Official Sony XBR4/XBR5 calibration thread - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 5495 Old 09-28-2007, 04:40 PM
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Alright I did a little more calibrating today. This time I took a little advice about calibrating on this thread-Basic Guide to Color Calibration using a CMS
and followed the Tint suggestions on setting Cyan as close as possible and then calibrated Gray Scale, etc. So this is what I came up with for all my connections with my Colorfacts Pro setup and AVIA Pro DVD's-(my changes are in bold)

Picture Menu
Picture Mode: Custom
Backlight: 5
Picture: 80
Brightness: (depending on connection 45 for DVD via HDMI, 35-45 for Xbox360 via Component & 52 for SD & HD cable)
Color: 56-58
Hue: R1
Color temp: Warm 1
Sharpness: 60-65
Noise reduction: Low
MPEG noise reduction: Low
DRC mode: Off

Advanced Settings
Black corrector: Off
Advanced C.E: Low
Gamma: Low
Clear white: Low
Color space: Wide
Live color: Off
Detail enhancer: Low
Edge enhancer: Low

White Balance Menu

R-Gain: -2
G-Gain: -1
B-Gain: -5 or -4
R-Bias: -1
G-Bias: -2
B-Bias: -5 or -4


Screen menu
Wide Mode: Normal
Auto Wide: OFF
4:3 Default: Normal (grayed out when Auto Wide is set to Off)
Display Area:(Normal for SD cable, Full Pixel for other HD inputs)

Video Options menu
Motion Enhancer: Standard or High
CineMotion: Auto 1
Game/Text mode: Off
Video/Photo Optimizer: Video
Video Color Space: x.v.Color
Photo Color Space: sYCC
Color Matrix: Default
RGB Dynamic Range: Auto or Full (my DVD Player has FULL RGB Output as do PS3's)

General Menu
Power saving: Low
Light sensor: Off

Oh and SD still sucks no matter what I try

Updated 9/30/07
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post #362 of 5495 Old 09-28-2007, 07:08 PM
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why dont you have the ty on full pixel
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post #363 of 5495 Old 09-28-2007, 09:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R.MnTnA View Post

Alright I did a little more calibrating today. This time I took a little advice about calibrating on this thread-Basic Guide to Color Calibration using a CMS
and followed the Tint suggestions on setting Cyan as close as possible and then calibrated Gray Scale, etc. So this is what I came up with for all my connections with my Colorfacts Pro setup and AVIA Pro DVD's-(my changes are in bold)

Picture Menu
Picture Mode: Custom
Backlight: 5
Picture: 79
Brightness: 45-52 (depending on connection 45 for DVD & 52 for SD cable)
Color: 54-58
Hue: R2
Color temp: Warm 1
Sharpness: 65-70
Noise reduction: Low
MPEG noise reduction: Low
DRC mode: Off

Advanced Settings
Black corrector: Off
Advanced C.E: Low
Gamma: Low
Clear white: Low
Color space: Wide
Live color: Off
Detail enhancer: Low
Edge enhancer: Low

White Balance Menu
R-Gain: -1
G-Gain: 0
B-Gain: -5
R-Bias: -1
G-Bias: -2
B-Bias: -5


Screen menu
Wide Mode: Full
Auto Wide: On
4:3 Default: Zoom
Display Area: -2

Video Options menu
Motion Enhancer: Standard or High
CineMotion: Auto 1
Game/Text mode: Off
Video/Photo Optimizer: Video
Video Color Space: x.v.Color
Photo Color Space: sYCC
Color Matrix: Default
RGB Dynamic Range: Auto or Full (my DVD Player has FULL RGB Output)

General Menu
Power saving: Low
Light sensor: Off

Oh and SD still sucks no matter what I try

Why opt to put the color temp on Warm 1 and then dial back the blue settings? If anything I find the Warm settings to be lacking in blue tones.

52XBR4
55HX929
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post #364 of 5495 Old 09-29-2007, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by EADGBE View Post

All I know is if you want to see something weird put on an HD movie (can even be from the Cable STB), set Cinemotion to Auto 1 and Motion Enhancer to High.

Yeah it makes 24fps film content look like it was shot in HD video. I find the effect pleasing to the eye, but it doesn't necessarily look natural. I'll bet cinematographers are really going to hate this feature/effect!

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post #365 of 5495 Old 09-29-2007, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by EADGBE View Post

Why opt to put the color temp on Warm 1 and then dial back the blue settings? If anything I find the Warm settings to be lacking in blue tones.

