Official 2015 Vizio 4K UHD M Series Thread - Page 502 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #15031 of 16078 Old 11-02-2016, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Joe879 View Post
For my reciever I used the one that says arc, and I use 1-4 hdmi due to someone saying that the Hdmi 5 had poor upscaling.
I was just revisiting the RTINGS review and looking at the images where they are comparing HDMI ports 1-4 vs 5, and there is an obvious quality bump with 1-4, even with 4k content.

I am curious if this is still the case for the 4k? Maybe a FW update resolved what RTINGS shows? I know there is an upscaling diff for 1-4 vs 5, but I am surprised the 4k on HDMI 5 looks WORSE than the 4k on 1-4. Has anyone done any tests of their own comparing the quality of the image between the ports?
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post #15032 of 16078 Old 11-02-2016, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by themcbrooms View Post
I was just revisiting the RTINGS review and looking at the images where they are comparing HDMI ports 1-4 vs 5, and there is an obvious quality bump with 1-4, even with 4k content.

I am curious if this is still the case for the 4k? Maybe a FW update resolved what RTINGS shows? I know there is an upscaling diff for 1-4 vs 5, but I am surprised the 4k on HDMI 5 looks WORSE than the 4k on 1-4. Has anyone done any tests of their own comparing the quality of the image between the ports?
Is this for 2015, or 2016 models?

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post #15033 of 16078 Old 11-02-2016, 11:26 AM
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2015. I looked at the 2015 RTINGS review as well.

I just did a quick test on my PS4 with a static 1080p image, flipping it from port 4 to 5 while standing 1 foot away analyzing small details of the image (using the same calibration settings). I figured that if I cant see a noticeable difference at this distance then I wont be able to see it at 5-8 feet. There was a slight general color push on port 4 vs 5, but the quality / detail looked identical to my eyes, it definitely was not as noticalbe like the 1080p comparison images on the RTINGS review.

All that said, I am going to stick with port 5 as I prefer the lower input lag and the 4k@60.

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post #15034 of 16078 Old 11-02-2016, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by VBB View Post
HDMI 1-4 are only limited to 30Hz at 4K. Anything below that can do 60Hz or even 120Hz* (depending on the model). So, unless your box can natively output 4k/60Hz, you have nothing to worry about.

*120Hz might be limited to HDMI 5, I forgot.
Any idea as to why Vizio limited ARC capability to just HDMI1, other than there isn't a ton of mainstream source devices that can output 4K/60? I think that's what the OP was really looking to have answered...

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post #15035 of 16078 Old 11-02-2016, 03:48 PM
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Any idea as to why Vizio limited ARC capability to just HDMI1, other than there isn't a ton of mainstream source devices that can output 4K/60? I think that's what the OP was really looking to have answered...
The Vizios aren't any different from other TVs in that they only have one HDMI that supports ARC. That is perfectly normal, considering you would only ever hook up one receiver or soundbar to the TV. What is unfortunate is that Vizio decided to make the individual HDMI ports differ in features and performance. So, I understand the dilemma of someone wanting to hook up their 4K/60Hz capable receiver to the only port that also offers 4K/60Hz (HDMI 5). The only thing you'll be missing out on if you plug the receiver into HDMI 5 is sound from the Vizio's built-in apps as well as sound for the built-in tuner (OTA). And for those you could always use an optical cable, especially since ARC on the 2015 M doesn't support anything better than DD5.1 anyway, if I remember correctly.
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post #15036 of 16078 Old 11-03-2016, 04:01 AM
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Originally Posted by VBB View Post
The Vizios aren't any different from other TVs in that they only have one HDMI that supports ARC. That is perfectly normal, considering you would only ever hook up one receiver or soundbar to the TV. What is unfortunate is that Vizio decided to make the individual HDMI ports differ in features and performance. So, I understand the dilemma of someone wanting to hook up their 4K/60Hz capable receiver to the only port that also offers 4K/60Hz (HDMI 5). The only thing you'll be missing out on if you plug the receiver into HDMI 5 is sound from the Vizio's built-in apps as well as sound for the built-in tuner (OTA). And for those you could always use an optical cable, especially since ARC on the 2015 M doesn't support anything better than DD5.1 anyway, if I remember correctly.
Good info, and I don't mean to thread jack, but the 2016 M series is out and quote a few have been upgrading. It would be kinda neat to know if there are any changes for the 2016 M series, and if people could know what's different for those regarding the ARC and DD5.1?

