The Official Pioneer 9G North American KRP-500M / KRP-600M Owner's Discussion Pt. II - Page 207 - AVS Forum
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post #6181 of 7070 Old 06-21-2011, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

@natsnd
Can you point me to this "D-Nice/Evangelo break-in process" thread?

If you have a Kuro monitor you should read the KRP FAQ. The various D-Nice settings are in the second block of links. The relevant line has the following comment: "(D-Nice panel aging settings are in the first post.)"
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post #6182 of 7070 Old 06-21-2011, 05:19 PM
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@Elix:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1053444

Settings for break-in on the KRP are in the middle of the first post. Post break-in Pure mode settings are in Post #9.

@bodosom:

So Studio Mode is not really an easy way into a fixed video production mode? The quote you cite from the Integrator Manual is even more vague than the brief description Pio provide in the user manual.

Why would anyone want a color temp of 3200K as standard for any reason?

Thanks,
Roger
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post #6183 of 7070 Old 06-21-2011, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by natsnd View Post

So Studio Mode is not really an easy way into a fixed video production mode? The quote you cite from the Integrator Manual is even more vague than the brief description Pio provide in the user manual.

Why would anyone want a color temp of 3200K as standard for any reason?

Thanks,
Roger

when the KRP-M display (showing content) is actually in the camera shot in the Studio

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post #6184 of 7070 Old 06-21-2011, 05:37 PM
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Thanks turbe for decoding the mysterious language in the user manual.

I guess I should've been able to figure it out, as a veteran broadcast engineering supervisor, but now it makes perfect sense.

They're just providing an answer to any and all user needs,I suppose, although where I work, the powers that be have never used Pio pro or other monitors for air or production, unfortunately...Panny pro series units all over the plant (and they are very, very good).

Regards,
Roger
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post #6185 of 7070 Old 06-22-2011, 12:47 AM
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@bodosom
@natsnd
Thanks! I'm still very intersted in those three test pictures. It must show if Kuros handle chroma upsampling well. Panasonics don't.
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post #6186 of 7070 Old 06-22-2011, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

Thanks! I'm still very intersted in those three test pictures. It must show if Kuros handle chroma upsampling well. Panasonics don't.

Elites (including the KRP) pass all the S&M tests (when driven with an Oppo -83) with the following issues:
The highest frequency chroma bursts fail when using YCC.
They clip below 16 and above 235 unless Dynamic Range Expansion (DRE) is enabled.
They clip green.
There are some minor cadence issues but really, who watches SD.

Specifically regarding CUE, it's not a problem although I would expect upsampling, deinterlacing and scaling to happen before the display.
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post #6187 of 7070 Old 06-22-2011, 09:15 AM
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I hope we're talking about the same thing...
http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/61281
First variant or second? And on what model?
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post #6188 of 7070 Old 06-22-2011, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

I hope we're talking about the same thing...

I'm talking about CUE. Go here and search the page for Chroma Upsampling Error to see the S&M primary CUE detection pattern. Note that your "test" images may or may not reveal a CUE error somewhere in the video chain.

If you have the opportunity to purchase a purchase a Kuro monitor you should do so (assuming it's in good condition).
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post #6189 of 7070 Old 06-22-2011, 10:53 AM
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Thanks for the great link but still... The lines in the picture in CUE paragraph doesn't look jagged to me. Yet those test images I've posted reveal the error. There's a clean difference between horizontal and vertical convergence lines on my Panasonic PDP. I can clearly see the fall of contrast and sharpness of vertical lines here compared to horizontal. Is it the same with KURO?
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post #6190 of 7070 Old 06-22-2011, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seether4113 View Post

Do you know how difficult of an install that is? It looks fairly straight forward. I'm no tv repairman but have experience building computers, etc...



It's 1.5 years old, no ext warranty, and I did use a MC that doubles the warranty. I assume that the "buzz" will be considered "normal" though and not covered. And, who is "we"? Google shows Corpus Christi... that's a little far from me in north texas.

