Official Sony Bravia LCD Uneven Backlight/Cloudy Thread - Page 20 - AVS Forum
View Poll Results: Does your Sony 46" XBR LCD suffer from an uneven backlight or cloudy background?
YES, clouds can been seen when dark colors are displayed or when switching inputs 1,294 69.05%
NO, my screen has a perfect, fully even, backlight 580 30.95%
Voters: 1874. You may not vote on this poll

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post #571 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 05:44 AM
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Thanks to everyone for thier experiences. Here is mine. I am on my second XBR2, the first one had pretty sevre clouding so I exchanged it at BB. The second one wasn't as bad but still unacceptable. I opened a case with Sony and they had thier service contractor, QualEx Serve, contact me. They seem very helpfull but unaware of this issue. I gave them all the information about my two defective sets and everything I've read on this post. The contractor contacted Sony which denied any awareness of this issue but authorized a new LCD panel replacement to be intalled in my set. I was initially hestitant to let them take my new set apart a install a potentially worse panel inside. I decided that I will go ahead with this and if it is worse, either have them put the original panel back and demand that Sony replace the entire set untill it is correct or just insist they replace the entire set without putting the original panel back. For the amount of money spent on the Sony name, I want this right. My current set is a September 06 build. I am really disapoijted in Sony having these manufactured in Mexico. Two of my co workers have the 40" sets manfactured in Japan and they are perfect. I believe there is no comparison with the quality control in Mexico vs. the years of expeience and strict QC of Japan. I will post more info to follow.
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post #572 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 06:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetp View Post

...Also, for those that layed their sets face down on a table, where the clouds seemed to diminish, are they remaining this way, or any clouds coming back? ...

I laid the panel on its face for around 30 hours while I work on installing a new console. Results were the same....clouds.

I did notice that depending on your exposure settings on you camera, and the settings on your panel, you pictures could show clouds or not, OR you could physically notice the clouds on the panel. With Power Saver on "Low" or "High" the clouds do go away but your calibrated settings are now compromised. Also, with light sensor "On", the clouds also do go away at night, but again you calibrated settings are also now compromised.

Here are some pictures with various lighting conditions and settings

Light Sensor "On"


Light Sensor "Off"


Power Saver "Low"


Power Saver "Off"


With SW Ep III - Component, Input 5



With Comcast HD box Input 8


Input 8 with NO signal, dark room:


Input 8 with NO signal, lighted room:


Bottom line, depending on your settings and inputs will determine whether you see the problem or not. For me using "petmic10" settings with Power Saver and Light Sensor both "Off" on inputs 5 and 8, the clouding problem is pretty evident.
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post #573 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 06:41 AM
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Originally Posted by seattlite View Post

I laid the panel on its face for around 30 hours while I work on installing a new console. Results were the same....clouds.

Bottom line, depending on your settings and inputs will determine whether you see the problem or not. For me using "petmic10" settings with Power Saver and Light Sensor both "Off" on inputs 5 and 8, the clouding problem is pretty evident.

Thanks for the pictures!

That's a lot worse the the 46XBR2s I've seen in person so far. The two that I've
seee had white cloud issues, but mostly limited to one side or one corner of the
screen. The white clouds on yours seem to be all over the place...
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post #574 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 06:48 AM
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Thanks for the pictures!

That's a lot worse the the 46XBR2s I've seen in person so far. The two that I've
seee had white cloud issues, but mostly limited to one side or one corner of the
screen. The white clouds on yours seem to be all over the place...

Yeah....even though CC gave me a DANG GOOD deal on the panel, I think I might return it and wait it out. I seems like too much work to get a perfect "replacement", and one is not guranteed to even get a "perfect" replacement.

Oh well.
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post #575 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 08:06 AM
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Yeah....even though CC gave me a DANG GOOD deal on the panel, I think I might return it and wait it out. I seems like too much work to get a perfect "replacement", and one is not guranteed to even get a "perfect" replacement.

