The Official Pioneer 9G non-Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread - Page 186 - AVS Forum
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post #5551 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

That's pretty much my story. I liked Movie mode on my 6020 right out of the box but slightly modified it in accordance with D-Nice's recommendations. Later I ended up with settings between Movie default and D-Nice's recommendations. My settings are:

Contrast 40
Brightness 0
Color 0
Tint R1
Sharpness -15
PureCinema
Film Mode: Advance
Text Optimization: On

I have had my 6020 for nearly 5 months and have liked these settings so well, I use them almost exclusively for all HD programming, including sports. The PQ, especially the shadow detail, is matchless.

Did you have your 6020 professionally calibrated first then tweaked your movie settings? Or did you just tweak it on your own. I have the 5020 and am using almost the same as you are in Movie mode but I am having my set calibrated in a few weeks. I was just wondering if I will have to re- tweak it or just leave these settings as is.

Thanks
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post #5552 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 10:13 AM
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Happy Holidays Everyone...



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post #5553 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g-dog View Post

Did you have your 6020 professionally calibrated first then tweaked your movie settings? Or did you just tweak it on your own. I have the 5020 and am using almost the same as you are in Movie mode but I am having my set calibrated in a few weeks. I was just wondering if I will have to re- tweak it or just leave these settings as is.

I did not have my 6020 professionally calibrated but whether or not to do that is a personal decision, of course. My 6020 gives me the finest PQ I have seen yet. Thus, my decision not to have a professional calibration done was simply an acknowledgment of the usually good advice not to fix something that isn't broken.

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Happy Holidays Everyone...




The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.
Henry David Thoreau

The same to you. The Thoreau quote, by the way, is one of my favorites
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post #5554 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I did not have my 6020 professionally calibrated but whether or not to do that is a personal decision, of course. My 6020 gives me the finest PQ I have seen yet. Thus, my decision not to have a professional calibration done was simply an acknowledgment of the usually good advice not to fix something that isn't broken.



The same to you. The Thoreau quote, by the way, is one of my favorites

Understood gwsat...

Thanks for the response.

Nice pics looks real beautiful now in Lake Tahoe...wish there was some of that (snow, scenery) down here in South Florida.
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post #5555 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 10:45 AM
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Just saw this:
Owners in Chicago wanting Pro Calibration next week....

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Originally Posted by DroptheRemote View Post

FYI --

I have a loyal, long-time client who recently moved from St. Louis to Chicago who needs some immediate post-holiday calibration attention after completing his new home theater over the weekend.

As a result, I'm going to be in the Chicago area next Monday Dec 29 and Tuesday, Dec 30 and because this is an otherwise one-off, one-client trip, I thought I'd drop you a note here to see if anyone else would be interested in scheduling a calibration while I'm in the area. I'll be waiving travel fees.

I'm coming from St. Louis, so in addition to the Chicago area, so I could also combine this with one or two stops in northern and/or central Illinois.

FWIW, in addition to the normal calibration toolkit, I am also equipped with the ControlCAL tools needed to calibrate current Pioneer Elite and non-Elite plasmas, and also possess the software tools required for activating ISF Day/Night modes on previous model Elites.

If you're interested, please call ASAP at 314-495-2993 or eMail me (doug [at] clearlyresolved.com).


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post #5556 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 01:08 PM
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cAN ANYONE POST SOME PICS OF THE 5020 PLAYING SOME BLU-RAYS AND VIDEO GAMES??

thANKS

p

ps--i AM WAITNG FOR MY 5020 TO ARRIVE AND I WILL SOON BE APART OF THE KURO CLAN WOOO HOOO!
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post #5557 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 02:25 PM
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I installed my 5020 last weekend, and have been experiencing issues with the tuner (Issue #1) and HMG (Issue #2).

Issue #1
I have issues with the operation of the OTA DTV tuner. When I select a digital TV station, the tuner (apparently) loses the signal and then "re-boots". The only way to re-gain the signal is to power cycle the TV.

