Official Sony XBR4/XBR5 calibration thread - Page 22 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #631 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 12:47 PM
Senior Member
 
FCEEVIPER's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Pulling The Gotham National Bank Job
Posts: 208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by slumpey326 View Post

I think someone should come up with the best Motion Enhancer (ME) and Cinemotion settings for:

Blue Ray/HD-DVD
ME: ?
Cinemotion: ?

Xbox 360/Playstation 3
ME: ?
Cinemotion: ?

Cable (Standard)

ME: ?
Cinemotion: ?

Cable (HD)

ME: ?
Cinemotion: ?

...and the settings for HD over-the-air antenna content also. Thx!

"Some men aren't looking for anything logical.
They can't be bought, bullied, reasoned, or negotiated with.
Some men just want to watch the world burn."

Dark Knight Saga - 072012
FCEEVIPER is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #632 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 04:50 PM
Newbie
 
ja333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_View View Post

Try changing your "Noise Reduction" to "high" (under the Picture settings) and see if that helps. For the clean signals that do not have noise it ignores. So, it's no big deal to have it on high for those either. From what I can tell it does not "add" or "soften" the image. Just removes fuzz.

Thanks Digital_View.

I tried the "Noise Reduction" setting to high and watched some other football clips and the problem is still there. I also tried the MPEG4 setting but no luck. It seems that this happens in some channels but not in others.

I also notice that when watching TNT HD the picture is very jerky on my TV. I could only resolve the problem by turning off both Motion Enhancer and CineMotion. Other channels looks fine. I have comcast and it seems that the transmission in some channels could be the problem???
ja333 is offline  
post #633 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 05:35 PM
Advanced Member
 
vumcrab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ja333 View Post

Thanks Digital_View.

I tried the "Noise Reduction" setting to high and watched some other football clips and the problem is still there. I also tried the MPEG4 setting but no luck. It seems that this happens in some channels but not in others.

I also notice that when watching TNT HD the picture is very jerky on my TV. I could only resolve the problem by turning off both Motion Enhancer and CineMotion. Other channels looks fine. I have comcast and it seems that the transmission in some channels could be the problem???

What city are you in?

NBC HD is pretty bad where I am. Did you watch the Broncos/Steelers game last night? On my Comcast feed, the Orange in the Broncos' jerseys was terrible. There was also noise in the background of the picture (crowd) as the camera panned. I was switching back and forth to the ALCS game in Boston on Fox. The PQ was great, but the audio and video feed kept breaking up. Before I got my xbr, I watched HD channels on my 4:3 SD TV just to see if I noticed things like that so I wouldn't think it was my new TV. The problems were there on my SD TV as well.

HD channels are not created equal.
vumcrab is offline  
post #634 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 06:26 PM
Newbie
 
ja333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by vumcrab View Post

What city are you in?

NBC HD is pretty bad where I am. Did you watch the Broncos/Steelers game last night? On my Comcast feed, the Orange in the Broncos' jerseys was terrible. There was also noise in the background of the picture (crowd) as the camera panned. I was switching back and forth to the ALCS game in Boston on Fox. The PQ was great, but the audio and video feed kept breaking up. Before I got my xbr, I watched HD channels on my 4:3 SD TV just to see if I noticed things like that so I wouldn't think it was my new TV. The problems were there on my SD TV as well.

HD channels are not created equal.

vumcrab that is great feedback. Yes that was the game I was watching when I noticed the problem. When the camera panned in close shots it produce terrible distortions in the picture (noise, pixelation) in the background but even the player that the camera was focusing on was impacted (to a smaller extent). When I switched to ESPN HD the image was better and I hardly noticed any problems. I am located at Pittsburgh.
ja333 is offline  
post #635 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 06:48 PM
Advanced Member
 
vumcrab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ja333 View Post

vumcrab that is great feedback. Yes that was the game I was watching when I noticed the problem. When the camera panned in close shots it produce terrible distortions in the picture (noise, pixelation) in the background but even the player that the camera was focusing on was impacted (to a smaller extent). When I switched to ESPN HD the image was better and I hardly noticed any problems. I am located at Pittsburgh.

BTW, what were you watching on ESPN last night?

