The Official PANASONIC PZ850u thread - All sizes (settings, feedback, etc...) - Page 40 - AVS Forum
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post #1171 of 1862 Old 03-05-2009, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webapalooza View Post

I've tried watching the same scenes on both 48Hz and 60Hz modes to see if I can discern any appreciable differences, and I just don't see it. It doesn't matter what the content is, I just don't see a real difference. Maybe my eyes are failing me, but the only difference that I do see is a noticeable (and annoying) flicker on very bright scenes in 60Hz mode.

I thought maybe 48Hz would at least smooth out panning shots or birds flying across the screen or scrolling text (like in the end credits of a movie), but there's no detectable difference to my eye. I just tried it again the other night with the end credits of "Close Encounters of the Third Kind" on Blu-ray, which has white text on a black outer space background of stars. Both 48Hz and 60Hz show noticeable judder of the credits as they chug their way up the screen.

Am I missing something? Because I'm just not seeing the advantage of 48Hz mode over 60Hz mode.

Well I must admit I havent tried it with the text portion yet.......and I am so expert by any means. I didnt compare it to the 60hz yet, just ran it on the 48 because I thought it would be better??? But I am still learning about it, and I will try some more A-B test from future movie rentals........so in the end maybe its my eyes thinking its better but its not??? I am just stoked about the quality of this set!
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post #1172 of 1862 Old 03-05-2009, 01:57 PM
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Ok can I ask a dumb question here guys? I just purchased my 46850U... got it yesterday looks great but for some reason after messing with some settings on my HTPC (in the Nvidia control panel for my geforce 8800GTX) the picture isn't as crisp or sharp/detailed and the HD doesn't 'pop' as it did before I did any changes. I'm not sure if it's a placebo affect or what but I didn't realize their was so much into 'curing' or 'breaking in' these TV's. From what I've read you should put it on standard mode and all settings below 50 for 200+ hours... Well I definitely haven't done this and I hope I haven't ruined the TV... I was playing around with all the picture settings last night (standard, studio ref, vivid, game) so I definitely haven't done the suggested 'break in' with all low settings... So my question is what should I do now? I've seen people talk about a 'break in' DVD etc... should I get one of these and run it? Is breaking it in really that important? So far the only 'break in' I've done is put it in studio ref mode and I have been running a movie (Wall-E 1080p) and left it looping for about 36 hours so far). Also which settings should I set in the options and service menus for absolutely best picture quality? I want to get the best possibly picture quality that I can out of this thing so I do want to do what will help me achieve that.... I've also noticed that my movies seem 'jittery' or 'jumpy' on this TV where before on my 1080i Hitachi they were smooth... is there something I can do about this? Kinda seems the the video is a bit behind the audio but it wasn't like that on my other tv... ANYHOW I guess all this can be summed up in 'Hey guys I just bought a new 46PZ850u, Now what?' LOL... Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
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post #1173 of 1862 Old 03-05-2009, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rscba70 View Post

To start out, the TH-50PZ850U is OMG good right out of the box (especially compared with my old Samsung). I am looking forward to tweeaking the picture later.

For now, I have 2 questions. First, any thoughts on whether or not to buy an extended warranty ($450+/- from BB). While I came by this set as the result of my previous extended warranty I have more confidence in the technology at this point. Anyway, I am looking for opinions.

Second, I see a lot of references to a break-in dvd. I did not receive much more that the remote and manual with the TV. Was there supposed to be a break-in dvd with the units?

Thx

I bought my Mack 3 year extended warranty IN-HOME repair for TV's less than 1700........I got a great deal on it as well......$119! I would gladly pay 40 a year to keep peace of mind, just hope I dont piss my girl off one day and she takes a bat to it, in which case the warranty would be void!!! Save yourself money and get a trustworthy one online. Mack is a great company from what I heard, there are others as well. But if you dont like getting raped then stay clear from BB man!
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post #1174 of 1862 Old 03-05-2009, 10:00 PM
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Any ideas guys?
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post #1175 of 1862 Old 03-06-2009, 03:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

Any ideas guys?