I would estimate that I can maintain a channel lock for about 30-60 seconds. I have four other OTA digital tuners from different manufacturers and different vintages that work without a hitch, so I do not think there are issues with my antenna signal.

I realize that different generations of tuners can have varying performance from the same antenna signal. I have a pre-amp on the antenna and am also using a two-way splitter to route the signal to two devices in the room.

I found posts on this thread concerning similar issues with the digital tuner, but it did not appear there was either recognition or resolution of the problem.

Issue #2
This past weekend, I tried to use HMG to stream music files from a Ready NAS server. At first, I was still in the digital tuner mode, and the menu system would disappear after a brief period. I realized this could be related to the issue above, so I switched to the analog tuner, which resolved the disappearing menu problem.

When either the digital tuner or the analog tuner were selected, the Ready NAS did not appear in HMG's list of servers. I have sucessfully streamed music from the Ready NAS to a Denon AVP, so I think the DNLA settings in the server are correct.

I searched in the thread, but could not find any posts related to this specific problem. I am now wondering if this could be related to the fact that I was using the TV tuner? I did not attempt to access the Ready NAS while an HDMI input was selected.

Thanks for any assistance / insight into these problems.

Mark
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post #5558 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giomania View Post

I installed my 5020 last weekend, and have been experiencing issues with the tuner (Issue #1) and HMG (Issue #2).

Issue #1
I have issues with the operation of the OTA DTV tuner. When I select a digital TV station, the tuner (apparently) loses the signal and then "re-boots". The only way to re-gain the signal is to power cycle the TV.

I would estimate that I can maintain a channel lock for about 30-60 seconds. I have four other OTA digital tuners from different manufacturers and different vintages that work without a hitch, so I do not think there are issues with my antenna signal.

I realize that different generations of tuners can have varying performance from the same antenna signal. I have a pre-amp on the antenna and am also using a two-way splitter to route the signal to two devices in the room.

I found posts on this thread concerning similar issues with the digital tuner, but it did not appear there was either recognition or resolution of the problem.

Issue #2
This past weekend, I tried to use HMG to stream music files from a Ready NAS server. At first, I was still in the digital tuner mode, and the menu system would disappear after a brief period. I realized this could be related to the issue above, so I switched to the analog tuner, which resolved the disappearing menu problem.

When either the digital tuner or the analog tuner were selected, the Ready NAS did not appear in HMG's list of servers. I have sucessfully streamed music from the Ready NAS to a Denon AVP, so I think the DNLA settings in the server are correct.

I searched in the thread, but could not find any posts related to this specific problem. I am now wondering if this could be related to the fact that I was using the TV tuner? I did not attempt to access the Ready NAS while an HDMI input was selected.

Thanks for any assistance / insight into these problems.

Mark

Your nametag should say, "Veni, Vidi, Vici". Veni is the perfect singular first person indicative active form of venio, venire, veni, ventus, which is translated as I came. I don't use HMG or the tuner, so I can't help you otherwise.

Jim, I was just mentioning it the that person. No need to yell. It's a stickied thread, so I figured it wouldn't be bad since I don't bump it to the top with an unnecessary post.

What is dead can never die. Long live my 151!
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post #5559 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by coltsfreak18 View Post

...I don't use HMG or the tuner, so I can't help you otherwise.

And, should we others infer something from the first part of your post???
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post #5560 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 05:25 PM
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AVS,

I have looked everywhere for a good extended warranty such as Repair Master(not so good reviews) MACK, N.E.W,etc. I purchased my 5020 with a mastercard so now i get an additional year of manufacturer warranty from pioneer, but im thinkin i want a couple more years like maybe one or two more. I have researched all of the above stated but none seem to have a good warranty like BB does. And everyone i have researched reviews on people say they all stink!!!

ANY SUGGESTIONS!!?
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post #5561 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 05:28 PM
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Hey all! This is my second post in this thread.
I am deciding between a samsung led LCD or the Pioneer 5020.