I think ESPN has one of the better HD feeds.
vumcrab is offline  
post #636 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 07:55 PM
Newbie
 
ja333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by vumcrab View Post

BTW, what were you watching on ESPN last night?

I think ESPN has one of the better HD feeds.

It was a college football game. I am not sure who was playing since I was more concerned in comparing to the NBC HD feed with the ESPN HD. The game was at the same time as the NBC game.
ja333 is offline  
post #637 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 09:17 PM
Newbie
 
sesome78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldPete View Post

Yes, that's correct, I have one hdmi going from the receiver to the tv for the video. Going to the Receiver are hdmi's from satellite box, PS3, and Apple TV, and component from old Xbox 360. (I am going to try going back to xbox to tv because of questions about the upconverting quality of the receiver.)

The big advantage of running everything through the receiver is the ability to get uncompressed or lossless audio (sounds great), which can't run through optical. Hdmi is the only way to get it.

In theory it is also easier to switch, because you can switch one remote without getting a universal remote. In practice it takes extra time for the hdmi to synch.

The disadvantage of using the receiver to switch is the loss of the ability to customize settings by input, so you end up compromising on your settings. CM and ME are fixed for the input, but you do have 3 separate picture settings to use; I use those to adjust for daytime or night viewing.

My receiver is a Sony DA5300ES, which has some tradeoffs. If you are looking at that level then I recommend comparing with others such as the Denon 3808. There are lots of good ones that cost less, but be careful of the number of hdmi ports, with expansion room for the future, if you are going to be using it to switch everything into the tv.

In summary, going thru a receiver is great for audio but costs more and comes with new problems. Sorry to make such a long reply.

Pete

Hey Old Pete running the same set-up as you, well technically. PS3 (HDMI), Xbox (Component) to Denon 2308 receiver (HDMI) out to 46 XBR4.
Everything has advanced settings. What should the PS3 be set to?
Reciever has Progresive mode- Auto, or Video1 (video playback) or Video2 (suitable for video & 30 frame film material, Should I use Video2 for Bluray?
Did you ever post your XBR setting for Xbox and PS3?
I'd appreciate your input and anybody else who may have advise.
Thanks,
Ted
sesome78 is offline  
post #638 of 5495 Old 10-22-2007, 09:26 PM
Newbie
 
sesome78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Another question while watching PS3 bluray on scenes like Casino Royale when Bond is chasing the burned guy threw the construction site. When they pan out to the background the sky will have a lot of noise, while everything in the foreground will remain sharp. What is this and is this the jutter that Me/ce is supposed to correct?
Thanks again guys.
Ted
sesome78 is offline  
post #639 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 10:51 AM
Member
 
OldPete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 181
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by sesome78 View Post

Hey Old Pete running the same set-up as you, well technically. PS3 (HDMI), Xbox (Component) to Denon 2308 receiver (HDMI) out to 46 XBR4.
Everything has advanced settings. What should the PS3 be set to?
Reciever has Progresive mode- Auto, or Video1 (video playback) or Video2 (suitable for video & 30 frame film material, Should I use Video2 for Bluray?
Did you ever post your XBR setting for Xbox and PS3?
I'd appreciate your input and anybody else who may have advise.
Thanks,
Ted

I gave settings in a reply, but in checking the black level calibration found a problem with the wide RGB range going through the receiver. I'm checking with Sony, deleted the post, and will post my settings when I've resolved the problem.

Pete
OldPete is offline  
post #640 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 12:10 PM
AVS Special Member
 
slumpey326's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 1,494
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
oldpete, can you re-post your settings after everything is straightened out.
slumpey326 is offline  
post #641 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 12:39 PM
Member
 
OldPete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 181
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
As a result of a problem with a Sony receiver not passing Full RGB I'll be changing my settings, if not my receiver, so I'll have to delay posting them. Sorry.

A point I found while chasing the problem may be interesting to some. The black level (brightness) setting changes with the RGB range, which isn't surprising, but explains the wide variation of settings posted here. I was calibrating with a PS3, the Avia black bar pattern, and an HDMI to the XBR4.