Exactly what settings did you "mess with" in the Nvidia Control Panel? Did you change the resolution? I read your post and I see "I messed with my video card settings, the video is not good, so it must be the TV", which is screwy logic.
As far as breaking in, just keep your picutre brightness and sharpness below 50. Avoid "vivid" and use the standard or movie setting.
Is the HTPC output via HDMI, component, or VGA? Any adapters present in the connection?
Try these settings on the TV:

PM:

Picture - +50
Brightness - +47
Color - +50
Tint - 0
Sharp - 50
CT - Warm
CM - Off
DCC - Off
C.A.T.S - Off

Pro Settings:

PB - Low
CE - Off
GA - Mid
BE - 0

W/B high R - -11
W/B high B - 0
W/B low R - +1
W/B low B - +1
AGC - Off

Advance Picture

All Off
Black Level - Light
24p - 60hz
HDS - 2
Then adjust your Nvidia output for the best video.
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post #1176 of 1862 Old 03-06-2009, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mesickstan View Post

________________________________________
This display includes a time counter in the service menu. Here's how to access
1. Enter Service Menu (Hold Vol. - down on the TV while pressing the INFO button on the remote 3 times).
2. Press the {2} button on the remote to see SRV-TOOL.
3. Press the {OK} button. A blue grid will appear with the following information.
TD2Mictocode: 81c00011
Flash ROM: 1-227E
PTCT :00.00.00.00.00
4. Cursor down to the PTCT :00.00.00.00.00 line and then cursor over to the right to highlight the empty box.
5. Press and hold the {MUTE} button on the remote for 3 seconds.
The TIME / COUNT info will be displayed in Hours and Minutes of Operation.
6. To exit, press and hold the {POWER} button on the TV for 2 seconds.

The display will re-start by itself.

Thanks again, but it still didn't work for me. I can get to the blue grid in step 3, but I never see the "SRV-TOOL" in step 2. I also can't "cursor down" to the PTCT line -- there is no cursor to move on my screen. I tried every which way, but nothing happened. So I backed out before I did anything I wasn't supposed to do. I'll just wait for the ISF calibration rather than risk doing any damage on my own. Thanks anyway!
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post #1177 of 1862 Old 03-06-2009, 06:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webapalooza View Post

Thanks again, but it still didn't work for me. I can get to the blue grid in step 3, but I never see the "SRV-TOOL" in step 2. I also can't "cursor down" to the PTCT line -- there is no cursor to move on my screen. I tried every which way, but nothing happened. So I backed out before I did anything I wasn't supposed to do. I'll just wait for the ISF calibration rather than risk doing any damage on my own. Thanks anyway!

There's really no cursor, just a highlighted box that you move around with the directional pad on the remote. Works for me on my 46PZ850U and my folk's 42 and 50PX80U.
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post #1178 of 1862 Old 03-06-2009, 07:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

Ok can I ask a dumb question here guys? I just purchased my 46850U... got it yesterday looks great but for some reason after messing with some settings on my HTPC (in the Nvidia control panel for my geforce 8800GTX) the picture isn't as crisp or sharp/detailed and the HD doesn't 'pop' as it did before I did any changes. I'm not sure if it's a placebo affect or what but I didn't realize their was so much into 'curing' or 'breaking in' these TV's. From what I've read you should put it on standard mode and all settings below 50 for 200+ hours... Well I definitely haven't done this and I hope I haven't ruined the TV... I was playing around with all the picture settings last night (standard, studio ref, vivid, game) so I definitely haven't done the suggested 'break in' with all low settings... .

Plasmas are a bit like a new car -- it's best to be gentle on it and drive it around town normally for the first few thousand miles, rather than taking it on a 3-day roadtrip right off the lot. It helps expose the engine to a lot of variation, which helps to break it in and get the parts moving smoothly in unison.

The phosphors in a plasma are sort of the same way. They need to "bake" (for lack of a better term) for 100-200 hours so that they become more resilient to IR.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

So my question is what should I do now? I've seen people talk about a 'break in' DVD etc... should I get one of these and run it?

If you ask me, I would just download my free break-in images and save them to an SD memory card, then run them in slideshow mode with Picture settings around 40%-50% and the slide intervals set to 15 seconds or less and set it to "repeat". Let it run overnight every night for a few weeks, and you should be good. I also like to vary the slide intervals each night, so that they vary anywhere between 1 second and 15 seconds on different nights.

Here's the link:

http://www.webapalooza.com/plasma

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

Is breaking it in really that important?

That's the $64,000 question, but the general consensus seems to be a resounding "yes".

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

So far the only 'break in' I've done is put it in studio ref mode and I have been running a movie (Wall-E 1080p) and left it looping for about 36 hours so far).

Ouch. You definitely do NOT want to use Studio Ref mode for break-in; use Custom mode with everything set to 40%-50%. And only loop a movie if you've stretched the image so that it completely fills the screen (no black bars). Otherwise you may be doing more harm than good.

