OFFICIAL Samsung 4k HU8550 and HU9000 thread - Page 28 - AVS Forum
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post #811 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 07:53 PM
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Why would the 1080p res coming from my PC look bad on a UHD TV? The TV is going to upscale the signal to 4K so the pic quality exceeds standard 1080p signal. I ordered the HU9000 with the intention of having a fabulous upscaled pic when gaming and watching 1080p movies. I'm expecting my already good Titanfall 1080p experience on PC to become great to excellent with the TV upscaling it to 4K while maintaining the 60fps.
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post #812 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 08:29 PM
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Originally Posted by doctorwizz View Post

In NVIDIA control panel I can select either RGB or YCbCr 444. I have it set to 444.

Oh man... thank you for this! I had no idea this setting was in there. I just changed it and it looks great on my older Samsung LCD.  What did you set "adjust video color settings" to?  Mine defaults to "with the video player settings" but I was wondering if "dynamic range" would make a difference.  

 

There are a lot of settings to play around with in the Nvidia Control Panel that I never realized.

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I thought DVI doesn't pass audio?

I have a DVI to HDMI connected to HDMI 2 on my 8550.

In windows playback devices, I have:
Samsung-0
2 - NVIDIA High definition Audio

I have a optical from the TV connected to the AVR TV input. That is assigned to optical.

So with the AVR set to TV, I set the windows default audio device to Samsung-0, I get stereo audio from the TV optical out to the AVR when I play a audio file in windows.
If I unplug the optical from the TV while music is playing, the audio stops. I have not been able to pass DTS or DD yet. But stereo works.

 

You are right DVI doesn't pass audio.  When I said that dual DVI has same spec I meant to say same video spec except for the confusing part regarding the color.  That part I'm not sure of because of wiki's statement.  I would assume that HDMI would be (even 1.4 spec) a superior platform for TVs specifically.

 

So optical from the TV to the AVR is not yielding Dolby Digital?  I was hoping that we would at least see DD when we were watching Netflix or Amazon Instant Video via the built in Samsung app on these sets.  

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Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

Why would the 1080p res coming from my PC look bad on a UHD TV? The TV is going to upscale the signal to 4K so the pic quality exceeds standard 1080p signal. I ordered the HU9000 with the intention of having a fabulous upscaled pic when gaming and watching 1080p movies. I'm expecting my already good Titanfall 1080p experience on PC to become great to excellent with the TV upscaling it to 4K while maintaining the 60fps.

 

I think Titanfall will look amazing even on 1080p settings.  

 

Here is my assumption regarding PC gaming and PCs in general on these sets... If you have the PC screen resolution adjusted to 1080, thus your in game settings will also be 1080.  I believe the same results will occur if your screen resolution is native (4k) and your in game settings are 1080.  I just don't think that there is going to be any pre/post processing done to enhance the image or upscale it to a 4k resolution with the PC (with the exception of PowerDVD or other media players).  However, if you are set to a default resolution of 4k and have the game settings as 4k than obviously you'll see 4k.    

 

With my current Samsung TV (2010 LCD model) it will display everything at 1080/60p whilst on the PC.  If I connect it to a cable box, the screen will adjust (and display the results in the upper right hand corner) of all the cable channels.  If it is a 1080i signal, it will say 1080i.  If it is a 720p signal, 720p will display and same with 480.  I can choose to have all images upscaled by the cable box to 1080i, and thus even analog channels will be upscaled to 1080i.  

 

I guess I just am not convinced that unless you see a 4k signal resolution, you are not getting an actual 4k resolution unless the TV has some "specific" upscaling setting that it is doing.  

 

When I get my 4k TV and HDCP 2.2 compliant AVR, I intend to set resolution to 2160.  I'll likely even play all my games at this resolution and just sacrifice graphics quality settings.  I don't mind playing on low settings if it means I have smooth gameplay at 2160 (that's a lot of real estate!)


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post #813 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 08:37 PM
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I use the video player settings.

From what I have read, DVI can pass audio. So my PC can send analog audio through the HDMI to DVI to the TV. Then through the optical.

I meant the DVI to HDMI does not pass DD or DTS.
The TV player and apps can pass DD and DTS through optical.

Just ordered a new HDMI to HDMI to replace that HDMI to DVI. I hate thick cables.

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post #814 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doctorwizz View Post

I use the video player settings.

From what I have read, DVI can pass audio. So my PC can send analog audio through the HDMI to DVI to the TV. Then through the optical.

I meant the DVI to HDMI does not pass DD or DTS.
The TV player and apps can pass DD and DTS through optical.