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post #15037 of 16078 Old 11-03-2016, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Jasonn B View Post
Good info, and I don't mean to thread jack, but the 2016 M series is out and quote a few have been upgrading. It would be kinda neat to know if there are any changes for the 2016 M series, and if people could know what's different for those regarding the ARC and DD5.1?
The 2016 P and M support DD+ (Dolby Digital Plus) over ARC as opposed to plain old Dolby Digital. Among other things, DD+ has the advantage of being able to add a spatially-coded substream for Dolby Atmos. As far as I'm aware, the only streaming app that currently supports this is Vudu.
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post #15038 of 16078 Old 11-07-2016, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by VBB View Post
The Vizios aren't any different from other TVs in that they only have one HDMI that supports ARC. That is perfectly normal, considering you would only ever hook up one receiver or soundbar to the TV. What is unfortunate is that Vizio decided to make the individual HDMI ports differ in features and performance. So, I understand the dilemma of someone wanting to hook up their 4K/60Hz capable receiver to the only port that also offers 4K/60Hz (HDMI 5). The only thing you'll be missing out on if you plug the receiver into HDMI 5 is sound from the Vizio's built-in apps as well as sound for the built-in tuner (OTA).
Indeed, that was what I was seeking - the ability to watch the TV's version of Netflix (4K!) with my AV Receiver. I'm surprised nobody else has complained about the looseness of the optical cable, which is why that solution didn't cut it for me (it kept falling out of the TV with the slightest movement).

Anyways, Google to the rescue. My Chromecast Ultra gets delivered today, and I can finally watch Netflix 4K the way I want! Thanks all.
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Anyone planning on getting the PS4 Pro? Curious if it's a worthwhile investment with the HDR-less 2015 M-Series. Please report if you get one!
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post #15040 of 16078 Old 11-07-2016, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by jharperweb View Post
Anyone planning on getting the PS4 Pro? Curious if it's a worthwhile investment with the HDR-less 2015 M-Series. Please report if you get one!
I was wondering the same thing. I have it pre-ordered but am still on the fence. I am wondering how much of a benefit I would get since I don't have an hdr compatible TV.
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post #15041 of 16078 Old 11-07-2016, 06:01 PM
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I have a M55-C2, with UHD 1.3.34 UHD.
Today, I cannot get any YouTube to play, either by casting with my PC, or playing through the VIA menu.

Is anyone else having this? Any solves?
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post #15042 of 16078 Old 11-07-2016, 06:54 PM
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How do you cast with your PC to the 2015 M series?

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post #15043 of 16078 Old 11-07-2016, 08:10 PM
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How do you cast with your PC to the 2015 M series?
Youtube - you can cast from your phone, or a Chrome browser to your Vizio.
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post #15044 of 16078 Old 11-07-2016, 08:17 PM
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I was wondering the same thing. I have it pre-ordered but am still on the fence. I am wondering how much of a benefit I would get since I don't have an hdr compatible TV.
The benefits of the Pro isn't just HDR. Because of the better hardware, it will allow game developers to add more graphically to SDR games.

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post #15045 of 16078 Old 11-07-2016, 08:39 PM
 
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Originally Posted by videoguy60467 View Post
I have a M55-C2, with UHD 1.3.34 UHD.
Today, I cannot get any YouTube to play, either by casting with my PC, or playing through the VIA menu.

Is anyone else having this? Any solves?
Just tried it. No problem casting to Youtube from Chrome on my M55-C2 with UHD 1.3.34.
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post #15046 of 16078 Old 11-08-2016, 05:06 AM
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To those talking about a PS4 Pro, you do know it doesn't have a UHD drive, right?

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/ps4.../1100-6443352/

https://www.playstation.com/en-gb/ex...s4/tech-specs/
^- click on the PS4 Pro tab

And the X Box 1 S doesn't decode the high res sound codecs. It down samples them to the next level down.

That's why I went with the Philips for mine.

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post #15047 of 16078 Old 11-08-2016, 06:00 AM
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Originally Posted by seggers View Post
To those talking about a PS4 Pro, you do know it doesn't have a UHD drive, right?

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/ps4.../1100-6443352/

https://www.playstation.com/en-gb/ex...s4/tech-specs/
^- click on the PS4 Pro tab

And the X Box 1 S doesn't decode the high res sound codecs. It down samples them to the next level down.

That's why I went with the Philips for mine.
Seggers

It was just announced at a Microsoft event the update for Atmos/bitstream is coming to all Xbox systems in early 2017

http://4k.com/news/the-4k-uhd-blu-ra...s-audio-17148/

The 5.0 is here

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post #15048 of 16078 Old 11-08-2016, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seggers View Post
To those talking about a PS4 Pro, you do know it doesn't have a UHD drive, right?

