Official Sharp Aquos 42D62U/46D62U/52D62U Owner's Thread (NO PRICE TALK!) - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:05 AM
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Has anyone had a chance to view OTA HD signals on their d62? Will the d62 bring in both analog and digital signals through the Antenna coax connection (i.e., will both the ATSC and NTSC tuners work as required automatically)? I've heard that some older models will only show HD signals if the UHF feed is connected to the Antenna input on the TV and that another connection to the Cable input is required for SD. Not sure this makes sense but this is what I was told.

(Sorry if this is a newbie question)

DG
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post #362 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gdog2004 View Post

Great thread...Therese, Shinraven --excellent insights.
I have a question for you guys now that you've owned the panels for a little while. I have a Sony A2000 that has a perfect picture(no green glob or color uniformity issues) that I am considering returning under the belief that this sharp may produce an even better picture.
I like LCD's for other reasons(no bulb replacment--no screen glare) but still--the overwhelming issue for me is PQ. Am I wrong to assume that the the 52" sharp could produce a even better picture ? I could deal with as good...but I may have remorse if its worse. Therese you have compared the sharp "filmlike" picture to the Rear Proj. SXRD so I *think* this is a valid question. I seem to find that a lot of people on this thread are not biased towards one particular technology so I eagerly await all your answers
Nothing worse than when you ask for advice on something and some guy who paid $6000 for a plasma 3 years ago has to justify his purchase by convincing you that what *he* bought is the best.

I was comparing the feel of the Sharp picture to that of the SXRD Ruby Projector - not the actual picture quality or that of the A2000. Someone else (maybe Westa?) can chime in here as I have not done extensive evaluation of the A2000 - due my need for a flat panel. However, what I recall and what I have done would leave me to believe in the sweet spot - the A2000 has better PQ than that of the Sharp. This is not scientific by any means and it is from my recolections as I have never compared the A2000 directly against this or any other LCD.

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post #363 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hancop View Post

I think someone in the other Sharp D62 thread that the Sharp does 1:1 pixel mapping, but I was at Bay Bloor Radio in Toronto yesterday talking to the Sharp rep while viewing the D62's, and he said that the Sharps do not do 1:1 pixel mapping.

Can anyone who owns the set and has tried this confirm ?

Thanks

The Sharp DOES 1:1 without overscan. Set it to dot by dot. Have confirmed on PC source, HD DVD source and 1080i video source.

Therese
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post #364 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MN_EE View Post

I returned later that evening with my wife to make our purchase... the 52". It'll be delivered on Thursday.

Thanks again for all the helpful advice,
-MN_EE

Congrats and enjoy the new set! You will soon think 52" is toooooooo small

Therese
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post #365 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:30 AM
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Therese

How goes the battle with the settings? I was thinking if you get the chance, you may want to update your comprehensive 1080p thread. More and more people are asking for comparitive information and that thread was uber useful.
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post #366 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:32 AM
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I have been a little concerned with the banding issues that some owners have been writing about. After doing some reading about what exactly "banding" is, i found the following blurb in an article about LCDs:

"On occasion, LCD projectors can manifest a problem known as vertical banding. Vertical banding consists of subtle (sometimes not so subtle) vertical bands often in the range of about 1-inch thick, evenly spaced across the entire picture. DLP projectors don't have this problem. Most LCD projectors don't eitherit is not an automatic byproduct of the technology. It is a flaw that can occur in the manufacturing process of the LCD panels themselves, and some LCD panels will tend to manifest it more noticeably than others. The panels that cause the most visible problems are usually weeded out in the vendor's quality control process. However, those that create just a hint of banding often pass through QC, since it is prohibitively expensive to discard all parts that exhibit flaws which may have no practical impact on picture quality."

