Sharp LC-45 OFFICIAL OWNERS THREAD Part 2: FAQ/ Clayface issue... - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 1318 Old 05-29-2005, 09:09 AM - Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
markrubin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 23,076
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 466
Sharp LC-45 OFFICIAL OWNERS THREAD Part 2

this thread is a continuation of the original 64 page Thread

Interesting Links / FAQ format would be great

please take the high road in every post
if you see a problematic post, please do not quote it or respond to it: report it to the mods to handle
markrubin is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 1318 Old 05-29-2005, 10:09 AM
Advanced Member
 
PhoenixScreen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 613
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Here's the old FAQ we created that, among other stuff, contains the information on the "hacking" that needs to be done to make a direct PC to panel connection at 1080p.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...69#post4929769

Phoenix
PhoenixScreen is offline  
post #3 of 1318 Old 05-29-2005, 10:22 AM
Member
 
sharpmibo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 86
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Does anyone out there have this set? I recently purchased one and am very displeased with the HD picture quality. Specifically, large blocks of similar colors, faces and hair, look terrible with blurred images. I have even contacted Sharp and they did indicate there is a problem and will shortly be providing a fix.
sharpmibo is offline  
post #4 of 1318 Old 05-29-2005, 10:39 AM - Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
markrubin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 23,076
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 466
Links to the Clayface Issue

please take the high road in every post
if you see a problematic post, please do not quote it or respond to it: report it to the mods to handle
markrubin is offline  
post #5 of 1318 Old 05-29-2005, 10:43 AM
Member
 
Eric Busch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 71
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Has there been any word when the next generation 45" with TV Guide On Screen will be released to catch up with the 37" 5U and 7U models? I really have no desire to add a cablebox so I'd be using the cablecard, but the current lack of a guide is one of the few things holding me back from the LC-45.
Eric Busch is offline  
post #6 of 1318 Old 05-29-2005, 04:09 PM
Advanced Member
 
RU Geekman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 890
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 13
The current models ship through July, the new models will be available in September.
RU Geekman is offline  
post #7 of 1318 Old 05-29-2005, 08:54 PM
Member
 
mejensen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Los Altos Hills, CA
Posts: 57
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
My experience with the Mac Mini and the LC45GXU:
I first tried to get the Mini to work at 1080i throught the AVC. I could not get a picture at all through Input 4 with a DVI to HDMI cable. And I could do no better than 720p through Input 5 DVI. My procedure for 1080p was to turn on the TV with the AVC box connected to the panel with all 3 cables. At about the same time I started the Mini. then I would disconnect the AVC DVI cable and connect the Mini to the DVI on the back of the panel (or switch the DVI switch). At this point the screen would go white. Then came the Mac bootup screen followed by the full 1080p desktop. I didn't use another display, and I didn't try to run at a lower resolution. When the Mini is connected to the panel at the right time, it detects that it can run at 1080p, and outputs that resolution. I came to the conclusion that the Mini can't do 1080i but can do 1080p.

Mark
mejensen is offline  
post #8 of 1318 Old 05-30-2005, 10:09 AM
Member
 
pvoorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: san diego,ca
Posts: 20
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10


SFHUB:
- "It has fans so can't be flush mounted"...

It has fans???? Who knew?? I can't hear a thing!
re:Flush mounting... it does stick a long way away from the wall... I have the GD4U unit (which is fatter than the GX) on a Sanus tilt mount and it is ugly (the Sanus adds 2 1/2 ") ... I'm getting a Chief PSM2241 from Geekman and hopefully that will help.

- "It has plenty of inputs"...

I can't really test video quality yet (clayface ) ... How does a DVD look over component vs DVI??? Is there a drop in PQ?
If there is, I'd say yeah "plenty of inputs but everyone is buying a switcher!" Need 1 more DVI or HDMI.

