The Official Pioneer 9G non-Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread - Page 254 - AVS Forum
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post #7591 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Sonnydigs View Post

We never found my speaker screws for my 6020..
I had to call Pioneer and wait a week, now I also realize I never received the cleaning cloth either..
Sonny

WTH....Pioneer trying to cut costs by only including screws and cloths in half of their boxes? lol

Is Pioneer sending them to you free of cost?
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post #7592 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by The Natural View Post

WTH....Pioneer trying to cut costs by only including screws and cloths in half of their boxes? lol

Is Pioneer sending them to you free of cost?

Yes, they sent the screws free.. Now I have to call and see about the cloth..
Was the cloth in your box????????????????/
Sonny
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post #7593 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 06:50 PM
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Hi, Im considering buying the Kuro from Costco. I called Pioneer and they said that costco.com is not an authorized reseller. How can costco give a 2 year warranty when Pioneer might not even honor the warranty since they are not an authorized reseller.
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post #7594 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dross333 View Post

Hi, Im considering buying the Kuro from Costco. I called Pioneer and they said that costco.com is not an authorized reseller. How can costco give a 2 year warranty when Pioneer might not even honor the warranty since they are not an authorized reseller.

I believe Costco will replace the unit for a comparable unit within that two year timeframe if something is wrong. Obviously you could use Pioneer for the repair work during the first year.

And of course, with Costco you have the 90 day return policy, which is pretty sweet. I bought my Toshiba XF550 from them.
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post #7595 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Nicktx27 View Post

Also something I haven't really seen mentioned before or if it was I missed it. You can hook a sub to th TV without any AV equipment.

Definitely cool!!!! I have had my Velodyne CT-150 rotting in the closet for the last year due to my temporary living situation... this gave me a reason to dig it out and hook it up. I will say it adds some needed bottom end to the tv... but the tv has no where near the line drive to effectively run this sub. I played some bass heavy rap music and it was overly punchy due to lack of power... This sub is obnoxiously loud at 1/2 gain... to get any good volume out of it I have to damn near full gain the amp... you can tell this feature was an after thought... Just my $.02 YMMV
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post #7596 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 08:42 PM
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Can anyone answer a mounting question for me. I have the Whalen XL stand (under their Bayside Furnishings brand) and I know I need to use the XYZ to mount it as shown in the instructions:




Going by the 5020 manual I think I'll need to use M8 screws, but my question has to do with the positioning of the two vertical bars that actually attach to the back of the television.

The stand manual says to make sure these are aligned and centered, but seeing as how there are multiple holes in the bars is it possible to attach them so that they are higher up the TV, and therefore will make the TV hang lower on the final mount? I'm just wondering if the height of the mount is adjustable this way in case I think it's too high in the default position.

Or is moving the bars like that possibly going to put too much torque on the wrong points of the back of the TV and snap something somehow?

Also, what's the best way to do this? Attach those brackets first and then get two people to hold the TV while I remove the included stand prior to mounting it? I'm trying to avoid having to lay the TV down flat.

Thanks, if anyone has any suggestions.
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post #7597 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by teiresias View Post

Can anyone answer a mounting question for me. I have the Whalen XL stand (under their Bayside Furnishings brand) and I know I need to use the XYZ to mount it as shown in the instructions:




Going by the 5020 manual I think I'll need to use M8 screws, but my question has to do with the positioning of the two vertical bars that actually attach to the back of the television.

The stand manual says to make sure these are aligned and centered, but seeing as how there are multiple holes in the bars is it possible to attach them so that they are higher up the TV, and therefore will make the TV hang lower on the final mount? I'm just wondering if the height of the mount is adjustable this way in case I think it's too high in the default position.

Or is moving the bars like that possibly going to put too much torque on the wrong points of the back of the TV and snap something somehow?

Also, what's the best way to do this? Attach those brackets first and then get two people to hold the TV while I remove the included stand prior to mounting it? I'm trying to avoid having to lay the TV down flat.

Thanks, if anyone has any suggestions.

great quesion.. I really need help with this too..
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post #7598 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Sonnydigs View Post

Yes, they sent the screws free.. Now I have to call and see about the cloth..
Was the cloth in your box????????????????/
Sonny

Yeah I got my cloth but no screws! What was the number you called to get them sent to you?
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post #7599 of 15008 Old 01-29-2009, 11:04 PM
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Originally Posted by vsugihjoso View Post

I have mine for about a month now. Amazing picture with Blu ray. I connect mine to a macbook and experience similar effect. Sometimes it shifts to the point I can's see the menu bar and I have to guess and click.