I know that this article is referring to LCD *projectors*, but I was curious about if this is the same kind of deal with LCD flat panels...i.e. is this more of a quality control issue than an issue with all of these new Sharp sets? I know that some people have seen the banding, while others have not, so I'm wondering if this is something that could be resolved by exchanging a banding-set for a non-banding set. That would be a hellaciously tedious process, so i was just curious.
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post #367 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonnyC79 View Post

I have been a little concerned with the banding issues that some owners have been writing about. After doing some reading about what exactly "banding" is, i found the following blurb in an article about LCDs:

"On occasion, LCD projectors can manifest a problem known as vertical banding. Vertical banding consists of subtle (sometimes not so subtle) vertical bands often in the range of about 1-inch thick, evenly spaced across the entire picture. DLP projectors don't have this problem. Most LCD projectors don't eitherit is not an automatic byproduct of the technology. It is a flaw that can occur in the manufacturing process of the LCD panels themselves, and some LCD panels will tend to manifest it more noticeably than others. The panels that cause the most visible problems are usually weeded out in the vendor's quality control process. However, those that create just a hint of banding often pass through QC, since it is prohibitively expensive to discard all parts that exhibit flaws which may have no practical impact on picture quality."

I know that this article is referring to LCD *projectors*, but I was curious about if this is the same kind of deal with LCD flat panels...i.e. is this more of a quality control issue than an issue with all of these new Sharp sets? I know that some people have seen the banding, while others have not, so I'm wondering if this is something that could be resolved by exchanging a banding-set for a non-banding set. That would be a hellaciously tedious process, so i was just curious.

Without getting into all the technical mumbu-jumbo - the majority of banding issues that are related to the panel itself(there are some that are power related) are a result of poor MFG'ing. SO yes QC has a good part to play in it, there was a study done about a year ago (See Insight Media)...that stated a defect rate of as high as 31%(across the 3 major panel mfg'rs) if a certain sigma was used for passing the panels. Obviously that would be unaccetable(financially) and lesser sigma is used. What you hope to get on the higher tiered sets is a better level of quality - same panel per se but more rigorous QC and cirteria - and that the end consumer doesnt have to "gamble" on the quality of the panel.

I think we have to wait for more reports to come in to see if this is a QC issue for Sharp. It appears from the numbers of 46" users - that it is higher among that population. However, there are more 46" ers' on the forum than 52" ers so how valid or skewed is unknown.

Therese
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post #368 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgldhl View Post

Therese

How goes the battle with the settings? I was thinking if you get the chance, you may want to update your comprehensive 1080p thread. More and more people are asking for comparitive information and that thread was uber useful.

I just watched a movie last night and did not play...much I am hoping to find my Spyder among my recent moving boxes to sit down and really dial it in this weekend. Box 3 of 24 was a no go...sigh..

Wasn't sure how many people actually found it useful as I got tons of PMS asking for pricing etc and stating that without pricing and comparative sunbjective data - it was not real ...well...helpful.

As I simply believe there are too many factors to have a subjective rating and we know the pricing rules - was just gonn alet it die...

Maybe I'll try another update.

Therese
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post #369 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 10:06 AM
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Cyber Chulo

Excellent gaming shots. That pic of graw is fantastic. No overscan whatsoever on the hud. Compare it to the screenshots over on the sammy thread... good stuff.

Great shots of SotC. You've got excellent taste in games .

Truth is... SotC is just a jaggy game. These old PS2 games aren't going to look that great when you blow them up on a big HD screen. I've actually hauled my PS2 into Best Buy and tried SotC on several TVs, and they all looked pretty jaggy.
And SotC actually fairs a bit better since it supports 480p. 480i games all look pretty horrendous.

