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post #1 of 179 Old 05-25-2014, 06:48 AM - Thread Starter
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In the market between now and at least this fall for 79+" new TV. Won't consider 70" or 65" (already have 64" and 65" plasmas in the house). Not excited about 75". Would be fine with 90", or even 120", but don't plan to spend 5-figures so that rules out the options now or upcoming that are over 90". Getting 4K would be a nice bonus but not essential. If I did, it would only be worth a dime if it either came or could be upgraded to HDMI 2.0, HVEC, etc. Otherwise a 4K panel is useless. FALD would be awesome, but I won't go smaller to accommodate it or pay $20+K for an 80-something inch set, so looking unlikely now that the new Vizio 80" turns out to be a re-badge of last year's non-FALD set. Coming from mostly plasma so used to good PQ so already trying to reset my expectations lower. Hate, hate, hate edge enhancements/soap opera effect, etc.

So here's what I think I should be looking at now. Help me flesh out options I am missing or key facts I should know:

-- Sharp 90" 1080P edge-lit 2013 tech

-- Sharp 80" 1080P edge-lit, 2013 or 2014 tech

-- Sharp 80" Q+ 4K lite, 2014 tech. Ruling out as I would be paying a premium for a marketing-gimmick that down coverts to 1080P anyway and early professional and user reviews all say the panel isn't great

-- Vizio M series 80", 2013 tech. Pros/cons versus the comparable Sharp? I have a smaller 2012 Vizio in a secondary room which is the worst TV I have ever bought. Terrible picture, even worse remote.

-- LG 4K 84" 2013 tech. Can be had while supplies last for about 1/3rd of original price bringing it in line with some of the options above. Decent reviews of picture and sound. pre-HDMI 2/HVEC but tons of quotes from LG reps that an upgrade of the board is coming as an option within a couple months. Also lots of complaints about audio lip sync issues when playing 3D. But true 4K at the same price range as the comparable sized Q+ faux 4K.

-- LG 4K 79" 2014 tech. HDMI 2/HVEC, etc. WebOS. About a grand more than getting last year's 84". The new 84" would be outside my price range.

-- Not sure there's anything in the Sony or Samsung line that will really apply? 75" is not an option.

Just as my last Vizio TV was terrible, I also have a mid-line 60" LG from 2012 that is surprisingly great. Also, watching passive 3D on that LG is SO MUCH BETTER than on the active 3D 64" Panasonic plasma. So as 3D goes, I am a major convert to passive so that's a plus about the LG's.

What am I missing?
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post #2 of 179 Old 05-25-2014, 07:24 AM
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If you are trying to stay under $10K your options are limited. There are 84" ones from Toshiba, JVC and others that all most likely use the LG Display panel. TCL is suppose to have an 85" set. If you want the probably the best picture you can get, their is the 77" OLED from LG that should be under $20K. Lg will also have a 79" and 98" LCD. Sony and Samsung both have 85" but are way over priced.
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post #3 of 179 Old 05-26-2014, 06:55 AM
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I'm in exactly the same boat as you with the same purchasing requirements. I rarely post here but read a lot. When I look at the TV's at Best Buy, I cannot get a real sense of which one I like best because they are set up so poorly. The 79+" category is a little lacking, and the 80" Vizio being edge lit was a definite disappointment

I can't see buying the older LG 84" set with 2 year old technology just because it's 4K and meets our size and price requirements. I think all the 2014 sets have excellent picture quality. I am a FALD believer since my bedroom set is a 47" full array LG model and the black levels are superb.

It is a very tough decision. I am not one to return a set because there may be something nicer or if there's a little blooming or light spot. I just want to make the right decision once and be happy thereafter.
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post #4 of 179 Old 05-26-2014, 01:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Dr Chill View Post

I'm in exactly the same boat as you with the same purchasing requirements. I rarely post here but read a lot. When I look at the TV's at Best Buy, I cannot get a real sense of which one I like best because they are set up so poorly. The 79+" category is a little lacking, and the 80" Vizio being edge lit was a definite disappointment

I can't see buying the older LG 84" set with 2 year old technology just because it's 4K and meets our size and price requirements. I think all the 2014 sets have excellent picture quality. I am a FALD believer since my bedroom set is a 47" full array LG model and the black levels are superb.

It is a very tough decision. I am not one to return a set because there may be something nicer or if there's a little blooming or light spot. I just want to make the right decision once and be happy thereafter.

If you make your decision or learn more, let me know. I'll do the same.

