Sharp UHD and HDTVs at CES 2014 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 42 Old 01-07-2014, 12:54 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Special Member
 
Scott Wilkinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Burbank, CA
Posts: 1,345
Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 353 Post(s)
Liked: 1185

Sharp is most known for its large LED-LCD TVs, starting at 60 inches and reaching a behemoth 90 inches, and the company's CES 2014 press conference confirmed that Sharp intends to continue pursuing that niche.

 

L-R: Sharp's Aquos HD, Q, Q+, and 4K series. (Photo by Scott Wilkinson)

 

Four new series were unveiled, starting with the entry level Aquos HD (1080p) at 60, 70, 80, and 90 inches with MSRPs from $1300 to $9000. Next up the ladder is the Aquos Q (Quattron) 1080p models at 60 and 70 inches ($1700 and $2700, respectively) with yellow subpixels in addition to red, green, and blue. At the top of the heap is the Aquos 4K line, which sports UHD resolution and Quattron subpixels in 60" and 70" screen sizes with MSRPs of $5000 and $6000, respectively.

 

What about the next-to-top series? That's the most interesting story. Called Aquos Q+, the models in this series include Quattron subpixels and a new technology called Revelation that divides each subpixel in half vertically, addressing each half alternately, which is said to effectively double the vertical resolution to 2160. We were also told that the horizontal resolution is effectively increased up to 3840 dynamically, depending on the content. I tried to ask how that was accomplished, but I never got a straight answer; hopefully, someone will explain it to me during the show. In any event, the Aquos Q+ series can display UHD content for half the price of a true UHDTV, which is pretty cool. This series comes in two lines—SQ in 60 and 70 inches for $2300 and $3100, respectively, and UQ in 60, 70, and 80 inches for $3000 to $6000.

 

The Aquos HD series will ship to dealers this month, while the Aquos Q will ship in February. The Q+ is expected to ship in the spring, with the 4K series following in the summer.

 

Return to CES Master Post

 

Like AVS Forum on Facebook

Follow AVS Forum on Twitter

+1 AVS Forum on Google+


Scott Wilkinson
AVS Editor
Scott Wilkinson is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 42 Old 01-07-2014, 06:07 PM
Member
 
dukemc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I thought Sharp was going belly up a few months ago. Are they going to continue making flat panel TVs ?
dukemc is offline  
post #3 of 42 Old 01-07-2014, 06:34 PM
AVS Special Member
 
jbug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 3,602
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 39 Post(s)
Liked: 41
I take it that none of these sets are FALD?
jbug is offline  
post #4 of 42 Old 01-07-2014, 07:17 PM
AVS Special Member
 
fafrd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,205
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 742
This 'pseudo-4K' concept of Sharps' could have been interesting if it worked well and was attractively priced.

The lowest MSRPs I've seen quoted for the Q+ are $2300 and $3100 for the 60" and 70".

The new 4K Vizio panels have MSRPs of $1800 and $2600 for the 60" and 70" (and $2200 for the 65"), so unless the Vizeo 4K sets are a disaster, I don't see how Sharp's neat idea of a 1080+ panel is going to get much interest (also because the Sharp panels are edge-lit and the Vizio panels are full-array).

The 60" edge-lit Aquos HD entry- level from Sharp has an MRP of $1300, close to the $1200 MSRP 60" M Series HD panel from Vizio which is also full-array (and more than double the Entry-level E Series HD panel from Vizio which has an MSRP of $900 for the 60" model and is also full-array).

So unless Vizeo falls on their face, I think Sharp's middle-of-the-road strategy is doomed...

-fafrd

p.s. I am also very confused about the difference between the Quatron UQ and SQ lines. The bezel of the UQ is metal and the bezel of the SQ is plastic - fine, I get that. The UQ includes Sharp's 'Revelation' technology and the SQ does not - what does this mean? Is Revelation technology needed to fully exploit sharp's sub-pixel-faking-it-as-a-pseudo-4K-panel concept or not?
Citivas likes this.
fafrd is offline  
post #5 of 42 Old 01-07-2014, 07:25 PM
AVS Special Member
 
fafrd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,205
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 742
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbug View Post

I take it that none of these sets are FALD?

From what I have understood, no, all of Sharp's 2014 offerings are edge-lit.

Seems like the market has largely shifted to 4K and back to full-array LED (and FALD) and Sharp's strategy of focusing on a value-priced HD+ offering is may fall on its face because at the price points they are targeting, consumers will now expect either full 4K or FALD (or both, if Vizio is successful).

