wrong but nobody talks about it.

UHD with FALD available in 55 and 65 inches, seems pretty good to me :)

Bobbylechat is offline  
post #114 of 368 Old 01-11-2014, 01:53 PM
Member
 
alucard3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
C|net
Quote:
The black bars on the prototype also looked black. There was a distinct lack of blooming or sudden changes in the backlight which makes this one of the best and most subtle dimming systems I've ever seen.

http://ces.cnet.com/8301-35303_1-57617001/panasonics-prototype-4k-led-boasts-plasma-like-picture/



Panasonic 4K LED LCD first look - plasma quality from LCD

http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/home-entertainment/1304875/panasonic-4k-led-lcd-first-look-plasma-quality-from-lcd
alucard3 is offline  
post #115 of 368 Old 01-11-2014, 02:34 PM
Advanced Member
 
avsform1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 502
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 21
I saw the demo that panasonic put up with the LED, you really cant tell with the cartoon they were using for the media content.
avsform1 is offline  
post #116 of 368 Old 01-11-2014, 08:53 PM
AVS Special Member
 
WaveBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 1,982
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 48 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Will panasonic be incorporating this level of quality in their top of the line 2014 '1080p' sets?

ZT65 still has the edge in motion resolution and Viewing angles, and perhaps black levels but it's extremely close. Everything else, the prototype 4k LED wins and then some. Brightness, no noise, dynamic colors, no ABL(The plasma like tech that has been integrated has corrected the entire local dimming issue, so the screen will still remain bright with deep inky blacks) ect ect.
WaveBoy is offline  
post #117 of 368 Old 01-12-2014, 02:55 AM
Member
 
kristoffer77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 133
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 17
Do the non-4K LCDs of Panasonic 2014 LCD still use IPS for the most part? rolleyes.gif
kristoffer77 is offline  
post #118 of 368 Old 01-12-2014, 05:01 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Writer @ AVS
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 5,681
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1135 Post(s)
Liked: 2285
Quote:
Originally Posted by avsform1 View Post

I saw the demo that panasonic put up with the LED, you really cant tell with the cartoon they were using for the media content.

How so? I thought it was very revealing, especially on dark scenes.

Find out more about Mark Henninger at
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
imagic is online now  
post #119 of 368 Old 01-12-2014, 05:15 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Wetumpka, AL
Posts: 15,369
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 119 Post(s)
Liked: 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by avsform1 View Post

I saw the demo that panasonic put up with the LED, you really cant tell with the cartoon they were using for the media content.

I wasn't there but using cartoons to demo a display speaks volumes.

Did anyone see their demo (asking did they actually have one) when they used non animated content including faces?

Samsung 64F8500, Panasonic 65VT50, Oppo 95, Tivo Roamio for OTA, Dish VIP722, Marantz AV8801 preamp, Rotel Amps, Atlantic Tech 8200 speakers, Seaton Submersive HP, Calman 5, Chromapure, Accupel DVG-5000, i1Display3pro, i1pro2, eecolor colorbox.
JimP is offline  
post #120 of 368 Old 01-12-2014, 06:26 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Writer @ AVS
 
imagic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 5,681
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1135 Post(s)
Liked: 2285
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimP View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by avsform1 View Post

I saw the demo that panasonic put up with the LED, you really cant tell with the cartoon they were using for the media content.

I wasn't there but using cartoons to demo a display speaks volumes.

Did anyone see their demo (asking did they actually have one) when they used non animated content including faces?

Right outside the demo room, the same TV was showing all kinds of content—including video AND test patterns. Not sure why nobody noticed that.

 

Also, there is a significant difference between cartoons and anime. The subtle shading and dark backgrounds of the material in the dark-demo was very useful for judging the quality of the content on each display.

 

 

ChadThunder likes this.

Find out more about Mark Henninger at
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
imagic is online now  
Reply LCD Flat Panel Displays

Tags
Ces 2014

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off