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/ps4.../1100-6443352/

https://www.playstation.com/en-gb/ex...s4/tech-specs/
^- click on the PS4 Pro tab

And the X Box 1 S doesn't decode the high res sound codecs. It down samples them to the next level down.

That's why I went with the Philips for mine.

Seggers
I buy my game consoles to play games, that is it.
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post #15049 of 16078 Old 11-10-2016, 02:01 PM
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Has anyone picked up a PS4 Pro yet? The only 4K option I have under output settings is 2160p YUV420. Is this preferable? Is there a way to enable 2160p RBG?
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post #15050 of 16078 Old 11-10-2016, 02:10 PM
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Has anyone picked up a PS4 Pro yet? The only 4K option I have under output settings is 2160p YUV420. Is this preferable? Is there a way to enable 2160p RBG?
If the option is there it would be in your PS4 Pro menu settings. The setting you see now is no different than what we get on our graphic cards for this model.

The 5.0 is here
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post #15051 of 16078 Old 11-10-2016, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by dw.og View Post
Has anyone picked up a PS4 Pro yet? The only 4K option I have under output settings is 2160p YUV420. Is this preferable? Is there a way to enable 2160p RBG?
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Originally Posted by mboojigga View Post
If the option is there it would be in your PS4 Pro menu settings. The setting you see now is no different than what we get on our graphic cards for this model.
Yup, and we already know that the M's EDID for HDMI-HDMI doesn't allow for RGB or YCC 4:4:4/4:2:2 at 4K/60Hz. Anything up to 4K/30Hz is fine. From what I've read, the new PS4 Pro always outputs at 4K/60Hz, so your only option with the 2015 M is YUV420.

I really wish they would fix this once and for all, because with an active DisplayPort-HDMI adapter, our 2015 M is capable of RGB at 4K/60Hz.
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post #15052 of 16078 Old 11-10-2016, 02:31 PM
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Yup, and we already know that the M's EDID for HDMI-HDMI doesn't allow for RGB or YCC 4:4:4/4:2:2 at 4K/60Hz. Anything up to 4K/30Hz is fine. From what I've read, the new PS4 Pro always outputs at 4K/60Hz, so your only option with the 2015 M is YUV420.

I really wish they would fix this once and for all, because with an active DisplayPort-HDMI adapter, our 2015 M is capable of RGB at 4K/60Hz.
The output settings in the PS4 Pro said something about 2160p YUV420 not being able to display as many colors. Is this true? I thought the jump to 2160p alone allowed for more color information as opposed to 1080p.
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post #15053 of 16078 Old 11-10-2016, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by dw.og View Post
Has anyone picked up a PS4 Pro yet? The only 4K option I have under output settings is 2160p YUV420. Is this preferable? Is there a way to enable 2160p RBG?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dw.og View Post
The output settings in the PS4 Pro said something about 2160p YUV420 not being able to display as many colors. Is this true? I thought the jump to 2160p alone allowed for more color information as opposed to 1080p.
YUV420 refers to the color space and chroma resolution being used. It has nothing to do with how many colors a display can show, and neither does the resolution increase from 1080 to 2160. See here for some more info on chroma subsampling: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chroma_subsampling
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post #15054 of 16078 Old 11-10-2016, 08:37 PM
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I have seen the issue discussed both here and on the Nvidia shield forums, but I wanted to check in with other people about the "sync loss" issues at 4K.

I played a bunch of games (and did a bit of 4K youtube) on my GTX 1080 card this week on my 2015 M65. 4K/60fps looks glorious, but every once and while the TV and PC would go blank then return with the menu displayed up top as though I had changed resolutions or just turned the PC on. There was variability in how often it happened and didn't seem to be any particular content type that caused it more than the others. Here's what I found playing around. The PC was plugged directly into HDMI 5 and I also tried multiple cables (Monoprice + another brand, both '2.0' rated cables). TV reports 1.3.34-UHD firmware and I tried a few different Nvidia drivers...
  • 4K/60Hz - Pretty frequent drops (every couple mins, sometimes a few in a row), generally annoying enough that I didn't leave it in this mode
  • 4K/59Hz - slightly less drops
  • 4K + custom refresh of 59.940 - far fewer drops, but still once every 5-10 mins. Anecdotally it felt like the longer the I played the more frequently it happened?
  • 1080p/120Hz - The odd drop as well. I wasn't sure if i was in 4:2:0 or 4:4:4.
  • 1080p/60Hz - Zero problems
  • 1080p/24Hz - Zero problems
  • 1080p/60Hz - PS4 will full range (RGB) back in the day I would get this drop maybe once a week when I was playing destiny daily

It's super annoying and really frustrating because otherwise its a magical experience. I really hope Nvidia/Vizio figure out the firmware to fix this. I also tried, though less extensively and thoroughly on a GTX 970 card and had the same general results.

