2014 Panasonic AX800 and AX900 4K FALD LED/LCD lineup - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 06:32 AM
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The DCI is 98% original color spectrum that digital cinema shown, what the director originally conceived in his movies... so it does not mean that colors are saturated, but otherwise its amplitude or color range is much wider than the standard Rec709 based on RGB; instead the DCI 98% is based: RGB+CMY (Cyan, Magneta and Yellow) see this chart:

colormode.jpeg


As you can see the range of colors of Digital Cinema (DCI 98%) is much higher than the standard HDTV Rec709, so display more colors can not be reproduced by LCD LED Conventional (such as: the turquoise color may not be reproduced by this).

We all have our bluray players, the '1080p Pixel Direct' option which means make a 'bypass' with the TV, under a new 4:4:4 color sampling which leaves the TV (according to its own color space resources) you can expand it to more color range than the simple standard Rec.709.
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post #92 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 07:21 AM
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As you can see the range of colors of Digital Cinema (DCI 98%) is much higher than the standard HDTV Rec709,

Nothing new in your explanation

You  not understand Blue Ray comes standard REC 709 onle REC 709
So what does it matter if my tv DCI 98% ? or rec 2020 ?

 

Quote:
you can expand it to more color range than the simple standard Rec.709.

from Where the screen Does another color ?

if the screen have option  to Display DCI 98%  He needs a compatible movie with DCI 98% colorer, the screen not making colorer No in the movie

 

 

Like I write

If I have a screen 4K so all the movies that i see is 4K

It is nonsense to write this

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post #93 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by BBBB1111 View Post

Nothing new in your explanation
You  not understand Blue Ray comes standard REC 709 onle REC 709

So what does it matter if my tv DCI 98% ? or rec 2020 ?

In practice, when in the store playing a Bluray anyone, both the AX800/4K and H9000/4K while... See if the same color, or just one of them is showing more color range on the standard Rec709 profile.
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post #94 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 08:27 AM
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In practice, when in the store playing a Bluray anyone, both the AX800/4K and H9000/4K while... See if the same color, or just one of them is showing more color range on the standard Rec709 profile.

Do you have proof ?

standard Rec709  is only play standard Rec709 

You do mix

 

Movies come 4:2:0

Games can be follow 4:4:4

 

i have tv 4661f  with 16 bit coler 48 bit 

And there is something in your words 4:4:4 Appears to be superior with amd video card hd7950

But need special player, adjust encoded 

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post #95 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by fonz5000 View Post

This is what my HU9000 looks like that they are replacing today. I really have no idea what I will do if the new one looks like that too. I don't want to spend $8000 for the Sony 950B or the AX900.

Yet the price of AX900 (newly released in September) is not known where they got that price $ 8000?

In my opinion I do not think pass of $ 5,000 at that time... hopefully, meanwhile only speculate.
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post #96 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 03:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonoman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by fonz5000 View Post

This is what my HU9000 looks like that they are replacing today. I really have no idea what I will do if the new one looks like that too. I don't want to spend $8000 for the Sony 950B or the AX900.

Yet the price of AX900 (newly released in September) is not known where they got that price $ 8000?

In my opinion I do not think pass of $ 5,000 at that time... hopefully, meanwhile only speculate.

Well, the MSRP of the 58" AX800 (edge-lit) is $3800: http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model/TC-58AX800U

So if you think the MSRP for the 65" AX900 full-array local dimming flagship will be below $5000, all I can say is 'dream on' biggrin.gif
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post #97 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post

Well, the MSRP of the 58" AX800 (edge-lit) is $3800: http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model/TC-58AX800U

So if you think the MSRP for the 65" AX900 full-array local dimming flagship will be below $5000, all I can say is 'dream on' biggrin.gif

Remember that there are three sizes, the AX900/4K : 50 ", 65" and 85 "(this may exceed $ 7,000) but the 65" ?.... if the Nano Full LED (which is much more complex than the Full Array) LG LA9700/4K of 65" on Amazon cost $ 4,999
http://www.amazon.com/LG-Electronics-65LA9700-65-Inch-Sliding/dp/B00DYVK1RY

Only time will agree... while we're both just speculating. cool.gif
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post #98 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonoman View Post


Remember that there are three sizes, the AX900/4K : 50 ", 65" and 85 "(this may exceed $ 7,000) but the 65" ?.... if the Nano Full LED (which is much more complex than the Full Array) LG LA9700/4K of 65" on Amazon cost $ 4,999
http://www.amazon.com/LG-Electronics-65LA9700-65-Inch-Sliding/dp/B00DYVK1RY

Only time will agree... while we're both just speculating. cool.gif

Nano LED is just a marketing term, it's the same thing as full array.

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post #99 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 04:30 PM
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Originally Posted by x3sphere View Post

Nano LED is just a marketing term, it's the same thing as full array.