JeanMarc:
A buddy and I were playing with my laptop and the GD4U. The connection is only 1280x1024 but iTunes Visualizer and Musicmatch GForce BLEW US AWAY! My kids sat there mesmerized and my wife even likes it. For those with Clayface and wondering if you've made a mistake...try this!!! It is also a good way to see how black the blacks are on this display.

MarcRubin:
Could you institute a "Sharp 45" Clayface Firmware Fix Release watch" thread?

cheers
paul
pvoorn is offline  
post #9 of 1318 Old 05-30-2005, 10:21 AM
AVS Special Member
 
sfhub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 9,527
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by pvoorn View Post

- "It has plenty of inputs"...

If there is, I'd say yeah "plenty of inputs but everyone is buying a switcher!" Need 1 more DVI or HDMI.

I guess to me it isn't a big deal to get a switcher. I'm more in the camp of, I can't switch what it doesn't have. I'm not a fan of switching video through a receiver because I've seen quirks in the past and to get a HDMI/DVI/component/svideo switching receiver would cost a bundle. $200-$300 HDMI switcher is much more reasonable. The one thing that did totally change my outlook on switchers is the transparency I can achieve with JP1 programmable remotes. Regardless of how many switchers I use I just press a single button to turn the whole system on and set the correct inputs.
sfhub is offline  
post #10 of 1318 Old 05-30-2005, 10:59 AM - Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
markrubin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 23,076
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 466
Quote:




Could you institute a "Sharp 45" Clayface Firmware Fix Release watch" thread?

this new thread has clayface in the title: let's use this thread for clayface issues

Mark

please take the high road in every post
if you see a problematic post, please do not quote it or respond to it: report it to the mods to handle
markrubin is offline  
post #11 of 1318 Old 05-30-2005, 12:13 PM
Advanced Member
 
chavel's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 747
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I think mejensen's post about the minimac's plug and play interface with the GX is a significent advance.

The mac os driver for the ati 9200 graphics card in the minimac recognizes the Sharp as a 1080P panel and adjusts the resolution to match. AFAIK video cards in PCs don't do this.

Some advantages of the minimac for use as a HTPC are: it's an affordable solution. Some of us payed almost as much just for their graphics card. It's also dead quiet and very small.

Disadvantages are it's no gaming platform and there is not as large of a number of HTPC installations so software might be limiting.

I guess I'm just trying to justify another electronic expenditure. It would be kind of fun to be able to toggle back and forth between PC and Mac desktops with the Gefen.
chavel is offline  
post #12 of 1318 Old 05-30-2005, 06:50 PM
Member
 
uberanalyst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Great Falls, VA
Posts: 176
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 18
I wall mounted the Sharp in the kitchen, but hated the ugly cable to the AVC sitting on a kitchen counter, as well as the AC power cord to the panel. Spent time this weekend figuring how to hide these all in the wall.

Installed 2-in PVC plastic drain pipe in the wall, which required lots of work tearing open drywall. The outside of 2-in drain pipe is 2 and 3/8 inch, which makes it possible to use a 2.5 inch hole saw to drill holes through 2x4 studs. The nice thing about an in-wall pipe is that it future-proofs the installation; I can change cables in the "conduit" at a later date.

Separated the Sharp's "3-headed" AVC cable (carefully cutting the mouldings that kept it together). Then fished each of the 3 cables, as well as a the power cable with an extension cord, through the drain pipe. The DVI cable is the fattest at 1.5 inches, so it was passed through the 2-inch inside diameter pipe first.

Have replaced the drywall pieces and will now have to do the usual application of joint compound and paint to repair the wall. But the Sharp's panel looks great on the wall with no wires, and I can conveniently connect everything to the AVC box.

Next step is to get a DVI switchbox and a Mac Mini with wireless keyboard, so I can sit in the kitchen with a cup of coffee and read AVS Forum on the Sharp panel at 1080p.

- Dave
uberanalyst is offline  
post #13 of 1318 Old 05-31-2005, 02:25 PM
Senior Member
 
jeanmarc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Montreal
Posts: 256
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Uberanalyst: I would advise a wireless keyboard that has a trackball or trackpad included for your HT set-up.