I called Pioneer and asked them if they could explain burn-in to me prior to purchasing their product. The guy told me not to watch anything with a static image for more than 2 hours.
He also didn't offer to speak about any technology in the tv to help against this which i thought was odd. 2 hours?
I then decided to call a local dealer (AmericanTV) and all 3 sales associates told me I would need to leave a static image on the screen for a long time. One said, "72 hours." One said, "3 weeks." Another guy told me to baby the TV for the first 500! hours and after that I can go crazy with games, bluray etc.

I am a little confused on this issue or...non-issue. It seems everyone has something different to say.
I like the pioneer picture quality, even though I like the sammy a950 PQ as well. I think the Pioneer produced a more lifelike picture, rather than an artificial picture.
But can someone clear this up for me without saying, "You need to have the static image on there a long time to burn in." What is a long time? That's too broad of a statement.
Also, how come I hear a lot of people having IR problems where it takes them hours to get it off the screen. That's something that scares me.

If I can get these issues cleared up, I think I may have to pull the trigger.
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post #5562 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 06:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mholtz2j View Post

Hey all! This is my second post in this thread.
I am deciding between a samsung led LCD or the Pioneer 5020.

I called Pioneer and asked them if they could explain burn-in to me prior to purchasing their product. The guy told me not to watch anything with a static image for more than 2 hours.
He also didn't offer to speak about any technology in the tv to help against this which i thought was odd. 2 hours?
I then decided to call a local dealer (AmericanTV) and all 3 sales associates told me I would need to leave a static image on the screen for a long time. One said, "72 hours." One said, "3 weeks." Another guy told me to baby the TV for the first 500! hours and after that I can go crazy with games, bluray etc.

I am a little confused on this issue or...non-issue. It seems everyone has something different to say.
I like the pioneer picture quality, even though I like the sammy a950 PQ as well. I think the Pioneer produced a more lifelike picture, rather than an artificial picture.
But can someone clear this up for me without saying, "You need to have the static image on there a long time to burn in." What is a long time? That's too broad of a statement.
Also, how come I hear a lot of people having IR problems where it takes them hours to get it off the screen. That's something that scares me.

If I can get these issues cleared up, I think I may have to pull the trigger.

It was an issue with older plasmas, I haven't heard of anyone having problems with IR recently (except for cheap, cheap plasmas).

If you were getting an older model or a tier-three plasma I'd say yes, you should keep an eye on it.
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post #5563 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 08:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mholtz2j View Post

Hey all! This is my second post in this thread.
I am deciding between a samsung led LCD or the Pioneer 5020.

I called Pioneer and asked them if they could explain burn-in to me prior to purchasing their product. The guy told me not to watch anything with a static image for more than 2 hours.
He also didn't offer to speak about any technology in the tv to help against this which i thought was odd. 2 hours?
I then decided to call a local dealer (AmericanTV) and all 3 sales associates told me I would need to leave a static image on the screen for a long time. One said, "72 hours." One said, "3 weeks." Another guy told me to baby the TV for the first 500! hours and after that I can go crazy with games, bluray etc.

I am a little confused on this issue or...non-issue. It seems everyone has something different to say.
I like the pioneer picture quality, even though I like the sammy a950 PQ as well. I think the Pioneer produced a more lifelike picture, rather than an artificial picture.
But can someone clear this up for me without saying, "You need to have the static image on there a long time to burn in." What is a long time? That's too broad of a statement.
Also, how come I hear a lot of people having IR problems where it takes them hours to get it off the screen. That's something that scares me.

If I can get these issues cleared up, I think I may have to pull the trigger.

Break in your TV as recommended and you are fine. The Kuros are the best plasmas when it comes to IR. I've still not seen any after months of ownership, including after heavy PC use.

Be a fan of displays, not companies or technologies!
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post #5564 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 08:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coltsfreak18 View Post

Your nametag should say, "Veni, Vidi, Vici". Veni is the perfect singular first person indicative active form of venio, venire, veni, ventus, which is translated as I came. I don't use HMG or the tuner, so I can't help you otherwise.