The reason I haven't ruled out the old LG (though waiting may rule it out for me) is:

1) It received generally great reviews for picture quality for an edge-lit set. With the exception of the FALD sets, none of which are available for under $10K at 79" or above, there doesn't appear to be any technological advance to the 2014 LCD sets picture-wise. In fact, some are saying the 2014 Sharp's are a step-back from 2013. They probably are more or less neutral. So not sure that it matters if not getting FALD whether it is last year's panels or this years.

2) Since the Q+ from Sharp appears to be a marketing gimmick that does not preserve the 4K image integrity before converting it for the "sub-pixels" the users seem to be saying it's a wash with the non-Q+ sets. And it's not true HDMI 2.0 or HVEC, so won't really be able to get much 4K content. That means you either skip 4K entirely or get a true 4K set. LG appears to be the most affordable in this size range. Would be nice to short-term future proof it, though not essential.

3) As I said in the first post, I have a 55" mid-line LG and have been impressed with it. Didn't do my normal level of research as it was for a cabin but it's become my second favorite TV after our 64" Samsung plasma (and ahead of our 65" Panasonic plasma). Didn't even calibrate it like we did the Samsung so using it out of the box. By comparison the Vizio we also got without researching is truly terrible, both he picture and the remote. EVen my wife comments on it and she's not a videophile in the least. So I am positively inclined toward LG. I like Samsung too, and Panasonic, and for LCD would be fine with Sony. Just not sure any of those brands have an option in my criteria and price range this year. I am agnostic about Sharp. Haven't owned one but we use the 70" panels at work as conference room monitors and the picture is great and bright -- at least displaying a PC screen. I tried watching some Blu-rays's on some panels at Magnolia using the various THX and Film modes and they all sucked for that. Shy of true calibration I seemed to have to chose between significant edge enhancement/soap opera effect or a truly dull, washed out picture.
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post #5 of 179 Old 05-27-2014, 08:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Guess I am reluctantly throwing the Samsung 78" curved panel into the mix since besides being a couple inches too small it meets all the key criteria. I don't really want a curved panel but still looking for the best performing large TV under $10K...
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post #6 of 179 Old 05-31-2014, 09:04 PM
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I'm in the same boat as you. Saw the LG - thought it sucked - was really hoping that would be the one. I really don't want a curved screen (I don't have curved walls and no curved content) and for some reason the latest curved Samsung isn't getting very good reviews but to be fair not many are getting consistently good reviews. That leaves the new Sony 78.6" x900b and Samsung 75" HUG8550. I'm going to try to be a good boy and wait until the end of the year to see if Sony releases a 78.6" model without the ridiculous side speakers. They did last year about 6 months after the release of their all in one set so I'm hoping they do the same again this year. From what I've seen, the flat Samsung has more vibrant colors, is brighter and thinner. The Sony has better motion which is pretty important to me (although it still isn't as good as a CRT or even a plasma). If I could combine the best of both I'd have a great TV or if Panasonic made a 4K plasma smile.gif.
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post #7 of 179 Old 05-31-2014, 09:58 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm in the same boat as you. Saw the LG - thought it sucked - was really hoping that would be the one. I really don't want a curved screen (I don't have curved walls and no curved content) and for some reason the latest curved Samsung isn't getting very good reviews but to be fair not many are getting consistently good reviews. That leaves the new Sony 78.6" x900b and Samsung 75" HUG8550. I'm going to try to be a good boy and wait until the end of the year to see if Sony releases a 78.6" model without the ridiculous side speakers. They did last year about 6 months after the release of their all in one set so I'm hoping they do the same again this year. From what I've seen, the flat Samsung has more vibrant colors, is brighter and thinner. The Sony has better motion which is pretty important to me (although it still isn't as good as a CRT or even a plasma). If I could combine the best of both I'd have a great TV or if Panasonic made a 4K plasma smile.gif.

You have seen the NEW LG already? Where? Which model? What exactly didn't you like. That's too bad if so because I was hoping it would be good.

I don't have a problem with the side speakers on the Sony either so that one is still in the running for me. Haven't seen it, the 2014 79" LG, the curved Samsung, so those are all in contention, though I am biased against curved if I have a choice (I guess some people must buy these sets to have only a couple people sit perfectly center in front of the TV but that wouldn't work in my household).