Of course if Vizio falls on their face and Sharp can offer an effective edge-lit HD+ at a price that comes close to the edge-lit HD offerings by Sony and Samsung, their strategy could still pay off.

And all of this is awaiting testing of actual production panels so we move out of dreamland and spec sheets to reality...

I think 2014 is actually going to be a fun year for TVs - seems like a good chance we consumers are going to be able to get a great deal more for a great deal less a year from now than we can find today.

-fafrd
fafrd is offline  
post #6 of 42 Old 01-07-2014, 07:31 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
rogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Stop making curved screens
Posts: 30,408
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 331 Post(s)
Liked: 634
Sharp had something in the booth labeled full array.... But it looked like nothing interesting....

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
rogo is offline  
post #7 of 42 Old 01-08-2014, 06:11 AM
Advanced Member
 
nathanddrews's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 42 Post(s)
Liked: 77
I think the Q+ is just Sharp's way of selling off the leftover bits from their 4K panel production. They don't quite meet 4K specs, but they're better than 1080p. Put a scalar in it, sell it for half price, and call it a day. It's better than just throwing them away.
nathanddrews is offline  
post #8 of 42 Old 01-08-2014, 09:34 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tgm1024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,868
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 675 Post(s)
Liked: 946

Where is Moth Eye in all of this?


Java developers, when I saw what has been placed into Java 8 I was immediately reminded of how I've spent so much of my life trying to protect engineers from themselves. Lambda expressions are a horrible idea. Gentlemen: the goal isn't to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer. The goal is to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer exhausted and hopped up on caffeine at 3 am. What a disaster Java 8 is!
tgm1024 is online now  
post #9 of 42 Old 01-08-2014, 09:44 AM
AVS Special Member
 
8mile13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,163
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 411 Post(s)
Liked: 270
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 
Where is Moth Eye in all of this?
hibernation wink.gif
8mile13 is offline  
post #10 of 42 Old 01-08-2014, 11:35 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tgm1024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,868
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 675 Post(s)
Liked: 946
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8mile13 View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 
Where is Moth Eye in all of this?
hibernation wink.gif

 

LOL.  Good grief, though.  It's 2014, Moth Eye has been proven, Museum Glass has been around for a very long time, and still we're given TVs that look like black mirrors.


Java developers, when I saw what has been placed into Java 8 I was immediately reminded of how I've spent so much of my life trying to protect engineers from themselves. Lambda expressions are a horrible idea. Gentlemen: the goal isn't to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer. The goal is to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer exhausted and hopped up on caffeine at 3 am. What a disaster Java 8 is!
tgm1024 is online now  
post #11 of 42 Old 01-08-2014, 02:26 PM
Advanced Member
 
billdag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 525
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 86 Post(s)
Liked: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post


What about the next-to-top series? That's the most interesting story. Called Aquos Q+, the models in this series include Quattron subpixels and a new technology called Revelation that divides each subpixel in half vertically, addressing each half alternately,

Return to CES Master Post

Like AVS Forum on Facebook
Follow AVS Forum on Twitter
+1 AVS Forum on Google+
Funny - Sharp has been doing this sub-pixel thing at least since I bought the very first 52" set about 5 Years ago. Not Quattron but the RGB pixels were indeed divided into upper and lower sub-pixels which were activated alternately to control brightness. My 80" LC-80LE632U has it as well. I would not call it an enhancement or superior to full pixels. In fact, on horizontal borders, in particular, you can see the alternate pixels from a good 6 feet or more away. Looks similar to the crawling dot pattern we used to experience on our old CRT sets.
billdag is offline  
post #12 of 42 Old 01-08-2014, 05:34 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tgm1024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,868
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 675 Post(s)
Liked: 946
Quote:
Originally Posted by billdag View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post


What about the next-to-top series? That's the most interesting story. Called Aquos Q+, the models in this series include Quattron subpixels and a new technology called Revelation that divides each subpixel in half vertically, addressing each half alternately,

Return to CES Master Post

Like AVS Forum on Facebook
Follow AVS Forum on Twitter
+1 AVS Forum on Google+
Funny - Sharp has been doing this sub-pixel thing at least since I bought the very first 52" set about 5 Years ago. Not Quattron but the RGB pixels were indeed divided into upper and lower sub-pixels which were activated alternately to control brightness. My 80" LC-80LE632U has it as well. I would not call it an enhancement or superior to full pixels. In fact, on horizontal borders, in particular, you can see the alternate pixels from a good 6 feet or more away. Looks similar to the crawling dot pattern we used to experience on our old CRT sets.