E vero. You would think after two years of Italian in college I would not have screwed that up. It was time for a change, anyway.

Mi dispiace.
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post #5565 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 09:17 PM
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I was browsing Pioneer Canada's website and spotted something I'd never seen before.. a link for updates on the xx20 series http://www.pioneerelectronics.ca/POC....Support?tab=B

If you look at all the other TVs there is no such tab and I'm pretty sure this was a recent modification. Coincidence? who knows For now the page is blank, who knows if that could change.

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post #5566 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 10:57 PM
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Pioneer 5020
Measured input lag over HDMI varies from 31 to 63 ms.
Most typical - 47 ms.
Average input lag 45 ms (about 3 frames delay):

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post #5567 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 10:59 PM
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Rather than lurking, I get to join in the fun! It will be delivered after the holidays. Thanks to all who post regularly, especially D-NICE. I look forward to joining the flat panel club. I've been using a very nice CRT HDTV since 2003 but happy to move all 200 lbs out of the house!

Look forward to being able to contribute to this thread.

Thanks again.
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post #5568 of 15008 Old 12-22-2008, 11:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giomania View Post

E vero. You would think after two years of Italian in college I would not have screwed that up. It was time for a change, anyway.

Mi dispiace.

No problem. Try doing Greek and see what kind of reaction you get.

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post #5569 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Patrick. View Post

Break in your TV as recommended and you are fine. The Kuros are the best plasmas when it comes to IR. I've still not seen any after months of ownership, including after heavy PC use.

I have a 5020 on the way to my house, but after all the research and consumer reviews i have read stating about burn in and IR, what the hell is the pioneer guy talking about?? Maybe the pioneer guy is just one of those phone answering guys!! But thats a little odd to me that he said only 2hrs??!!! thats like crazy short, especially for a video game. But everyone i have talked to on here, BB, or any other store ive been to have all stated(and some have the 50/6020) the same thing as my research "it seems almost impossible with pioneer plasmas, at least after break in, to burn in or have any type of IR, and if there is IR it goes away quite fast" Not only did i get that hear but i got it from the guy at BB to who had a 6020 as i spoke with him about static image. So my worries are pretty much gone i just thought that was weird how the pioneer guy could say only 2 hrs when some people on here constantly do 6hrs of gaming or viewing a day with no problems.

Sry just my 2 cents
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post #5570 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 07:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by video313 View Post

Pioneer 5020
Measured input lag over HDMI varies from 31 to 63 ms.
Most typical - 47 ms.
Average input lag 45 ms (about 3 frames delay):



I thought Plasmas do not have input lag??? WOW 63 ms that just as bad as some LCD's, now im gettin a little worried about my gaming
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post #5571 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 07:20 AM
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video313,

What external components were involved? receiver, cablebox, bluray player?

Samsung 64F8500, Panasonic 65VT50, Oppo 95, Tivo Roamio for OTA, Dish VIP722, Marantz AV8801 preamp, Rotel Amps, Atlantic Tech 8200 speakers, Seaton Submersive HP, Calman 5, Chromapure, Accupel DVG-5000, i1Display3pro, i1pro2, eecolor colorbox.
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post #5572 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STILESP113 View Post

I thought Plasmas do not have input lag??? WOW 63 ms that just as bad as some LCD's, now im gettin a little worried about my gaming

This has already been tested and there is no input lag as long as you're using the game mode with game perf or the HDMI PC mode. My LCD a Dell 2707WFP has about 40ms, the Kuro definitely does not in the modes I described and it's easy to tell the difference.

Be a fan of displays, not companies or technologies!
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post #5573 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by video313 View Post

Pioneer 5020
Measured input lag over HDMI varies from 31 to 63 ms.
Most typical - 47 ms.
Average input lag 45 ms (about 3 frames delay):


Did you measure GAME mode with Game Pref turned on? What was the input lag then? What is the input lag on MOVIE mode?