The MacMini work well with the GX for everyday use: jukebox, web browsing, e-mail, viewing trailers, and DVD player. It's small, utterly silent, and would fit almost anybody's needs. HOWEVER, it cannot take advantage of the new H.264 codec and therefore Video Chatting does not have the same quality as a G5. Further, when playing HD files, or even compressed HD episodes, the mini had some trouble. It played, but not well, pausing or slowing down every now and then, even dropping frames (btw, it's the 1080p power requirement, for I set-up a mini for my parents on a 61" plasma screen, but with a lesser resolution and it worked pretty flawlessly).

Personally, I fully intend to use a MacMini.... But I'm waiting for the new generation to come out, with a more advanced video card. And I don't think we'll have to wait too long for that.
jeanmarc is offline  
post #14 of 1318 Old 05-31-2005, 02:38 PM
Advanced Member
 
PhoenixScreen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 613
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
>>The mac os driver for the ati 9200 graphics card in the minimac recognizes the Sharp as a 1080P panel and adjusts the resolution to match. AFAIK video cards in PCs don't do this.

Chavel,

Remember, people using the nVidia 6600 series cards (in Windows PCs) had reported that these cards were able to automatically display all screen resolutions, including BIOS and boot screens. This would seem to imply that the 6600 series cards read the EDID data and detect the need for scaling without any driver or OS support (hence the BIOS screens working).

I've never had a 6600 card to test this with, but nobody's reported otherwise, and I'm hopeful this is a sign that all future nVidia cards will "just work" as nicely.

Phoenix
PhoenixScreen is offline  
post #15 of 1318 Old 05-31-2005, 05:51 PM
Advanced Member
 
chavel's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 747
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Right you are Phoenix - I forgot that 6600 card owners are seeing the boot screens. I guess you're saying that it must be the firmware on the card because it shows the BIOS screen before any OS or driver gets loaded same as mejensen reports for the minimac. BTW you can almost buy a minimac for the price of some of the newer video cards. Thanks for pointing that out.
chavel is offline  
post #16 of 1318 Old 05-31-2005, 06:04 PM
Advanced Member
 
chavel's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: SF Bay Area
Posts: 747
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Personally, I fully intend to use a MacMini.... But I'm waiting for the new generation to come out, with a more advanced video card. And I don't think we'll have to wait too long for that.
____________________________________________________________ _______

Thanks for the tip I needed something to stop me from getting one. Hope it's not too long and that it will be geared for 1080P HDTV displays. Apple seems to know what they're doing in the HTPC department.
chavel is offline  
post #17 of 1318 Old 06-03-2005, 10:06 AM
Senior Member
 
robmarti@tampa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 295
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 10
does anyone have there 45gx6u hanging on wall with tilt mount. i was wondering which one people are using, and ease/difficulty there was with them and any surprises with the installation.

-rob
robmarti@tampa is offline  
post #18 of 1318 Old 06-03-2005, 10:31 AM
Member
 
kiall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
While not a tilt-only mount, I have mine hung in a 24" deep niche on a Sanus Systems VMAA mount, which in addition to tilting -15 to +5 degrees, can shift left-right and extends up to 30 inches from the wall. I experienced no problems mounting this, but since this mount's brackets do cover the TV's rear pop-off panel where the power and AVC cables terminate, I was especially careful to make sure these were all tight before installing the mount.
kiall is offline  
post #19 of 1318 Old 06-03-2005, 11:50 AM
Member
 
mattgilmore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 37
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by uberanalyst View Post

Installed 2-in PVC plastic drain pipe in the wall, which required lots of work tearing open drywall. The outside of 2-in drain pipe is 2 and 3/8 inch, which makes it possible to use a 2.5 inch hole saw to drill holes through 2x4 studs.