 

Not to OT ourselves too far to the older models, but that "crawling" thing you saw: was that on a 1080i feed only?  Or was progressive scan affected the same way?


Java developers, when I saw what has been placed into Java 8 I was immediately reminded of how I've spent so much of my life trying to protect engineers from themselves. Lambda expressions are a horrible idea. Gentlemen: the goal isn't to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer. The goal is to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer exhausted and hopped up on caffeine at 3 am. What a disaster Java 8 is!
tgm1024 is online now  
post #13 of 42 Old 01-08-2014, 07:11 PM
Advanced Member
 
billdag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 525
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 86 Post(s)
Liked: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Not to OT ourselves too far to the older models, but that "crawling" thing you saw: was that on a 1080i feed only?  Or was progressive scan affected the same way?
Doesn't matter. It wasn't actually crawling. It was just my visual description on the horizontal border created by the alternate pixel method to regulate brightness. A medium or low brightness red bordered by black is really easy to see from a fair distance.
billdag is offline  
post #14 of 42 Old 01-09-2014, 01:37 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
rogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Stop making curved screens
Posts: 30,408
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 331 Post(s)
Liked: 634
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanddrews View Post

I think the Q+ is just Sharp's way of selling off the leftover bits from their 4K panel production. They don't quite meet 4K specs, but they're better than 1080p. Put a scalar in it, sell it for half price, and call it a day. It's better than just throwing them away.

No not even a little.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

Where is Moth Eye in all of this?

Absolutely MIA.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
rogo is offline  
post #15 of 42 Old 01-09-2014, 05:55 AM
Advanced Member
 
nathanddrews's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 42 Post(s)
Liked: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

No not even a little.
Please explain. The answers provided by Sharp don't offer much in the way of alternatives. Sounds like a 4K panel without a native 4K controller.
nathanddrews is offline  
post #16 of 42 Old 01-09-2014, 07:30 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tgm1024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,868
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 675 Post(s)
Liked: 946
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanddrews View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

No not even a little.
Please explain. The answers provided by Sharp don't offer much in the way of alternatives. Sounds like a 4K panel without a native 4K controller.

 

I can't speak for Rogo, but from my perspective, I don't believe any product that can be perceived as a "stop-gap" measure by the public ever receives enormous acceptance, regardless of it's technical merits touted by folks in the know.  In prior lives, I've fought and fought and fought this concept with engineer driven companies...we engineers routinely forget how the public sees things.  They want slam-dunk solutions.  They don't want: "hey, we're almost" anything.


Java developers, when I saw what has been placed into Java 8 I was immediately reminded of how I've spent so much of my life trying to protect engineers from themselves. Lambda expressions are a horrible idea. Gentlemen: the goal isn't to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer. The goal is to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer exhausted and hopped up on caffeine at 3 am. What a disaster Java 8 is!
tgm1024 is online now  
post #17 of 42 Old 01-09-2014, 06:50 PM
Member
 
David Baldwin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 103
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I think Sharp's success with Q+ will come down to the price point they will actually hit with it.

If they dump the price, would you buy a similarly priced TV that can't play UHD content or one that can play 4K content?

I must admit that I am interested in Vizio's local dimming approach for LCDs, and liked this year's Samsung 8000 series with local dimming for a bright room, but…

"The future is OLED" per many experts. Supposedly OLED surpasses plasma's black levels and can still achieve very good brightness. I have yet to see one in person though. How well do they handle motion?

If OLED is as good as the experts are saying, and I can buy a 65" flat HDMI2.0 UHD supporting HVEC H.265 decoding with a good scaler for SD and HD content for $4000-$5000, I may jump in that direction for my family room. Wife is complaining about my old 52" being too small.

Problem is that my Home Theater projector is due for an upgrade soon too and I can't afford to do both! Maybe I can't afford to do either. ;-)
David Baldwin is offline  
post #18 of 42 Old 01-10-2014, 05:57 AM
Advanced Member
 
nathanddrews's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 42 Post(s)
Liked: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Baldwin View Post

"The future is OLED" per many experts. Supposedly OLED surpasses plasma's black levels and can still achieve very good brightness. I have yet to see one in person though. How well do they handle motion?

The Best Buy (Magnolia) near me has a couple OLEDs. They're both curved and the basketball game that was on looked great. I wasn't as blown away as I was back when I first saw the Sony 11" unit years ago, but I think that's just because LCD and PDP have come so far since then.

