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Official 2015 Vizio 4K UHD M Series Thread

2M views 16K replies 2K participants last post by  videoguy60467 
#1 · (Edited)
Specs and prices for new Vizio M series just leaked by hdguru so wanted to start a thread. Per hdguru:

8 screen sizes from 43-inches ($599) to 80-inches ($3999). While all have 4K (3840 x 2160) resolution, there are no quantum dots for a wider color gamut or higher dynamic range. 3D is omitted. Like Vizio’s 2014 4K UHD “P” series the “M”s offer LCD panels using full array LED backlighting with local dimming. The 60- and 65-inch models have 32 dimmable zones and employ 10-bit LCD panels. While Vizio does not provide a native refresh rate, per cnet it's likely to be 60 or 120 Hz

Vizio’s 2015 4K UHD M Series (Vizio will announce and release April 13-14).
M80-C3 $3,999 June
M75-C1 $2,999 Fall 2015
M70-C3 $2,199 Spring
M65-C1 $1,699 Spring
M60-C3 $1,499.99 Now on Amazon
M55-C2 $999 Spring
M50-C1 $899 Spring
M43-C1 $599 Spring

Model Information: Vizio 2015 M65-C1
Physical Properties
Dimensions w/ Stand: 57.39 x 35.37 x 11.6
Dimensions w/o Stand: 59.39″ x 32.87″ x 2.52″
Remote Model: XRT500
Weight w/ Stand: 61.73 Lbs.
Weight w/o Stand: 60.72 Lbs.
Remote Connectivity: IR
Stand Measurements
Distance Between Inner Stand Legs: 46.80″
Distance Between Outer Stand Legs: 49.95″
Stand Depth (Back Side): 5.55″
Stand Depth (Front Side): 4.85″
Total Stand Depth: 11.16″
Display Features
Screen Size (Diag): 65″
64.5″ actual screen size
Number of Colors: 1.07 Billion
Backlight Type: Full Array LED
Local/Smart Dimming: Yes (32 zones)
Dynamic Contrast Ratio: 20 Million to 1
Smart TV: Yes
Resolution: 2160p (4K)
Refresh Rate (SPS/Native): 240Hz (SPS)/ Unclear Hz Native, per cnet may be 60 or 120
Smooth Motion: No
Clear Action Rate: 720
3D: No
CEC: Yes
ARC: Yes
Zero Bright Pixel Policy: Yes
Audio Features
Speaker Power Output: 10W x 2
DTS StudioSound: Yes
DTS TruVolume: Yes
DTS TruSurround: Yes
Wi-Fi: 802.11ac dual band
Bluetooth/Wifi-Direct: No
Inputs/ Outputs
HDMI: 5
Analog Audio Out: 1
Component: 1
Digital Audio Out (SPDIF): 1
Composite: 1 (shared with Component)/ Coaxial: 1
Multimedia Features
Ethernet: 1
USB Music: Yes
USB: 1
USB Photo: Yes
PC/VGA: 0
USB Video: Yes
Media Sharing Capable: Yes
Mount Pattern: 400mm x 400mm
Screw Size: M6
Screw Length: 16mm
Power Consumption: 220W
Standby Power Consumption:
 
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#10,102 ·
If you adjust the individual brightness settings more than a few stops you will introduce the posterizing effect. That is unavoidable with the current firmware. From what I have seen it takes more than just a few stops to get the individual brightness of the colors corrected.
But gray scale and gamma can still be calibrated and you need a meter for that.
 
#10,103 ·
I have reversed my opinion of the Clear Action setting for certain sizes of the M-series in certain situations. When I first tested it I only used it on the M55 and it did nothing like RTINGS.com said so I abandoned it. However, it has gone through many changes since then with the firmware updates but RTINGS.com refuses to revisit it.

Therefore, I will give you my take on it now after testing it with the 120 FPS P50 and M80 TVs and the 60 FPS M55 TV and the latest firmware.

1. Clear Action still produces a noticeable flickering with the 60 Hz TVs(M60 and smaller). However, there are certain brightness and contrast values that exaggerate the flickering extensively. You can switch to the RGB Color Space to prevent BTB and WTW clipping and then adjust the brightness and contrast settings until the flickering is minimized.

For the 120 Hz TVs(M60 and larger and all 2014 P-series) the flickering is not visible with the latest firmware. I literally cannot see any flickering at all but there is a significant improvement in the inherent pixel lag that all LCD based TVs have. The TV dims significantly with Clear Action turned on. However, there are certain situations where that is acceptable.