Just ordered a new HDMI to HDMI to replace that HDMI to DVI. I hate thick cables.
Good to know.

I wish the new hdcp standard would have been mainstream prior to the release of 4k tv's it seems like other resolution leaps this has been the case.

The industry took such a giant leap to 4K. I almost with they'd of taken the 3k leap first. At least my current video cards can do 3k.

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post #815 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 08:49 PM
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4:4:4 should be fine OTOH YCbCr 4:2:2 is Blue Ray /HDTV spec you can use that also . I'm using YCbCr :4:4:4 right now it's fine If the TV can't make the higher whites in YCbCr 4:4:4:
( it's not supposed to ) as opposed to 4:2:2: it will just clip them anyway .

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post #816 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 08:49 PM
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Uh, from what I've read the ALL 4K TVs are supposed to upscale ALL sources to 4K, PC included. If I leave Windows set to 1080p instead of changing it to 4K, I'm still supposed to see the perceived benefits of the upscaling. Now, yes, I can definitely run Windows at 4K res and just keep m games running at 1080p or maybe the next res up, but I the upscaling should still apply at all times.

If you are telling me that my PC won't be upscaled by the TV in general then I don't want a 4K TV.
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post #817 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

Uh, from what I've read the ALL 4K TVs are supposed to upscale ALL sources to 4K, PC included. If I leave Windows set to 1080p instead of changing it to 4K, I'm still supposed to see the perceived benefits of the upscaling. Now, yes, I can definitely run Windows at 4K res and just keep m games running at 1080p or maybe the next res up, but I the upscaling should still apply at all times.

If you are telling me that my PC won't be upscaled by the TV in general then I don't want a 4K TV.

I don't know specifically but I really wouldn't worry about whether or not the image is up-scaled to 4k or not.  I have always had a vague understanding of how "up-scaling" works but I can tell you that if the tv is 4k than every image will be either 4k or a stretched version of the image.  I believe that this TV will take a 1080p image, stretch it, and still make it slightly better than the same image would appear on a 1080p TV.  

 

Simply put, if the source isn't 4k (i.e. wasn't filmed in 4k) than any 4k TV isn't going to produce a miracle out of the same image.  

 

I was recently in a retail store where the same image was outputed onto all the TV's in the room.  The HU8550 was right next to the H7150... I can tell you, without a doubt, there was no difference in PQ.  This was the Samsung reel too... the same advertisement type of thing that Samsung gives to retailers (probably a 1080p video) to show off the PQ.  


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AVR: Pioneer VSX-1124-K.
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HTPC: z97 mobo, 16GB mem, i5-4440, SSD+HD, LG BD drive, Win 8.1 pro w/WMC + MB3.
Content sources: OTA Winegard HD7698P, Amazon Fire TV Stick, Netflix etc.
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post #818 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 09:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

Uh, from what I've read the ALL 4K TVs are supposed to upscale ALL sources to 4K, PC included. If I leave Windows set to 1080p instead of changing it to 4K, I'm still supposed to see the perceived benefits of the upscaling. Now, yes, I can definitely run Windows at 4K res and just keep m games running at 1080p or maybe the next res up, but I the upscaling should still apply at all times.

If you are telling me that my PC won't be upscaled by the TV in general then I don't want a 4K TV.

if you have a 4K TV panel it will ofc upscale to the panels native resolution they all do that . The issue is HDMi 1.4 or 2.0 /2.1 specifications and frame rates accepted by the TV .

If you have enough video card to output 4K ( it takes a good one or sometimes two ) then try sending 4K from that see what looks better to you otherwise 1080p will be upscaled by the TV.

2K HDTV = 720p /1080p = Rec. 709 it specifies the following picture rates: 60 Hz, 50 Hz, 30 Hz, 25 Hz and 24 Hz.

UHDTV (4K ) = Rec. 2020 = 120p, 60p, 59.94p, 50p, 30p, 29.97p, 25p, 24p, 23.976p

HDMI 1.4 single link only accepts up to 60Hz where as the latest 2014 standards, HDMI 2.0/2.1 accepts up to 120p .

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post #819 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 09:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

Why would the 1080p res coming from my PC look bad on a UHD TV? The TV is going to upscale the signal to 4K so the pic quality exceeds standard 1080p signal. I ordered the HU9000 with the intention of having a fabulous upscaled pic when gaming and watching 1080p movies. I'm expecting my already good Titanfall 1080p experience on PC to become great to excellent with the TV upscaling it to 4K while maintaining the 60fps.

The pic quality when upscaled can't exceed a 1080p signal in quality if that's your source...