Natural had too much blue and because that's what the Colorfacts & Spyder 2 calibration was reporting as too high.
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post #366 of 5495 Old 09-29-2007, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by slumpey326 View Post

why dont you have the ty on full pixel

Thanks for catching that. I do have it set to Full Pixel on my DVD and HD sources. I use the Normal for the standard type screen when watching SD channels. I don't really like to stretch it out with Wide Zoom or Zoom cause it looks crappier to me.
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post #367 of 5495 Old 09-29-2007, 08:14 PM
 
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can anyone post calibrated settings for the smaller xbr4 -?
32 inch - i just got mines - and its very nice - but i am not great with all those settings - if anyone Calibrated this size - and like to post the settings - that would be great

there isnt much talk about this model - this size really -
also if anyone can tell me which movie - DVD to watch where i can actually see the motionflow working -

i been watching DVD's for 2 days and dont see any difference or notice anything -

thanks
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post #368 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 06:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

can anyone post calibrated settings for the smaller xbr4 -?
32 inch - i just got mines - and its very nice - but i am not great with all those settings - if anyone Calibrated this size - and like to post the settings - that would be great

there isnt much talk about this model - this size really -
also if anyone can tell me which movie - DVD to watch where i can actually see the motionflow working -

i been watching DVD's for 2 days and dont see any difference or notice anything -

thanks

Like the saying goes "Size Doesn't Matter" How many saw that coming?
Have you tried any of the settings posted for the other sizes to see. I went from a 40" to a 46"and calibrated them both and the settings were pretty much the same. Also to see motionflow in action and really see the effect you have to have the cinemotion on Auto1 and motion enhancer on High. Try it with the Matrix Lobby scene or LOTR. Also Don't put theater mode or Game mode on, these disable motion enhancer.
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post #369 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

can anyone post calibrated settings for the smaller xbr4 -?
32 inch - i just got mines - and its very nice - but i am not great with all those settings - if anyone Calibrated this size - and like to post the settings - that would be great

there isnt much talk about this model - this size really -
also if anyone can tell me which movie - DVD to watch where i can actually see the motionflow working -

i been watching DVD's for 2 days and dont see any difference or notice anything -

thanks

I'm too lazy to look again but I think there is a thread for 32XBR4 owners.
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post #370 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 08:42 AM
 
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Originally Posted by bilbo3660 View Post

I'm too lazy to look again but I think there is a thread for 32XBR4 owners.

yes i posted on the 32 inch trend - but it seems as if no one else posts there too much -- there isnt much attention giving to the 32 inch xbr4 - in terms of feed back and picture settings etc. -- thats why i decided to ask for help here - i am sure alot of people got the 32 inch - i hear there is AVIA II coming out soon - i will wait for that and give it a shot - but in the meantime - if anyone can offer some settings to try - that would be great --

which matrix movie is the one where i can notice the motionflow in action ? i really like to see the difference
i got this size for my bedroom as a test of these new features - if i dont see much difference - when i do shop for the 46 inch model - i may just look at one step below
which is the W model - i like the xbr4 frame - but i also like the slim frame also and saves 6 inches and makes the panel seem larger and save space at the same time - but for now - i just got the 32 inch xbr4 and like to see motion flow in action - also the blacks are pretty good with power savings on - and black correction - and ACE makes it nice and black for movies at night - its very acceptable - i got no clouds or dead/stuck pixels that i can see - its a Aug. 2007 build - mexico - -

any help with settings would be great - and any other dvd movies that i can watch which will show me motionflow in action - please post them --

thanks -
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post #371 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 10:28 AM
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Has anyone played with the x.v.Color setting on HD channels (40XBR4)? Also, one of my HD channels has a white line at the top of the picture when the screen is set to Full Pixel; it's fine at -1, -2 and normal. Has anyone else noticed this effect when changing the display area?

Thanks
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post #372 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by LCCPCC View Post

Has anyone played with the x.v.Color setting on HD channels (40XBR4)? Also, one of my HD channels has a white line at the top of the picture when the screen is set to Full Pixel; it's fine at -1, -2 and normal. Has anyone else noticed this effect when changing the display area?

Thanks

Yes, my wife and I were just talking about that (white line). The same thing happen on my Sharp D92U. This is normal and has been talked about before.

"Hence we will not say that Greeks fight like heroes, but that heroes fight like Greeks." - Winston Churchill
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post #373 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 10:33 AM
 
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Originally Posted by LCCPCC View Post

Has anyone played with the x.v.Color setting on HD channels (40XBR4)? Also, one of my HD channels has a white line at the top of the picture when the screen is set to Full Pixel; it's fine at -1, -2 and normal. Has anyone else noticed this effect when changing the display area?