Therefore, I am now recommending that you set Clear Action to On for 120 Hz TVs when you play video games on those TVs. It will still darken the picture and that isn’t ideal but it isn’t really awful with the latest firmware. I also set the backlight to 100% when I turn clear action on for games.

For 60 Hz TVs I still am not ready to recommend turning Clear Action because while you can improve the flickering you still can’t eliminate it like you can on the 120 Hz TVs. That being said I did turn on Clear Action for my M55 that is a dedicated PS4 gaming TV and it has acceptable results for me. The flickering of the 60 Hz TVs may be too much for other people though.

2. Please do not turn on Clear Action for anything but gaming on a console or computer though. It is pointless to do it for regular TV content. Regular TV programs have intentional blurring by default because of the slower shutter speeds they use. Clear Action can’t undo what is in the TV program by default.

3. Using clear action and Game Low Latency together gives me excellent motion handling and minimal motion blurring for games and yet I still get the excellent input lag reduction from the GLL setting. This is my ideal experience for gaming especially if you also feed it a 1080p @ 120 FPS signal from a computer. That will just blow your mind with Black Ops III at 9 feet from an 80 inch TV with full surround sound.
Nice work!
 
#10,104 ·
I asked this earlier, and it was overlooked. I apologize for asking again, but can the factory remote control other devices via IR signal?

I noticed it has "bulbs" on all four sides, when you remove the side cover to put in batteries. I am just looking to control my old audio system with this remote.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
#10,105 ·
I asked this earlier, and it was overlooked. I apologize for asking again, but can the factory remote control other devices via IR signal?

I noticed it has "bulbs" on all four sides, when you remove the side cover to put in batteries. I am just looking to control my old audio system with this remote.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The remote cannot directly control other devices via IR (it's not programmable as far as I know). If your receiver supports CEC (which is only supported via HDMI - your older audio system may not support CEC, definitely not if it's not connected via HDMI), then your TV can send certain signals to the receiver such as volume +/-, turn on, etc. You'll need to enable CEC on both devices for this.

If you need to control multiple IR-only devices with the same remote, you should look into a universal remote like the harmony.

The remote has IR LEDs on two sides (front and left)... the ones on the front (close to the power button) are used for the top/normal buttons, the LEDs on the left side of the remote are only used for the keyboard (as you'd be holding the remote parallel to the TV when using the keyboard on the back of the remote).
 
#10,106 ·
But gray scale and gamma can still be calibrated and you need a meter for that.
If you aren’t going to 100% calibrate the entire TV why insist on getting 100% calibration for a portion of the spec? Why insist on getting exactly 100 nit brightness if your colors don’t match up with the rest of the spec? You can match blacker than black and whiter than white up visually without a meter. You can choose the gamma setting that you prefer. None of that requires a meter other than your eyes.

You can’t eyeball the colors. Your eyes aren’t sensitive enough to all of the colors for that. That is why you need a meter for the colors.

Also the default settings for brightness and contrast are essentially calibrated at the factory. Vizio explicitly adjusts the TV so that a value of 50 for contrast and brightness properly seats min black and max white for REC.709. There is no other adjust that needs to be made for that portion of the spec, for any of the M-series TVs, with REC.709 content. It has already been done for you by Vizio and it is 100% correct every time for that specific requirement of the spec.

That part of the spec is not dependent on room lighting, or preference, or your eyes. It is completely dependent on how the TV translates pure black and pure white from the disc to what it displays as min black and max white.

My guess is that even if people calibrate their TV exactly to the spec they will prefer to make the TV brighter than 100 nits in the end. There aren’t too many people that watch the TV with that low of a backlight setting even in a dark room. If there were that many people then HDR would never get off the ground because the first thing it does is set the backlight to MAX brightness.
 
#10,108 ·
Say what?
What spec are you going to calibrate an HDR TV to? No two HDR TVs produce the same color spectrum and only one HDR TV(Vizio R-series) has reached 100% of even DCI-P3. There simply is no way to calibrate HDR TVs to a single spec the way you can calibrate today’s TVs to REC.709.

TVs like the M-series were specifically designed not to exceed REC.709 for the colors. It can exceed the brightness of REC.709 by a great deal but it just barely covers the colors. That means that the TV isn’t wasting anything with respect to the colors when you calibrate to REC.709.