I was concerned that mine was defective, too. But somebody mentions about the orbiter to prevent burn in; and I tried it. I turned off the Orbitter (Setup-Option) and the pixels stopped moving; turned it back on (Mode 2) then the pixels started moving again.

Thank you. Problem solved. Case closed
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post #7600 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 02:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teiresias View Post

Can anyone answer a mounting question for me. I have the Whalen XL stand (under their Bayside Furnishings brand) and I know I need to use the XYZ to mount it as shown in the instructions:

Going by the 5020 manual I think I'll need to use M8 screws, but my question has to do with the positioning of the two vertical bars that actually attach to the back of the television.

The stand manual says to make sure these are aligned and centered, but seeing as how there are multiple holes in the bars is it possible to attach them so that they are higher up the TV, and therefore will make the TV hang lower on the final mount? I'm just wondering if the height of the mount is adjustable this way in case I think it's too high in the default position.

Or is moving the bars like that possibly going to put too much torque on the wrong points of the back of the TV and snap something somehow?

Also, what's the best way to do this? Attach those brackets first and then get two people to hold the TV while I remove the included stand prior to mounting it? I'm trying to avoid having to lay the TV down flat.

Thanks, if anyone has any suggestions.

I own the same TV Stand, so let me chime in and try to help. Unfortunately, I do not own the 5020 -yet. Despite this, I have what might be some good advice. Most Important, is to make sure the M8 or whatever screws are going to do the job properly. First, thread the screws into the 5020 -by hand- to insure proper threading. Lightly screw them in all the way, noting how far they insert into the TV, then remove the screws. Next, pass the screws into the vertical support bar, and note how far the screw extends past the support bar, because this is how much screw length you will be inserting into the TV. Is the screw too long -or- too short? Make sure that the screw will be long enuf to get at least 6 to 8 threads deep into the TV insert nut, and also not too long! Bummer for me, none of the included screws was the right length, so I had to make a trip to the local hardware store. With regard the the position of the vertical support bars; you would first want to position them in the middle of the TV. If you want to make a height adjustment, you can do it without, or with little concern about hurting your 5020. The hanging design is placing the weight load mostly on the screws and TV inserts, not the bar top -or- bottom of the bar, as it rests on the back of TV. I would not recommend mounting the bars using the top most, or bottom most available screw holes tho. Try sticking to only "a few holes up, or a few holes down" from the middle point of the vertical bar(s). When tightening these screws, be sure to take care and not try to torque them too hard, it is a TV, not a car.

If you lay your 5020 face down, it will activate an internal speaker that repeats "what-you-doing!" untill you return it to vertical. I believe this is an exclusive design to Pioneer, and works without the TV plugged in.

On the TV I did recently, I mounted the vertical bars, then disconnected the mounting hardware of the Base, then a 3rd man pulled the base off, while the 2 man lift team hung the TV.

*My ever so smart GF has done & did an edit to my signature... now using other ways of concealing my passwords*
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post #7601 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 04:14 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Doug Blackburn View Post

Tsk tsk - if you are going to bomb a guy, make sure you get your facts right... the 5020/6020 have a 'flatter' grayscale BEFORE you use ControlCAL than the 800U Panasonics. And the 5020/6020, while not having an ideal 6500K color temp, are no worse than the 800Us in THX mode. Both can be made quite good with calibration, though the 800U jumps around (wider spread/range) than the 5020/6020.

There is something clearly wrong with the Panasonic 800U THX mode... it NEVER looks right no matter WHAT I do to them... it's flat, dull and dark looking even when I set the peak white level HIGHER than the peak white on a Kuro or Samsung plasma. I THINK the problem is that Panasonic has intentionally messed with Gamma in the 800Us... the Gamma is too low at the dark end of the luminance scale and too high at the top end of the luminance scale. I THINK this is what produces that consist flat-dull look. I want to duplicate that type of Gamma using the Lumagen Radiance XD to see if it makes other TVs without the manipulated Gamma look flat and dull like the 800U but I haven't had time.

I'll take a calibrated Samsung 550/650 plasma over a calibrated 800U any day.