 

I wouldn't buy a 4K TV for upscaling. Buy one if you plan to view content at native 4K. You can't expect any miracles from upscaling its main purpose is to just make the picture quality not look worse with minimal scaling artifacts.

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post #820 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by x3sphere View Post

The pic quality when upscaled can't exceed a 1080p signal in quality if that's your source...

I wouldn't buy a 4K TV for upscaling. Buy one if you plan to view content at native 4K. You can't expect any miracles from upscaling its main purpose is to just make the picture quality not look worse with minimal scaling artifacts.

Ok. Well, I have a 1080p/HDMI 1.4 receiver (like most people) and all of my sources connect to it. I will not be connecting to the One Connect box and I currently only have a single GTX 780 Ti Superclocked card. I know if I try to run Titanfall or any other AAA game at native 4K my frames won't exceed 20-30 fps. I cannot/will not play a shooter at less than 50 fps, so I'm going to have to keep the in-game resolution well below 4K. So, until the HDMI 2.0 cards come out and I upgrade to a new 4K receiver, I'm pretty much stuck with whatever benefits I get from an upscaled image. Please correct me if I'm wrong in my thinking.

Are you basically saying that I should hold off on a 4K TV until I can feed it a native 4K gaming source? Same for movies?
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post #821 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x3sphere View Post
 

The pic quality when upscaled can't exceed a 1080p signal in quality if that's your source...

 

I wouldn't buy a 4K TV for upscaling. Buy one if you plan to view content at native 4K. You can't expect any miracles from upscaling its main purpose is to just make the picture quality not look worse with minimal scaling artifacts.

 

WRONG!

 

:p

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post #822 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 10:51 PM
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So I got my hu9000 delivered today. I thought the picture looked amazing. Didn't notice any light bleed but it was daytime. Now tonight I was watching tv and notice a lot of light bleed from the bottom two corners. I feel like it's pretty bad for a $5000 tv. I mounted the tv this evening, would that make it worse? Also, how does it work with the best buy replacement plan. I can't keep this tv like this.
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post #823 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 11:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

Ok. Well, I have a 1080p/HDMI 1.4 receiver (like most people) and all of my sources connect to it. I will not be connecting to the One Connect box and I currently only have a single GTX 780 Ti Superclocked card. I know if I try to run Titanfall or any other AAA game at native 4K my frames won't exceed 20-30 fps. I cannot/will not play a shooter at less than 50 fps, so I'm going to have to keep the in-game resolution well below 4K. So, until the HDMI 2.0 cards come out and I upgrade to a new 4K receiver, I'm pretty much stuck with whatever benefits I get from an upscaled image. Please correct me if I'm wrong in my thinking.

Are you basically saying that I should hold off on a 4K TV until I can feed it a native 4K gaming source? Same for movies?
Personally I plan to play FPS PC games on a 4K set. Whether I get Samsung, Pamasonic, Sony etc I'm undecided. In my opinion, gaming at 4k isn't an option right now, so I slowed down my purchasing intentions, until more sets are on the market, more hdmi 2.0 avr's are on the market and at least until a 2.0 video card is on the horizon. I really am not missing much forgoing 4k at the moment. Perhaps it's wise for you to wait as well. I like hearing get what purchasers here have encountered good or bad. I think 4k will be an awesome thing... however, it's gonna be beneficial to be patient on this one.

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post #824 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 11:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post


Ok. Well, I have a 1080p/HDMI 1.4 receiver (like most people) and all of my sources connect to it. I will not be connecting to the One Connect box and I currently only have a single GTX 780 Ti Superclocked card. I know if I try to run Titanfall or any other AAA game at native 4K my frames won't exceed 20-30 fps. I cannot/will not play a shooter at less than 50 fps, so I'm going to have to keep the in-game resolution well below 4K. So, until the HDMI 2.0 cards come out and I upgrade to a new 4K receiver, I'm pretty much stuck with whatever benefits I get from an upscaled image. Please correct me if I'm wrong in my thinking.

Are you basically saying that I should hold off on a 4K TV until I can feed it a native 4K gaming source? Same for movies?

Yes, it would be wise to wait unless you can take advantage of the 4K resolution now. I've been playing Dark Souls 2 on my set and it looks amazing at native 4K. Very playable despite being limited to 30 Hz, it is a slower game though so the frame rate is tolerable. Definitely wouldn't want to play a shooter locked at 30.