With a backlight/picture of 8/85, power saving high, here are the calibrated brightness settings:
Limited RGB: Brightness 44
Full RGB: Brightness 51

For my night setting of 4/70:
Limited RGB: Brightness 45
Full RGB: Brightness 52

I had wondered why some people would get such a different black level; this could be why. One more reason to be careful in using posted settings.

Pete

Edit: researching pro's and con's of using Full RGB vs. YCbCr. More tomorrow.
OldPete is offline  
post #642 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 01:40 PM
Member
 
rontonio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: So. Cal.
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
ja333, I experienced a "jerky" picture while watching football games this weekend, and No matter what I did with CineMotion or MotionFlow could make it go away. I did solve the problem by feeding the 32XBR4 panel with a 720p signal from the Moto box rather than the 1080i signal I had been using with the now-replaced CRT. Now I can't live without Cinemotion Auto 1 and Motionflow Standard on HDTV and for DVDs. BTW, I've found that feeding the panel a 480i signal from my Oppo 970 produced the best artifact-free DVD images.
rontonio is offline  
post #643 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 01:59 PM
Advanced Member
 
vumcrab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by rontonio View Post

ja333, I experienced a "jerky" picture while watching football games this weekend, and No matter what I did with CineMotion or MotionFlow could make it go away. I did solve the problem by feeding the 32XBR4 panel with a 720p signal from the Moto box rather than the 1080i signal I had been using with the now-replaced CRT. Now I can't live without Cinemotion Auto 1 and Motionflow Standard on HDTV and for DVDs. BTW, I've found that feeding the panel a 480i signal from my Oppo 970 produced the best artifact-free DVD images.

Same here. I set my Moto. 3416 STB to output 480p (used to be 1080i) and its the best signal into the xbr, no doubt.
vumcrab is offline  
post #644 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 04:04 PM
Senior Member
 
Digital_View's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 425
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hey, OldPete.

I have not decided which I like better: Limited vs Full RGB since both look good IMO. Yes, the FULL works with the XBR4/PS3. But it does tend to crush the blacks. Not to the extent of a LCD that does NOT support FULL. But enough to where I have to to extra steps finessing the gama, brightness, drc mode and C.E. settings.
Digital_View is offline  
post #645 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 04:08 PM
Newbie
 
ja333's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by rontonio View Post

ja333, I experienced a "jerky" picture while watching football games this weekend, and No matter what I did with CineMotion or MotionFlow could make it go away. I did solve the problem by feeding the 32XBR4 panel with a 720p signal from the Moto box rather than the 1080i signal I had been using with the now-replaced CRT. Now I can't live without Cinemotion Auto 1 and Motionflow Standard on HDTV and for DVDs. BTW, I've found that feeding the panel a 480i signal from my Oppo 970 produced the best artifact-free DVD images.

rontonio thank you for the advice. I have a SA4250HD and will try some changes on the box to see what can be improved.

In any case, does anyone has a recommendation for what is the best configuration for the SA4250HD. The majority of the feedback on the thread has been for motorola boxes.
ja333 is offline  
post #646 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 04:32 PM
Advanced Member
 
vumcrab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_View View Post

Hey, OldPete.

I have not decided which I like better: Limited vs Full RGB since both look good IMO. Yes, the FULL works with the XBR4/PS3. But it does tend to crush the blacks. Not to the extent of a LCD that does NOT support FULL. But enough to where I have to to extra steps finessing the gama, brightness, drc mode and C.E. settings.

Do you only get benefit from the RGB setting if you have a 1080p source over HDMI? I have my STB connected via HDMI, but I've always left my RGB setting to AUTO.
vumcrab is offline  
post #647 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 04:49 PM
AVS Special Member
 
schlick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,393
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Limited rgb range is digital values 16-235 with "black" being value 16 and peak white being 235.

Full range is digital 1-254 the values below 16 are considered "blacker than black" and the xbr should have no problem processing them. Values from 236-254 are (i think) considered whiter than white??