The 5020/6020... hmmmm, after a ControlCAL calibration I can't tell that the picture is not as good as an Elite Kuro unless I have the 5020/6020 right next to an Elite Kuro with the same Blu-ray feed. So I guess I'd have to put either Kuro series on the top of the heap by a significant margin with Elite Kuros having a slight edge. All Kuros have a sharper image too... looks more focused than a Samsung or Panasonic - but again, have to have all 3 side by side in a dark room with the same feed to see it. Memory is not good enough.

Excellent post, thanks for the information.

What is your opinion regarding the image rendered by an 'Elite' Kuro PDP w/Pure mode versus a non-Elite Kuro PDP w/Optimum mode using pre/post calibration settings for this equipment?
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post #7602 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 05:42 AM
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Originally Posted by optivity View Post

Excellent post, thanks for the information.

What is your opinion regarding the image rendered by an 'Elite' Kuro PDP w/Pure mode versus a non-Elite Kuro PDP w/Optimum mode using pre/post calibration settings for this equipment?


I'm no expert or calibrator but it would be the Elite in Pure mode vs. the Kuro in Movie mode, which is the only mode you can calibrate properly on the 5020/6020. If you have someone who knows what they are doing you can get decently close, or so I have been told.
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post #7603 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 06:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity View Post

Excellent post, thanks for the information.

What is your opinion regarding the image rendered by an 'Elite' Kuro PDP w/Pure mode versus a non-Elite Kuro PDP w/Optimum mode using pre/post calibration settings for this equipment?

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Natural View Post

I'm no expert or calibrator but it would be the Elite in Pure mode vs. the Kuro in Movie mode, which is the only mode you can calibrate properly on the 5020/6020. If you have someone who knows what they are doing you can get decently close, or so I have been told.

In my non-professional opinion, Movie mode can look quite good but it is cannot be made very bright. This seems to be the most important difference between the displays. All other modes I have tried with the 5020, are overblown. They bloom on white content and I cannot adjust with with the contrast setting.

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post #7604 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 06:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Nicktx27 View Post

On another note. Have been watching my 5020 for the past day and one huge thing I didn't really think about was its SD image quality. Now while SD still looks like garbage to me, It looks really great on my set. Pio has done a great job at its processing of such an inferior signal.


I'd be interested to know what your settings are for SD Nick, my picture is so bad in SD that I avoid it.
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post #7605 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 07:22 AM
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Just using Dnice's settings for the break in. nothing spectacular. Like I said SD is garbage but it looks alot better than I thought it would.
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post #7606 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by dross333 View Post

Hi, Im considering buying the Kuro from Costco. I called Pioneer and they said that costco.com is not an authorized reseller. How can costco give a 2 year warranty when Pioneer might not even honor the warranty since they are not an authorized reseller.

I believe the costco warranty is their own extended warranty plan not a Pioneer plan.
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post #7607 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Nicktx27 View Post

Just using Dnice's settings for the break in. nothing spectacular. Like I said SD is garbage but it looks alot better than I thought it would.


I constantly walk by and my family is watching Peachtree TV in SD and I have to blink to make sure it is not my eyes. The signal is blurry. I did find that some SD got worse after I used ControlCal and D-Nice offsets. But it was worth it as HD and Blu Ray got better.
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post #7608 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 07:54 AM
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Originally Posted by KCinWhitby View Post

...my picture is so bad in SD that I avoid it.

What mode are you using to view SD channels? I also avoid SD to a certain degree, but MSNBC is going to be in HD until late Spring, and I watch that in the morning. Even with stretching it to avoid the black bars right now (still waiting to get some hours on the set), the picture is quite nice. I'm on FiOS, so that could explain some of the differences we see, although there are some really bad SD channels that I totally avoid watching. Fox Sports is really nasty for the most part!
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post #7609 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 07:55 AM
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Originally Posted by The Natural View Post

Yeah I got my cloth but no screws! What was the number you called to get them sent to you?