Now, what I am dieing to see, is Shadow of the Collosus running on the PS3 (backward compatible) upscaled to 1080p. I'm wondering how much it will get cleaned up.
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post #370 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 10:14 AM
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I am also looking for the packing dimensions of the 46" if anyone gets a moment. Thanks for all the help early buyers ;-)
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post #371 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonnyC79 View Post

I have been a little concerned with the banding issues that some owners have been writing about. After doing some reading about what exactly "banding" is, i found the following blurb in an article about LCDs:

"On occasion, LCD projectors can manifest a problem known as vertical banding. Vertical banding consists of subtle (sometimes not so subtle) vertical bands often in the range of about 1-inch thick, evenly spaced across the entire picture. DLP projectors don't have this problem. Most LCD projectors don't eitherit is not an automatic byproduct of the technology. It is a flaw that can occur in the manufacturing process of the LCD panels themselves, and some LCD panels will tend to manifest it more noticeably than others. The panels that cause the most visible problems are usually weeded out in the vendor's quality control process. However, those that create just a hint of banding often pass through QC, since it is prohibitively expensive to discard all parts that exhibit flaws which may have no practical impact on picture quality."

I know that this article is referring to LCD *projectors*, but I was curious about if this is the same kind of deal with LCD flat panels...i.e. is this more of a quality control issue than an issue with all of these new Sharp sets? I know that some people have seen the banding, while others have not, so I'm wondering if this is something that could be resolved by exchanging a banding-set for a non-banding set. That would be a hellaciously tedious process, so i was just curious.

As soon as I get home, I will photograph the 3 horizontal bands (about 1" in eight) that go across my screen (mainly visible on the right side). Yes, horizontal, not vertical.

I'm beginning to get really annoyed with this thing. I may just return it, and not exchange at all.

Also, before I had the 46d62u, I had a 27" Panasonic Tau. After I had rearranged my pad a few months ago, I would notice a thin horizontal line going from the bottom to the top very slowly. I don't know what caused this; I know it's some kind of interference from something.

Could it be possible that the same interference is causing the 3 lines on my 46incher?

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post #372 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 10:23 AM
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Thanks Therese. It looks like Westa is my only source for a comparison here ! He has told me his CURRENT sharp(2005 model) is close to the XBR1 but not quite as good in the sweet spot. Guess I will have to see for myself unless Westa gets his first.
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post #373 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothias View Post

As soon as I get home, I will photograph the 3 horizontal bands (about 1" in eight) that go across my screen (mainly visible on the right side). Yes, horizontal, not vertical.

I'm beginning to get really annoyed with this thing. I may just return it, and not exchange at all.

Also, before I had the 46d62u, I had a 27" Panasonic Tau. After I had rearranged my pad a few months ago, I would notice a thin horizontal line going from the bottom to the top very slowly. I don't know what caused this; I know it's some kind of interference from something.

Could it be possible that the same interference is causing the 3 lines on my 46incher?

Usually....not as in always...but usually banding typical of LCD's is vertical. Usually...as in not always......horizontal banding is related to interference.

Are you using a power strip of some kind?

Is this present on all sources or just video? I.E. Does your DVD player source exhibit this anomoly as well?

You say the set is irritating you...what other issues are you experiencing? Promise I will not flame Just think it is important that any and all issues get brought out to assist not only potential buyers - but to assist in seeing if there are other issues we should be looking for that may have not manifested themselves in a particular setup. The strength of the internet and the diversity is the amount of variability it brings to the table - allowing for much more "real world" testing than most MFG's ever even attempt.

It also may be that some issues are source related and the collective thought power of the forum can assit in alleviating. SO please do not hesitate to post what you are experiencing.

Therese
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post #374 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 10:33 AM
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therese...

when watching dtv and your h20 box, are you letting it set the mode or are you manually adjusting it. it goes to 480p automatically, but i can manually adjust the box to either 720 or 1080i. i cant seem to tell much difference, but wonder if there is a better setting
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post #375 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isucamper View Post

Cyber Chulo

Excellent gaming shots. That pic of graw is fantastic. No overscan whatsoever on the hud. Compare it to the screenshots over on the sammy thread... good stuff.

Great shots of SotC. You've got excellent taste in games .

Truth is... SotC is just a jaggy game. These old PS2 games aren't going to look that great when you blow them up on a big HD screen. I've actually hauled my PS2 into Best Buy and tried SotC on several TVs, and they all looked pretty jaggy.
And SotC actually fairs a bit better since it supports 480p. 480i games all look pretty horrendous.