Oh well.

I got a fantastic price on mine, too--that's what makes it so hard to give up. I haven't even seen mine yet because my BB was so backed up on deliveries. This problem has been driving me crazy as is demonstrated by what happened to me yesterday:

As of yesterday morning, I had decided to cancel my order and wait out the problem. I even called Best Buy to try to cancel, but they told me I had to do it in person with the receipt in hand.

After reading more posts, I think to myself that maybe I'm acting crazy by returning what could potentially be a great TV before I've even seen it yet based on anecdotal evidence on one message board (I was unable to find discussion of this problem anywhere else through google). I called Best Buy again and asked if instead of delivery, whether I could come in and pick it up. I figured I'd get the TV, see it for myself, and then decide. They said I could do that.

I go down to Best Buy and they cancel my delivery order, pull the TV out of storage, bring it out to my car, and lo and behold it won't fit in my car. Everyone thought I was crazy for thinking it would fit (I have a civic), but I have bought tons of stuff at IKEA and never had to strap anything to my roof. When those seats fold down, you'd be amazed what fits in that car. Anyway, so then they had to bring the TV back inside, reschedule the delivery (luckily for the same day as before). The whole procedure took an hour and a half (they don't do anything fast down there).

I sleep on it and now I'm thinking, based on the posts I've read, people are getting one TV, returning it, another TV, returning it, another TV returning it. Making it seem that every TV off the lot may very well have this problem, to varying degrees, and that the reason there aren't mass returns of this product and a recall is because the issue is subtle enough that (unless it's a particularly bad set) the casual buyer that isn't looking for it won't notice it right away (until it's too late or will never notice it). Obviously AVS readers aren't casual buyers and neither am I, so chances are I will have a problem, notice it, and need to return the set.

However, my initial strategy of 1) get the TV, 2) test it, 3) return if needed, is now affected by the fact that I now know this TV won't fit in my car. Thus, whereas before the fact that I had a great deal made me willing to go through the hassle of accepting what would probably be a defective set just to make sure; now, returning the TV is going to be a big pain and could require me to actually rent a Zip Car ($10-20) to return it. I suppose I could also pack the TV in my car outside of the box, which would probably fit, but that presents its own problems.

Also, I have become obsessed with checking this message board, the other Sony XBR boards, and even the Sharp banding discussion. Reading new posts has become like crack to me, as I constantly hope the next post will be a Sony rep saying "Good news everyone, we're aware of this problem and it's been fixed, the defective TVs have been recalled, and new TVs with the problem fixed are already at your local retailer, so go on down and pick one up today."

So, I have finally decided to cancel the order and wait it out. If the same people that helped me yesterday are there again today, they will sure love me.

Hopefully the 12/06 or 1/07 builds will have this problem corrected.
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post #576 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 08:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kronius View Post

I got a fantastic price on mine, too--that's what makes it so hard to give up. I haven't even seen mine yet because my BB was so backed up on deliveries. This problem has been driving me crazy as is demonstrated by what happened to me yesterday:

As of yesterday morning, I had decided to cancel my order and wait out the problem. I even called Best Buy to try to cancel, but they told me I had to do it in person with the receipt in hand.

After reading more posts, I think to myself that maybe I'm acting crazy by returning what could potentially be a great TV before I've even seen it yet based on anecdotal evidence on one message board (I was unable to find discussion of this problem anywhere else through google). I called Best Buy again and asked if instead of delivery, whether I could come in and pick it up. I figured I'd get the TV, see it for myself, and then decide. They said I could do that.

I go down to Best Buy and they cancel my delivery order, pull the TV out of storage, bring it out to my car, and lo and behold it won't fit in my car. Everyone thought I was crazy for thinking it would fit (I have a civic), but I have bought tons of stuff at IKEA and never had to strap anything to my roof. When those seats fold down, you'd be amazed what fits in that car. Anyway, so then they had to bring the TV back inside, reschedule the delivery (luckily for the same day as before). The whole procedure took an hour and a half (they don't do anything fast down there).