Thanks

hi - yes i noticed that - but i have the 32 inch xbr4 - i dont have HD signal yet - but on SD - i noticed the white line on my left side going up and down the panel - which i put on -1 and its fine - i can keep it on normal on HDMI input watching DVD's and dont see that line --

i dont know if the smaller 32 inch has all the same options as your size and larger - but i though having it on Normal is the full pixel -- i dont see setting that says - full pixel - ?
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post #374 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

hi - yes i noticed that - but i have the 32 inch xbr4 - i dont have HD signal yet - but on SD - i noticed the white line on my left side going up and down the panel - which i put on -1 and its fine - i can keep it on normal on HDMI input watching DVD's and dont see that line --

i dont know if the smaller 32 inch has all the same options as your size and larger - but i though having it on Normal is the full pixel -- i dont see setting that says - full pixel - ?

Try this: Press "Home" on the remote and go over to the "Settings"...then scroll down to "Screen." From there you can change the Display Area to Normal, Full Pixel, -2 or -1.
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post #375 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:16 AM
 
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Originally Posted by LCCPCC View Post

Try this: Press "Home" on the remote and go over to the "Settings"...then scroll down to "Screen." From there you can change the Display Area to Normal, Full Pixel, -2 or -1.

thanks - i went there - thats where i changed it from normal to -1 when watching SD cable - but i dont have a option for Full Pixel there ?

i though Normal was or is Full Pixel - maybe it is for the 32 inch xbr4 ? i dont know - i have it on standard setting

could it be that normal is full pixel on my TV - ?
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post #376 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:23 AM
 
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Originally Posted by LCCPCC View Post

Has anyone played with the x.v.Color setting on HD channels (40XBR4)? Also, one of my HD channels has a white line at the top of the picture when the screen is set to Full Pixel; it's fine at -1, -2 and normal. Has anyone else noticed this effect when changing the display area?

Thanks


my set also has the x.v Color - but i am still not sure what that does or how it gets activated -- i dont think there are options to activate that - i think you have to have a source putting out HDMI v. 1.3 - and it would just work - i am not sure though excatly - if i am wrong - correct me -- but i been looking thru all my settings and i dont see anything about x.v Color -- just the wide color settings -
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post #377 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

can anyone post calibrated settings for the smaller xbr4 -?

I will be posting my settings for the KDL-32XBR4 pretty soon - watch this space!

Note to others - the 32" has rather different settings options to the bigger sets (it has the Bravia Engine, not the Bravia Engine Pro), so there is rather less control overall (unless you dive into the service menu, and even that offers very little), and the numbers for some settings are definitely different.
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post #378 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

my set also has the x.v Color - but i am still not sure what that does or how it gets activated -- i dont think there are options to activate that - i think you have to have a source putting out HDMI v. 1.3 - and it would just work - i am not sure though excatly - if i am wrong - correct me -- but i been looking thru all my settings and i dont see anything about x.v Color -- just the wide color settings -

x.v.Color is supposed to work with moving images. (I think). On the 40" it's found under Home/Video Options/Video Color Space (x.v.Color). Then the inputs can be set to Auto, Normal or x.v.Color. I'm not sure if this is supposed to work in conjunction with Motionflow or not.
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post #379 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

i though having [the 32"] on Normal is the full pixel -- i dont see setting that says - full pixel - ?

Sadly, my KDL-32XBR4 has fairly aggressive overscan (cropping) even in Normal. Well, that is to say my example does, and since this is all digital, I would expect that to apply to all of them. I am losing about 2.5% via HDMI from my Oppo DVD player. I'll experiment with PC mode (which, I believe really should be full pixel) to see if that gets me more picture. The "full pixel" setting in the configuration menu is yet another of those things that only the bigger sets have.
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post #380 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:47 AM
 
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Originally Posted by LCCPCC View Post

x.v.Color is supposed to work with moving images. (I think). On the 40" it's found under Home/Video Options/Video Color Space (x.v.Color). Then the inputs can be set to Auto, Normal or x.v.Color. I'm not sure if this is supposed to work in conjunction with Motionflow or not.

i have to double check my set - i am almost sure it says that my set has it also on the Sonystyle.com site - maybe its a different name - would it be called - wide color ?
that setting i have - once you choose wide color - you then have a few settings - off - normal - med. or high i think - that expands the colors that the tv shows -

not sure if its the same thing as x.v Color - i know the settings are different from the larger xbr's - some names of the settings are different too -

what different does it make when you choose x.v Color in the settings with the picture ?
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post #381 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by LCCPCC View Post