For HDR and WCG TVs you wouldn’t want to calibrate to REC.709 because the TVs are capable of so much more and you have paid a lot extra for that WCG. That is why HDR material is encoded differently. The colors for HDR material are not rendered to any specific standard on the disc or in the video stream. That processing and rendering of the colors happens in real-time as the content is being played.

This enables the TV to render the max colors that it can display for all content. It may not look exactly the same as some other TV but you will be taking full advantage of the max color spectrum that the TV can display every time you play HDR content in it.

In essence each individual HDR TV will have its own standard that it renders to. For the Vizio M-series that standard just happens to coincide with the REC.709 spec because Vizio built it that way to save cost. All other TVs especially HDR ones will have a specific spec unique to that specific TV that they render the colors to.
 
#10,109 · (Edited)
I have reversed my opinion of the Clear Action setting for certain sizes of the M-series in certain situations. When I first tested it I only used it on the M55 and it did nothing like RTINGS.com said so I abandoned it. However, it has gone through many changes since then with the firmware updates but RTINGS.com refuses to revisit it.

Therefore, I will give you my take on it now after testing it with the 120 FPS P50 and M80 TVs and the 60 FPS M55 TV and the latest firmware.

1. Clear Action still produces a noticeable flickering with the 60 Hz TVs(M60 and smaller). However, there are certain brightness and contrast values that exaggerate the flickering extensively. You can switch to the RGB Color Space to prevent BTB and WTW clipping and then adjust the brightness and contrast settings until the flickering is minimized.

For the 120 Hz TVs(M60 and larger and all 2014 P-series) the flickering is not visible with the latest firmware. I literally cannot see any flickering at all but there is a significant improvement in the inherent pixel lag that all LCD based TVs have. The TV dims significantly with Clear Action turned on. However, there are certain situations where that is acceptable.

Therefore, I am now recommending that you set Clear Action to On for 120 Hz TVs when you play video games on those TVs. It will still darken the picture and that isn’t ideal but it isn’t really awful with the latest firmware. I also set the backlight to 100% when I turn clear action on for games.

For 60 Hz TVs I still am not ready to recommend turning Clear Action because while you can improve the flickering you still can’t eliminate it like you can on the 120 Hz TVs. That being said I did turn on Clear Action for my M55 that is a dedicated PS4 gaming TV and it has acceptable results for me. The flickering of the 60 Hz TVs may be too much for other people though.

2. Please do not turn on Clear Action for anything but gaming on a console or computer though. It is pointless to do it for regular TV content. Regular TV programs have intentional blurring by default because of the slower shutter speeds they use. Clear Action can’t undo what is in the TV program by default.

3. Using clear action and Game Low Latency together gives me excellent motion handling and minimal motion blurring for games and yet I still get the excellent input lag reduction from the GLL setting. This is my ideal experience for gaming especially if you also feed it a 1080p @ 120 FPS signal from a computer. That will just blow your mind with Black Ops III at 9 feet from an 80 inch TV with full surround sound.
I will give an other go at GLL but WITH clear action on tonight.


BUT I did realize something just now. I am playing Xenoblade X right now and that game caps at 30 fps. I think it is a pretty steady 30 but there could be dips. Motion handling, at 30 fps, is VERY problematic especially with GLL.
I thought my issues where deeper because of testing with Splatoon which is a solid 60 fps game. But I just learned that the lobby is 30 fps so that is why panning was terrible in my testing.


I had bad blur with Fallout 4 on PC also but I now think that im most likely closer to 30 fps than I am to 60 fps.


So the lesson here regarding games motion handling and GLL is 60 fps YAAAY! but 30 fps BOOOOOOO!
 
#10,110 ·
Anyone know how high the m series sit on the stand? My soundbar is almost 4 inches high so I don't want that to be a problem.
Check out stikle's comprehensive list of leg measurements... At 4 inches, your sound bar will most certainly cover a bit of the screen. You could look into wall mounting the TV or the soundbar or find a way to raise the bezel by putting something under the legs.
 
#10,112 · (Edited)
So the lesson here regarding games motion handling and GLL is 60 fps YAAAY! but 30 fps BOOOOOOO!
This is exactly correct and 120 FPS is F@CK YEA!

If the game is only rendering at 30 FPS then motion will look more like 24 FPS than it will like 60 FPS. I guess the ultimate thing for games would be if we could use Reduce Motion Blur and GLL simultaneously. However, we all know that GLL works because it has to disable the motion interpolation settings.

