Pioneer Elite Pro 111-FD vs Panasonic TC-P58V10 - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 22 Old 03-21-2009, 08:55 PM - Thread Starter
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I work at a retailer and about once an year we get INCREDIBLE deals from Panasonic where we get the employee discount from our employer and a mail in rebate from Panasonic for like $700 off on top of that. For the Pioneer Elites though, the price is basically the same as everyone pays because they're SOOO heavily discounted now. There are 2 things that really had me favoring the Pioneers besides the better picture quality. The Pioneer Kuro Elite Plasmas had by shortest green phosphor lag of any Plasma I tested(they got a C in this department) whereas the Regular Kuros got a D(does prossesing affect GPL?), and all other Plasmas including 2008 Panasonics got an F in this test.
The other things that had me concerned about the 2009 Panasonics were 24p flicker, and lower motion resolution than the Kuro Elite.
The Kuro Elites are the best sub $10,000 displays out there with only 2 major weaknesses in my opinion. I'd give them a B- for motion handling(900 lines @ one screen per 5 seconds). The Panasonic Neo Panels should get a B in this test (1080 lines @ 1 screen per 5 seconds). I don't think anything besides a CRT can get an A or A+ in that test, and almost all LCDs get an F with one or 2 exceptions. Motion Handling and GPT are just 2 categories out of like 20 or 30 major ones and since the Kuro Elites have As or A+ in all the other ones so it's still a major contender for me.
The thing about the Panasonic V10 panels is that I don't know much yet.
If the Panasonic V10 Panels get an F with my GPL test disc, then Panasonic is completely out of the question for me. as the 2008 Pannys didn't just get a F in my GPL test, they got a really low F.
If the V10 panels get at least a C in the GPL test, and also pass the 24P Flicker Free test, then that really will make things tough.
Should I wait another 8 months, 12 months etc(till the amazing Panasonic Deal from my Employer comes back), or do I just get the Pro 111-FD after I graduate in May? The other thing is that this television is actually going to go in my bedroom till I get a good career going and move out.
I'll have to actually get rid of my big bed and get a Twin bed to get the minimim required viewing distance for a 50" or larger Panel.
I'm not sure 58" is even possible even a Twin Bed, but 54" should definately be doable.
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post #2 of 22 Old 04-21-2009, 07:47 AM
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I am considering the same. panasonic seems to have better motion handling which means a great deal to me. I'd rather have absolute smooth playback of 24p material than a slightly better blacklevel. I am also curious about the new Samsung plasma's. Samsung offers an 58" model as well.

Samsungs plasma will hit the stores soon, the Panasonic P58V10 will see the light in aug/sept. So aug/sept will be the time I will probably make my decision.

How about you? Any new thoughts?
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post #3 of 22 Old 05-01-2009, 05:17 PM
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Any word on when the 54V10 and 58V10 will show up in the stores........???
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post #4 of 22 Old 06-10-2009, 02:41 AM
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post #5 of 22 Old 06-10-2009, 05:36 AM
 
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If you are considering the Internet purchase of a Pioneer "Elite" product, please be aware that Pioneer will not honor their warranty.
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post #6 of 22 Old 06-10-2009, 06:03 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack White View Post

I work at a retailer and about once an year we get INCREDIBLE deals from Panasonic where we get the employee discount from our employer and a mail in rebate from Panasonic for like $700 off on top of that. For the Pioneer Elites though, the price is basically the same as everyone pays because they're SOOO heavily discounted now. There are 2 things that really had me favoring the Pioneers besides the better picture quality. The Pioneer Kuro Elite Plasmas had by shortest green phosphor lag of any Plasma I tested(they got a C in this department) whereas the Regular Kuros got a D(does prossesing affect GPL?), and all other Plasmas including 2008 Panasonics got an F in this test.
The other things that had me concerned about the 2009 Panasonics were 24p flicker, and lower motion resolution than the Kuro Elite.
The Kuro Elites are the best sub $10,000 displays out there with only 2 major weaknesses in my opinion. I'd give them a B- for motion handling(900 lines @ one screen per 5 seconds). The Panasonic Neo Panels should get a B in this test (1080 lines @ 1 screen per 5 seconds). I don't think anything besides a CRT can get an A or A+ in that test, and almost all LCDs get an F with one or 2 exceptions. Motion Handling and GPT are just 2 categories out of like 20 or 30 major ones and since the Kuro Elites have As or A+ in all the other ones so it's still a major contender for me.
The thing about the Panasonic V10 panels is that I don't know much yet.
If the Panasonic V10 Panels get an F with my GPL test disc, then Panasonic is completely out of the question for me. as the 2008 Pannys didn't just get a F in my GPL test, they got a really low F.
If the V10 panels get at least a C in the GPL test, and also pass the 24P Flicker Free test, then that really will make things tough.
Should I wait another 8 months, 12 months etc(till the amazing Panasonic Deal from my Employer comes back), or do I just get the Pro 111-FD after I graduate in May? The other thing is that this television is actually going to go in my bedroom till I get a good career going and move out.
I'll have to actually get rid of my big bed and get a Twin bed to get the minimim required viewing distance for a 50" or larger Panel.
I'm not sure 58" is even possible even a Twin Bed, but 54" should definately be doable.