Not sure, it was in the manual though..
Sonny
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post #7610 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 08:10 AM
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Originally Posted by jvcjbl View Post

Definitely cool!!!! I have had my Velodyne CT-150 rotting in the closet for the last year due to my temporary living situation... this gave me a reason to dig it out and hook it up. I will say it adds some needed bottom end to the tv... but the tv has no where near the line drive to effectively run this sub. I played some bass heavy rap music and it was overly punchy due to lack of power... This sub is obnoxiously loud at 1/2 gain... to get any good volume out of it I have to damn near full gain the amp... you can tell this feature was an after thought... Just my $.02 YMMV

Well Mine sounds great. Hits on the explosions and crashes. I don't feel it lacks at all. At least for what it is.
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post #7611 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by sotagear View Post

Sorry, I didn't want to get into the specifics about that display in this thread, since this is the Kuro thread, but here ya go. I tried to experiment with the 58" 800u because I felt like it just didn't have the contrast as viewed in the stores. So I brought my own Bluray disc in that I was familiar with, connected directly to the panel with a Panny BR player and had him turn the lights down fairly low in the showroom. I felt that the THX setting was OK, but a bit lifeless, regardless of how I adjusted that. I tried the custom and standard modes with every setting I could throw at it and it looked fine, but not as sharp as I had hoped. It looked noisier than I expected, and more importantly, like there was a slight haze over the display. This is not how I remembered that same disk with my dialed in XBR4. While I don't expect the punch of a high quality LCD, I did expect better from my hour long tweaking. (BTW, I also did this same thing with a local over the air HD broadcast the day before, which is why I went back with my own disc.) Now maybe this is exactly what you can dial out of it with a proper calibration, but I tried every way possible on every preset and couldn't get that haze to go away. Just expected to get a tack sharp signal out of this and any display at the top of their game.

Of course, that worried me about the Pioneer since they always looked even more dull than the Pannys and Samsungs in stores.

Did the Pioneer, that you weren't able to adjust, look similar to the Panasonic in THX mode? If so, it was most likely set to Movie, the least saturated and warmest setting. In my home, which is never pitch black, Blu Ray movies with Movie mode look amazing, with plenty of pop when it's supposed to be there, and very natural skin tones. I commented earlier in the thread about watching an episode of CSI, with all of the vegas lights at night reflecting off a car windshield, and finding the saturation just spot on in Movie mode. I hit pause and flipped through the other settings, and after that, Movie looked comparatively dull but still the most natural.

You also mentioned that you've been impressed with 5020s you've seen. I don't believe there should be any material difference between the 50 and 60 Pioneers in terms of color accuracy, vibrancy, etc.
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post #7612 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by ChicagoPhil View Post

Did the Pioneer, that you weren't able to adjust, look similar to the Panasonic in THX mode? If so, it was most likely set to Movie, the least saturated and warmest setting. In my home, which is never pitch black, Blu Ray movies with Movie mode look amazing, with plenty of pop when it's supposed to be there, and very natural skin tones. I commented earlier in the thread about watching an episode of CSI, with all of the vegas lights at night reflecting off a car windshield, and finding the saturation just spot on in Movie mode. I hit pause and flipped through the other settings, and after that, Movie looked comparatively dull but still the most natural.

You also mentioned that you've been impressed with 5020s you've seen. I don't believe there should be any material difference between the 50 and 60 Pioneers in terms of color accuracy, vibrancy, etc.

Actually, I'm not sure what all the Pioneers were set to at all the different stores but when I finally got someone to attempt to adjust a 6020 I noticed they had it on Optimum, not movie mode. Then I asked him to change the mode and he said they always run them at Optimum and he wouldn't change it. This was at Magnolia's.
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post #7613 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Sonnydigs View Post

Not sure, it was in the manual though..
Sonny

Called this morning, screws are on the way! I thought about asking for another cloth too but didn't want to be greedy
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post #7614 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by The Natural View Post

Called this morning, screws are on the way! I thought about asking for another cloth too but didn't want to be greedy

It happens every once in a while that they do not put screws in the box. Also, you could have easily received another cloth. Did they next day or 2 day the screws for you?
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post #7615 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Marde View Post

I own the same TV Stand, so let me chime in and try to help. Unfortunately, I do not own the 5020 -yet. Despite this, I have what might be some good advice. Most Important, is to make sure the M8 or whatever screws are going to do the job properly. First, thread the screws into the 5020 -by hand- to insure proper threading. Lightly screw them in all the way, noting how far they insert into the TV, then remove the screws. Next, pass the screws into the vertical support bar, and note how far the screw extends past the support bar, because this is how much screw length you will be inserting into the TV. Is the screw too long -or- too short? Make sure that the screw will be long enuf to get at least 6 to 8 threads deep into the TV insert nut, and also not too long! Bummer for me, none of the included screws was the right length, so I had to make a trip to the local hardware store. With regard the the position of the vertical support bars; you would first want to position them in the middle of the TV. If you want to make a height adjustment, you can do it without, or with little concern about hurting your 5020. The hanging design is placing the weight load mostly on the screws and TV inserts, not the bar top -or- bottom of the bar, as it rests on the back of TV. I would not recommend mounting the bars using the top most, or bottom most available screw holes tho. Try sticking to only "a few holes up, or a few holes down" from the middle point of the vertical bar(s). When tightening these screws, be sure to take care and not try to torque them too hard, it is a TV, not a car.