OLED TVs have “perfect” motion handling because their pixels are instant on, instant off. However, they also have mediocre input lag. I really do prefer a good input lag over better motion handling because I only play first person shooter games that all render at 60 FPS or more.

I really enjoy playing Black Ops III on the computer at 1080p @ 120 FPS. It is truly rendering the game at 120 FPS. However, even my high end Gaming laptop can barely sustain that frame rate at that resolution. It really is a shame that the Samsung TVs can’t do 1080p @ 120 FPS at all. That is a feature I would miss very much.
 
#10,113 · (Edited)
Thinking about ordering a i1 Display Pro to calibrate my M75.

My i1DP3 will be here today...to learn to calibrate on my M75 as well. Great minds think alike!

My M50 did not have the screws. I needed to get M6 12mm screws for my set.

Interesting. I wonder if they're including them on the larger size panels under the assumption that they will be more likely wall mounted than the smaller sizes.

1. If I remember correctly, it's the individual colors' brightness settings that will result in a noisier/grainier picture when changed away from default.
2. I don't believe there is an issue with the 2/11-point grayscale.
3. There are two methods to calibrate this TV correctly:
  • With Active LED off - Use full-field patterns, then turn Active LED back on when you're done calibrating
  • With Active LED on - Use 1% window patterns with a 100% white background. This is my preferred method, as it takes into account any anomaly that "Active LED on" might exhibit.

Active LED on is what I'm going to play with. I know nothing about calibration at this point (even after 4 hours of watching Michael Chen calibrate my plasma 4 years ago). Good thing I have nothing but time at night to fart around with it.


That list is still missing the M49 Table to Bezel edge measurement. If an M49 owner could measure that and let me know what it is then I'll update the list.

You could look into wall mounting the TV or the soundbar or find a way to raise the bezel by putting something under the legs.

I've got a friend with an E65 and he's running into the same thing with his new Pioneer Andrew Jones Center channel. It blocks the lower center of his screen. My suggestion for a quick fix was to get a couple chunks of 4x4 to put under the legs. Maybe use a drill, dremel, router, etc to create some indents on the top for the feet of the legs to fit into so they don't slip off. 4x4's would be easily paintable/stainable to blend in with the current tabletop. That'd be a cheap quick fix.

That being said, my friend has yet to implement any solution at this point and is just living with it.
 
#10,114 ·
If you aren’t going to 100% calibrate the entire TV why insist on getting 100% calibration for a portion of the spec? Why insist on getting exactly 100 nit brightness if your colors don’t match up with the rest of the spec? You can match blacker than black and whiter than white up visually without a meter. You can choose the gamma setting that you prefer. None of that requires a meter other than your eyes.

You can’t eyeball the colors. Your eyes aren’t sensitive enough to all of the colors for that. That is why you need a meter for the colors.

Also the default settings for brightness and contrast are essentially calibrated at the factory. Vizio explicitly adjusts the TV so that a value of 50 for contrast and brightness properly seats min black and max white for REC.709. There is no other adjust that needs to be made for that portion of the spec, for any of the M-series TVs, with REC.709 content. It has already been done for you by Vizio and it is 100% correct every time for that specific requirement of the spec.

That part of the spec is not dependent on room lighting, or preference, or your eyes. It is completely dependent on how the TV translates pure black and pure white from the disc to what it displays as min black and max white.

My guess is that even if people calibrate their TV exactly to the spec they will prefer to make the TV brighter than 100 nits in the end. There aren’t too many people that watch the TV with that low of a backlight setting even in a dark room. If there were that many people then HDR would never get off the ground because the first thing it does is set the backlight to MAX brightness.
I'm just saying don't throw the baby out with the bath water. People that want an accurate picture do what they can within the limits of their set. Just because some controls cause bad side effects doesn't meet you give up on everything.

As to the gamma setting, sure you can pick one but do you know if it is accurate? It is just like the color temp setting. You need to measure to know what the particular setting is going and which is more accurate. Sure you can adjust to what you like, but that is not calibration.

You have done a lot of work on these TVs and helped a lot of people. However, I feel many of your posts come across as "gospel", the absolute truth and are all encompassing while containing mostly opinion and including inaccuracies and incorrect information. To me comments such as "these are the best settings one can get from the TV" and "people need to get accustom to the fact of not calibrating a TV" are far from truth.

