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post #4321 of 5279 Old 12-13-2009, 11:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Viper359 View Post

Could I not just assemble the stand, and with my helper to lift, and spotter to align it, lift the tv onto the stand and then secure the screws? Would this not be a much safer way to install this?

Many installers and owners to it that way to avoid laying it down. I've always thought that it's the best way.
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post #4322 of 5279 Old 12-13-2009, 11:35 PM
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...okay, so we liked his work. Perhaps a bit overstated, but close. (Jeff Meier = Umr.)

Jeff came over and calibrated our 141FD.

We purchased it in late July 2009. We were upgrading after 10 years, and hoped everything would come together at approximately the same time. That didn't work out.

We had the panel installed in late September. We set it on Optimum and did not run the break in disc. We only watched hi-def cable and no movies since installation. No stretching needed; only viewed full screen Hi Def.

Jeff came over Saturday afternoon (12/ 12) and immediately found some setting errors. He spent quite a while calibrating with a myriad of equipment. The panel immediately looked better (i.e., a greater spectrum of color and more color depth). He does a visual test after the instrument calibration, and found it necessary to make a couple minor tweaks in one mode.

I'm pretty deep technically, so I was able to have Jeff articulate details of the process and easily follow his explanations.

Today, as we watched football (mostly), Julie at several points (during all 3 games) just asked me to pause and said how much she enjoyed the calibration and how nice it was for the family. She raved about the picture and the variances from the previous weekend. Can't get much better endorsement than that. Before the calibration, she thought the whole process would be a waste of time as she liked what we had just fine. Thank God one of us is technical.

Jeff is a really fun person with great interpersonal skills. I'd hang with him on the lake and have a cocktail any time. Julie concurs.
_____________
Plus, I want to add, I used Jeff's A/V consultation service. Jeff was with me every step of the way as I tried to upgrade to something that would fit my environment and still be within my (very loose) budget. He suggested so many different products at an incredible range of price points...all great values no matter what the price.

I upgrade every 10 years or so. What I began with is somewhat irrelevant after 10 years. What I wound up with (well, not everything is here) is more important. Without going into all the rhyme and reason about how and why, this is what we wound up with: (This is a 5.2 system for a multi-purpose room, not a dedicated theater.)

Speakers: A pair of HT3s and an HTC from Salk Signature Sound (still being built). A pair of Klipsch KS-525-THX for the rears. Subwoofers: Two Martin Logan Decent I.

Processor: A Denon AVP A1HDCI.

Amplification: A McIntosh MC303 for the L+R+C and an Anthem MCA 20 for the rears.

Source: Oppo BPD-83. Other stuff to come.

The Salks are still being built and the MLs won't be here until later in the week. Jeff came over and help me connect AND configure everything, including helping me lift the 155 lb. Mac amp onto the shelf. Stand up guy.

We can't be happier. Jeff is coming back in April to do the audio.

I'd like to tell everyone to be careful about calibration. Sometimes timing and/or need will override other variables. You can have a perfect calibration with Jeff, or you can have convenient. (I'm biased, of course, and there probably are 2-3 other folks out there of Jeff's caliber.)

I hope you enjoy your 141, one of the last flat panels capable of truly accurate color.

Regards,

Chris & Julie
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post #4323 of 5279 Old 12-13-2009, 11:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper359 View Post

It is a little late, but hoping some of you owners are still awake. My 141FD is arriving tomorrow, with the optional stand. The manual I read online says to lay the tv flat to install the stand. Is this a very smart idea? I thought that should never be done to a tv.

Could I not just assemble the stand, and with my helper to lift, and spotter to align it, lift the tv onto the stand and then secure the screws? Would this not be a much safer way to install this?

I am just concerned about laying this tv flat on the ground, and I do not have a table big enough to support the glass panel. My tables are all too small, and this would leave the ends hanging over the side, and thus the glass on the unsupported parts could buckle and crack.


My 101's manual suggested laying it flat, and I felt the same about it as you do. Two of us lowered it vertically while a third secured the screws -- no problem, and probably the easier way to do it.
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post #4324 of 5279 Old 12-13-2009, 11:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctouhey View Post

(Jeff Meier = Umr.)

Jeff came over and calibrated our 141FD.

Thanks for your calibration report. I've added it to the flat panel (Post#2) list that's linked at the bottom of my post.

Be sure to let us know how the audio calibration goes.
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post #4325 of 5279 Old 12-13-2009, 11:48 PM
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Thanks guys. I am not going to risk cracking this glass or worse. Since getting a replacement would be next to impossible now, with such a short supply up here in Canada. This is after Pioneer Canada bought a large lot from the US Parent Co.
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post #4326 of 5279 Old 12-13-2009, 11:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper359 View Post


Could I not just assemble the stand, and with my helper to lift, and spotter to align it, lift the tv onto the stand and then secure the screws? Would this not be a much safer way to install this?