I personally wouldn't use a DVD to break in my TV, even if it were set to loop. You could experience a disc error, and then you could have a menu or error message on the screen for hours on end before you ever noticed it. Slideshows off a memory card seem to be a safer option.

You can also run the scrolling bar every so often -- that seems to do a good job of "erasing" any visible remnants of IR that may occur. The worse the IR, the longer you would need to run the scrolling bar.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

Also which settings should I set in the options and service menus for absolutely best picture quality? I want to get the best possibly picture quality that I can out of this thing so I do want to do what will help me achieve that....

Try buying an optimizer DVD, like the ones from DVE, Aria, or ISF/Monster.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

I've also noticed that my movies seem 'jittery' or 'jumpy' on this TV where before on my 1080i Hitachi they were smooth... is there something I can do about this? Kinda seems the the video is a bit behind the audio but it wasn't like that on my other tv...

Hmmm... not sure about that one. I've never seen any jittery or jumpy images on mine. Did you try switching between 48Hz and 60Hz modes to see what looks best to you? Some people prefer 48Hz, but I think it flickers too much so I leave mine set at 60Hz. But whatever works for you is what you should use.
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post #1179 of 1862 Old 03-06-2009, 09:07 PM
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well after scoring an 850u 50" floor model i dropped it off at home last week went away came back and while watching this amazing picture wed nite.... bam girlfriend says hey do you see those lines on the tv ? i'm off to the side an say no so i go up to the tv and if you look straight ahead i see them, 2- 4 inch long lines in the middle of screen man i get in close run my finger sure enough scratches! off i go back to store thank god i plea my case and he offers me a sammy 50a550 1300 done so we gonna give this one a ride, p.s. this one's new sealed in box. well take care guys and good luck heading over to the 50a550 thread be well and thanks for your help1
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post #1180 of 1862 Old 03-06-2009, 11:22 PM
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So does anyone know if entering the service menu voids your warranty???
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post #1181 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 04:40 AM
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if your just checking the hours it shouldnt. they have no way of knowing. but i still have a diff of opinion. i keep blacks at dark instead of light and the picture is way better.
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post #1182 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 09:45 AM
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In the descriptions for the PZ850U units they specify it has Viera Cast IPTV. Is this something you get if you you have cable or satellite service or do you connect a cable to your internet router/switch.
Thank you
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post #1183 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

From what I've read you should put it on standard mode and all settings below 50 for 200+ hours... Well I definitely haven't done this and I hope I haven't ruined the TV... I was playing around with all the picture settings last night (standard, studio ref, vivid, game) so I definitely haven't done the suggested 'break in' with all low settings... So my question is what should I do now?

I doubt that you have "ruined" the display. Breaking in the new plasma is a routine that goes back to the earliest generations of PDPs when image retention was a definite problem--just as it was for CRT computer displays and TV monitors used woth security cameras.

You and others may find this 2005study from IDC and ISF sponsered by Pioneer interesting. It tests several "myths" about PDPs, using a 24 hour image retention test and a 228 hour accerated aging test. Plasma is compared with other technologies and the black level findings are interesting also.

Most of what is on the web about image retention and break-in is anecdotal -- more in the catagory of folk wisdom than science.
Quote:


.... I've also noticed that my movies seem 'jittery' or 'jumpy' on this TV where before on my 1080i Hitachi they were smooth... is there something I can do about this? Kinda seems the the video is a bit behind the audio but it wasn't like that on my other tv.

Did you check to see if you were set at 48 rather than 60 frames?

The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd.
-Bertrand Russell
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post #1184 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pestocat View Post

In the descriptions for the PZ850U units they specify it has Viera Cast IPTV. Is this something you get if you you have cable or satellite service or do you connect a cable to your internet router/switch.
Thank you

You must connect it to the internet.

Right now it is weather, You Tube, Picassa, and Bloomberg. Soon it will add Amazon on-demand movies (Hopefully, though I wonder about on-board memory for buffering).

The fact that an opinion has been widely held is no evidence whatever that it is not utterly absurd.
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post #1185 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robbyrockets View Post

Well folks here is the final calibration, top to bottom, and all the graphs and charts that go along with it.

Everything looks great!

The setup consisted of the following:

Denon AVR-4308CI Receiver
Panasonic TH-58PZ850U Plasma
Panasonic DMP-BD55K BRPlayer - Video Pic on player USER all 0's.