The 111 is a reference display and represents the best PQ that is presently obtainable in a panel TV. It is used as a measuring stick to evaluate other displays. As long as you get one with no problems, you are fine. If I didn't want to buy other electronic toys(HD camcorder and DSLR)I'd invest in one. I have had a Panasonic Plasma and it's been a great display and NO PROBLEMS. I am planning on upgrading to another Panasonic Plasma this year. If I didn't want a diversified portfolio of electronics and wanted to invest my electronic budget in just one item, I'd buy an Elite in a heartbeat. Since you are curious, the V-10 resolved the flicker problem by going to 96hz, so no problem there.

As another poster mentioned, you must make sure you buy from an authorized dealer. Just being an authorized dealer for Pioneer is not enough, they must be an authorized dealer for the Elite that you purchased. This is one of the reasons Pioneer failed as a business model. They tried to be too exclusive and actually "excluded" potential customers with this draconian stance on warranty issues. They made a lot of high end business owners wealthy, and killed themselves in the process.

Buy the 111 while you can and enjoy it for years.
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post #7 of 22 Old 06-10-2009, 08:29 AM - Thread Starter
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I did end up getting the 111-FD and I got a great deal on it since they lowered the employee price to about $1100 less than the sale price for customers and I got it that week. The employee price has increased about $300 since then so I probably got a new 111-FD cheaper than anyone in America. It's not perfect, but it's probably the closest thing to perfection in a 50" or smaller Flat Panel Television. A 1080P CRT or a 1080P+ CRT Front Projector would still be better in my opinion for picture quality, but they're unrealistic options becuase of small screen size for the direct view 1080p CRTs(24" and 32") and because of the incredible cost and space requirement of the 1080P+ CRT Front Projectors.
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post #8 of 22 Old 06-11-2009, 02:05 PM
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im waiting for this panasonic to be released does anyone have a price on what it will be?


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post #9 of 22 Old 08-01-2009, 11:26 AM
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"If you are considering the Internet purchase of a Pioneer "Elite" product, please be aware that Pioneer will not honor their warranty."

I spoke to Pioneer and they will have all parts in inventory and honor all warranties. They are not going out of business--they are just stopping plasma production.

Greg
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post #10 of 22 Old 08-10-2009, 09:32 AM
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I have been hawking the 58"-65" V series for the past 2 months.
Being that the 50" G series was a nice addition to the residence, we're moving up in size in the living room.

The date was pulled off their internal shipping/inventory system by a trusted person.

Price appeared to be $2699. Compared with the Samsung 860 series, I'll stay with Panasonic. Now mind you, the pricing with the G class 50" started at 1799. Because of specials and price matching, I ended up only paying 1299 for a THX plasma in the G series. Now that it's sitting in our bedroom, it even looks better.

Congrats on the Pioneer purchase. Just not my cup of tea to run after a product no longer in production. (Unless it's a vehicle, because then, it will either hold it's value or appreciate.)
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post #11 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLBIII View Post

I have been hawking the 58"-65" V series for the past 2 months.
Being that the 50" G series was a nice addition to the residence, we're moving up in size in the living room.

The date was pulled off their internal shipping/inventory system by a trusted person.

Price appeared to be $2699. Compared with the Samsung 860 series, I'll stay with Panasonic. Now mind you, the pricing with the G class 50" started at 1799. Because of specials and price matching, I ended up only paying 1299 for a THX plasma in the G series. Now that it's sitting in our bedroom, it even looks better.

Congrats on the Pioneer purchase. Just not my cup of tea to run after a product no longer in production. (Unless it's a vehicle, because then, it will either hold it's value or appreciate.)