Has anyone played with the x.v.Color

To see x.v.Color, you need a source that outputs x.v.Color. I'll take a large bet you don't own such a source. Do a search on these forums for lots more on this topic.
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post #382 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:51 AM
 
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Originally Posted by pheadland View Post

Sadly, my KDL-32XBR4 has fairly aggressive overscan (cropping) even in Normal. Well, that is to say my example does, and since this is all digital, I would expect that to apply to all of them. I am losing about 2.5% via HDMI from my Oppo DVD player. I'll experiment with PC mode (which, I believe really should be full pixel) to see if that gets me more picture. The "full pixel" setting is yet another of those things that only the bigger sets has.

so its not just my set then - i was worried - i put my set at -1 with SD cable and its fine - with dvds - and hdmi - i have it on normal which i believe is the best it can be to show the most picture on the panel - i am waiting on my OPPO also - which model do you have - i ordered the 981hd model - does the oppo make a nice difference ?

how do you know how much picture you are loosing ?
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post #383 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 11:55 AM
 
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Originally Posted by pheadland View Post

To see x.v.Color, you need a source that outputs x.v.Color. I'll take a large bet you don't own such a source. Do a search on these forums for lots more on this topic.

i think your right - i read that somewhere also with a review - that x.v Color only works if the source puts it out also - over hdmi v1.3 and right now - there arnt any dvd players or HD channels etc. that put out x.v Color - so its useless right now - hopefully in the future - it may come into play and till then - we dont know how it works or if it does anything better or worse till those sources arrive that put out x.v Color -
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post #384 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

i am waiting on my OPPO also - which model do you have - i ordered the 981hd model - does the oppo make a nice difference ?

See my post in this thread a couple of days ago (previous page of posts, I think). The bottom line is that I felt the Oppo 980 was a better match for this TV. I believe that it is a bad idea to use an upscaling DVD player with the 32" XBR4 because the set's physical resolution is 768 lines, so whatever you send it will get scaled internally. Given that this TV has a good scaler/deinterlacer of its own, it makes most sense to send it a "raw" 480i feed from your DVD player. My impression is that the CineMotion and MotionFlow stuff works better with that. The 981 can only do 480p via HDMI, the 980 can do 480i via HDMI, plus it's cheaper. In fact, a sub-$100 DVD player with 480i over HDMI would probably be just fine (if such a thing exists - most seem to only do 480p).

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how do you know how much picture you are loosing ?

The Digital Video Essentials (DVE) test DVD (widely available, just Google for it), has test patterns that give you this kind of information.
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post #385 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 12:10 PM
 
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Originally Posted by pheadland View Post

See my post in this thread a couple of days ago (previous page of posts, I think). The bottom line is that I felt the Oppo 980 was a better match for this TV. I believe that it is a bad idea to use an upscaling DVD player with the 32" XBR4 because the set's physical resolution is 768 lines, so whatever you send it will get scaled internally. Given that this TV has a good scaler/deinterlacer of its own, it makes most sense to send it a "raw" 480i feed from your DVD player. My impression is that the CineMotion and MotionFlow stuff works better with that. The 981 can only do 480p via HDMI, the 980 can do 480i via HDMI, plus it's cheaper.



The Digital Video Essentials (DVE) test DVD (widely available, just Google for it), has test patterns that give you this kind of information.


oh - now i am worried about the oppo 981 - i read the reviews and they all said its the best of the bunch - i understand what you mean about the 768 of the panel -
but it said that the video processing on the 981 is the best there is out of the bunch - well its too late now - its on the truck to be delivered already -- i know that with my S model sony - with a cheap upconvert player that i am using now - it made a big difference - it was sharper when i set it to 1080i - then the TV makes it to 768 - at 720p - it was good too - just a bit softer - but better than the reg. 480p - i cant say how it will work on this set -

so you tried them both the oppo 980 and 981 - ?

if you post the link to your post - i cant seem to find it -

thanks -
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post #386 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by expresso712 View Post

i know that with my S model sony - with a cheap upconvert player that i am using now - it made a big difference - it was sharper when i set it to 1080i - then the TV makes it to 768 - at 720p - it was good too - just a bit softer - but better than the reg. 480p - i cant say how it will work on this set -

The S-series doesn't have a very good scaler. I think the scaler in the KDL-32XBR4 is pretty good. Good enough that it's better than double-scaling.