Blu-ray player was run through the receiver clean, meaning no processing done by the Denon.

HDMI1

Service Menu:

Contrast - 000
Color - 3F
Tint - 03
Sub-Brt - 800

WB-ADJ: CUSTOM

All-Cut - 80
All-Drv - FC
R-Cut - 80
G-Cut - 80
B-Cut - 80
R-Drv - FC
G-Drv - D9
B-Drv - 7D
Format - HD
Method - 03
Color Temp - Warm


PM:

Picture - +50
Brightness - +47
Color - +50
Tint - 0
Sharp - 50
CT - Warm
CM - Off
DCC - Off
C.A.T.S - Off

Pro Settings:

PB - Low
CE - Off
GA - Mid
BE - 0

W/B high R - -11
W/B high B - 0
W/B low R - +1
W/B low B - +1
AGC - Off

Advance Picture

All Off
Black Level - Light
24p - 60hz
HDS - 2

Best gamma I could pull while still achieving an excellent black level was 2.10, target was 2.2, not bad in the end.
Picture is stunning!

The service menu adjustment under CUSTOM is my friends factory default THX setting from his 800 series.

As you can tell, once I applied his THX setting, the changes were far less drastic in the pro menu.

The colors pop more at the default settings so I left them as is.

Less IR with these changes.

I haven't tried these settings yet but I'm about to... I just had a few questions:

1. It seems these are pretty much excepted as the best settings for picture quality so far... That being said, should I even bother paying for someone to come out and calibrate my tv if I use these settings?

2. I just got my TV a few days ago. Is it too early to use these settings? Should I wait until the 'break-in' period to use these settings?

3. Is there a way to tell how many hours your tv has logged so far?
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post #1186 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 01:08 PM
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mrt2: "3. Is there a way to tell how many hours your tv has logged so far?"

Just look ^ post #1176
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post #1187 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webapalooza View Post

Plasmas are a bit like a new car -- it's best to be gentle on it and drive it around town normally for the first few thousand miles, rather than taking it on a 3-day roadtrip right off the lot. It helps expose the engine to a lot of variation, which helps to break it in and get the parts moving smoothly in unison.

The phosphors in a plasma are sort of the same way. They need to "bake" (for lack of a better term) for 100-200 hours so that they become more resilient to IR.



If you ask me, I would just download my free break-in images and save them to an SD memory card, then run them in slideshow mode with Picture settings around 40%-50% and the slide intervals set to 15 seconds or less and set it to "repeat". Let it run overnight every night for a few weeks, and you should be good. I also like to vary the slide intervals each night, so that they vary anywhere between 1 second and 15 seconds on different nights.

Here's the link:

http://www.webapalooza.com/plasma


Thanks for the detailed responses dude. I really appreciate you taking the time for the guidance. My video problem I believe is fixed. There was an apparent issue with the 'render' method chosen for my video player... Once I changed to a different render method it appears to be running much more smooth.
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post #1188 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 02:19 PM
 
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Does anyone have some screen shots of a calibrated 58pz850u? I'm guessing a greater ability for perfect calibration is the reason you choose the 850 over 800?
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post #1189 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

1. It seems these are pretty much excepted as the best settings for picture quality so far... That being said, should I even bother paying for someone to come out and calibrate my tv if I use these settings?

They give a real and easily noticeable improvement over the best 'stock' settings (i.e. CNET).
I doubt any calibrator could make additional real and noticeable - to the naked eye - improvement. It's just the law of diminishing returns. An instrument and maybe a handful of the best calibrators might see a difference, but you or I never would. Try these before spending the money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

2. I just got my TV a few days ago. Is it too early to use these settings? Should I wait until the 'break-in' period to use these settings?

Nope. break in is subjective on modern plasmas. Many will insist it exists, and that the display gets brighter, but I don't think there is real proof. I did it, I think there may have been a bit of difference and possibly some additional 'burn in' protection, but I couldn't prove any of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt2 View Post

3. Is there a way to tell how many hours your tv has logged so far?

Yes, scroll back a few posts.
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post #1190 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 02:50 PM
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Is there a RJ-45 connector? I don't see it listed on the list of inputs/outputs. Do you set an IP address or get it automatically from network DHCP. Can I also view local material on IP network?
Thank you






Quote:
Originally Posted by trekguy View Post

You must connect it to the internet.

Right now it is weather, You Tube, Picassa, and Bloomberg. Soon it will add Amazon on-demand movies (Hopefully, though I wonder about on-board memory for buffering).