In structural terms as LED backlighting, you could say yes ... but in terms of regulation zones, is different: can have 2,304 blocks of 8 (Hence the name of Nano)
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post #100 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 05:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonoman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by x3sphere View Post

Nano LED is just a marketing term, it's the same thing as full array.

In structural terms as LED backlighting, you could say yes ... but in terms of regulation zones, is different: can have 2,304 blocks of 8 (Hence the name of Nano)

The 65LA9700 has an MSRP of $7500 and has been such a poor performer that LG will probably have to give them away. I doubt they are finding many buyers even at the current 'discounted' price of $5000.

Whatever new local dimming technology LG tried to introduce with the LA9700, it did not work well enough to make up for the other deficiencies, and I expect the Panasonic AX800 (let alone the AX900) to vastly outperform the LG9700 in terms of image uniformity and lack of artifacts.
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post #101 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post

The 65LA9700 has an MSRP of $7500 and has been such a poor performer that LG will probably have to give them away. I doubt they are finding many buyers even at the current 'discounted' price of $5000.

Whatever new local dimming technology LG tried to introduce with the LA9700, it did not work well enough to make up for the other deficiencies, and I expect the Panasonic AX800 (let alone the AX900) to vastly outperform the LG9700 in terms of image uniformity and lack of artifacts.

Malfunction? please .. LA9700/4K the LG has a very deep black level of 0.005 cd/m2, contrast ratio of 25,000 and a perfect uniformity (nothing Clouding, DSE, flaslight, Bleending, etc). Check the web reviews, and their owners....
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post #102 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 06:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonoman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by fafrd View Post

The 65LA9700 has an MSRP of $7500 and has been such a poor performer that LG will probably have to give them away. I doubt they are finding many buyers even at the current 'discounted' price of $5000.

Whatever new local dimming technology LG tried to introduce with the LA9700, it did not work well enough to make up for the other deficiencies, and I expect the Panasonic AX800 (let alone the AX900) to vastly outperform the LG9700 in terms of image uniformity and lack of artifacts.

Malfunction? please .. LA9700/4K the LG has a very deep black level of 0.005 cd/m2, contrast ratio of 25,000 and a perfect uniformity (nothing Clouding, DSE, flaslight, Bleending, etc). Check the web reviews, and their owners....

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427711,00.asp

"The LA9700 turned in a respectable black level measurement of 0.0356 cd/m2 and a peak brightness level of 296.08 cd/m2. The resulting contrast ratio of 8,316:1 was solid, but doesn't come close to the kind of intricate black detail that you get from a high-end plasma set..."

"I noticed some minor background noise in certain up-scaled scenes, and backlight bloom, or haloing, was evident in scenes with dark backgrounds..."

In addition, no HDMI 2.0
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post #103 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427711,00.asp

"The LA9700 turned in a respectable black level measurement of 0.0356 cd/m2 and a peak brightness level of 296.08 cd/m2. The resulting contrast ratio of 8,316:1 was solid, but doesn't come close to the kind of intricate black detail that you get from a high-end plasma set..."

"I noticed some minor background noise in certain up-scaled scenes, and backlight bloom, or haloing, was evident in scenes with dark backgrounds..."

In addition, no HDMI 2.0

Pcgam?.... Check a serious review:
http://www.avforums.com/review/lg-la970w-uhd-tv-review.9441#sectionAnchor28070

"If there was one area where the LA970 really surprised us, it was in terms of it’s native black levels. We actually measured black at 0.005cd/m2 which is extremely good for an IPS panel. The LA970 also had plenty of brightness, easily hitting out target of 120cd/m2 and giving us an on/off contrast ratio of 24,000:1 "

"However as the checker board pattern shows, thanks to the full array backlight the measurements were very uniform.In fact this was one area where the LA970 was especially strong, with a very uniform backlight and no clouding and bright corners or edges. "


P.D: I was wrong in stating 25,000:1.... and I leave the discussion here, that we are out of topic.
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post #104 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 07:59 PM
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I've seen a 65" LA9700 in person. It definitely has blooming from the FALD backlight. The store I saw it in was too bright to make an evaluation on the black level.
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post #105 of 295 Old 05-08-2014, 08:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonoman View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by fafrd View Post

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427711,00.asp

"The LA9700 turned in a respectable black level measurement of 0.0356 cd/m2 and a peak brightness level of 296.08 cd/m2. The resulting contrast ratio of 8,316:1 was solid, but doesn't come close to the kind of intricate black detail that you get from a high-end plasma set..."

"I noticed some minor background noise in certain up-scaled scenes, and backlight bloom, or haloing, was evident in scenes with dark backgrounds..."