Motion on OLED can be better than LCD, but like most things in life, not all OLEDs are created equal. It all comes down to how the panel is designed. See this article for more detail than you may want:
http://www.blurbusters.com/faq/oled-motion-blur/
nathanddrews is offline  
post #19 of 42 Old 01-10-2014, 03:12 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
rogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Stop making curved screens
Posts: 30,408
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 331 Post(s)
Liked: 634
Quote:
Originally Posted by nathanddrews View Post

Please explain. The answers provided by Sharp don't offer much in the way of alternatives. Sounds like a 4K panel without a native 4K controller.

It's not a 4K panel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

I can't speak for Rogo, but from my perspective, I don't believe any product that can be perceived as a "stop-gap" measure by the public ever receives enormous acceptance, regardless of it's technical merits touted by folks in the know.  In prior lives, I've fought and fought and fought this concept with engineer driven companies...we engineers routinely forget how the public sees things.  They want slam-dunk solutions.  They don't want: "hey, we're almost" anything.

Really, really, really true.

"This isn't 4K, but it's kinda nearly sorta as good" isn't going to interest people in a world where real 4K is getting cheaper and cheaper fast. "Sorta 4K" Sharp is going to be shopped against actual 4K Vizio not against actual 4K Sony.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
rogo is offline  
post #20 of 42 Old 01-11-2014, 08:14 AM
Advanced Member
 
njfoses's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 651
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 26
Hopefully the 90" can be had for under $5000 by years end.
njfoses is offline  
post #21 of 42 Old 01-11-2014, 08:46 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Cleveland Plasma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Posts: 12,411
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 528 Post(s)
Liked: 692
Would be nice but I would not hold your breath....

So some exciting gear from sharp.

Standard 90" unit will be available as well.

Sharp again has a true 4K unit coming out in 70" with HDMI 2.0. No other sizes.

Sharp also has a 60", 70", and 80" Q+ series which can except 4K but is a 1080P set. Q+ actually downscales Ultra HD content. It displays a maximum of 2,160 vertical and 3,840 horizontal lines, but can display less, depending on the format of the content being played. For more info........ Click Here ......These look very promising for the standard LED price.
.
.
.
Cleveland Plasma is offline  
post #22 of 42 Old 01-11-2014, 07:15 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
rogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Stop making curved screens
Posts: 30,408
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 331 Post(s)
Liked: 634
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

W
Sharp again has a true 4K unit coming out in 70" with HDMI 2.0. No other sizes.


.

Sharp has demoed a full array local dimming set at about 5 different CES shows in recent memory. They have shipped one once. I would not hold my breath on this particular set materializing.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
rogo is offline  
post #23 of 42 Old 01-11-2014, 09:32 PM
AVS Special Member
 
fafrd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,205
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 742
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

Would be nice but I would not hold your breath....

So some exciting gear from sharp.

Standard 90" unit will be available as well.

Sharp again has a true 4K unit coming out in 70" with HDMI 2.0. No other sizes.

Sharp also has a 60", 70", and 80" Q+ series which can except 4K but is a 1080P set. Q+ actually downscales Ultra HD content. It displays a maximum of 2,160 vertical and 3,840 horizontal lines, but can display less, depending on the format of the content being played. For more info........ Click Here ......These look very promising for the standard LED price.
.
.
.

The only problem with your above statement is that 'the standard LED price' has just changed dramatically.

Sharp 60" Q+ 1080p+/4K- has an MSRP of $3100
Vizio 60" M Series 1080p has an MSRP of $1200 (40% of Sharp's Q+ pricing)
Vizio 60" P Series 4K has an MSRP of $1800 (60% of Sharp's Q+ pricing)
(and the Visio 60" entry-level E-Series 1080p has an MSRP of $900 (30% of Sharp's 60" Q+ pricing)

And if you need another indicator that 4K now costs a great deal less than it did before CES, JVC is offering a 65" 4K set for $2500...

-fafrd

If Sharp had revived Elite-like FALD as part of their '4K-lite' strategy, they might have had a chance, but by sticking to edge-lit, I fear they will be toast as the new year unfolds...
fafrd is offline  
post #24 of 42 Old 01-11-2014, 10:40 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Cleveland Plasma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Posts: 12,411
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 528 Post(s)
Liked: 692
We will have to wait to see how good these sets from Vizio are, if they are not good who cares what they are selling for..........we will see. Last year I believe, Samsung said there 4K units would all be FALD, not so......... Samsung raised they price after release on a FALD set, I forget the model number tough.