Did you check whether those studs were load-bearing first? Those studs are now nearly structurally useless. I hope they're not holding up anything important.
mattgilmore is offline  
post #20 of 1318 Old 06-03-2005, 04:03 PM
Member
 
uberanalyst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Great Falls, VA
Posts: 176
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by mattgilmore View Post

Did you check whether those studs were load-bearing first? Those studs are now nearly structurally useless. I hope they're not holding up anything important.

Obviously I wouldn't want to cut 2.5-inch holes in 2x4s in a load-bearing wall. Fortunately this is an inside non-load-bearing wall of a post-and-beam house. Have now completed wall repair and painting, and the Sharp looks awesome mounted on the wall without any wires.
uberanalyst is offline  
post #21 of 1318 Old 06-03-2005, 05:02 PM
Advanced Member
 
RU Geekman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 890
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by robmarti@tampa View Post

does anyone have there 45gx6u hanging on wall with tilt mount. i was wondering which one people are using, and ease/difficulty there was with them and any surprises with the installation.

-rob

Click here to see the Chief PRO-2241 pitch-adjustable (i.e., tilting) wall mount. It's a basic model that provides up to 15 degrees of tilt, which is adjusted via bolts on the back. It is very sturdy, low profile (1 1/2") and reasonably priced, with an MSRP of $249.99. Slightly more expensive, at $349.99, the Chief PLP-2241 allows for hand-adjustment with no tools necessary. This mount allows you to pull forward the bottom of your display 3" from the wall, for the easy attachment of cables. It offers up to 15 degrees of tilt and has a 1 7/16" ultra-slim mounting profile. It is shown here. With a suitable padlock, you can secure your Sharp panel to either of these mounts.

The Sanus VMAA universal mount comes in either black or silver powder-coated finish and features an articulating arm that extends up to 25 3/4 " from the wall. It offers 20 degrees of down-tilt and 5 degrees of up-tilt, and has an MSRP of $549.99. See it here. Sanus was recently purchased by Chief Manufacturing.

In articulating-arm wall mounts, I prefer the Peerless PLA-1. This is the top-selling such mount on the market today. Its heavy-duty construction will not allow the display to sag over time. It extends up to 30 1/2" from the wall and offers 10 degrees of down-tilt and 5 degrees up-tilt, which is more than sufficient for most installations. It has a wire-management design that conceals and protects display cables, which is a nice feature. This wall mount is available in silver or black finish and carries an MSRP of $561. The required Sharp 45" LCD-specific adapter plate has an MSRP of $115, for a total price of $676. Check it out here.

An interesting hybrid of the above two types of wall mounts (i.e., pitch-adjustable and fully articulating-arm) is the Chief PWP-2241. It features a 4" pivot arm that allows up to 19 degrees of side to side pivot, along with 5 degrees up-tilt and 15 degrees down-tilt. As you can see from this schematic, it has a very slim profile when retracted (less than 3"), yet offers quite a bit of flexibility. The MSRP of this model is $485.

All of the above wall mounts will work with any of the three 45" Sharp LCD models currently on the market.
RU Geekman is offline  
post #22 of 1318 Old 06-03-2005, 05:06 PM
Member
 
sharpmibo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 86
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Contacted today by Sharp, the firmware upgrade has been released. Unfortunate because I've already arranged a swap out to GDX6U. I does appear that this model is the only one currently able to accept 1080p and that is with a bypass of the AVC (not supported by Sharp). If you have a clayface issue now would seem to be a good time to contact Sharp. They will require a field service tech to perform the upgrade. Am curious to learn if this fix works.
sharpmibo is offline  
post #23 of 1318 Old 06-03-2005, 05:30 PM
Advanced Member
 
RU Geekman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 890
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 13
There is no GDX6U. You must mean the LC-45GX6U, which does indeed allow 1080p input directly to the panel.
RU Geekman is offline  
post #24 of 1318 Old 06-04-2005, 12:59 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
Abbas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Morgan Hill, CA
Posts: 481
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
I still dont know if I have the clayface issue since I bypass the AVC entirely.