If you lay your 5020 face down, it will activate an internal speaker that repeats "what-you-doing!" untill you return it to vertical. I believe this is an exclusive design to Pioneer, and works without the TV plugged in.

On the TV I did recently, I mounted the vertical bars, then disconnected the mounting hardware of the Base, then a 3rd man pulled the base off, while the 2 man lift team hung the TV.

Thanks for the great info! I'm thinking I need to con . . . errr . . . ask at least one more of my friends to come help me move next week.
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post #7616 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by sotagear View Post

Sorry, I didn't want to get into the specifics about that display in this thread, since this is the Kuro thread, but here ya go. I tried to experiment with the 58" 800u because I felt like it just didn't have the contrast as viewed in the stores. So I brought my own Bluray disc in that I was familiar with, connected directly to the panel with a Panny BR player and had him turn the lights down fairly low in the showroom. I felt that the THX setting was OK, but a bit lifeless, regardless of how I adjusted that. I tried the custom and standard modes with every setting I could throw at it and it looked fine, but not as sharp as I had hoped. It looked noisier than I expected, and more importantly, like there was a slight haze over the display. This is not how I remembered that same disk with my dialed in XBR4. While I don't expect the punch of a high quality LCD, I did expect better from my hour long tweaking. (BTW, I also did this same thing with a local over the air HD broadcast the day before, which is why I went back with my own disc.) Now maybe this is exactly what you can dial out of it with a proper calibration, but I tried every way possible on every preset and couldn't get that haze to go away. Just expected to get a tack sharp signal out of this and any display at the top of their game.

Of course, that worried me about the Pioneer since they always looked even more dull than the Pannys and Samsungs in stores.

I've never experienced any noise issue or hazy display on my set at home. However, there was some noise on the pio 6020 @ bestbuy displaying a demo BD. I'm not sure if it was the disc or the fact that they extend the video to ~15 displays. The optimum mode has plenty of punch for normal cable channel viewing, but for movies, I prefer the movie mode. Yes it is a bit dull compared to the optimum mode, but I think it best suits the mood for a dark room movie watching. I also find the pionner to have a very sharp picture. You can check out some screen shots from the kuro @ the picture thread and see if that helps .
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=920011
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post #7617 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 10:37 AM
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Just received my 5020 this morning. I will only get a few hours of break-in before the Super Bowl but have to watch the game with it.
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post #7618 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexInvision View Post

It happens every once in a while that they do not put screws in the box. Also, you could have easily received another cloth. Did they next day or 2 day the screws for you?

5 days I'm in no rush to receive them anyways, not like I need the speakers I was just wanted to put them on to cover up the skinny legs on the stand.

Anyone know if the cloth provided is washing machine safe?
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post #7619 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walkoflea View Post

Just received my 5020 this morning. I will only get a few hours of break-in before the Super Bowl but have to watch the game with it.

Don't worry about it, you won't hurt a thing. I did nothing formal to break in my 6020, other than to avoid torch mode and having static images on the screen for too long at a time. The PQ undoubtedly improves after a certain number of hours are on the display but it's not chopped liver right out of the box.
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post #7620 of 15008 Old 01-30-2009, 12:21 PM
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I see that the 5020 is presently on sale for some excellent prices in the $2000range. My only hesitation on this panel is the "inaccurate primary colors" and the "lack of picture controls" noted on 2 reviews including CNET. Would these issues really change my mind and lets say buy a panasonic 800 or 850U or even consider the Elite?
Thanks!
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Reply Plasma Flat Panel Displays

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Pioneer , Pioneer Pdp 5020fd 50 Inch 1080p Kuro Plasma Hdtv , Pioneer Pdp 6020fd 60 Inch Class Kuro Plasma Hdtv
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