THANKS!
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post #5574 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STILESP113 View Post

I thought Plasmas do not have input lag??? WOW 63 ms that just as bad as some LCD's, now im gettin a little worried about my gaming

On normal A/V video modes input lag has been measured here reliably which most users will find virtually undetectable for casual gaming. If you require more precision you can get ZERO input lag by using the Game Control Pref option of Game Mode.

Very demanding gamers have verified results, I've posted and discussed and others and have verified the gaming peformance pref in actual game play so this is quite reliable and thanks to Mr2828 who documented real testing procedures.
Example:
Quote:
Originally Posted by stradaONE8 View Post

Words cannot express how much I love you right now.

Ever since I got my 5020, my Halo playing ability has gone to hell because I just can't steady my aim for the life of me. I'm always overshooting my target and can never correct it appropriately, ie overshooting on the way back as well. Basically I look like a seizing monkey trying to play Halo. My aim was relatively rock solid before and this was just absurd how bad I was after the new TV.

At first I thought it was the larger screen (I came from 21") that was causing it and I thought after I got used to it it would be fine, but 2 weeks later with no improvement made me a bit frustrated.
I have played on some bigger screens before and there wasn't a problem with them like this.

Finally you came through with the lag correction and lo and behold, everything is perfect again. My aim is dead on and there is no issue whatsoever, if anything the larger screen helps now like everyone had been telling me.
Thank you very very much mr2828. I don't have much time to play Halo, and despite I'm still pretty decent, the lag was ruining my fun and you just restored it.

With gaming pref it's best to send a 1080p signal from the console to avoid any need for deinterlacing or scaling.

Quote:


Sidenote: If [Game Control Pref] was set to "On" in [Game] mode, most of the excellent video processing on the Pioneer PDP-LX5090 would be disabled to reduce input lag, resulting in a loss of resolution during video deinterlacing, and also proliferation of jaggies. For this reason, you should refrain from sending interlaced signals (e.g. 480i, 576i or 1080i) from your game console to the Pioneer PDP-LX5090 plasma television insofar as possible if you're going to engage [Game Control Pref] for its gaming response benefit.

As this reviewer also cites in his benchmark tests on his Kuro, you should be able to avoid any input lag also by using the PC Input modes:

Quote:


Benchmark Test Results:
Input lag (rel. to Samsung F96) On par if [Game Control Pref] engaged, or in [PC] mode


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post #5575 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick. View Post

I was browsing Pioneer Canada's website and spotted something I'd never seen before.. a link for updates on the xx20 series http://www.pioneerelectronics.ca/POC....Support?tab=B

If you look at all the other TVs there is no such tab and I'm pretty sure this was a recent modification. Coincidence? who knows For now the page is blank, who knows if that could change.

There are USB Firmware, updates for the European version of the 5020 on the Pioneer UK web site, date non the less Dec 2008.

Pioneer Elite rules the house!!!, but the little one is a close second!!
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post #5576 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 09:55 AM
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I installed my 5020 last weekend, and have been experiencing issues with the tuner (Issue #1) and HMG (Issue #2).

Issue #1
I have issues with the operation of the OTA DTV tuner. When I select a digital TV station, the tuner (apparently) loses the signal and then "re-boots". The only way to re-gain the signal is to power cycle the TV.

I would estimate that I can maintain a channel lock for about 30-60 seconds. I have four other OTA digital tuners from different manufacturers and different vintages that work without a hitch, so I do not think there are issues with my antenna signal.

I realize that different generations of tuners can have varying performance from the same antenna signal. I have a pre-amp on the antenna and am also using a two-way splitter to route the signal to two devices in the room.

I found posts on this thread concerning similar issues with the digital tuner, but it did not appear there was either recognition or resolution of the problem.

Issue #2
This past weekend, I tried to use HMG to stream music files from a Ready NAS server. At first, I was still in the digital tuner mode, and the menu system would disappear after a brief period. I realized this could be related to the issue above, so I switched to the analog tuner, which resolved the disappearing menu problem.