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post #1191 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

Does anyone have some screen shots of a calibrated 58pz850u? I'm guessing a greater ability for perfect calibration is the reason you choose the 850 over 800?

I doubt a picture can relay the differences accurately. The 850 may not be as technically correct as the THX setting of the 800 out of the box, but the additional control ability can easily make it so, and IMHO surpass the 800.
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post #1192 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pestocat View Post

Is there a RJ-45 connector?

Yes
Quote:
Originally Posted by pestocat View Post

Do you set an IP address or get it automatically from network DHCP.

It will obtain one automatically, and you can also 'tell' it to renew / get one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pestocat View Post

Can I also view local material on IP network?

No
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post #1193 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webapalooza View Post

Thanks again, but it still didn't work for me. I can get to the blue grid in step 3, but I never see the "SRV-TOOL" in step 2. I also can't "cursor down" to the PTCT line -- there is no cursor to move on my screen. I tried every which way, but nothing happened. So I backed out before I did anything I wasn't supposed to do. I'll just wait for the ISF calibration rather than risk doing any damage on my own. Thanks anyway!

You need to keep pressing the "2" button until the SRV-TOOL shows up. I'm not positive, but I think it is 6 times.
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post #1194 of 1862 Old 03-07-2009, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammie View Post

You need to keep pressing the "2" button until the SRV-TOOL shows up. I'm not positive, but I think it is 6 times.

You only need to press 2 once or 1 six times.
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post #1195 of 1862 Old 03-08-2009, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mesickstan View Post

You only need to press 2 once or 1 six times.

Thanks for that clarification.
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post #1196 of 1862 Old 03-08-2009, 08:45 AM
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someone had mentioned this earlier but it never got answered, does entering the service menu and adjusting settings yourself void the manufacturer warranty?

I'm surprised the service menu is even made available without a special access to the customer, my old panasonic plasma has no such menu.

also, I had a question about the preset modes vs. custom video settings. It seems studio ref looks great even out of the box. When you go and change the settings however, are the "custom" settings like a separate mode that you change independently of the other settings, retaining say, studio ref as is default, or do the custom settings get applied on-top of another setting, almost as if you're starting at studio ref as a baseline and tweaking the settings from there, I'm guessing/hoping that if it's the latter that there is a simple way to restore the defaults on the preset modes?

one last dumb question, I saw mentioned earlier that the SD card needs to be formatted for camera use. I own neither an SD card capable camera or an SD reader for a computer. The only SD item I own is a Wii which is fairly limited for file management. Any suggestions on what I should, cheaply, to get an SD card with the break-in images on my soon to be new 850U? I'd prefer that to the DVD route for the obvious benefits, but I'm a tad hardware limited.

Thanks for the help guys.
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post #1197 of 1862 Old 03-08-2009, 08:52 AM
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another side question, I don't currently have any sort of line conditioner for my setup.

I've had good experience with them drastically cleaning up the cable connection in the past and figured I should get one. However, without my BB employee discount to help me this time, I'm definitely not dropping multiple hundreds on a monster line conditioner that I really don't need.

Is there any brand or online location that you guys have experience with for good quality without dropping a huge was of cash? I'd like to spend no more than $100 on one.

Thanks
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post #1198 of 1862 Old 03-08-2009, 10:39 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oatmeal769 View Post

I doubt a picture can relay the differences accurately. The 850 may not be as technically correct as the THX setting of the 800 out of the box, but the additional control ability can easily make it so, and IMHO surpass the 800.

How so?
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post #1199 of 1862 Old 03-08-2009, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

How so?

I can only speak for myself, but I've never seen a picture of a display which accurately represents what it is to actually see the same in person. - Especially when comparing subtleties such as color, light and dark, etc.
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post #1200 of 1862 Old 03-10-2009, 01:37 PM
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Hi,

I just got my 50, mounted it on the wall and connected it to my video processor. I am trying to adjust the vertical/horizontal position of the picture while using an HDMI input as that is how my video processor is connected (and the VP generates the overscan screen). As far as I can tell such an adjustment with consumer controls is only possible using the PC input. I assume I have to enter the service menu to do it while using the HDMI inputs. I know how to get into the service menu but I am not familiar with the controls once I'm in there. It is very different than the 50 inch pro panny service menu.

So:

1. Correct that V/H position can only be adjusted from service menu when using HDMI inputs?

2. How to do V/H position adjustment from service menu?

many thanks.
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