Yes, or even better -- with the panel supported -- have the stand person slide the stand into the panel and put a bolt in each side, then set it down and put in the other bolts. That avoids the binding problem.
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post #4327 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper359 View Post

It is a little late, but hoping some of you owners are still awake. My 141FD is arriving tomorrow, with the optional stand. The manual I read online says to lay the tv flat to install the stand. Is this a very smart idea? I thought that should never be done to a tv.

Could I not just assemble the stand, and with my helper to lift, and spotter to align it, lift the tv onto the stand and then secure the screws? Would this not be a much safer way to install this?

I am just concerned about laying this tv flat on the ground, and I do not have a table big enough to support the glass panel. My tables are all too small, and this would leave the ends hanging over the side, and thus the glass on the unsupported parts could buckle and crack.

Yes do not lay it down!

Mine got delivered this past Saturday and I placed the stand on the carpet and they lifted the monitor off the box and placed it over the stand and secured the screws, then lifted it up to my entertainment center.
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post #4328 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper359 View Post

Could I not just assemble the stand, and with my helper to lift, and spotter to align it, lift the tv onto the stand and then secure the screws? Would this not be a much safer way to install this?

Exactly how we did our 141 back in June. Only no spotter needed - we lifted the 141 straight from the box onto the stand which was sitting on a tall library table, then about 60 seconds later (after plugging in all the cables) it went about a foot straight up, onto the wall. Never even bolted the TV to the stand! So if we ever move and cannot wall mount the 141, we have a 99.9% brand new stand waiting. I'd hate to calc the $/hr usage that we got from the stand...

FWIW, we had a holiday party this past weekend, and some people were watching a hockey game on CBUT hi-def. Many people commented on how great the picture looked - even I was amazed at the PQ for the Comcast cable feed. I had the 141 on ISF-Day mode*, which looked great even with the lights on full in the room.

* HELP NEEDED:
I can't remember if a 1080i/60 signal uses the exact same calibration settings that were performed by Michael Chen when he calibrated this input using a 1080p/24 signal from my Pioneer BDP-51FD**. I have yet to hook up the laptop to confirm this. Can someone jog my memory if I need to copy my 1080p/24 settings to 1080p/60, 1080i, 720p, etc for all my ISF modes? I only use Input #8 on the 141 as all sources are routed thru an Onkyo TX-SR805 set to pass-through...

** Of course, I have since upgraded to the Oppo BD player, so might need to get Michael back for a tuneup!

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post #4329 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 02:19 PM
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all you have to do is select the isf mode you want for every resolution. you don't need to copy the isf settings for every resolution. i asked d-nice the same question when he calibrated my set.

i love this monitor - it is my window to the world.

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post #4330 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by bouhhan View Post

all you have to do is select the isf mode you want for every resolution. you don't need to copy the isf settings for every resolution. i asked d-nice the same question when he calibrated my set.

Is it really set up this way? I had the Oppo set to Source Direct, so most Blu-ray discs come out at 1080p/24. I did play one regular DVD earlier in the day (Brian Setzer's Christmas Extravaganza) and noticed the picture looked absolutely horrible - lots of ringing around most objects. The 141's info button showed it receiving a 480i signal (& ISF-Day), which makes sense due to the Oppo's Source Direct mode.

When I changed the Oppo's output resolution to 1080p, the PQ was greatly improved on the 141, which showed it now receiving a 1080p signal (& ISF-Day). The ringing around objects was greatly diminished. Not sure if this is proof that the Oppo's upscaling abilities trumps that of the 141? Or if I need to input the same 1080p/24 ISF settings for all other input signals?

Since this is my first DVD played on the Oppo I wasn't sure what to expect. I'll have to go back thru this thread and see what settings Sillysally has his Oppo and 141 set for...

EDIT - btw, we have similar systems, with the Onkyo and Polk speakers - though I have the RTi70/CSi40/RCi80 line from a few gens back. At least I'm current with their microPro 3000 sub - I now enjoy a better "EMP burst" experience from Transformers 2!

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post #4331 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 03:31 PM
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not sure if we understood each other there - the isf settings need to be dialed into each input separately.

once they are in an input, all you need to do is pick the isf setting you'd like to watch, for each resolution.

am i making sense?

this is regardless of components.

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post #4332 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bouhhan View Post

not sure if we understood each other there - the isf settings need to be dialed into each input separately.

once they are in an input, all you need to do is pick the isf setting you'd like to watch, for each resolution.

am i making sense?

this is regardless of components.