Most standard dvd's are encoded with the 16-235 range, and use the below and above values as a kind of digital headroom.
I believe these are the differences brtween limited and full range rgb. I think the full range was intended for computer graphics where video levels don't really apply.
schlick is offline  
post #648 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 05:03 PM
Member
 
rontonio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: So. Cal.
Posts: 88
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
vumcrab, what benefits have you seen for 480P input vs 720P? I don't seen any artifacts from 720P from the 3416STB. I'm not leaning one way or the other BTW.
rontonio is offline  
post #649 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 05:51 PM
Senior Member
 
Digital_View's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 425
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldPete View Post

As a result of a problem with a Sony receiver not passing Full RGB I'll be changing my settings, if not my receiver, so I'll have to delay posting them. Sorry.

A point I found while chasing the problem may be interesting to some. The black level (brightness) setting changes with the RGB range, which isn't surprising, but explains the wide variation of settings posted here. I was calibrating with a PS3, the Avia black bar pattern, and an HDMI to the XBR4.

With a backlight/picture of 8/85, power saving high, here are the calibrated brightness settings:
Limited RGB: Brightness 44
Full RGB: Brightness 51

For my night setting of 4/70:
Limited RGB: Brightness 45
Full RGB: Brightness 52

I had wondered why some people would get such a different black level; this could be why. One more reason to be careful in using posted settings.

Pete

Edit: researching pro's and con's of using Full RGB vs. YCbCr. More tomorrow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vumcrab View Post

Do you only get benefit from the RGB setting if you have a 1080p source over HDMI? I have my STB connected via HDMI, but I've always left my RGB setting to AUTO.

Vumcrab,

On the PS3. RGB is for HDMI only. And I have no "auto" under the display settings. Only limited and full.
Digital_View is offline  
post #650 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 06:30 PM
Member
 
OldPete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 181
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_View View Post

Hey, OldPete.

I have not decided which I like better: Limited vs Full RGB since both look good IMO. Yes, the FULL works with the XBR4/PS3. But it does tend to crush the blacks. Not to the extent of a LCD that does NOT support FULL. But enough to where I have to to extra steps finessing the gama, brightness, drc mode and C.E. settings.

Thanks for the useful feedback; have you tried YCbCr to compare?
OldPete is offline  
post #651 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 06:33 PM
Member
 
OldPete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 181
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by schlick View Post

Limited rgb range is digital values 16-235 with "black" being value 16 and peak white being 235.

Full range is digital 1-254 the values below 16 are considered "blacker than black" and the xbr should have no problem processing them. Values from 236-254 are (i think) considered whiter than white??

Most standard dvd's are encoded with the 16-235 range, and use the below and above values as a kind of digital headroom.
I believe these are the differences brtween limited and full range rgb. I think the full range was intended for computer graphics where video levels don't really apply.

Thanks, that fits with what I had seen elsewhere. While I now understand it was intended for computers, I liked the effect of it, but can't use it now with the receiver. Any comments on YCbCr?
OldPete is offline  
post #652 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 07:52 PM
Member
 
tagheuer01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
so I'm guessing that I shouldn't try to use someone else's calibration settings posted here, right? (because all rooms are different, etc.)

BB tried to sell me calibration for $300.

can I just buy a DVD and do it myself? (I am somewhat of a techie, but want something relatively straightforward as far as calibration discs etc...)

What do you recommend, and how easy/hard is this?

I'm not trying to render 100 percent accurate colors for printing photos or anything, just an average joe who wants a good picture.
tagheuer01 is offline  
post #653 of 5495 Old 10-23-2007, 09:13 PM
Advanced Member
 
vumcrab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by rontonio View Post

vumcrab, what benefits have you seen for 480P input vs 720P? I don't seen any artifacts from 720P from the 3416STB. I'm not leaning one way or the other BTW.

Sorry, I wasn't specific enough. I'm talking about the 4:3 SD upconvert option on the 3416 not the HDMI option. On the 4:3 default setting, you have 480i, 480p, Stretch (upconverts to 1080i to fill the screen) and Off (upconverts to 1080i but puts the black bars on the sides). For HD (the HDMI setting), I've always left it at 1080i and have been happy.
vumcrab is offline  
post #654 of 5495 Old 10-24-2007, 02:46 AM
AVS Special Member
 
bplewis24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Sacramento, CA.
Posts: 7,743
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by schlick View Post

Values from 236-254 are (i think) considered whiter than white??