I sleep on it and now I'm thinking, based on the posts I've read, people are getting one TV, returning it, another TV, returning it, another TV returning it. Making it seem that every TV off the lot may very well have this problem, to varying degrees, and that the reason there aren't mass returns of this product and a recall is because the issue is subtle enough that (unless it's a particularly bad set) the casual buyer that isn't looking for it won't notice it right away (until it's too late or will never notice it). Obviously AVS readers aren't casual buyers and neither am I, so chances are I will have a problem, notice it, and need to return the set.

However, my initial strategy of 1) get the TV, 2) test it, 3) return if needed, is now affected by the fact that I now know this TV won't fit in my car. Thus, whereas before the fact that I had a great deal made me willing to go through the hassle of accepting what would probably be a defective set just to make sure; now, returning the TV is going to be a big pain and could require me to actually rent a Zip Car ($10-20) to return it. I suppose I could also pack the TV in my car outside of the box, which would probably fit, but that presents its own problems.

Also, I have become obsessed with checking this message board, the other Sony XBR boards, and even the Sharp banding discussion. Reading new posts has become like crack to me, as I constantly hope the next post will be a Sony rep saying "Good news everyone, we're aware of this problem and it's been fixed, the defective TVs have been recalled, and new TVs with the problem fixed are already at your local retailer, so go on down and pick one up today."

So, I have finally decided to cancel the order and wait it out. If the same people that helped me yesterday are there again today, they will sure love me.

Hopefully the 12/06 or 1/07 builds will have this problem corrected.

Like you said, why not have BB unbox it and test it at the store? Kinda off a pain sine you really need a somewhat dark room to see the clouds.

Also, if they can make the deal 2 weeks ago, they will CERTAINLY be able to make an the same or better deal a few weeks from now if the issues have been resolved.
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post #577 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
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Like you said, why not have BB unbox it and test it at the store? Kinda off a pain sine you really need a somewhat dark room to see the clouds.

I considered this option as well, but decided that cancelling the order and waiting would be preferable to an in-store test. The viewing conditions at the store just seem so non-ideal, that I think it's too likely I wouldn't see anything in the store, then I would take it home and see something. Plus, then I would have to either take it home outside of the box, or rebox it--which others have said is a rather difficult endeavor.

I think part of it is that if I get any set built from one of these bad lots, even if I don't see them, I will always be looking for the clouds, rather than enjoying my TV. Just for my own peace of mind it is probably better to just wait for the problem to be fixed.



Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlite View Post

Also, if they can make the deal 2 weeks ago, they will CERTAINLY be able to make an the same or better deal a few weeks from now if the issues have been resolved.

That's what I'm hoping, particularly the post-christmas sales.
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post #578 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 08:54 AM
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"Good news everyone, we're aware of this problem and it's been fixed, the defective TVs have been recalled, and new TVs with the problem fixed are already at your local retailer, so go on down and pick one up today."

This line really hits the nail on the head doesn't it? I'm keeping my set until I essentially hear this from Sony, and not dealing with multiple returns. Already did one return, and luckily the new set is not as noticeable.
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post #579 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 09:23 AM
 
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This line really hits the nail on the head doesn't it? I'm keeping my set until I essentially hear this from Sony, and not dealing with multiple returns. Already did one return, and luckily the new set is not as noticeable.


Certainly does. But I doubt Sony will make a grand admission like that, especially with all the other troubles they've had lately.

I'm assuming we'll find out about good sets coming in through this board. Like you, I'm waiting until that happens to do anything about it because picking up the tv and getting it home was hassle enough the first time. I may even wait until the HDMI 1.3 sets come out and just upgrade.