I care first, second and third about PQ (after size). I don't care how thick it is or the brand or if it has speakers or a thick bezel or whatever. I do care that it not have all the things that make the picture blow like uniformity problems, flash lighting, clouding, blooming, degraded off-angle viewing (though for this room I shouldt need more than about 40%), etc.. Coming from a couple 65" plasmas so unfortunately my bar is pretty high. And I care about scaling quality because a lot of viewing will come from DirecTV playing 1080i or 720p.
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post #8 of 179 Old 05-31-2014, 10:56 PM
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I saw the latest LG at AV in Santa Monica. They got the first batch of them. The color was oversaturated and the motion was dreadful. While it could require some tweaking I don't think if I tried I could make my TV look that bad. I was really hoping it would look good but within about 30 seconds it was all I needed to see. I drove all the way down there and left before a nickel on the meter would have been used (I wasted a whole quarter smile.gif ) I might look at it one more time before I buy my next TV but certainly not at that store. I'd suggest it was a customer purposely f'ing it up but there was no remote to be found so they would have had to have come with their own remote for the sabotage which seems a little far fetched.

I think the Samsung backlit LED is better for uniformity than the Sony but the motion on the Sony is better. That being said I hope the whole curved screen nonsense is dies quickly and goes away, unlike the 3D which fester under the front porch.

I do care about thickness because to a degree that goes with weight and the Sony with speakers is not only very thick but too heavy for my preferred TV mount. In addition it significantly increases the cost for a dunsel. I think you'll have to accept a step down from plasma in some respect but once you exceed 70" you really need 4K. There is always a slight chance Panasonic will have something before the end of the year as well but so far none of the articles on the Panasonic AX900 seem to pay much attention to motion and if you watch sports or movies with action, that can be very important.
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post #9 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 02:26 PM - Thread Starter
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It is frustrating how every set is still a major trade-off. I don't feel like that was a the case with plasma for the last few years, relative to its technology. Both Panasonic and Samsung were excellent and people were really splitting hairs to pick their favorite. And of course the Kuru from 2009 still wins shoot outs.

But turn to LED still in 2014 and you have to pick between sets with terrible motion and image enhancement, or terrible blacks and clouding or curved sets that create weird reflections and have to be viewed from near center angle, etc. And you have to perpetually wait, wait, wait because the manufactures spread out the delivery of their competing sets over the entire year, so if you aren't sure you want to settle for the trade-off's of the Sony, Samsung or LG you have to wait until the end of the year to see if the Panasonic or Vizio FALD's are worth it, etc.

I felt back in the plasma day that if I needed a new set I could expect at any given year there would be some minor evolutionary improvement the next year but nothing to worry about. Now I feel like every year is a year away from a truly great set…

Almost makes me want to say screw it, get a sub-$3K 80" 1080P panel from Vizio or Sharp and revisit this in a few years...
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post #10 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 03:16 PM
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I'm also looking into ~80in TV's. I was debating a projector but the estimated cost for a good projector, special blinds, the screen, etc were too much. Plus I want to be able to watch basketball/football games during the day without any problems. I know sharp 80UQ in is not true 4K but I'm finding that the price is coming down recently so it's not really much of a premium over the previous year's model. I was considering the Samsung 78hu9000 but I'm not sold on the curved screen, especially if i'm using it for a mini home theatre and people seated on the sides may not like the view. I think I may have to wait to see if Samsung comes out with a flat screen 78in, or wait for the Sony. I've had previous bad experience with Vizio and I'm not too familiar with LG"s upcoming models.

for the price I'm thinking the sharp 80UQ is the best bet if someone needs a tv right now. I'm usually patient but if the sharp drops below 4000 I think i'll jump on the deal. otherwise i'm waiting it out for a few months. I'm curious about the Panasonic TV coming out but will it be 80in?
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post #11 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 04:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm also looking into ~80in TV's. I was debating a projector but the estimated cost for a good projector, special blinds, the screen, etc were too much. Plus I want to be able to watch basketball/football games during the day without any problems. I know sharp 80UQ in is not true 4K but I'm finding that the price is coming down recently so it's not really much of a premium over the previous year's model. I was considering the Samsung 78hu9000 but I'm not sold on the curved screen, especially if i'm using it for a mini home theatre and people seated on the sides may not like the view. I think I may have to wait to see if Samsung comes out with a flat screen 78in, or wait for the Sony. I've had previous bad experience with Vizio and I'm not too familiar with LG"s upcoming models.

for the price I'm thinking the sharp 80UQ is the best bet if someone needs a tv right now. I'm usually patient but if the sharp drops below 4000 I think i'll jump on the deal. otherwise i'm waiting it out for a few months. I'm curious about the Panasonic TV coming out but will it be 80in?