Does this match up with other people's experiences?
This is a pretty good summary of the 4K/60 bug. While I haven't hooked it up to my PC to test specific resolution/refresh combos via video card HDMI output, I *have* experienced these exact issues with the Nvidia Shield and XBox One S. It annoyed me to the point where I don't even send 4K content to the TV anymore. I'm pretty sure this is all on Vizios end. Whether it is firmware fixable or not... who knows? I believe this issue has been known for nearly a year now...

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post #15055 of 16078 Old 11-11-2016, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by as2onish View Post
I have seen the issue discussed both here and on the Nvidia shield forums, but I wanted to check in with other people about the "sync loss" issues at 4K.

I played a bunch of games (and did a bit of 4K youtube) on my GTX 1080 card this week on my 2015 M65. 4K/60fps looks glorious, but every once and while the TV and PC would go blank then return with the menu displayed up top as though I had changed resolutions or just turned the PC on. There was variability in how often it happened and didn't seem to be any particular content type that caused it more than the others. Here's what I found playing around. The PC was plugged directly into HDMI 5 and I also tried multiple cables (Monoprice + another brand, both '2.0' rated cables). TV reports 1.3.34-UHD firmware and I tried a few different Nvidia drivers...
  • 4K/60Hz - Pretty frequent drops (every couple mins, sometimes a few in a row), generally annoying enough that I didn't leave it in this mode
  • 4K/59Hz - slightly less drops
  • 4K + custom refresh of 59.940 - far fewer drops, but still once every 5-10 mins. Anecdotally it felt like the longer the I played the more frequently it happened?
  • 1080p/120Hz - The odd drop as well. I wasn't sure if i was in 4:2:0 or 4:4:4.
  • 1080p/60Hz - Zero problems
  • 1080p/24Hz - Zero problems
  • 1080p/60Hz - PS4 will full range (RGB) back in the day I would get this drop maybe once a week when I was playing destiny daily

It's super annoying and really frustrating because otherwise its a magical experience. I really hope Nvidia/Vizio figure out the firmware to fix this. I also tried, though less extensively and thoroughly on a GTX 970 card and had the same general results.

Does this match up with other people's experiences?
The only time I have had issues with 4k@60 or 1080p@120 was when the television came out and before Windows 10 launched. I haven't seen any of this since. M65-C1, EVGA 980Ti have downloaded every driver.
The 1080p@120 bug was on the 2014 P-series models until they came out with a firmware update that resolved the issue June/July 2015 for both 2014 P and 2015 M. I use Amazon Basic High speed HDMI.

The 5.0 is here
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post #15056 of 16078 Old 11-11-2016, 09:34 AM
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Has anyone picked up a PS4 Pro yet? The only 4K option I have under output settings is 2160p YUV420. Is this preferable? Is there a way to enable 2160p RBG?
Curious to hear your impressions of the pro with these tv's after you have had time to use it more.
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post #15057 of 16078 Old 11-11-2016, 01:34 PM
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The only time I have had issues with 4k@60 or 1080p@120 was when the television came out and before Windows 10 launched. I haven't seen any of this since. M65-C1, EVGA 980Ti have downloaded every driver.
The 1080p@120 bug was on the 2014 P-series models until they came out with a firmware update that resolved the issue June/July 2015 for both 2014 P and 2015 M. I use Amazon Basic High speed HDMI.
It's encouraging to hear that someone doesn't have the issue! Are you HDMI directly into the 980Ti? Did you do any special in the nvidia control panel? Any particulars of your setup that you think might help me?
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post #15058 of 16078 Old 11-11-2016, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by as2onish View Post
It's encouraging to hear that someone doesn't have the issue! Are you HDMI directly into the 980Ti? Did you do any special in the nvidia control panel? Any particulars of your setup that you think might help me?
Nothing special my gaming PC has always been connected to HDMI 5. No custom resolutions. They are all available in the control panel. If you look up summer of last year in this same thread you would see screen shots from me and many others showing all the test we were doing.

The 5.0 is here
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post #15059 of 16078 Old 11-12-2016, 06:06 AM
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I have a 2015 m70-c3 and just picked up a Xbox One S. On port 5 I get 4k up scaling except on games since none of the ports are HDR10. Is this something that can be fixed with a firmware update? Would hate to have an out of date product less than a year after I picked it up. Thoughts anyone
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post #15060 of 16078 Old 11-12-2016, 06:18 AM
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The 2015 M series will not get an HDR update.
But I don't understand why you can't get 4K resolution without HDR.
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