The sad thing is that I absolutely LOVE this tv. HD is awesome on it. SD is surprisingly crisp and clear. My Playstation 3 looks phenomenal on it, too. And while the clouds aren't noticeable all the time, when they do shine through, it absolutely ruins the otherwise awesome picture of this set. Hopefully wind of good news will start breezing through soon.
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post #580 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seattlite View Post

Like you said, why not have BB unbox it and test it at the store? Kinda off a pain sine you really need a somewhat dark room to see the clouds.

Also, if they can make the deal 2 weeks ago, they will CERTAINLY be able to make an the same or better deal a few weeks from now if the issues have been resolved.


The last discount (over recent holiday) was a Sony sponsered discount to all retailers that lowered the list price. There is a risk in returning the defective unit and waiting for good units to appear. However, this is a risk that is worth it for me, as $3.5K is to much to pay for a problematic TV. This problem is going to take a while to correct and it may be a few months before we see that all units are delivered without the 'cloudiness' issue. Engineering changes can sometimes take months to implement. Sony knows darn well what is going on by now, and they should be aggressively working on it.

My past experience with Sony service (poor at best) tells me to return the set and wait it out. Eventually there will be another sale.
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post #581 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 10:26 AM
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The last discount (over recent holiday) was a Sony sponsered discount to all retailers that lowered the list price. There is a risk in returning the defective unit and waiting for good units to appear. However, this is a risk that is worth it for me, as $3.5K is to much to pay for a problematic TV. This problem is going to take a while to correct and it may be a few months before we see that all units are delivered without the 'cloudiness' issue. Engineering changes can sometimes take months to implement. Sony knows darn well what is going on by now, and they should be aggressively working on it.

My past experience with Sony service (poor at best) tells me to return the set and wait it out. Eventually there will be another sale.

If the XBR had the problem from day 1, I would really be worried. The fact that pre-August TVs were fine and then all of a sudden they have this problem, it should be easier to fix because all they have to do is figure out what changed and undo it.
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post #582 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 10:47 AM
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I know I'm in the wrong thread, but I bought the KDL-462010 (which is a sony 720p LCD) last week that also displays the clouding issue. I haven't really heard any problems from anyone else on this TV.

I want to exchange this at circuit city, but living in a small apartment I trashed the box it came in. Has anyone ever exchanged a TV at Ciruit City without a box? Should I have any problems?
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post #583 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 10:55 AM
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I know I'm in the wrong thread, but I bought the KDL-462010 (which is a sony 720p LCD) last week that also displays the clouding issue. I haven't really heard any problems from anyone else on this TV.

I wan't to exchange this at circuit city, but living in a small apartment I trashed the box it came in. Has anyone ever exchanged a TV at Ciruit City without a box? Should I have any problems?

You will be fine. Go ahead and call CC first to be sure, but you shouldn't have any problems without the box for a large TV.
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post #584 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 11:05 AM
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Hi! Remember me? lol. Who thinks it's safe getting a good XBR3 in 2007? 8D
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post #585 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alanb49 View Post

The last discount (over recent holiday) was a Sony sponsered discount to all retailers that lowered the list price. There is a risk in returning the defective unit and waiting for good units to appear. However, this is a risk that is worth it for me, as $3.5K is to much to pay for a problematic TV. This problem is going to take a while to correct and it may be a few months before we see that all units are delivered without the 'cloudiness' issue. Engineering changes can sometimes take months to implement. Sony knows darn well what is going on by now, and they should be aggressively working on it.

My past experience with Sony service (poor at best) tells me to return the set and wait it out. Eventually there will be another sale.

The deal that I got at CC was BETTER than the Sony sponsored discounts. I came in at a bad time for CC, and they inturn gave me a SWEET deal to get a sale on a slow sales day. I figure in a few weeks time, they would honor the same deal since the deal was not based on a time limited sale.
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post #586 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 01:02 PM
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I vote that we send all the 46XBR2 with bad white cloud issues to Kim Jong Il
in North Korea. He has a craving for the finer things, like flat screen TV, according
to the news. I'm sure these problem XBRs will drive him insane... Oh, wait,
I believe it is now illegal to send flat panesl to NK...
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post #587 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 02:36 PM
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I made an appointment with the Sony warranty folks, via a contractor for this Thursday Dec 7. at my home. From what I was told, the tech will either fix the problem here (yeah right) or take my TV for a few days to diagnose the problem.