I've seen them called "peak white" actually. I'm finally about halfway through this reference guide ( http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...89#post4969789 ). According to that, they shouldn't be referred to as whiter-than-white because unlike BTB they should be visible in the final picture:

Quote:


Codes 1-15 represent data that is below reference black, hence it is called blacker-than-black (BTB). Codes 236-254 are peak whites. I will refrain from calling them whiter than white' because this implies that they shouldn't normally be present or visible in the final picture. They should be, unlike BTB(BTB should not regularly be visible in the final calibrated image)! It is important to maintain the full range of encoded data through your video chain for the best image.

This also correlates to the PS3 display setting for Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr output which is listed as "super white" capability.

Brandon
bplewis24 is offline  
post #655 of 5495 Old 10-24-2007, 02:58 AM
Senior Member
 
Digital_View's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 425
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldPete View Post

Thanks, that fits with what I had seen elsewhere. While I now understand it was intended for computers, I liked the effect of it, but can't use it now with the receiver. Any comments on YCbCr?

Here's what I found out. In trying to figure out RGB and Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr....I've done some comparisons...There are two main settings of interest under the PS3's menu:

BD/DVD Settings -> BD/DVD Video Output Format (HDMI) -> Automatic, RGB, Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr

And...

Display Settings -> RGB Full Range (HDMI) -> Full, Limited

What I found is that setting the BD/DVD Video Output Format (HDMI) to Automatic and playing BD movies is the same thing as selecting Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. It never uses RBG even if "RGB Full Range (HDMI) is set to "Full." It seem to ignore it because "Automatic" auto selects "Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr" for BD movies.

Setting RGB Full Range (HDMI) to "Limited" and FORCING "RGB" or "Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr" under BD/DVD Video Output Format (HDMI) look the same to me.

But. Setting RGB Full Range (HDMI) to "Full" and FORCING "RGB" looks a bit too BLACK for BD movies. Which is kind of the effect I get for the XMB when RGB Full Range (HDMI) is set to "Full."

Although, I don't mind the XMB to be "blacker than black" since it works well with extreme contrasts. Movies (and games) are another matter when it's good to have some detail in the blacks.

I should note that the XBR4 does support RGB Full since I would be able to adjust the brightness and contrast to my liking. My older LCD did not support FULL RGB and no matter what I did I could never lighten up the blacks once RGB Full was turned on.

I not tested this with games yet. Although, I wonder if all a long I've been running under "Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr" and not "RGB" even though my XMB was reflecting the "FULL RGB" as active.
Digital_View is offline  
post #656 of 5495 Old 10-24-2007, 04:38 AM
AVS Special Member
 
schlick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,393
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldPete View Post

Thanks, that fits with what I had seen elsewhere. While I now understand it was intended for computers, I liked the effect of it, but can't use it now with the receiver. Any comments on YCbCr?

The component (Y/Cr/Cb) allows you to differentiate between the the two color decoder matrixes on the xbr (ITU 601 and ITU 709). In the video options menu, second to last item as you scroll to the bottom. As I recently found out myself, the use of Y, R-Y, and B-Y (or Y Pr Pb, Y Cr Cb etc.) uses the 601 standard for SD content, and the 709 standard for HD content, whereas RGB doesn't use either, because after all processing the tv ultimately uses RGB to display the picture with each pixel being made up of a red, green, and blue sub pixel. I'm not sure if the color space setting in the picture menu directly affects the matrix setting in the video options menu. I've been meaning to see if there is a connection between the two but haven't had time yet this week to delve into it.
schlick is offline  
post #657 of 5495 Old 10-24-2007, 08:27 AM
Advanced Member
 
vumcrab's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 713
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_View View Post

Here's what I found out. In trying to figure out RGB and Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr....I've done some comparisons...There are two main settings of interest under the PS3's menu:

BD/DVD Settings -> BD/DVD Video Output Format (HDMI) -> Automatic, RGB, Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr

And...

Display Settings -> RGB Full Range (HDMI) -> Full, Limited

What I found is that setting the BD/DVD Video Output Format (HDMI) to Automatic and playing BD movies is the same thing as selecting Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr. It never uses RBG even if "RGB Full Range (HDMI) is set to "Full." It seem to ignore it because "Automatic" auto selects "Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr" for BD movies.