The Sharp 80" UQ was the first of these models I took a close look at. To each their own but I ruled it out for myself. There are a couple reviews out as well as user feedback here. Of course with the user feedback you always get people mostly positive because they all want to self-justify their purchase but there were a fair number of critical reviews from purchasers here too -- none saying its terrible just that it's not great. The two professional reviews I saw so far both say the same thing -- that the Q+ panel is not much different than the regular Sharp panel so it's not worth the huge premium over just getting the LE650 panel from Sharp instead and saving a couple grand. Also, the UQ is kind of a weird bird when it comes to 4K. It's not true 4K resolution and you know that going in. In does accept HDMI 2.0. But there are no products that use it yet. The only real 4K content is either from the web, which didn't need 4K or from streaming providers that are using the new HEVC standard, which the UQ is not compatible with. So I'm not convinced that there will in the lifespan of the set be a real purpose for the 4K inputs. I suspect HEVC will be more important in the next couple of years.

In terms of quality control, I feel like I have seen comparable measures of negative feedback from both Sharp and Vizio owners. If you go to the Vizio topic it's full of people who said they burned through a couple defective Sharp's before giving up and getting their Vizio. In terms of personal experience, I too have had a bad one with Vizio. I have a mid-line 38" 2012 model set that is by a mile the worst I have ever owned of any technology, including CRT or rear screen. Picture quality is atrocious. And the remote is criminally bad. My whole family hates it. It's the only TV purchase I regret making. That said, by all accounts the high end large screen Vizio's they put out now, other that what appears to still be terrible remotes, are supposedly night and day from that. Samsung's early TV's were total garbage. So I am willing to cede that they can change -- they just need to fire whoever manages the group responsible for their remotes.
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post #12 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Citivas View Post

It is frustrating how every set is still a major trade-off. I don't feel like that was a the case with plasma for the last few years, relative to its technology. Both Panasonic and Samsung were excellent and people were really splitting hairs to pick their favorite. And of course the Kuru from 2009 still wins shoot outs.

But turn to LED still in 2014 and you have to pick between sets with terrible motion and image enhancement, or terrible blacks and clouding or curved sets that create weird reflections and have to be viewed from near center angle, etc. And you have to perpetually wait, wait, wait because the manufactures spread out the delivery of their competing sets over the entire year, so if you aren't sure you want to settle for the trade-off's of the Sony, Samsung or LG you have to wait until the end of the year to see if the Panasonic or Vizio FALD's are worth it, etc.

I felt back in the plasma day that if I needed a new set I could expect at any given year there would be some minor evolutionary improvement the next year but nothing to worry about. Now I feel like every year is a year away from a truly great set…

Almost makes me want to say screw it, get a sub-$3K 80" 1080P panel from Vizio or Sharp and revisit this in a few years...

I agree with pretty much most of what you said and it is very frustrating as I am in the market for a new TV for my bedroom and I need LCD since it will be mainly used as my computer display and I don't want to deal with image retention. I currently have a 46" Sammy D630 in there which has served me very well yet I want to go up to 55-60" and there is nothing but trade-offs with these TVs (not to mention having to play the panel lotto and hope the clouding isn't too severe) and it is frustrating. I have no real need for 4k yet it seems like I may need to get one if I want to get the top PQ these companies are offering unless I wait it out until 2015 which I just may do. Vizio is out for me since they don't sell here in Canada.

Your last comment may be the best option if a front projector set up won't work for you or doesn't appeal to you. I myself am a big front projection fan and am glad I have a projection setup for my movie watching as this tv stuff is too annoying.

Best of luck mate!

ROB
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post #13 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 05:05 PM
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All,

Wow, so glad to find this thread. I'm in the exact boat as you all. Looking for 80 in.

So what exactly is wrong with the Visio M-Series M801i-b2 thats supposed to be coming out in a few months?
I noticed the OP discounted it because it was 2013 tech? Can you explain.

It seems like it will be compelling at a price of $3200.00 and its the right size!

The only bad thing I've heard about it is the potential for game-mode to lock you out of all picture enhancement controls, resulting in a much dimmer display with game mode on. If true, a complete deal breaker for me.

However, until proven out, the Visio M801i-B2 is my front runner for a new TV while I wait a few years for 4K to make sense.

After reading this thread, I have a second option: The Sharp 80in Q+, but at $5,000.00 its a little more than I wanted to spend and not true 4k, so I really need the visio to be good... you guys are scaring me... smile.gif

-Mike
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post #14 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 05:55 PM - Thread Starter
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All,

Wow, so glad to find this thread. I'm in the exact boat as you all. Looking for 80 in.