I am so glad that I purchased the GX model. I was the reading the stats on the Sony PS3 getting released next year which will support 1080p. The games should look very nice on the Sharp. Too bad, we have to wait until May of 2006.

abbas
Abbas is offline  
post #25 of 1318 Old 06-04-2005, 06:21 AM
Senior Member
 
jeanmarc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Montreal
Posts: 256
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
While I don't think we ever got a clear answer on the origin of the Clayface issue: Display or AVC, it is now safe to assume that the culprit is the AVC since Sharp is working on an update.

While waiting for the PS3, I've been playing HALO in FULL 1080p. wohw. I am rediscovering the game, much to the chagrin of my wife.
jeanmarc is offline  
post #26 of 1318 Old 06-04-2005, 06:39 AM - Thread Starter
Super Moderator
 
markrubin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Jersey Shore
Posts: 23,076
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeanmarc View Post

While I don't think we ever got a clear answer on the origin of the Clayface issue: Display or AVC, it is now safe to assume that the culprit is the AVC since Sharp is working on an update.

it is still speculation but I think it has to be an issue in the AVC box

please take the high road in every post
if you see a problematic post, please do not quote it or respond to it: report it to the mods to handle
markrubin is offline  
post #27 of 1318 Old 06-04-2005, 08:16 AM
Advanced Member
 
RU Geekman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 890
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by markrubin View Post

it is still speculation but I think it has to be an issue in the AVC box

I know of someone who has a GD4U with clayface (he didn't buy it from me!!), so it's not related to any circuitry that is unique to the AVC box. Whatever the cause of the problem, all three 45" models are susceptible.
RU Geekman is offline  
post #28 of 1318 Old 06-04-2005, 08:46 AM
Senior Member
 
jeanmarc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Montreal
Posts: 256
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hmmm,

The only way to know for sure, as Sawyer had mentioned in Part I, is to have someone with a GX, a bypass, and clayface. If the bypassed picture shows no clayface, then it's the AVC. Otherwise, it's the display. Up to now, no one has met all three requirements. However, the fact that GD models also have clayface issues does not help in establishing if it's the Display or the AVC. It seems to me that if only GDs existed, it would be impossible for a normal user to find out. I could very well be related to the AVC part of the TV only: the GDs, from what I understood, have the AVC components flattened behind the display, to put it perhaps too simply.
jeanmarc is offline  
post #29 of 1318 Old 06-04-2005, 12:24 PM
Advanced Member
 
RU Geekman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 890
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeanmarc View Post

...However, the fact that GD models also have clayface issues does not help in establishing if it's the Display or the AVC. It seems to me that if only GDs existed, it would be impossible for a normal user to find out. I[t] could very well be related to the AVC part of the TV only: the GDs, from what I understood, have the AVC components flattened behind the display, to put it perhaps too simply.

That's why I included the qualification that clayface is not caused by circuitry that is "unique to the AVC box." Because the problem can be found in both GX and GD units, obviously it must be due to circuits that are common to both. Hopefully, we'll get some real answers soon. I have a call into the technical person at Sharp who is in charge of such things, but we've been playing phone tag.
RU Geekman is offline  
post #30 of 1318 Old 06-04-2005, 01:35 PM
Senior Member
 
jeanmarc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Montreal
Posts: 256
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I see what you are saying. My thinking is simply that the GD and the GX have overall the same circuitry albeit presented differently (the GX in an AVC box, the GDs behind the display). Anyway, we'll have to wait for Sharp to comment further, which I hope for those affected will be soon!

For those that followed the clayface thread, I had mentioned that I had experienced it on precisely HALF of my screen, until I rebooted. I had called it "posterization" of the faces. I now think that this was a different problem: 1. it was not persistent and 2. it was localised on only half the screen.
jeanmarc is offline  
Reply LCD Flat Panel Displays

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off