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so you tried them both the oppo 980 and 981 - ?

Yup.

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if you post the link to your post - i cant seem to find it -

The post I was taking about is this one.
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post #387 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 03:22 PM
 
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The S-series doesn't have a very good scaler. I think the scaler in the KDL-32XBR4 is pretty good. Good enough that it's better than double-scaling.



Yup.



The post I was taking about is this one.

thanks for the link to your post - i would think and most likely -- yes the xbr4 should and mostly like has a better scaler - but the weird thing is this - i just got the xbr4 32 - i had a S model 26 inch two years old - and with the same dvd upconvert which i am using now - which is a cheap coby brand - hdmi - - now with the S model i had - i had the coby set to 1080i and it looked a bit sharper --
now all i did is buy a new TV - xbr4 - i hooked it up and it seems that at 1080i - it dosnt show as good as it did with the S model - so left it on auto - which puts out 720p -
it shows good as long as the DVD i am playing is not too compressed -- so it feels as if the S model showed better -- now i will try it with the Oppo 981 - i hope to get a better picture with the oppo over what i have now which is a $30 player - the reason i got the 981 is because of the reviews - they said its the best processor out of all them - not that the 980 is bad - which i was about to get because it had other outputs also - where the 981 has only HDMI output - but then i figured i will be using HDMI anyway - and if they said its the best - why not get it -- i hope its pleasing to my eye at least - i just hate the whole return and wait process - so i am crossing my fingers - i did like to have other outputs since this tv can take up to 1080p on Components also -
how big a difference was there in your eyes between the two players - ? 981 over 980
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post #388 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 03:33 PM
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Yes, but, with the Oppo 981 you will be scaling twice: 480i->720p->~800p, or 480i->1080i->800p. That will lose you resolution and introduce artefacts. The sad news is that you just don't need another scaler (or, indeed, another DVD player). Just set your Coby to 480i output (if it can do that) and let the TV do all the scaling. Don't let the Coby do the deinterlacing.

The difference between the Oppo 981 and 980 came down to the fact that only the 980 has 480i output over HDMI. And 480i is slightly smoother on pans than 480p, presumably because allowing the TV to do both deinterlacing and scaling in one operation works better.

Try it for yourself (and let us all know) but I believe you will find that you get no picture improvement using the Oppo to scale to 1080i (or 1080p). Look at smoothness of motion, etc. as well as "sharpness" (which is often just fake digital enhancement in the DVD player).
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post #389 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 04:19 PM
 
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what you are saying is right - if the TV does a better job than the Player you are using - which may be the case - this is all new to be -- so it more trail and error here -
the coby i have cant put out 480 -- lowest is 720p over hdmi - well i just found it has 720 x 480 setting - what that means i dont know - i put it there and it seems about the same - hard to tell the difference - - i had it on component cables with the S model and hdmi was much better in color and sharpness in general so i just use hdmi now --

i did have another cheap player called the Spectron IQ - which gave a much much better picture than this coby on my S model - cleaner - sharper - more color etc. - it was really good - but died in 3 weeks - i replaced - died in one week -- wont load the dvd any more - so i left it alone

the reason for getting these cheapo players was that the space i have to fit - isnt wide enough for the reg. players - so i was limited to these players --

now i upgraded the TV - the space i have is much wider and can fit the better players - so i picked the oppo 981 because of the reviews - what i will do is hook it up and leave the coby hooked up also - play the same dvd on the oppo that i am watching now - master and commanders - and see if theres a difference - - i guess worse case i can return for exchange to the 980 model -
got it at Amazon.com -
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post #390 of 5495 Old 09-30-2007, 07:31 PM
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I received my 52" XBR4 today. I'd like to thank everybody in this thread who really helped me greatly speed up my setup time. All went well (no clouding, dead pixels, etc.), except I have some sort of HDCP issue (I think) with my Motorola DTC-6412 STB. I can only get a picture over HDMI (using Monoprice DVI->HDMI cable) for anywhere from 5 seconds to about an hour, then my screen goes black (or at least a VERY dark gray ).

Anyways, I guess I can just use component 'til I get this straightened out...to my eyes component looks quite good on this set, it's just that I was looking forward to going all HDMI (HDMI on Sony upconverting DVD plays no problem).

One other thing...I've already become a bit addicted to watching movies (or at least parts of movies) with Motionflow set to high. I watched part of The Fifth Element tonight, and it was freaking me out, looking at Bruce Willis walking around in what looked like the set of a soap opera.
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