So what exactly is wrong with the Visio M-Series M801i-b2 thats supposed to be coming out in a few months?
I noticed the OP discounted it because it was 2013 tech? Can you explain.

It seems like it will be compelling at a price of $3200.00 and its the right size!

The only bad thing I've heard about it is the potential for game-mode to lock you out of all picture enhancement controls, resulting in a much dimmer display with game mode on. If true, a complete deal breaker for me.

However, until proven out, the Visio M801i-B2 is my front runner for a new TV while I wait a few years for 4K to make sense.

After reading this thread, I have a second option: The Sharp 80in Q+, but at $5,000.00 its a little more than I wanted to spend and not true 4k, so I really need the visio to be good... you guys are scaring me... smile.gif

-Mike

As far as anyone can tell (information is not perfect), the 2014 M-series is exactly the same set as the 2013 series on the inside, without the 3D. The entire rest of the 2014 Vizio line-up are brand new panels that are now FALD (full array local dimming), which dramatically improves PQ if done well. Vizio previously sold a 3D model last year and a non-3D for less money. Many stores still have last year's 2013 model with 3D for $2,999 while supplies last. So basically you are paying $200 more to get the downgraded 2013 set that you may still be able to find for sale. I have seriously considered getting the 2013 set, but I would not pay more to get the same set without a feature.

Now Vizio has been playing coy by refusing to say whether the "new M-series 80" is really just a short-term interim set and that they still plan to release a truly new 80" later this year with a FALD display like the rest of their line-up. You can argue it both ways. Their website claims the new tech will come in up to 80" which favors this theory, Vizio refuses to deny it and it could be argued that it's logical they wouldn't confirm it because then no one would buy the current 80" sets. On the other hand it seems unlikely they would gear up for production and release a whole new product line, even if re-badged old tech, and then replace it 5 months later. Who knows. But personally I am skeptical. More likely they simply couldn't source an affordable, production-ready 80" FALD panel and that size won't show up as FALD until next year.

If you are going to consider the 80" Vizio, why not consider the comparable 80" Sharp LE650 that isn't a Q+? It's selling for about $2.7K at many stores right now, even less than the M-series.
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post #15 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 06:25 PM
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Mike,

The SQ at that price isn't worth it. Based on my experience with the SQ, I'd say a fair price for the 80 inch shouldn't be more than 4k max and more like 3500.

ROB
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post #16 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 08:42 PM
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Review for Sony x900b which comes in a 79" by HDTV test. Did very well and they seem to prefer it Vs the Sammy hu8550 and hu9000

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/kd55x9005b-201405123771.htm
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post #17 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 09:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Eric Navarro View Post

Review for Sony x900b which comes in a 79" by HDTV test. Did very well and they seem to prefer it Vs the Sammy hu8550 and hu9000

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/kd55x9005b-201405123771.htm

Nice.

I'm pretty sure the 79" version is a different panel -- I don't just mean bigger of course but sourced differently. That's why the 79" will have passive 3D instead of the active 3D for the smaller units like the one tested. The net of this is we'll really have to see an independent review of the 79" calibrated panel because it may not have the same results.
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post #18 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 10:23 PM
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As far as anyone can tell (information is not perfect), the 2014 M-series is exactly the same set as the 2013 series on the inside, without the 3D. The entire rest of the 2014 Vizio line-up are brand new panels that are now FALD (full array local dimming), which dramatically improves PQ if done well. Vizio previously sold a 3D model last year and a non-3D for less money. Many stores still have last year's 2013 model with 3D for $2,999 while supplies last. So basically you are paying $200 more to get the downgraded 2013 set that you may still be able to find for sale. I have seriously considered getting the 2013 set, but I would not pay more to get the same set without a feature.

Now Vizio has been playing coy by refusing to say whether the "new M-series 80" is really just a short-term interim set and that they still plan to release a truly new 80" later this year with a FALD display like the rest of their line-up. You can argue it both ways. Their website claims the new tech will come in up to 80" which favors this theory, Vizio refuses to deny it and it could be argued that it's logical they wouldn't confirm it because then no one would buy the current 80" sets. On the other hand it seems unlikely they would gear up for production and release a whole new product line, even if re-badged old tech, and then replace it 5 months later. Who knows. But personally I am skeptical. More likely they simply couldn't source an affordable, production-ready 80" FALD panel and that size won't show up as FALD until next year.

If you are going to consider the 80" Vizio, why not consider the comparable 80" Sharp LE650 that isn't a Q+? It's selling for about $2.7K at many stores right now, even less than the M-series.