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post #825 of 10117 Old 05-01-2014, 11:35 PM
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28k will be the rave for ces2015 with hdmi4.0

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post #826 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 05:58 AM
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Are any of you using a bluetooth keyboard? If so, which one. I tried my apple keyboard and it did not pair with the TV, so I just want to make sure I get a compatible one. The official smartTV keyboard has pretty atrocious reviews.
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post #827 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 06:06 AM
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While I am waiting on my 8550 delivery, reading some threads got me thinking to ask this question........there is another "official thread" for these TVs and the question of lip sync seems to come up quite a bit.........anyone here having any issues with this subject either with the TVs internal speakers, or with external speakers? If so, what is your remedy? My current set up with an old Sony XBR has been flawless with regard to tlhis issue.
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post #828 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 07:49 AM
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The sounds settings have an option for audio delay you can adjust up or down if you have an issue with out of sync audio.

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post #829 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x3sphere View Post

The pic quality when upscaled can't exceed a 1080p signal in quality if that's your source...

I wouldn't buy a 4K TV for upscaling. Buy one if you plan to view content at native 4K. You can't expect any miracles from upscaling its main purpose is to just make the picture quality not look worse with minimal scaling artifacts.

Totally disagree. Upscaled 4K looks amazing and is clearly better than the native resolution(1080 etc) whether I am watching cable or blu-rays but everyone has their own opinion. All you can do is see for yourself.
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post #830 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 08:09 AM
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Totally disagree. Upscaled 4K looks amazing and is clearly better than the native resolution(1080 etc) whether I am watching cable or blu-rays but everyone has their own opinion. All you can do is see for yourself.

DO you think the box from Direct TV could make a difference. Blu-ray looked amaizing on my set, minus the corner light bleed I have that is causing me to return this one, but when watching Direct TV, I felt like sometimes it looked really grainy.
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post #831 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
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Totally disagree. Upscaled 4K looks amazing and is clearly better than the native resolution(1080 etc) whether I am watching cable or blu-rays but everyone has their own opinion. All you can do is see for yourself.

I looked at the exact same video clip from the exact same feed on the HU8550 and the H7150.  There was absolutely no difference in PQ and sharpness.  The sets were right next to each other.  I don't think that upscaling is doing any miracles.  Its taking a image and stretching it... but it isn't making the image worse.  

 

edit: if the image wasn't upscaled, there would be a black bar all the way around the image.  I could be wrong about the whole "upscaling" marketing ploy but I don't think that it does anything other than stretch the image and do a little processing.

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HTPC: z97 mobo, 16GB mem, i5-4440, SSD+HD, LG BD drive, Win 8.1 pro w/WMC + MB3.
Content sources: OTA Winegard HD7698P, Amazon Fire TV Stick, Netflix etc.
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post #832 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhughy2010 View Post

I looked at the exact same video clip from the exact same feed on the HU8550 and the H7150.  There was absolutely no difference in PQ and sharpness.  The sets were right next to each other.  I don't think that upscaling is doing any miracles.  Its taking a image and stretching it... but it isn't making the image worse.  

edit: if the image wasn't upscaled, there would be a black bar all the way around the image.  I could be wrong about the whole "upscaling" marketing ploy but I don't think that it does anything other than stretch the image and do a little processing.

Well there are more pixels on the screen, it is not just stretching, and with larger TV's this makes a difference.

FWIW look at the different images here:

http://www.red.com/learn/red-101/upscaled-1080P-vs-4K


I can tell you that watching an upscaled 4K hockey game is a huge improvement, the clarity of the puck and PQ is far superior to my Samsung plasma in 1080P. The same goes when watching baseball, Vikings, GOT, or pretty much anything else. Older movies and tv shows....not so much.
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post #833 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joneszilla View Post

Totally disagree. Upscaled 4K looks amazing and is clearly better than the native resolution(1080 etc) whether I am watching cable or blu-rays but everyone has their own opinion. All you can do is see for yourself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joneszilla View Post

Well there are more pixels on the screen, it is not just stretching, and with larger TV's this makes a difference.

FWIW look at the different images here:

http://www.red.com/learn/red-101/upscaled-1080P-vs-4K


I can tell you that watching an upscaled 4K hockey game is a huge improvement, the clarity of the puck and PQ is far superior to my Samsung plasma in 1080P. The same goes when watching baseball, Vikings, GOT, or pretty much anything else. Older movies and tv shows....not so much.

I agree the upscaled 1080 to 4K is an improvement as long as the original 1080 signal is very good. I have noticed a nice improvement with a good quality signal (not all channels especially the one that use tons of compression) and blu-rays are spectacular.

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post #834 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 10:00 AM
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I've decided to cancel my HU9000 until I can feed it a native 4K gaming source. My main priority is gaming and if the upscaling isn't going to significantly improve the 1080p quality of the game I'm playing then it will be a waste.