SWEET! I too have been waiting for a release date for that model. I am a bit skeptical about the price though - I doubt there will be only $100 difference between it and the listed retail cost of the 54".

Saw another listing for it at 27-2800, and the 65 for around $3900 as well. Tough decisions. Of course part of me still feels like trying to find an elite 151.
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post #12 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 08:31 PM
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Thursday from 5:00 pm to 9:00pm Ulitimate Electronics are selling the 54V10 for 400 off at 2199.00. So I asked if they would sell the 58V10 with 400.oo off at 2299.00 And they said they would after taxes its 2484.00 while cleveland plasma would be 2900.00.

Bhawes
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post #13 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 08:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhawes View Post

Thursday from 5:00 pm to 9:00pm Ulitimate Electronics are selling the 54V10 for 400 off at 2199.00. So I asked if they would sell the 58V10 with 400.oo off at 2299.00 And they said they would after taxes its 2484.00 while cleveland plasma would be 2900.00.

Bhawes

I checked their web site and all the have are S and G models along with last years models.
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post #14 of 22 Old 08-12-2009, 09:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaltDoc View Post

SWEET! I too have been waiting for a release date for that model. I am a bit skeptical about the price though - I doubt there will be only $100 difference between it and the listed retail cost of the 54".

Saw another listing for it at 27-2800, and the 65 for around $3900 as well. Tough decisions. Of course part of me still feels like trying to find an elite 151.


When I had Best Buy price match their own ad, The 50" G was cheaper than the 50" S. I guess it just depends who their price matching.

After my Sunday visit to Best Buy, I'm looking around 2200 to pick this up..As soon as I do, I will post back...Unless I could squeeze the 65" into my mounting area..
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post #15 of 22 Old 08-12-2009, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gstarr View Post

"If you are considering the Internet purchase of a Pioneer "Elite" product, please be aware that Pioneer will not honor their warranty."

I spoke to Pioneer and they will have all parts in inventory and honor all warranties. They are not going out of business--they are just stopping plasma production.

Greg

I think he was referring to Pioneer not honoring internet sales of their ELITE line of plasmas. This has always been the case. It has nothing to do with their decision to not manufacture plasmas anymore.

If you're talkin, you ain't learnin.
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post #16 of 22 Old 08-13-2009, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhawes View Post

Thursday from 5:00 pm to 9:00pm Ulitimate Electronics are selling the 54V10 for 400 off at 2199.00. So I asked if they would sell the 58V10 with 400.oo off at 2299.00 And they said they would after taxes its 2484.00 while cleveland plasma would be 2900.00.

Bhawes

Not anymore....TC-P58V10 came in at a lower price than expected.

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post #17 of 22 Old 08-25-2009, 07:30 AM
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Bought one yesterday from Brandsmart in Buford, Georgia for $2100 plus tax. I love bargaining and I enjoyed the back-and-forth with the department manager to secure my $700 discount from their posted prices.
Hooked it up today and am absolutely loving the unit.
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post #18 of 22 Old 09-03-2009, 01:53 PM
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Thanks to the previous post and other prices posted from internet vendors I was able to get a V10 58" at BB for 2199, of course they are not expected to be instock till the end of Sept. Now I will have something else to dream about since I did not win the lotter last night.

David Ferebee
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post #19 of 22 Old 09-07-2009, 08:55 PM
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I did not know they did this. What sites do they price match? I have tried before on other items and they indicated that they did not Price Match online sites.

Is this a new policy?

Thanks.
Steve
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post #20 of 22 Old 09-08-2009, 02:49 PM
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It isn't a price match in the sense that they are obligated to do due to their policy, it is a price match that they are accepting as part of bargaining.
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post #21 of 22 Old 09-08-2009, 03:21 PM
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I have had retailers claim that internet pricing does not fall under their price match policy. I have also have retailers not price match Costco. Under this scenario, I just leave and purchase at Costco.

I would rather not purchase a $3K TV through the internet.
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post #22 of 22 Old 09-10-2009, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HTSteve View Post

I have had retailers claim that internet pricing does not fall under their price match policy. I have also have retailers not price match Costco. Under this scenario, I just leave and purchase at Costco.

I would rather not purchase a $3K TV through the internet.

That is par for the course, not matching web vendors or club stores. One can read a given policy, to see if they are following what they are supposed to. Of course, what they are supposed to, is decided by them.
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