I appreciate all the insights, let me see if I get this straight. You all are saying:

* The 2013 Sharp 80" TV (link below) is the best I'm going to do in an 80 inch model in the sub $5000.00 range.
* This Sharp beats the quality of both the Visio 2013 and (pending) 2014 80" model that I've been waiting for?
* The only other TV in the sub 5,000.00 range is the Sharp Q+ 80", but it is totally not worth the premium, so might as well get the 2013 sharp and save 1-2 thousand dollars.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sharp-aquos-80-class-80-diag--led-1080p-120hz-smart-hdtv/8681069.p?id=1218887762709&skuId=8681069

Thoughts?


**EDIT** Ahh crap, I just checked the input lag. 58ms, which is one of the highest you can have for a TV set. That's a deal breaker for me.
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post #19 of 179 Old 06-01-2014, 11:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike MCGowan View Post

I appreciate all the insights, let me see if I get this straight. You all are saying:

* The 2013 Sharp 80" TV (link below) is the best I'm going to do in an 80 inch model in the sub $5000.00 range.
* This Sharp beats the quality of both the Visio 2013 and (pending) 2014 80" model that I've been waiting for?
* The only other TV in the sub 5,000.00 range is the Sharp Q+ 80", but it is totally not worth the premium, so might as well get the 2013 sharp and save 1-2 thousand dollars.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sharp-aquos-80-class-80-diag--led-1080p-120hz-smart-hdtv/8681069.p?id=1218887762709&skuId=8681069

Thoughts?


**EDIT** Ahh crap, I just checked the input lag. 58ms, which is one of the highest you can have for a TV set. That's a deal breaker for me.

I don't think I said the Sharp beats the 2013 Vizio M-series. I think they are "comparable" sets, in feature and price. Close enough that you really need to look at them both and decide for yourself. If input lag is a huge issue for you and the Vizio is materially better, go for it. But you should be able to get either for sub $3K before tax.

I gave up trying to see the Best Buy price on the link you provided. It's one thing to say you have to check into the Cart to see the price but I went through numerous pages of them trying to force up-sell me add-ons into the cart only to them have them want me to completely register or sign-in and not see the price until provided by credit card info. That's a new low for any retailer. Unless the price has changed in the last day or sow it was several hundred below $3K on Amazon and Best Buy matches Amazon if you ask (per their policy). But the prices of the Sharp and Vizio are within 10% of each other so close enough to pick on personal preference.
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post #20 of 179 Old 06-02-2014, 10:21 AM
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I sure hope the Panasonic AX900 manages to have good motion. They are my best hope for something good this year but I'm not planning on anything as they may not offer something in the 75-80" range. Of course I'll want to see the LG 77" OLED smile.gif http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1401429603&rss
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Same boat here, too, though I don't plan to buy until August. Gives me the summer to geek out here and maybe even learn from what you guys do. I love Sony - wish there was a 79-inch X950B, or a 79-inch X900B without ears.

I'll likely repeat your steps and try to see and talk myself into the Sharp 80 Q+ or LG 79UB9800.

For now my final four looks like Sharp 80 Q+, LG 79, Sony 70X850B or Sony 79X900B.

That or go cheap Sony 70" or cheap Sharp 80" and plan on buying again in 2-3 years.
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post #22 of 179 Old 06-03-2014, 07:41 AM
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So I'm down to two options:

2013 Visio M801d (less than $2999.99)
  • Much Cheaper
  • Reviews are good. Generally solid performance
  • Lag at 39ms (Good Rating)
  • Seems like old reliable choice here.



2014 Sharp Q+ LC-80UQ17U (less than $4999.99)
  • Newer Tech
  • Reviews are good, people seem to love it.
  • Lag at 58ms (average rating)
  • I can spend 5k, I only buy a TV once every 5-10 years, so I like to get "the best" I can afford and sit back for a time.
  • But I can't afford the 4K's in 80" so I think the sharp would be a nice compromise.
  • Lag is my main concern on this set, but I wonder if I'm getting worked up over meaningless numbers. (39ms vs 58ms)
  • I crawled the owners thread and no one is complaining about video game lag as long as game mode is on.



I still haven't done the "eye" test yet, but I don't think I'll find these guys at 80" in the showroom.

I guess it boils down to, does the Sharp Q+ set's display look noticeably better than the vizio? I will I notice a 20ms difference in lag?

Thoughts and advice? It seems like I'm trying to talk myself into the Sharp.

If anyone has viewed both in person, how different does 1080p content looks on these sets? Is the Q+'s picture better?


