Samsung 2009 plasmas - Page 7 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-26-2009, 06:16 PM
Member
 
Carman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Layton, Utah
Posts: 143
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
squint real hard, and press your nose right up against a 42" set and maybe you will notice the difference between 720p and 1080p....Don't believe the 1080p propoganda on smaller sets!!!

HD-DVD & BD Supporter

HD-105
BD-52
Carman24 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-26-2009, 06:21 PM
Member
 
The Hornet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: West Michigan, USA
Posts: 132
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carman24 View Post

squint real hard, and press your nose right up against a 42" set and maybe you will notice the difference between 720p and 1080p....Don't believe the 1080p propoganda on smaller sets!!!

Have any of you, literally compared...say a 42" & 50" set of the same make, and been able to tell the difference? NOT Blu Ray...or maybe so, and been really able to tell one from the other, at say...5 feet?
The Hornet is offline  
Old 02-26-2009, 06:40 PM
"Don't PM Me Bro"
 
RandyWalters's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: El Segundo, Calif
Posts: 17,520
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 109 Post(s)
Liked: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hornet View Post

Have any of you, literally compared...say a 42" & 50" set of the same make, and been able to tell the difference? NOT Blu Ray...or maybe so, and been really able to tell one from the other, at say...5 feet?

I have a 42" 768p Plasma and a 42" 1080p Plasma and i can clearly see a difference at as much as 9 feet with SD and HD content. Most people seem to be able to see the difference at around 7 feet. There is no way i'd ever buy a 768p set again in any size larger than 26".

Randy
TC-P55ST60, TC-P50GT50, TC-P46G10, TH-42PZ700U, TH-42PX50U, HP LC2600N, TiVo Series3, TWC Cisco 8742HDC DVR, Onkyo TX-SR333, URC R40 Remote.
Pic of My A/V setup - http://cdn.avsforum.com/f/f1/900x900..._Img_4867.jpeg
Gallery - http://www.avsforum.com/g/a/2082686/randywalter...
RandyWalters is offline  
Old 02-26-2009, 06:43 PM
Advanced Member
 
BWDinc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Greenville,SC
Posts: 595
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 10
The reason most people say that you cant see the diff is simple. They dont know what the diff is and what to look for. 1080 is great, and yes id say about 26 inch is too small to matter unless you are 3 feet away.
BWDinc is offline  
Old 02-26-2009, 06:46 PM
AVS Special Member
 
StinDaWg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 352 Post(s)
Liked: 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carman24 View Post

squint real hard, and press your nose right up against a 42" set and maybe you will notice the difference between 720p and 1080p....Don't believe the 1080p propoganda on smaller sets!!!

The difference is pretty noticeable at 6-7'. Text/graphics are much sharper and overall the picture is clearer. As an added bonus the 1080p sets usually have newer tech.
StinDaWg is offline  
Old 02-27-2009, 06:58 AM
Member
 
Macguybrazil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Brazil
Posts: 28
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
interesting news about sammy plasma and LCD 2009 here at "homecinemachoice.com" web site:

http://www.homecinemachoice.com/blog...scaler+27+02+0

here:

"Don't bother upscaling your DVDs, Samsung's 2009 range of LCD and plasma TVs will do a much better job than any player. At least that's the company's claim,.........,Essentially, says Samsung, there's no point in buying or using an upscaling DVD with any of the brand's new screens........."

and this is quite interesting:

"...Curiously, the Korean giant says that this year it will separate LED backlit models out from its LCD ranges and sell them under a new 'LED TV' monicker. 'We expect all our LED screens to be displayed away from normal CCFL backlit TVs in high-streets stores,........,
OLED is not commercially viable and I don't think people will confuse the terms. Our LED TVs offer clear benefits in power consumption, slimness and picture quality........"



--
MacGuyBrazil

Mac User since 1991
Brazil
Macguybrazil is offline  
Old 02-27-2009, 07:16 AM
Advanced Member
 
hoodlum's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Looks like LED LCDs will be more of a niche product this year.
hoodlum is offline  
Old 02-27-2009, 10:05 AM
AVS Special Member
 
egrady's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Posts: 1,029
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

I have a 42" 768p Plasma and a 42" 1080p Plasma and i can clearly see a difference at as much as 9 feet with SD and HD content. Most people seem to be able to see the difference at around 7 feet. There is no way i'd ever buy a 768p set again in any size larger than 26".