Yes, I understand "per input", since there are eight of them available - though I'm just using Input #8. I know that the regular AV modes (Pure, etc) can have different settings per signal input (1080/24, 1080/60, 720. etc) for the same 141 input. IIRC, it will store the last eight settings that were input, otherwise it replaces the oldest setting.

I just can't remember if the same applies for the ISF modes, at least in terms of input signal resolution for each individual 141 input. I guess I'll just use ControlCal when I have some extra time and check the current ISF settings by cycling thru all the resolutions from the Oppo and recalling the settings via ControlCal.

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post #4333 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 07:40 PM
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sorry if i'm being confusing. if you're just using input 8 and you already have the isf modes set up then you're all set. all you need to do is choose the mode you want to watch in the menu. for input 8 isf modes will have the same values no matter what resolution. you just need to pick day, night or auto.

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post #4334 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by mak99 View Post

I just can't remember if the same applies for the ISF modes, at least in terms of input signal resolution for each individual 141 input.

The ISF modes are per input, regardless of the input signal. In your case, Input #8's ISF Day settings will apply to any and all signals on that input.

(Bouhan beat me to it )
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post #4335 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctouhey View Post

...Jeff came over Saturday afternoon (12/ 12) and immediately found some setting errors. He spent quite a while calibrating with a myriad of equipment. The panel immediately looked better (i.e., a greater spectrum of color and more color depth). He does a visual test after the instrument calibration, and found it necessary to make a couple minor tweaks in one mode..... We can't be happier. Jeff is coming back in April to do the audio....

Thanks Chris and Julie.

I will be in the South East US in January if anyone else would like to have their system operating at optimum conditions.
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post #4336 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by bouhhan View Post

sorry if i'm being confusing. if you're just using input 8 and you already have the isf modes set up then you're all set. all you need to do is choose the mode you want to watch in the menu. for input 8 isf modes will have the same values no matter what resolution. you just need to pick day, night or auto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdbimmer View Post

The ISF modes are per input, regardless of the input signal. In your case, Input #8's ISF Day settings will apply to any and all signals on that input.

(Bouhan beat me to it )

Thanks to both of you for the confirmation. Saves me some time with ControlCal...but of course, the engineer in me will still check this out to satisfy my curiosity!

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post #4337 of 5279 Old 12-14-2009, 08:15 PM
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Got my 141fd. Let it warm up to room temp. All is well, picture is stunning. I do have a question. Is it normal for the fans to not be running? I have yet to see my fans on.
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post #4338 of 5279 Old 12-15-2009, 07:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Viper359 View Post

Got my 141fd. Let it warm up to room temp. All is well, picture is stunning. I do have a question. Is it normal for the fans to not be running? I have yet to see my fans on.

I have never noticed my fans on. So even if they do come on they are to silent to hear. Have also monitored the temp around each fan via the web server in the 141 and found the heat to rise then stay at constant levels.
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post #4339 of 5279 Old 12-15-2009, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mak99 View Post

Thanks to both of you for the confirmation. Saves me some time with ControlCal...but of course, the engineer in me will still check this out to satisfy my curiosity!

Or you could use KuroReader to read the settings from the comfort of your couch. Go wireless with one of these : http://www.google.com/products/catal...03&sa=button#p
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post #4340 of 5279 Old 12-15-2009, 09:44 AM
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Vancouver;

Thanks for your input. I am at ease now. Coming from an old Sony 55A20 that was rear projection, you heard a fan every time it was on. I am also not used to the heat the comes from the plasma panel. I walked by it and could feel it. Kinda made me go...wow.

Glad to hear it is normal. Now I just need to tweak the initial settings.

My panel does buzz, and let me tell you, who cares. Again, coming from my rear projection, this thing is quiet as a mouse fart. I will have no issue with the noise it makes. Matches my Roges PVR for noise level when there is no noise from the speakers.

A thank you to everyone on these forums, in both the V10 and all kuro posts! Lots of reading helped me make my purchase.
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post #4341 of 5279 Old 12-15-2009, 10:18 AM - Thread Starter
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Its certainly very normal to feel heat from it when you walk by.
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post #4342 of 5279 Old 12-15-2009, 10:51 AM
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Is there a post in this thread that covers out of the box settings? I am not doing the break in, but I watch 99% HD.

I am trying to find the perfect, out of box, any idiot like myself can do settings.

I use my scientific Atlanta 8300PVR with component cables and my Samsung BDP1400 blu ray player via HDMI.

What I have found so far is controlcal stuff or isf stuff. I would just like some nice settings I can do with the remote until I am ready for a pro to come over and properly calibrate.
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post #4343 of 5279 Old 12-15-2009, 11:03 AM
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check the calibration forums for sillysallys pure mode settings. you have a pm.