When either the digital tuner or the analog tuner were selected, the Ready NAS did not appear in HMG's list of servers. I have sucessfully streamed music from the Ready NAS to a Denon AVP, so I think the DNLA settings in the server are correct.

I searched in the thread, but could not find any posts related to this specific problem. I am now wondering if this could be related to the fact that I was using the TV tuner? I did not attempt to access the Ready NAS while an HDMI input was selected.

Thanks for any assistance / insight into these problems.

Mark

Anyone?
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post #5577 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 11:56 AM
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Are there any firmware updates for the 6020? I have had other TVs in the past requiring them. Does Pioneer send them to you if you ask or does it have to be done by a service center?

Thanks

Mark
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post #5578 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 12:15 PM
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I'm reposting BASICEO's calibration report here so that other Kuro owners will have a better chance to read it. I'm also including this post in the flat panel (Post#2) list that's linked at the bottom of my post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BASICEO View Post

Pioneer 5020 Calibration

Let me start by saying that I am not a neophyte when it comes to Flat Panel Display devices. I bought my first Plasma in 2000 and since that time, I have had 4 more panels. I try to update to newer technology every 18 months. My first panel was a Fujitsu marketed under the Onkyo Integra brand name. I'll not bore you with what the unit cost in 2000.

I have used both Plasma and LCD technologies and always return to Plasma after judging picture quality. I still have one LCD in one of the guest bedrooms but that is another story.

As my 18 month upgrade pate came about, I made a decision to acquire a Pioneer 5020 to replace my Panasonic TH50PH9UK (Pro Series). What a great decision I made.

Once I received the unit, I set it up in a spare office and started the 200 hour preliminary break-in process (using BruZZI & Angelo2's Break-In DVD) running on my PS3 which I brought from home. The unit ran non-stop for over 200 hours.

Keeping a log of time, I reached the 200 hour mark and moved the unit to my home, set it up using D-Nice's post Break-In setting and sat back and enjoyed a truly great picture. At this point, I had no doubt that the unit was superior to the TH50PH9UK. Little did I know that the image I was so impressed with was only "Half Way There".

On December 20th, I had the pleasure of D-Nice visiting my home to perform a calibration. I had been in touch with him all day as he had multiple calibrations to perform in the Charlotte area before getting to me. He arrived at my home around 8:30 PM and started to perform his magic.

What an impressive young man. Well dressed, well spoken, confident and a true professional. After setting up his equipment (I1Pro & Calman) he took my unit to areas that I could only imagine. Tweeking every little control through the Service Menu, he set about to accomplish perfection. When he finished, we had an absolutely level grey scale and colors (99% color accuracy with the 1% being a slight cyan push) that simply pops off the screen. He worked non-stop for well over 2 hours until he was satisfied, and still had a 2 hour drive to return to his home. That is dedication and a perfectionist.

I noted earlier that I was not a neophyte when it comes to display panels. My business deals with these units every day for varied application, including TV studios which use monitors for background display during newscasts. I have seen what I thought was the best picture attainable but was not prepared for the results that D-Nice obtained for my unit.

This report is long enough already. Let me close by saying that if you are located in the Southeast and have a FPD, you are losing may hours of viewing pleasure by not contracting D-Nice to calibrate your panel. He truly is "The Magic Man".

Jack

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post #5579 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 12:36 PM
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Where do you think you can get the best deal on a 60" Pioneer Kuro if you live in N.C.? You can send me a PM on that question. How much real difference between Regular Pioneer Kuro and the Elite version? Is it simply the advanced adjustments? I know there is a $1000 price difference. Thanks for any info you can provide.
Happy Holidays to you all.
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post #5580 of 15008 Old 12-23-2008, 02:04 PM
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Well, I think I am around 150 hours on my 5020 now, and I becoming more and more relaxed with it. There has not been a hint of IR at all, even playing letterbox movies, and a few hours of PS3 here and there. No 4:3 TV yet though.

I am moving into my new house in February, and would like to get it professionally calibrated after that. Is there anyone in Southern Ontario that does this?
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