Can anyone tell me if Titanfall is going to look noticeably better upscaled versus the quality I have now on my Sony W900A?
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post #835 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

I've decided to cancel my HU9000 until I can feed it a native 4K gaming source. My main priority is gaming and if the upscaling isn't going to significantly improve the 1080p quality of the game I'm playing then it will be a waste.

The improvement is not like it was when we went from SD to HD but there is a marginal improvement if the source is good. Since gaming signals are very good from consoles in the first place I would think you would see an nice upscaled improvement. PC gaming can be done in 4K!

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post #836 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 10:11 AM
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what settings are you guys using on the 8550? I noticed lots of shadow noise etc...not sure if it can be tweaked

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post #837 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 10:57 AM
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The improvement is not like it was when we went from SD to HD but there is a marginal improvement if the source is good. Since gaming signals are very good from consoles in the first place I would think you would see an nice upscaled improvement. PC gaming can be done in 4K!

Yes, but at the expense of a serious reduction in frames per second, which is unacceptable for a game like Titanfall. 4K gaming is NOT feasible on PC without at least a high-end SLI configuration. Even still, you are limited to 30fps and again, that is unacceptable for online shooters. I guess I can take the chance to see how Titanfall looks upscaled to see if it is worth it. I just don't want to have a $3500 TV sit in my house and only provide a marginal improvement of my already fantastic, top-rated W900A.
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post #838 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

I've decided to cancel my HU9000 until I can feed it a native 4K gaming source. My main priority is gaming and if the upscaling isn't going to significantly improve the 1080p quality of the game I'm playing then it will be a waste. Can anyone tell me if Titanfall is going to look noticeably better upscaled versus the quality I have now on my Sony W900A?
Upscaling is not going to do much. If you want to be amazed, you will need 4K material, transferred in 4K.
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post #839 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 11:28 AM
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Well there are more pixels on the screen, it is not just stretching, and with larger TV's this makes a difference.

FWIW look at the different images here:

http://www.red.com/learn/red-101/upscaled-1080P-vs-4K


I can tell you that watching an upscaled 4K hockey game is a huge improvement, the clarity of the puck and PQ is far superior to my Samsung plasma in 1080P. The same goes when watching baseball, Vikings, GOT, or pretty much anything else. Older movies and tv shows....not so much.

 

That short article was very informative and cleared up the confusion that I myself had for the "upscaling" talk of some of these 4k sets.  

 

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Yes, but at the expense of a serious reduction in frames per second, which is unacceptable for a game like Titanfall. 4K gaming is NOT feasible on PC without at least a high-end SLI configuration. Even still, you are limited to 30fps and again, that is unacceptable for online shooters. I guess I can take the chance to see how Titanfall looks upscaled to see if it is worth it. I just don't want to have a $3500 TV sit in my house and only provide a marginal improvement of my already fantastic, top-rated W900A.

 

I believe you made a wise choice for canceling your order if you have aspirations to do it right when the time comes.  Like I've said in the past, I think PC gamers who intend to play FPS games need to wait until these 4k sets have all been released (we still are waiting on Sony, Panasonic, Toshiba and Vizio).  We will get a better idea of which set is better for PC gaming in general.  I think the HU8550 might not be the best out of all of these sets that are to be released in regards to input lag.  

 

Furthermore, Pioneer, Denon and Marantz have yet to ship there HDMI 2.0 AVRs to retailers.  The only option today is Onkyo (even though this seems like a good AVR).  Last but not least, there are no Nvidia or ATI cards with HDMI 2.0 and I expect that we won't see one until late June to early August.  I actually haven't even heard of the vendors making this a priority (they are pretty hush to begin with).


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AVR: Pioneer VSX-1124-K.
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post #840 of 10117 Old 05-02-2014, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAUROS View Post

Yes, but at the expense of a serious reduction in frames per second, which is unacceptable for a game like Titanfall. 4K gaming is NOT feasible on PC without at least a high-end SLI configuration. Even still, you are limited to 30fps and again, that is unacceptable for online shooters. I guess I can take the chance to see how Titanfall looks upscaled to see if it is worth it. I just don't want to have a $3500 TV sit in my house and only provide a marginal improvement of my already fantastic, top-rated W900A.

Maybe you can get a test at BB or somewhere then decide if its worth it. W900A is a fine set!

Sammy 4k UN65HU9000 CURVED - Calman5 Calibrated" ----------- Oppo 103D for Blu Ray & SACD & DVD-A
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