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post #4344 of 5279 Old 12-15-2009, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper359 View Post

I would just like some nice settings I can do with the remote until I am ready for a pro to come over and properly calibrate.

Correct settings depend on both your particular panel and you specific environment. I suggest you get the Spears & Munsil HD Benchmark disc. That disc plus a small investment in time will yield a significant benefit. There's an AVS thread about it. Besides guiding you through basic adjustments it will also help you assess your components.
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post #4345 of 5279 Old 12-17-2009, 09:58 AM
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Could someone point me to the correct ControlCal profile purchase for the Signature 141? My brother just purchased this set and I was going to calibrate it with ColorHCFR and my i1 Display LT, but realized maybe at first I'll buy the ControlCal software and just input the D-Nice settings for Day and Night for now to get him probably 90% of the way there.

But for some reason I'm slighly uncertain where to find the correct information on the controlcal site! Seems there is a profile for "non-North American" 141's but not North American 141s? Clearly I haven't had enough coffee! If you could point me to the correct one it would be appreciated!

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post #4346 of 5279 Old 12-17-2009, 12:02 PM
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pbc, PM sent

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post #4347 of 5279 Old 12-17-2009, 02:19 PM
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[quote=RJVR23;17717692]Yes do not lay it down!


I'm curious what the concern is about laying these down flat. The instructions for attaching the WM01 Wall Mounting system tells you (and shows an example) to place it flat on a table with protective material to attach the display side fittings (rails that attach to the TV).

GH
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post #4348 of 5279 Old 12-17-2009, 04:51 PM
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[quote=Gerryh;17739660]
Quote:
Originally Posted by RJVR23 View Post

Yes do not lay it down!


I'm curious what the concern is about laying these down flat. The instructions for attaching the WM01 Wall Mounting system tells you (and shows an example) to place it flat on a table with protective material to attach the display side fittings (rails that attach to the TV).

I laid my 60" display down on a carpeted floor with a sheet under it. If you keep it clean and you're careful to avoid torquing the glass then it's fine.

I think a better option for those with a table top stand is to use that to attach the wall mount hardware without putting the display on it's face. It's not a black and white issue. A lot of professional installers use the table to stand approach.
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post #4349 of 5279 Old 12-17-2009, 06:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mak99 View Post

Is it really set up this way? I had the Oppo set to Source Direct, so most Blu-ray discs come out at 1080p/24. I did play one regular DVD earlier in the day (Brian Setzer's Christmas Extravaganza) and noticed the picture looked absolutely horrible - lots of ringing around most objects. The 141's info button showed it receiving a 480i signal (& ISF-Day), which makes sense due to the Oppo's Source Direct mode.

When I changed the Oppo's output resolution to 1080p, the PQ was greatly improved on the 141, which showed it now receiving a 1080p signal (& ISF-Day). The ringing around objects was greatly diminished. Not sure if this is proof that the Oppo's upscaling abilities trumps that of the 141? Or if I need to input the same 1080p/24 ISF settings for all other input signals?

Since this is my first DVD played on the Oppo I wasn't sure what to expect. I'll have to go back thru this thread and see what settings Sillysally has his Oppo and 141 set for...

EDIT - btw, we have similar systems, with the Onkyo and Polk speakers - though I have the RTi70/CSi40/RCi80 line from a few gens back. At least I'm current with their microPro 3000 sub - I now enjoy a better "EMP burst" experience from Transformers 2!

For DVD film (480i) and your BD-83, set the BD-83 to 1080P, Deep color off (dithered), DVD forced 24 off, 1080p@24 on.
Matter of fact just leave these settings for BD film as well.

As the Oppo BD-83's firmware keeps evolving, it is sometimes helpful to make small changes in these and a few other settings.
Right now I have a BD-83NE and am running bata firmware, all these current settings work well as long as you have updated your Firmware to the official BD-83 firmware.

ss
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post #4350 of 5279 Old 12-17-2009, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

Correct settings depend on both your particular panel and you specific environment. I suggest you get the Spears & Munsil HD Benchmark disc. That disc plus a small investment in time will yield a significant benefit. There's an AVS thread about it. Besides guiding you through basic adjustments it will also help you assess your components.

I would be careful on recommending any calibration disc for the 141.
And yes I have a SM disc, but the only thing I use it for is setting sharpness. However the guide is helpful to understand the meaning of the settings.
I also use a AVS HD 709 disc BD (free) for color patterns only. And a DVE HD Basics BD disc for gray scale patterns. All set to 1080P. Below is a link for AVS.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post12373254

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