Thanks,
-Mike
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post #23 of 179 Old 06-03-2014, 09:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike MCGowan View Post

So I'm down to two options:

2013 Visio M801d (less than $2999.99)
  • Much Cheaper
  • Reviews are good. Generally solid performance
  • Lag at 39ms (Good Rating)
  • Seems like old reliable choice here.



2014 Sharp Q+ LC-80UQ17U (less than $4999.99)
  • Newer Tech
  • Reviews are good, people seem to love it.
  • Lag at 58ms (average rating)
  • I can spend 5k, I only buy a TV once every 5-10 years, so I like to get "the best" I can afford and sit back for a time.
  • But I can't afford the 4K's in 80" so I think the sharp would be a nice compromise.
  • Lag is my main concern on this set, but I wonder if I'm getting worked up over meaningless numbers. (39ms vs 58ms)
  • I crawled the owners thread and no one is complaining about video game lag as long as game mode is on.



I still haven't done the "eye" test yet, but I don't think I'll find these guys at 80" in the showroom.

I guess it boils down to, does the Sharp Q+ set's display look noticeably better than the vizio? I will I notice a 20ms difference in lag?

Thoughts and advice? It seems like I'm trying to talk myself into the Sharp.

If anyone has viewed both in person, how different does 1080p content looks on these sets? Is the Q+'s picture better?


Thanks,
-Mike

Either would be great choices. A couple comments.

Reviews have not been uniformly great for the Sharp UQ17. I think many of the people who bought it and are commenting in the AVS Forum like it, though some have expressed disappointment. The CNEt review was middling and said it wasn't worth the upgrade over the LE650. Similarly the AVS Editor review said it wasn't impressive to him, nor to the Sound & video editor. That all say it's fine but not materially better than the non-Q+ screens and therefore not worth the premium.

I viewed the UQ17 at Magnolia. Playing it's Sharp-provided loop it looked fantastic. I had them play the Avengers Blu-ray. In the default dynamic (vivid) mode it looked super bright, colorful and sharp (no pun intended) but had the soap opera effect. Switching to any of the cinema modes made it look cloudy and dull. Didn't do a full calibration or even customize the settings much and others have said the Sharp does much better after all this is done.

If you get the Vizio from Costco (you can order online and I don't think you even have to be a member), you have a 90-day no-fault return policy so if you aren't happy with the result you can always change your mind. Assuming you plan to be happy, it's a fair, good faith option.

Not trying to talk you out of the UQ17. If you like the picture playing real content (not the Sharp loop) first-hand, go for it of course...
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post #24 of 179 Old 06-03-2014, 10:22 AM
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I wouldn't drop 5k on the Sharp. Being one who has spent the last week with a calibrated 70SQ (there won't be much difference between the UQ and SQ) I think it has nice picture quality (black and dark scenes production isn't anything to write home about though) and it is really good with ambient lighting yet 5k seems too much even if 80" carries an added premium especially since Sharp seems to have poor quality control when it comes to clouding.

I think a fair price is more around a maximum of 4k. The 80" LE650 2013 model can be had for under 3k and while I have never seen that set, I highly doubt these news guys are worth a 2k premium. The pseudo 4k resolution doesn't do anything huge for HD content. Not 2k worth.

ROB
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If you are still thinking of the 2013 Vizio, better act soon. As of now (it was there last night) it's out of stock on Costco.com. I called 3 semi-local (if you call an hour drive local) today before I found one with just one left other than the display. And Amazon is now out of stock and referring you to third party sites.
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As to the Vizio 80" I've stated before that we have 3 of them above our new Clubhouse Outdoor Grill/Bar and they are OK IMO for that purpose and our Clubhouse/Community budget but there is no way I'd park one of them in my HT - Big don't mean jack if the PQ is on par with anything on a Walmart wall. It's a budget big ass panel period but if it's subpar to quality HT panels it cannot deliver HT immersion by virtue of size alone.

You don't need to view an 80" to know - a 70" can tell you since a good wow filled PQ is just going to get better with size. I can speak to this by buying a Sony 70R550 thinking it could and it was friggin horrible and my 60/65" Samsung D/F8000 panels blow it out of the water even though it was larger it was a TURD and worst Sony I've ever seen.