In addition, no HDMI 2.0

Pcgam?.... Check a serious review:
http://www.avforums.com/review/lg-la970w-uhd-tv-review.9441#sectionAnchor28070

"If there was one area where the LA970 really surprised us, it was in terms of it’s native black levels. We actually measured black at 0.005cd/m2 which is extremely good for an IPS panel. The LA970 also had plenty of brightness, easily hitting out target of 120cd/m2 and giving us an on/off contrast ratio of 24,000:1 "

"However as the checker board pattern shows, thanks to the full array backlight the measurements were very uniform.In fact this was one area where the LA970 was especially strong, with a very uniform backlight and no clouding and bright corners or edges. "


P.D: I was wrong in stating 25,000:1.... and I leave the discussion here, that we are out of topic.

I did check out your review - here are some excerpts:

'The LA970 also had plenty of brightness, easily hitting out target of 120cd/m2 and giving us an on/off contrast ratio of 24,000:1. When it came to the ANSI contrast ratio, things weren’t quite as impressive, with the LA970 measuring at 1,767:1.

'In fact this was one area where the LA970 was especially strong, with a very uniform backlight and no clouding and bright corners or edges. Unfortunately all this good work was undone once you moved off-axis. Surprisingly for an IPS panel, the off-axis performance was very poor with bright objects against dark backgrounds glowing very noticeably, even with local dimming turned off. '

'So whilst the picture looked great directly in front of the screen, it rapidly deteriorated as you moved further from centre.'


'The LEDs are just too close to the panel itself and LG's proprietary Nano filter doesn't diffuse them enough to eliminate certain issues. Thus, as we mentioned in the Test Results section, as soon as you move off centre bright objects against dark backgrounds glow excessively. This haloing is common with poorly applied local dimming but it was obvious on the LA970 regardless of whether the local dimming was on or off. As long as you were sat dead centre it was not an issue but as soon as you moved to either side it was immediately noticeable. We could tolerate the glowing to a certain extent because, as we said, it wasn't an issue when you watched the LA970 directly on-axis but it will make it difficult for the whole family to watch TV when spread across the living room.'

'The second factor was far more of an issue and is again a result of the LEDs proximity to the panel. Unfortunately whenever a camera panned from one side to the other banding was clearly visible. This banding was the result of LED array and you could literally see the columns of LEDs that make up the backlight. Again it didn't matter if the local dimming was on or off and it was always there regardless of whether you were watching 4K, high-def or 3D content. It was especially noticeable if the camera panned over a uniform surface such as a sky or a green field and thus made football almost unwatchable. LG developed the Nano filter as a way of combating this banding but it has proved largely ineffective and LG have failed to address this problem despite us feeding back our comments on it over the last two years. As a result the picture is compromised and certainly can't justify the LA970's hefty price tag.


'The glowing of bright objects on dark backgrounds once you move off-axis means the LA970 has very limited viewing angles, which is a problem for a TV this big. Whilst the banding that appears every time a camera pans will make some content and especially football almost unwatchable. '

'The simple fact is that the 65-inch UHD TVs on offer from both Sony and Samsung offer better performance for a lower price and, as a result, the LG 65LA970W is a case of close but no cigar.'

I would have been interested in this TV, but the reported problems with very poor off axis performance, haloing/blooming, and banding during pans caused me to cross the LA970 off my list. From what I have read so far, I expect the AX800 and AX900 to deliver superior picture quality for the money.
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Panasonic AX800

Do not write the screen brightness ?

Do not write  the  total  colors  ?

Do not write  what panel  8bit or 12 bit ?

 

Do not write  what contrast ?

 

Do not write  if thay work whit 4:4:4 8bit or more ?

 

Customer service does not respond

Panasonic wants only money,no service, no responses

 

more info:

http://hdguru.com/hands-on-panasonics-tc-l65ax800-4k-ultra-hdtv/

"The lack of dark detail has been an issue since the first LCDs and we are pleased panel "

 

"the AX800 displayed some clouding (lighter areas) on letterboxed bars."

 

4500$ for what ?

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post #107 of 295 Old 05-09-2014, 04:59 AM
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Originally Posted by fafrd View Post

From what I have read so far, I expect the AX800 and AX900 to deliver superior picture quality for the money.
The AX900 will use the same IPS panel and have a similar backlight. I wouldn't get your hopes up too much with regards to some of the problems the LA9700 had.
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post #108 of 295 Old 05-09-2014, 06:52 AM
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The AX900 will use the same IPS panel and have a similar backlight. I wouldn't get your hopes up too much with regards to some of the problems the LA9700 had.

what problems ?

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In the prototype AX900/4k, will detect a small haloing the backlight (which can happen in a FALD) but has several months to correct ... so would not be worrying about that.
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what problems ?
Contrast ratio, off angle black levels, blooming, etc.
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post #111 of 295 Old 05-09-2014, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post


Contrast ratio, off angle black levels, blooming, etc.


the tv has Full array, locally-dimmed backlights make for great black levels

have the bast  contrast ratios of 55,779:1

 

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427711,00.asp

 

I have no idea what you're writing?