A person with 20/20 vision can fully resolve a 720p image at a maximum distance of 8.2 feet from a 42" screen. To fully resolve a 1080p image, 5.4 feet. Obviously, if one is 20/10 one doesn't need to be that close. Another factor that is complicating things in your case is the 768p plasma is scaling a 720p source up and a 1080 source down. That gives the 1080p set a real advantage when the comparison is a 1080 source. I'd be willing to bet that, short of the vision of a fighter pilot, at 9 feet it would be impossible to tell the difference, on a 720p and a 1080p 42" set, if the 720p set was displaying a 720p image and the 1080p set was displaying the the same image but in 1080p form.
egrady is offline  
Old 02-27-2009, 11:03 AM
AVS Special Member
 
discopaul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,366
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 11 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macguybrazil View Post

interesting news about sammy plasma and LCD 2009 here at "homecinemachoice.com" web site:

http://www.homecinemachoice.com/blog...scaler+27+02+0

here:

"Don't bother upscaling your DVDs, Samsung's 2009 range of LCD and plasma TVs will do a much better job than any player. At least that's the company's claim,.........,Essentially, says Samsung, there's no point in buying or using an upscaling DVD with any of the brand's new screens........."

and this is quite interesting:

"...Curiously, the Korean giant says that this year it will separate LED backlit models out from its LCD ranges and sell them under a new 'LED TV' monicker. 'We expect all our LED screens to be displayed away from normal CCFL backlit TVs in high-streets stores,........,
OLED is not commercially viable and I don't think people will confuse the terms. Our LED TVs offer clear benefits in power consumption, slimness and picture quality........"



Interesting news and good to see the technology moving forward.
discopaul is offline  
Old 02-27-2009, 12:37 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mkoesel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Canton, MI
Posts: 2,343
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Sounds like a smart marketing move. LCDs have their share of baggage (just like plasmas do) and coining a new term that distances them from the LCD name will allow them to drop some of that baggage over time. I suspect nearly all LCD TVs will be LED backlit within the next 3 to 5 years or so. Probably Samsung hopes people will forget all about LCDs and ask for an LED TV instead.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Macguybrazil View Post

and this is quite interesting:

"...Curiously, the Korean giant says that this year it will separate LED backlit models out from its LCD ranges and sell them under a new 'LED TV' monicker. 'We expect all our LED screens to be displayed away from normal CCFL backlit TVs in high-streets stores,........,
OLED is not commercially viable and I don't think people will confuse the terms. Our LED TVs offer clear benefits in power consumption, slimness and picture quality........"



mkoesel is offline  
Old 03-01-2009, 03:37 PM
Member
 
pinnick's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Northern Europe
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hm if one is to believe the pressrelease from Samsung then the new 5-series should be based on a new panel if they claim 50% energy reduction compared to past models. I guess that means 50% energy reduction at the same brightnesslevel. 2x lumen tech compared to 2008 models? How else could they reduce energyconsumption by 50% and expect to compete? :-)

I want my next TV to have "smell the glove"-blacklevel. I got me an st50 and I think I can smell some leather in a not too far away distance somewhere.
pinnick is offline  
Old 03-01-2009, 03:40 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Cleveland Plasma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Posts: 12,411
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 528 Post(s)
Liked: 692
Quote:
Originally Posted by hoodlum View Post

Looks like LED LCDs will be more of a niche product this year.

There are more than a few coming out.......
Cleveland Plasma is offline  
Old 03-01-2009, 08:13 PM
Member
 
brbrbr1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 75
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Well, PN50B450 and PN50B550 are now listed at Best Buy.
brbrbr1 is offline  
Old 03-01-2009, 10:53 PM
AVS Special Member
 
StinDaWg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 352 Post(s)
Liked: 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by brbrbr1 View Post

Well, PN50B450 and PN50B550 are now listed at Best Buy.