Look, Vizio may reinvent the game when the P and Reference series arrives but for now I'd lean towards Sharp or consider others in that giant size for now. Input lag is unlikely to differ on a larger size - it should be next to zero impact because the same TV is 10" larger - never had lag issues on my past Sharps since they had their own proprietary chips to prevent it for over the past ten years. Based upon my viewing the 80" Vizio it's fine for drinking at the bar and watching sports but I'd never place one in my HT. Audition and let yours eyes decide but try your best to have return rights if it fails in your HT. Good Luck!smile.gif
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post #27 of 179 Old 06-03-2014, 01:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Citivas View Post

If you are still thinking of the 2013 Vizio, better act soon. As of now (it was there last night) it's out of stock on Costco.com. I called 3 semi-local (if you call an hour drive local) today before I found one with just one left other than the display. And Amazon is now out of stock and referring you to third party sites.

Costco has them online again.

I may bite considering the 90 day return option. Nothing like having it for an extended time and playing full movies and TV in your actual environment to decide if the performance is what you need it to be. I have yet to ever return a TV I buy so my track record for not frivolously returning is good.

Like I have said before, the 2012 Vizio 38" we have absolutely sucks, both PQ and remote. But having read dozens of reviews, hundreds of user posts and general Internet feedback on Vizio vs Sharp reliability, etc., I am hopeful this is materially better than that unit, and convinced that Sharp and Vizio are on-par. I am agnostics between the two, though I can get a longer return window with the Vizio. This forum and other sites are full of people who returned multiple Sharp's due to quality control problems. And the reviews on the Sharp panels are middling just like they are for Vizio. At this moment you either spend about 3 grand for comparable Vizio or Sharp's, 4.5-5 grand for a higher end Sharp reviewers are saying isn't much better or you pay over 6-7 grand for a Sony, Samsung, LG or Panasonic 4K which may indeed be better but how much better? By paying half as much I can feel good about replacing it twice as quickly, presumably when/if FALD is truly available and affordable in these large panel sizes and they have possibly sorted out 4K standards.
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Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post

As to the Vizio 80" I've stated before that we have 3 of them above our new Clubhouse Outdoor Grill/Bar and they are OK IMO for that purpose and our Clubhouse/Community budget but there is no way I'd park one of them in my HT - Big don't mean jack if the PQ is on par with anything on a Walmart wall. It's a budget big ass panel period but if it's subpar to quality HT panels it cannot deliver HT immersion by virtue of size alone.

You don't need to view an 80" to know - a 70" can tell you since a good wow filled PQ is just going to get better with size. I can speak to this by buying a Sony 70R550 thinking it could and it was friggin horrible and my 60/65" Samsung D/F8000 panels blow it out of the water even though it was larger it was a TURD and worst Sony I've ever seen.

Look, Vizio may reinvent the game when the P and Reference series arrives but for now I'd lean towards Sharp or consider others in that giant size for now. Input lag is unlikely to differ on a larger size - it should be next to zero impact because the same TV is 10" larger - never had lag issues on my past Sharps since they had their own proprietary chips to prevent it for over the past ten years. Based upon my viewing the 80" Vizio it's fine for drinking at the bar and watching sports but I'd never place one in my HT. Audition and let yours eyes decide but try your best to have return rights if it fails in your HT. Good Luck!smile.gif
The Vizio 80" set uses a Sharp panel. The same one Sharp is using in non Q+ models. They look pretty similar when I've seen them side by side in Costco.
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The Vizio 80" set uses a Sharp panel. The same one Sharp is using in non Q+ models. They look pretty similar when I've seen them side by side in Costco.
Do you know this for a fact or assumption? Vizio ia a passive 3D whereas Sharp has no passive 3D and Sharp subcontracts out none of it's large glass 60"> as they have no need whereas Vizio historically has used LG, AUO and may have some Konka glass from China - monster glass is being produced in China and Taiwan that is 8G quality whereas Sharp is producing 10G glass they can't. If the 80" Vizio has passive 3D it's unlikely to be Sharp. CMI may also be another source in Asia. Not saying your wrong but one cannot assume because it's 80" it's Sharp today as they no longer monopolize that size like they use to.smile.gif
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post #30 of 179 Old 06-03-2014, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post

Do you know this for a fact or assumption? Vizio ia a passive 3D whereas Sharp has no passive 3D and Sharp subcontracts out none of it's large glass 60"> as they have no need whereas Vizio historically has used LG, AUO and may have some Konka glass from China - monster glass is being produced in China and Taiwan that is 8G quality whereas Sharp is producing 10G glass they can't. If the 80" Vizio has passive 3D it's unlikely to be Sharp. CMI may also be another source in Asia. Not saying your wrong but one cannot assume because it's 80" it's Sharp today as they no longer monopolize that size like they use to.smile.gif
Uhh... No, I'm not sure. However, 70" and 80" are sizes that Sharp makes. Other companies make 65, 75, 84, 85, 79, etc.
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