Now, what I am dieing to see, is Shadow of the Collosus running on the PS3 (backward compatible) upscaled to 1080p. I'm wondering how much it will get cleaned up.

Thanks for the post to the Sammy thread. It never occured to me how big of a problem overscan is. For alot of people on that thread it was a deal breaker. After seeing the GRAW picson the D62, I have renewed faith and the 46" will make a great companion to my PS3, 360 and Wii-nis.

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post #376 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 11:38 AM
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Theresa suggested that my multiple components are causing the horizontal lines on my 46d62u. What do you guys think? Here's what we concluded to be the problems:

1) Wi-Fi router right next to TV.
2) Mac a few feet away from TV, and I use Bluetooth for my mouse & keyboard.
3) Cable modem in close proximity to the TV.
4) Lack of a noise-reducting power strip.

I will experiment later on by buying a higher-end power strip, and moving all of the components away from the set.

Can one or all of these things really cause the multiple 1" thick horizontal lines that I see on my set?

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post #377 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 11:43 AM
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Attended the Bay Bloor Radio Sharp rollout of the new scrrens last night here in Toronto, good crowd.

Those 3 screens are phenominal. Therese posting here noted by many, and very helpfull.

I wuz checking to look for the colour fade off axis on the 42 inch model. Sorry folks for the life of me, I could not see that. Actually all 3 panels were set up side by side, and ya knows wot, I thought the 42 inch was the best! But I did not see a wide variety of feeds, just the 1080p loop of flowers and scenes, no spots action, no SD feeds. Will have to arrange another time to check on other lower quality feeds.

Very spectacular LCD's IMO
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post #378 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 11:55 AM
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I don't recall who posted about this before. My 46D62U has the buzzing noise. It does go away in DYNAMIC (FIXED) mode, however, that mode is not the reason it goes away. It will go away in all modes if the backlight level is set to 100%. It appears to be coil buzz in the backlight PWM circuit. Any level below 100% buzzes the same amount. It is very high pitch and if you have other noise in the room (air conditioner, etc.) you will not hear it.

Now that I've identified it, it is driving me crazy. Possibly enough to return the TV. My old Pioneer Elite also had a high pitched noise problem and the longer I owned that TV, the longer I regretted not doing something about it.
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post #379 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothias View Post

Theresa suggested that my multiple components are causing the horizontal lines on my 46d62u. What do you guys think? Here's what we concluded to be the problems:

1) Wi-Fi router right next to TV.
2) Mac a few feet away from TV, and I use Bluetooth for my mouse & keyboard.
3) Cable modem in close proximity to the TV.
4) Lack of a noise-reducting power strip.

I will experiment later on by buying a higher-end power strip, and moving all of the components away from the set.

Can one or all of these things really cause the multiple 1" thick horizontal lines that I see on my set?

Just another idea to throw out.

When I first got my Sharp 45" last year I had intermittent line interference and it would periodically get worse and we had just moved into a new home and I discovered I had a sump pump in the basement kicking in down in the basement replicating line interference on my panel. Once I acquired a Belkin PF60 Line Conditioner for my HT systems all those issues were resolved. I'm not saying this is your issue but using a Line Conditioner was successful at resolving all of mine - but do not buy it in the B&M - I got it on-line for about 60-70% less than what they sell it at B&M's. Once in awhile Provantage has specials on them and Ecost in the cart special.

Good Luck!

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post #380 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothias View Post

Theresa suggested that my multiple components are causing the horizontal lines on my 46d62u. What do you guys think? Here's what we concluded to be the problems:

1) Wi-Fi router right next to TV.
2) Mac a few feet away from TV, and I use Bluetooth for my mouse & keyboard.
3) Cable modem in close proximity to the TV.
4) Lack of a noise-reducting power strip.

I will experiment later on by buying a higher-end power strip, and moving all of the components away from the set.

Can one or all of these things really cause the multiple 1" thick horizontal lines that I see on my set?