Interesting... both state 2mil:1 dynamic contrast (for what it's worth)
StinDaWg is offline  
Old 03-01-2009, 11:38 PM
AVS Special Member
 
discopaul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,366
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 11 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Those contrast numbers are indeed impressive. I can't wait to see one. One curious oddity is BestBuy shows there are no component inputs. I'm guessing that's a misprint.
I went to Samsung's site but they don't have them up yet.
discopaul is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 12:28 AM
AVS Special Member
 
StinDaWg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 352 Post(s)
Liked: 185
The new Panasonic 50x1 also states 2 mil:1 contrast, so it's likely it's just marketing (obviously none of these sets are going to measure more than a few thousand in real world tests). They are about 1 1/2" slimmer than the entry level Panasonic yet still weigh the same.

The other thing I found interesting is their description of the panel

E-Panel with FilterBright antiglare technology

Whatever that means. Eco? Electricity? If they just put the same coating they put on their lcds I will be happy. SUPER black.

The msrp on the 50B550 is very nice. $200 cheaper than the Panasonic S1 msrp.

Will Samsung finally have a chance to compete with Panasonic this year? We'll see.
StinDaWg is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 08:55 AM
Advanced Member
 
JoeProcopio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 655
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
TOC is on the 550? doesn't look like it from the picture. then what separates the 650 from the 550 then...only thing last year was 4-3 HDMI inputs and TOC on the 650, not the 550...hmmmmm
JoeProcopio is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 08:58 AM
Advanced Member
 
H_Prestige's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 850
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

The new Panasonic 50x1 also states 2 mil:1 contrast, so it's likely it's just marketing (obviously none of these sets are going to measure more than a few thousand in real world tests). They are about 1 1/2" slimmer than the entry level Panasonic yet still weigh the same.

The other thing I found interesting is their description of the panel

E-Panel with FilterBright antiglare technology

Whatever that means. Eco? Electricity? If they just put the same coating they put on their lcds I will be happy. SUPER black.

The msrp on the 50B550 is very nice. $200 cheaper than the Panasonic S1 msrp.

Will Samsung finally have a chance to compete with Panasonic this year? We'll see.

They already use the same coating as on their LCDs. And from CES reports, only the 6 and 8 series offer picture quality advancements.

I do like how thin they are though, just under 3 inches. Contrast that to Panny, whose models are an average a little bit fatter than last year.
H_Prestige is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 09:52 AM
AVS Special Member
 
PrimeTime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Lower California
Posts: 1,795
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 58 Post(s)
Liked: 47
Does anybody know what this spec is?

We already know that Panasonic has reduced its Maximum Power Consumption significantly on the new X series. At least they have the fortitude to list it on their Specifications page.

In contrast, Samsung coyly states, on its Specifications page for the A450,

"For the power supply and Power Consumption, refer to the label attached to the product."

So...Has anybody seen a PN50B450 in the flesh yet? And, if so, looked on the back label to ascertain its Power Consumption?

My concern is the apparent correlation, marketing handwaving aside, between maximum power consumption and maximum brightness.
PrimeTime is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 11:20 AM
AVS Special Member
 
StinDaWg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 352 Post(s)
Liked: 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by H_Prestige View Post

They already use the same coating as on their LCDs.

You sure about that? When the set is off the lcds look jet black while their plasmas only look about 80% as black.
StinDaWg is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 11:49 AM
AVS Special Member
 
chrisherbert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,863
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

You sure about that? When the set is off the lcds look jet black while their plasmas only look about 80% as black.

On plasmas, the phospor material itself is a grayish color (like CRTs). That's what makes the screen look less black than an LCD.
chrisherbert is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 11:58 AM
AVS Special Member
 
wrinklefree's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 1,656
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by discopaul View Post

Those contrast numbers are indeed impressive. I can't wait to see one. One curious oddity is BestBuy shows there are no component inputs. I'm guessing that's a misprint.
I went to Samsung's site but they don't have them up yet.