--- Its all speculation until models hit the streets and are tested............
Cleveland Plasma is offline  
post #25 of 42 Old 01-12-2014, 09:11 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tgm1024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,868
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 675 Post(s)
Liked: 946
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

We will have to wait to see how good these sets from Vizio are, if they are not good who cares what they are selling for

 

Unless there's absolutely no other choice (or if they stop producing 3D movies), if a TV is 2D only I'm not buying it.  Period, end of chapter, end of story.  I don't care how good the image is.  The sight of a room full of kids enthralled with a 3D movie is priceless at our house, and the quality of 3D passive these days is jaw dropping.


Java developers, when I saw what has been placed into Java 8 I was immediately reminded of how I've spent so much of my life trying to protect engineers from themselves. Lambda expressions are a horrible idea. Gentlemen: the goal isn't to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer. The goal is to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer exhausted and hopped up on caffeine at 3 am. What a disaster Java 8 is!
tgm1024 is online now  
post #26 of 42 Old 01-12-2014, 01:34 PM
Advanced Member
 
billdag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 525
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 86 Post(s)
Liked: 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

and the quality of 3D passive these days is jaw dropping.
I beg to differ if you are referring to 1080P sets. Much as I like the passive technology I can't get past the obvious horizontal lines that are plainly visible at normal seating distances (reminds me of my old CRT sets). The 4K 3D passive does sound like the best of both worlds though as the vertical resolution is still a very good 1080 lines vs. 540 for the 1080P sets.
billdag is offline  
post #27 of 42 Old 01-12-2014, 01:41 PM
AVS Special Member
 
fafrd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 4,205
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 742
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

We will have to wait to see how good these sets from Vizio are, if they are not good who cares what they are selling for...........

Of course - that is a given.

First reviews of the 40" E Panels have been promising, however, and indicate Visio is in fact bringing some significant innovation to the low-end flat-panel market this year...


-fafrd
fafrd is offline  
post #28 of 42 Old 01-12-2014, 02:08 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tgm1024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 6,868
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 675 Post(s)
Liked: 946
Quote:
Originally Posted by billdag View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tgm1024 View Post

and the quality of 3D passive these days is jaw dropping.
I beg to differ if you are referring to 1080P sets. Much as I like the passive technology I can't get past the obvious horizontal lines that are plainly visible at normal seating distances (reminds me of my old CRT sets). The 4K 3D passive does sound like the best of both worlds though as the vertical resolution is still a very good 1080 lines vs. 540 for the 1080P sets.

 

Doesn't happen to me.  Did on the first few demos I saw of it, but not since 2012 or so.

 

This is what I find weird: I can easily see the differences of 4K and 2K (2D), but I'm not in the least bothered by, nor particularly "see", the interleaved 540 blank lines you're talking about.  I can see a reduced resolution, but not the horizontal grid so much.

 

Perhaps related to the way that lit lines bloom larger than unlit ones optically?  Frankly, I'm not sure why passive is so great on my 2K TV.  But it really is.


Java developers, when I saw what has been placed into Java 8 I was immediately reminded of how I've spent so much of my life trying to protect engineers from themselves. Lambda expressions are a horrible idea. Gentlemen: the goal isn't to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer. The goal is to make code readable for a competent mid-level engineer exhausted and hopped up on caffeine at 3 am. What a disaster Java 8 is!
tgm1024 is online now  
post #29 of 42 Old 01-12-2014, 04:26 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
rogo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Stop making curved screens
Posts: 30,408
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 331 Post(s)
Liked: 634
People seem to not be grasping this, but Vizio's plan is to knock Toshiba, Panasonic, Sharp and Sony all out of the U.S. TV market. That's absolutely what they are trying to do. None of those 4 are especially secure right now, given limited success, lack of profits, corporate restructuring or some combination of the above.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
rogo is offline  
post #30 of 42 Old 01-12-2014, 04:36 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Citivas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,509
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 291 Post(s)
Liked: 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

People seem to not be grasping this, but Vizio's plan is to knock Toshiba, Panasonic, Sharp and Sony all out of the U.S. TV market. That's absolutely what they are trying to do. None of those 4 are especially secure right now, given limited success, lack of profits, corporate restructuring or some combination of the above.

More power to them. But I won't get excited until it's real. Fortunately I don't hold a grudge but I own a Vizio set now that is the worst flat-panel I have ever owned and the only one I regret purchasing. It's a 2012 model. Here's to hoping both the quality and prices become reality...
Citivas is offline  
Reply LCD Flat Panel Displays

Tags
Ces 2014



Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off