Short answer: Yes. Though physical proximity of those things to the TV shouldn't - since FCC cert requires consumer electronics to reject & ignore all forms of RF interference - but the cert doesn't cover the cabling leading up to the unit or signals present on those cables

So, particularly if your cables are a tangled mess, power running parallel or too close to signal cables for any distance can cause interference.

The other potential candidate is ground loops. Most common cause I've found is where more than one device "attached" to the TV has a cable input, or various devices attached to the TV are run off different power circuits. Experimentation can isolate these issues.

Chris.
(Not an expert, just had some interference issues of my own earlier in the year.)
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post #381 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 11:59 AM
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Wouldn't a quick and no-cost check be to simply power off the Mac, the Wi-Fi router, the cable modem, etc. for a few minutes? Then, if the problem goes away, turn on one at a time - you get the idea. If it IS interference from one of these, I wonder if your cables are involved?

Doug
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post #382 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:00 PM
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I have spent several hours viewing these new Sharps along with other displays. I have seen zero of this banding being talked about. Just be sure you have a clean signal going to your display. To connect cable, satellite, OTA, I find component works just fine. Keep all wiring (electrical and audio/video) as neat and simple as possible. Any banding you see is probably caused by a source outside the tv , I would guess. I spent some time again today viewing the newest sets. There is little difference among the top displays..be they lcd or plasma. You can adjust all of them to get looking very much alike. I again worked on the 5070 and the Sharp 52" and, now, you can hardly tell the difference. The Sharp appears just a touch sharper (more resolution) but hardly talking about. This is on OTA and cable and satellite viewing. Not calling anything the best here. But I will comment, there is nothing noticable better (under $4000) than the Pioneer plasma 5070 (and probably the newest monitor..Pioneer 507cmx) and the Sharp 52" 1080p display. To debate which is the 'best' is foolish because there is no best.
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post #383 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYFOOTBALLGIANTS View Post

I am also looking for the packing dimensions of the 46" if anyone gets a moment. Thanks for all the help early buyers ;-)

The manager at my BB personally measured the 46 and 52 boxes and gave me these dimensions:

46D62U
13" x 34" x 48"

52D62U
14" x 37" x 56"
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post #384 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richard korsgren View Post

I have spent several hours viewing these new Sharps along with other displays. I have seen zero of this banding being talked about. Just be sure you have a clean signal going to your display. To connect cable, satellite, OTA, I find component works just fine. Keep all wiring (electrical and audio/video) as neat and simple as possible. Any banding you see is probably caused by a source outside the tv , I would guess. I spent some time again today viewing the newest sets. There is little difference among the top displays..be they lcd or plasma. You can adjust all of them to get looking very much alike. I again worked on the 5070 and the Sharp 52" and, now, you can hardly tell the difference. The Sharp appears just a touch sharper (more resolution) but hardly talking about. This is on OTA and cable and satellite viewing. Not calling anything the best here. But I will comment, there is nothing noticable better (under $4000) than the Pioneer plasma 5070 (and probably the newest monitor..Pioneer 507cmx) and the Sharp 52" 1080p display. To debate which is the 'best' is foolish because there is no best.

What else would cause banding uses outside of uneven backlighting?

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post #385 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timothias View Post

As soon as I get home, I will photograph the 3 horizontal bands (about 1" in eight) that go across my screen (mainly visible on the right side). Yes, horizontal, not vertical.

I'm beginning to get really annoyed with this thing. I may just return it, and not exchange at all.

Also, before I had the 46d62u, I had a 27" Panasonic Tau. After I had rearranged my pad a few months ago, I would notice a thin horizontal line going from the bottom to the top very slowly. I don't know what caused this; I know it's some kind of interference from something.

Could it be possible that the same interference is causing the 3 lines on my 46incher?

Hi timothias,

Interference is absolutely a possibility and from what you've described it sounds probable to me also. I remember as a kid seeing the TV image seriously degrade every time my mom used the new microwave...

Anyway, interference comes in two forms, either conducted (i.e. over a cable) or radiated (i.e. over the air). There are many ways to mitigate noise problems, but before you spend any money, I suggest you isolate the problem (no sense in buying a power filter if you're getting radiated source interference).