I wouldn't put much stock in those laughable contrast numbers. If I'm not mistaken the ridiculously high 1:1000000 ratio in last years model was derived from the fact the panel would essentially shut off during an all black content after 5 seconds, ONLY in Dynamic mode.
wrinklefree is offline  
Old 03-02-2009, 12:43 PM
AVS Special Member
 
StinDaWg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,773
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 352 Post(s)
Liked: 185
Quote:
Originally Posted by H_Prestige View Post

And from CES reports, only the 6 and 8 series offer picture quality advancements.

Has this actually been confirmed by Samsung? I only read one report about the other models using 2008 panels. Why would they re-release the same tv with NO improvements at all?
StinDaWg is offline  
Old 03-03-2009, 11:35 AM
Senior Member
 
jae3cpa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 293
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by wrinklefree View Post

I wouldn't put much stock in those laughable contrast numbers. If I'm not mistaken the ridiculously high 1:1000000 ratio in last years model was derived from the fact the panel would essentially shut off during an all black content after 5 seconds, ONLY in Dynamic mode.

Is Samsung doing a 63 inch plasma in the 6 and 6 series for 2009 ??
jae3cpa is offline  
Old 03-03-2009, 01:34 PM
WTS
AVS Special Member
 
WTS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Calgary
Posts: 1,769
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
What are the past reliabilty issues like on the samy plasma sets?

Walter
WTS is offline  
Old 03-03-2009, 02:23 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Orta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,574
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carman24 View Post

squint real hard, and press your nose right up against a 42" set and maybe you will notice the difference between 720p and 1080p....Don't believe the 1080p propoganda on smaller sets!!!

Is this a joke or sarcasm? 42" 720p Plasmas are typically 1024x768. The size of the pixels alone is immediately recognizable with even a cursory glance from several feet.
Orta is offline  
Old 03-03-2009, 03:23 PM
Member
 
brbrbr1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 75
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Orta View Post

The size of the pixels alone is immediately recognizable with even a cursory glance from several feet.

Now is this a joke or sarcasm? I'm typing this on my notebook with the same number of pixels on the screen from one foot distance and I need to look at the screen pretty hard to even recall that it consists of pixels. Anyway its obvious you have a pretty good and quick eyesight.
brbrbr1 is offline  
Old 03-03-2009, 03:30 PM
AVS Special Member
 
chrisherbert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,863
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by brbrbr1 View Post

Now is this a joke or sarcasm? I'm typing this on my notebook with the same number of pixels on the screen from one foot distance and I need to look at the screen pretty hard to even recall that it consists of pixels. Anyway its obvious you have a pretty good and quick eyesight.

Well, your laptop screen isn't 42", and LCDs have less space between the pixels than plasmas, meaning that lower resolution is somewhat less obvious on an LCD screen than a plasma panel.

I can definitely see "screen door effect" on a 42", 720p plasma at 4-6 feet.
chrisherbert is offline  
Old 03-03-2009, 04:14 PM
Member
 
brbrbr1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 75
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisherbert View Post

and LCDs have less space between the pixels than plasmas

Well, then I think I should take my notebook comparison back, but that also means that the resolution itself is less important than the distance between pixels and if the 1080p panel has smaller pixels than 720p panel but the same distance between them, it will not help much. And thanks for the tip, I'd check SDE on plasmas more thoroughly (so far I have CRT, LCD TVs and DLP projector and it turns out they all handle SDE better than plasma)
brbrbr1 is offline  
Old 03-03-2009, 04:28 PM
AVS Special Member
 
chrisherbert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,863
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by brbrbr1 View Post

Well, then I think I should take my notebook comparison back, but that also means that the resolution itself is less important than the distance between pixels and if the 1080p panel has smaller pixels than 720p panel but the same distance between them, it will not help much. And thanks for the tip, I'd check SDE on plasmas more thoroughly (so far I have CRT, LCD TVs and DLP projector and it turns out they all handle SDE better than plasma)

1080p plasma has smaller pixels AND less distance between them.

I've found DLPs to have about the same SDE as plasmas, though it's honestly been a while since I've seen a DLP.
chrisherbert is offline  
 
Thread Tools


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off