I get it, you have many Vizio TVs and like them and therefore have an inherent bias, but try to keep in mind there is another side.
 
#10,115 ·
What spec are you going to calibrate an HDR TV to? No two HDR TVs produce the same color spectrum and only one HDR TV(Vizio R-series) has reached 100% of even DCI-P3. There simply is no way to calibrate HDR TVs to a single spec the way you can calibrate today’s TVs to REC.709.

TVs like the M-series were specifically designed not to exceed REC.709 for the colors. It can exceed the brightness of REC.709 by a great deal but it just barely covers the colors. That means that the TV isn’t wasting anything with respect to the colors when you calibrate to REC.709.

For HDR and WCG TVs you wouldn’t want to calibrate to REC.709 because the TVs are capable of so much more and you have paid a lot extra for that WCG. That is why HDR material is encoded differently. The colors for HDR material are not rendered to any specific standard on the disc or in the video stream. That processing and rendering of the colors happens in real-time as the content is being played.

This enables the TV to render the max colors that it can display for all content. It may not look exactly the same as some other TV but you will be taking full advantage of the max color spectrum that the TV can display every time you play HDR content in it.

In essence each individual HDR TV will have its own standard that it renders to. For the Vizio M-series that standard just happens to coincide with the REC.709 spec because Vizio built it that way to save cost. All other TVs especially HDR ones will have a specific spec unique to that specific TV that they render the colors to.
Your statement was that we will not be able to calibrate TVs in the future, so we better get used to it now. Please provide any evidence that when I buy a TV in 6 months that I will not be able to calibrate in.

A lot of new technology is coming at us with these new sets. Sure, standards and proper calibration equipment may not exist now in the early stages but I bet it will be in the future.
 
#10,116 ·
What spec are you going to calibrate an HDR TV to? No two HDR TVs produce the same color spectrum and only one HDR TV(Vizio R-series) has reached 100% of even DCI-P3. There simply is no way to calibrate HDR TVs to a single spec the way you can calibrate today’s TVs to REC.709.



TVs like the M-series were specifically designed not to exceed REC.709 for the colors. It can exceed the brightness of REC.709 by a great deal but it just barely covers the colors. That means that the TV isn’t wasting anything with respect to the colors when you calibrate to REC.709.



For HDR and WCG TVs you wouldn’t want to calibrate to REC.709 because the TVs are capable of so much more and you have paid a lot extra for that WCG. That is why HDR material is encoded differently. The colors for HDR material are not rendered to any specific standard on the disc or in the video stream. That processing and rendering of the colors happens in real-time as the content is being played.



This enables the TV to render the max colors that it can display for all content. It may not look exactly the same as some other TV but you will be taking full advantage of the max color spectrum that the TV can display every time you play HDR content in it.



In essence each individual HDR TV will have its own standard that it renders to. For the Vizio M-series that standard just happens to coincide with the REC.709 spec because Vizio built it that way to save cost. All other TVs especially HDR ones will have a specific spec unique to that specific TV that they render the colors to.

You act like there will never be a standard to calibrate to with HDR. As always it will just take a little time for things to be updated. I think the problem is that you are making definitive statements instead of saying "for now" or "until new standards are made". The WCG of TVs are based upon set standards already (P3/Rec 2020) these CAN be calibrated to, even if they are not used with all content. While we will need to wait and see how this affects Rec709 material, it doesn't mean "we'll never calibrate with equipment again". I know you have tried to be a proponent against calibrating with equipment and software, but especially here that won't go without having people "raise their eyebrows".


Sent from nowhere
 
#10,118 ·
Any reason why certain channels will not stay hidden on a M43-C1? (while other ones will)

My dad had bought this set, it is being used OTA & is NOT connected to the internet. I was kind of discuouraging him from a "smart TV", but all 4K's seem to have this.

Also noted quirky operation, channels go "Black screen" on a channel change, set needs to be turned of & on for operation to go back to normal. :confused: Is this the PC based processor causing this?
 
#10,120 ·
That list is still missing the M49 Table to Bezel edge measurement. If an M49 owner could measure that and let me know what it is then I'll update the list.
You can find detailed measurements for all Vizio's on their website. Just go to the Support section and then find your Model and it will be under Technical Specifications. On a different note, my M75 did not come with screws for wall mounting. The screws that were in it were way too short.
 
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