The easiest way to do this is to recreate the problem, monitor it and then start systematically eliminating the possible sources starting with the most likely (i.e. when you see banding watch the display while you disconnect the power to the possible sources you've described). If you get to the point where you've unpluged every likely offender, try disconnecting inputs (source noise coupling) or moving cables (cross talk). Usually, the problem will just disappear when you pull the right plug or reorient a cable. Unfortunately, occasionally I come across people who have spent a lot of time and money only to have to tell them it's the doplar radar tower across the street...

Anyway if you can isolate the source we can suggest some solutions.

Good luck,
-MN_EE
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post #386 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by wpwj40e View Post

The Sharp DOES 1:1 without overscan. Set it to dot by dot. Have confirmed on PC source, HD DVD source and 1080i video source.

Therese

If you do 1280x720 (720p) from a PC, will it strech w/o overscan? (This is for when using the monitor for PC applications and not HTPC use; I can't easily read 1920x1080 on my 50" SXRD.)

Quietly rooting for the glorious comeback of the MCE2005 UI in the new Vista Media Center.
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post #387 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:43 PM
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This is a pic of the banding seen during the "20th Century Fox" opening on one of my DVDs...the camera is swooping over the top of the '2' in '20th'. I figured this would be a good scene since most people will own a 20th Century Fox DVD and can try it for themselves. As you can see, the two main horizontal bands (marked with red arrows) split the screen about into thirds. There are other minor, hardly noticeable bands if you look closely.

This is independent of source for me. It is visible on DVD, Comcast HD STB, and PS2, all connected via component. I am also using a surge protector for the power cable. The bands are static and do not change position, so I don't feel this is something caused by OTA interference... Any suggestions (including 'exchange it!') are welcome.
LL
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post #388 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Bicster View Post

... buzzing noise ... will go away in all modes if the backlight level is set to 100%. It appears to be coil buzz in the backlight PWM circuit. Any level below 100% buzzes the same amount. It is very high pitch and if you have other noise in the room (air conditioner, etc.) you will not hear it.

Now that I've identified it, it is driving me crazy. Possibly enough to return the TV.

I've run across this problem before, its a deal breaker for me. Hope this is not typical of the new line. I would expect to use the set at minimum backlight, I would think you need to exchange it.

Anybody do a power use test on the 52 with a killawatt or other meter for various backlight tests ? Most curious on power consumption.
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post #389 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:48 PM
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With all the reviews here (mostly from Therese), i'm pretty much sold on the sharp 52, but i wanted to see it in person first. Went to my local circuit city, about a mile away from my apartment, and messed around it.

Saw the red push right away, tweaked a few settings and got rid of it, but i lost some quality in the colors and contrast. Its right next the the 46" xbr2. Above the xbr2 is the 50px60U, but with so much glare on it from bad overhead lighting i couldn't even use it as a comparison. That right there was enough to convince me there is no way i can go plasma with my rooms lighting conditions.

They have the sharp connected via component, but being pretty new to tweaking a set, i had trouble getting the settings to a point where it was competing with the xbr2 in PQ. The blacks were blacker, but the contrast wasn't as good. They were running some HD movie station, called HDmoviesomething. Anyone have some settings they found for HDTV via component video that i can use to get a better impression of what this TV can do? I also didnt find a "white" setting anywhere that i saw referenced somewhere in someone elses settings.

I'm going back with my roomates later today so we can make sure its what we want for the apartment.
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post #390 of 12250 Old 10-11-2006, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bpmurr View Post

What else would cause banding uses outside of uneven backlighting?

All kinds of thing are being brought up here. Someone posted some verbiage regarding LCD projector banding which is totally unrelated to direct view LCD flat panels. That has to do with the LCD imager itself through which the light is projected (front or rear). Interference can cause, well, interference in the form of bands across a screen, but the descriptions people have been posting about sound much more like uneven backlight distribution to me too.


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