Somehow, I feel this will take more than just a few days, and I hope it's worth it when the tech has to take my TV away, which seems likely to me, unless Sony wants to do a swap. I hope my TV isn't gone for long, and Sony doesn't mess around.

Why do I have to be so picky, and this thing bug me so? I'll bet 99% or so of people with my cloudy uneven "haze" wouldn't have even noticed this, but I did, and now I have to get it fixed.

I was even thinking of getting a Samsung HL-S5088W, which was my second choice all along. But, then I'd have to sell my XBR on ebay or something and lose maybe 50% of the price. I should wait and see what happens first I suppose. Brain over impulse right

It sure would be nice to hear back from a couple of people who posted in this thread earlier, about what happened when they went through Sony repair? I think one person said his Sonystyle store would have simply exchanged it, and said come back anytime or something. Mine doesn't appear to be working that way presently, but there's always hope Sony will come through (knock on wood).
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post #588 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 02:43 PM
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Sonydude- You would have the same problem with the Samsung HL-S5088W as the Sony XBR since Sony outsources the LCD panels from Samsung. Look at post #58 in this thread.
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post #589 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pb565 View Post

I am really disapoijted in Sony having these manufactured in Mexico. Two of my co workers have the 40" sets manfactured in Japan and they are perfect. I believe there is no comparison with the quality control in Mexico vs. the years of expeience and strict QC of Japan. I will post more info to follow.

Hey PB565 - not sure if this will make you feel any better or not, but over in Australia we are experiencing just the same thing with our X sets - made in Japan. Perhaps the Samsung panels all come from the one single factory and that's where the issue lies... ?
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post #590 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 03:13 PM
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Sonydude- You would have the same problem with the Samsung HL-S5088W as the Sony XBR since Sony outsources the LCD panels from Samsung. Look at post #58 in this thread.

Yes, I saw that the Samsung LCD's are having this issue too, that is totally wrong on so many levels that they let all these messed up screens out in the wild. You know, I think most people won't even say or notice a thing about this. I'll bet that's what Sony determined as well. I just find it hard to believe this problem was not/is not known by Sony. Come on, what are you doing over there Sony if you don't know? Do you get so many complaints, about so many things, that you just have too much to deal with? What's the deal?

The Samsung I was looking at was DLP technology, so no LCD screen to worry about. The main reason the Samsung was my second choice and not my first, was because of the bulb replacement every 6000-8000 hours (I'm thinking maybe 1 per every 2 years, maybe 1 per year at most). At current bulb prices, that's $1,650 - $3,350 extra in 10 years just for bulbs, making DLP more expensive than is initially disclosed. $2,100 + $1,650 (1 new bulb every 2 years) = $3,750. I paid right around $3,000 for my 40XBR2. So, the DLP would be $750 more in 10 years, maybe a little more because I only added 1 bulb every 2 years which is conservative.

Still DLP seems like a fine second choice. Plasma is a no go, I hate image retention (burn in or not). I like my 4:3 content and don't like to even think about stretching content. I really should put up with this Sony problem until it goes through the channels before I buy a new TV. I almost wish the Sony would just go away and give me a full refund.