Setting RGB Full Range (HDMI) to "Limited" and FORCING "RGB" or "Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr" under BD/DVD Video Output Format (HDMI) look the same to me.

But. Setting RGB Full Range (HDMI) to "Full" and FORCING "RGB" looks a bit too BLACK for BD movies. Which is kind of the effect I get for the XMB when RGB Full Range (HDMI) is set to "Full."

Although, I don't mind the XMB to be "blacker than black" since it works well with extreme contrasts. Movies (and games) are another matter when it's good to have some detail in the blacks.

I should note that the XBR4 does support RGB Full since I would be able to adjust the brightness and contrast to my liking. My older LCD did not support FULL RGB and no matter what I did I could never lighten up the blacks once RGB Full was turned on.

I not tested this with games yet. Although, I wonder if all a long I've been running under "Y Pb/Cb Pr/Cr" and not "RGB" even though my XMB was reflecting the "FULL RGB" as active.

What are you setting Color Space to in the Advanced portion of the Picture Settings? Last night I experimented with WIDE. I've always used Standard. I did notice a difference in the slight punch it gave colors, but couldn't decide if I liked it well enough to leave on WIDE. Some things it made look better, others not so much.

How would you think this setting affects the RGB setting, if at all?

EDIT: In case anybody wondered, setting color space to WIDE only affects HD content.
vumcrab is offline  
post #658 of 5495 Old 10-24-2007, 09:24 AM
Member
 
OldPete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 181
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Thanks to all for the discussion and link on RGB/YCbCr. Interesting and helpful.

Pete
OldPete is offline  
post #659 of 5495 Old 10-24-2007, 09:54 AM
Member
 
OldPete's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 181
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by tagheuer01 View Post

BB tried to sell me calibration for $300.

can I just buy a DVD and do it myself? (I am somewhat of a techie, but want something relatively straightforward as far as calibration discs etc...)

What do you recommend, and how easy/hard is this?

I'm not trying to render 100 percent accurate colors for printing photos or anything, just an average joe who wants a good picture.

There are DVD's for doing it yourself. The advantage over using someone else's calibration is that you are calibrating for your unique combination of equipment, environment, and tastes.

I've used the Avia (preferred) and Digital Video Essentials DVD's for many years and and gotten decent results, though certainly not up to the professional level. The SD versions are dated but still work to some degree for HD, and can either guide you along in a fairly easy tutorial or let you choose test patterns.

DVE is available in HD DVD, and the Avia is claimed to be ready in both formats in a few months, perhaps.
OldPete is offline  
post #660 of 5495 Old 10-24-2007, 10:29 AM
Member
 
tagheuer01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldPete View Post

There are DVD's for doing it yourself. The advantage over using someone else's calibration is that you are calibrating for your unique combination of equipment, environment, and tastes.

I've used the Avia (preferred) and Digital Video Essentials DVD's for many years and and gotten decent results, though certainly not up to the professional level. The SD versions are dated but still work to some degree for HD, and can either guide you along in a fairly easy tutorial or let you choose test patterns.

DVE is available in HD DVD, and the Avia is claimed to be ready in both formats in a few months, perhaps.


Thank you. I will *not* spend another $150 and buy a colormeter or whatever they are called. I just want to do better than out of box settings and I enjoy fiddling with technology and trying to do things myself...

I just want to calibrate primarily for the cable signal, as I don't even have a hi-def DVD player, I am waiting for the format war to end...

So with that in mind, does it matter whether I calibrate with HD-DVD or SD, for cable signal only purposes?
tagheuer01 is offline  
Reply LCD Flat Panel Displays

Tags
Sony Bravia Xbr Kdl 52xbr4 52 Inch 1080p Lcd Hdtv , Sony Bravia Xbr Series Kdl 52xbr5 52 Inch 1080p Lcd Hdtv , Lcd Hdtv , Sony Bravia Xbr Kdl 32xbr4 32 Lcd Hdtv
Gear in this thread - 52xbr4 by PriceGrabber.com

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off