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the tv has Full array, locally-dimmed backlights make for great black levels
have the bast  contrast ratios of 55,779:1



http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427711,00.asp

I have no idea what you're writing?
No need to respond then... I referenced some of the specific complaints listed in post 105 from this review of the LA9700.

IPS panels, like the LG LA9700 and the AX900 use do not have the same sort of native contrast ratio that VA type panels do. You're looking at something like 1500:1 vs. 4000:1 I'm well aware that full array local dimming backlights can enhance the contrast ratio of the panel. I'd still rather have a VA panel enhanced by a full array local dimming backlight than an IPS one.
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post #113 of 295 Old 05-09-2014, 10:27 AM
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If you like VA, then have to look at 85" AX900/4K which will be on the panel type. I personally prefer to be IPS, and If the engineers plasma Panasonic & Pioneer Kuro, chose to IPS 65"(and 50") to tie the overall performance of ZT60, their motives will...

I can not imagine for a TV room, do not have viewing angle (which is also a fundamental part of the picture) all have family, so as I see it well from the center, so well see what they're sitting next to me... the World Cup Brazil 2014 approaches, thus several friends come to visit me, and I do not want a bad impression with my TV was .... which by the way will be the AS800/1080p which is a Direct LED/IPS with Local Dimming.

I say an IPS panel with backlight types: Full Array, Direct LED, Nano Full LED; be a thousand times better uniformity, black level and contrast what based Edge LED/IPS backlight.

Oh taste for everyone....
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AX800 work with 4:4:4  10/12 bit ?

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Found out that 65AX800 will be $4999 in Canada.
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post #116 of 295 Old 05-09-2014, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyJoin View Post


the tv has Full array, locally-dimmed backlights make for great black levels
have the bast  contrast ratios of 55,779:1



http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427711,00.asp

I have no idea what you're writing?

That is on/off dynamic contrast.
It is meaningless in any content.
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post #117 of 295 Old 05-10-2014, 02:52 AM
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We all have our bluray players, the '1080p Pixel Direct' option which means make a 'bypass' with the TV, under a new 4:4:4 color sampling which leaves the TV (according to its own color space resources) you can expand it to more color range than the simple standard Rec.709.

How can I take advantage of this

with Samsung TV + Computer?
Connect  to  PC  HDMI ?
  ( in samsung this like game mode )

 

How can I take advantage of this  with tv 12 bit ?

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post #118 of 295 Old 05-10-2014, 04:13 AM
 
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we have the AX800 here in sweden now
here is the first rating about it.

its the 58AX800E
http://www.prisjakt.nu/produkt.php?p=2602303

(Google Translated)
Quote:
The rating is based on a comparison of the store ( compared it with ZT and ST series Panasonic plasma ) and a few hours at home without having had time to set it up properly. Last generation plasma is still slightly better in black and also has better viewing angle. So if you have dark room or watch TV without having to sit right in front of the plasma can be a better option . But the picture on the LCD when you feed it with Bluray or 4K is absolutely incredible. The colors and the depth of the picture is amazing. There will not plasma get close ( according to me that is not a pro ) . Tested just to play in the World Of Tanks in 4K via DisplayPort and it was really cool. Sorry is not enough my R9 290 to more than about 20-30 FPS so will perhaps have to be a 290 and Crossfire in the future. Had not thought about playing at this from the start. Have just noticed two negative things so far.
- When starting Netflix so it just says " coming soon " ? ?
- When switching from DisplayPort to HDMI TV, or so it seems that the TV will switch off the DisplayPort output. This makes your computer think that disconnecting the screen.
Both of these can however be configurations that I have not yet found . Will be back with updated scores when I had time to test some more.
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post #119 of 295 Old 05-10-2014, 05:06 AM
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the '1080p Pixel Direct' option which means make a 'bypass' with the TV, under a new 4:4:4 color sampling which leaves the TV (according to its own color space resources) you can expand it to more color range than the simple standard Rec.709.

do you try it with 4:4:4

to see Digital Cinema (DCI 98%)  ?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhyJoin View Post

do you try it with 4:4:4
to see Digital Cinema (DCI 98%)  ?

If the same ZT60.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBBB1111 View Post

AX800 work with 4:4:4  10/12 bit ?




Although I say yes (because it has Display Port 1.2a, HDMI 2.0, HEVC)... would be good to consult directly with the Panasonic support, since not indicated on its website 'officially' but all indicate so ... at least 10 bit.


Published a recent update to Caiman (5.3.5 build 1562), it will add support for Panasonic Series: AS800/1080p (DCI 92%), AX800/4K (DCI 98%) and AX900/4K (DCI 98%)
http://www.spectracal.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=119&t=5298

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