Alas, I am over my 30 day and have to go through trying to get it fixed. Atleast if I don't get it resolved, it should be fairly easy to sell for half price or something on ebay. Man, I don't want to lose that much money on this. Let's hope Sony comes through for us people who are having this problem. I've been waiting to hear any success stories after the initial 30 day return period from anyone. Please keep us posted good or bad please. Thanks.
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post #591 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 04:07 PM
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Is this issue also affecting the V2500 series as well?
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post #592 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 04:35 PM
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Is this issue also affecting the V2500 series as well?

yes i have one october 06 serial
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post #593 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 05:30 PM
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I live in New Zealand and have just bought a 46" Bravia X-Series LCD TV and noticed the white clouds issue already. The model number for mine is KLV-46X200A, and states the date of manufacture is October 2006, and is made in Japan.
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post #594 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 06:03 PM
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I live in New Zealand and have just bought a 46" Bravia X-Series LCD TV and noticed the white clouds issue already. The model number for mine is KLV-46X200A, and states the date of manufacture is October 2006, and is made in Japan.

I have to say I am quite surprised your model made in Japan has the same problem as the sets made in Mexico by Sony. That is not good news.
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post #595 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by desertmichael View Post

I have to say I am quite surprised your model made in Japan has the same problem as the sets made in Mexico by Sony. That is not good news.

So much for the Mexico theory. Man, what the hell.
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post #596 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertmichael View Post

I have to say I am quite surprised your model made in Japan has the same problem as the sets made in Mexico by Sony. That is not good news.

I'll look into posting a photo tonight (NZ time) when the blotches are most visible.
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post #597 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 06:31 PM
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Does anybody know if the manufactured date is displayed on the outside of the box? Thanks in advance!
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post #598 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 07:03 PM
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Well, I was a brave soul tonight. I actually took the entire back panel off to see if there were some screws that I could "release" some tension on. The panel was actually easy to remove. I found several screw that I loosened, but not sure if they were primary to holding the LCD screen in place or not. I also did not remove the front bezel to see if there were screws secured in that direction or not. In any event, the loosening of a dozen or so screws did not have any effect. I screwed everything back down and secured the back panel on again. I am now trying the face down on a table approach, but not sure for how long. It's been about 20 minutes now. Should I leave overnight, or out it back now? Anyway, I was hoping to have good news about loosening an imagined "tension" on the panel by disassembling, but I won't be the person who defeated the cloud problem tonight.
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post #599 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 07:22 PM
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was at the Sony store in downtown San Francisco this morning and tried to check this problem.
The show room is well lit and they were displaying high def clips with vivid colors and no black scenes. They had about 4 40xbr2/3 and 3 46 xbr2/3. I asked the sales person if I could check the panel with no input. It was perfect black for the 5 sets that I have tested. He did not know what I was talking about and said maybe it was dust that people are seeing... When he left, I check the back of all of them and found that all were made in JULY.

So maybe there is something to the build date.

I so much want to get the 46xbr but I'm very scared of getting a set with this problem especially that I enjoy watching movies in a totally dark room.
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post #600 of 9118 Old 12-01-2006, 07:48 PM
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I just took back my KDL-40V2500 which turned out to have clouding issues (didn't see country of build or build date) to BB and replaced it with a 40XBR2. When I took the XBR2 out of the box, I noticed it was built in October 2006. I actually had to take the TV out of the box in the parking lot at BB and put it in the backseat of my Corolla. I carried it home just resting on my backseat with a quilt draped over it. This, by the way, is how I got my V2500 back home, too. It rode for over an hour in my backseat (I live over an hour away from my 'local' BB). Anyhow, I just plugged the tv in and got my PS3 and Xbox 360 hooked up. Guess what? NO CLOUDING. . . at all. It has the normal backlighting that you get with an LCD, but it doesn't have clouds. I'm going to run the now-famous Petmic settings on the TV and then I'll see if I can take some pics to post. I must say, I was somewhat concerned when I saw Oct. on the back of the TV, but I'm happy the guys south of the border put this one together correctly. Still, I'm a bit dismayed that Sony is building things in Mexico. It just doesn't seem right - Sony should mean "Made in Japan" PERIOD!

GT: irunnoft
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Reply LCD Flat Panel Displays

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