We can be 'found' by PMing us. Also, by calling Pioneer cust svc and asking for the authorized servicenter in CC, Tx 78411
You've got a potential problem and I would get a claim started with the ccard company.
It is a matter of your convincing your local Pioneer warranty center to go to bat for you if the 'noise' is in that grey area between someone saying it is normal and another arguing it is a defect.
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post #6191 of 7070 Old 06-22-2011, 07:56 PM
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Is there any quick/easy way to copy the same settings (such as D-Nice's Pure settings) to multiple inputs and input memories? I know you can view this in KuroReader but I didn't know if you could like save the settings and then apply them to another input/memory. I seem to always have a different input resolution so it has the default settings and I would like to apply the same settings to all of my memories. Thanks!
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post #6192 of 7070 Old 06-23-2011, 06:35 AM
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I unplugged the KRP as a thunderstorm approached last night. A few seconds later, lightning struck somewhere on my property. After the storm passed, I plugged the KRP back in and it ran through the blue shutdown (SD) sequence (7 blinks). The strike temporarily knocked my FIOS router out, but the KRP is fine except that I could no longer connect to it via the ethernet port, even after trying all the usual reboot methods. In addition, my Sony BD player ethernet port is dead, and one cordless phone is now always "off-hook". I still have serial control, and found the subcategory code of the shutdown points to the IO board IP circuit (which makes sense). The good news is I ordered a new board for $50 and it looks easy to replace.

The weird part of this is that FIOS comes into the house over non-conductive fiber. However, I do have some COAX connections that go underground to a covered splitter outside, so the spike must have come into the system from there.
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post #6193 of 7070 Old 06-23-2011, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdbimmer View Post

The good news is I ordered a new board for $50 and it looks easy to replace.
...
I do have some COAX connections that go underground to a covered splitter outside, so the spike must have come into the system from there.

Good to hear there's good news.

Do you use a coax surge protector?
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post #6194 of 7070 Old 06-23-2011, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

Good to hear there's good news.

Do you use a coax surge protector?

I have tried to plug the coax into my surge protector but then the cable doesn't work right. I believe the cable company tells you not to run the coax through the surge protector but it definitely makes sense to. Too bad mine doesn't work with the coax going through the surge protector. What is everyone else's experience with this?
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post #6195 of 7070 Old 06-23-2011, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

Good to hear there's good news.

Do you use a coax surge protector?

Yes. And the FIOS ONT is grounded, its BBU has a surge protector, the TV, STB, BDP, and Router are all on surge protectors, so I would have expected (wrongly) that would prevent surges from any thing other than a direct hit on the ONT which is inside the garage. Then again, I am only speculating that the surge came through COAX, it could have been EMF somehow getting into the in-house CAT5 and POTS wiring. I didn't think it was necessary, but I may get an Ethernet surge protector for the KRP soon..

PS - Luckily all of my connected PC ethernet ports survived.
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post #6196 of 7070 Old 06-23-2011, 03:05 PM
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Does 9G KUROs have rising blacks? Is the new set darker than a used one?
What things should I pay attention to when buying a used 500A/500M?
Also, please see this thread if you'll have some free time. Thanks!
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post #6197 of 7070 Old 06-23-2011, 08:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post
Does 9G KUROs have rising blacks?
In the sense you probably mean there's no evidence of that.
Quote:
Is the new set darker than a used one?
There's no evidence of that but most people, even most Kuro monitor owners, are not in a position to make that assessment.
Quote:
What things should I pay attention to when buying a used 500A/500M?
You should seek to understand the 500M, first point: it's not the same as a 500A.
Quote:
Also, please see this thread if you'll have some free time. Thanks!
It's helpful to actually ask the questions you're interested in. In this case why would you send YCC from a computer to a panel that accepts RGB and has a PC-mode? And if you're still concerned about CUE and you insist on sending YCC then send 4:4:4.
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post #6198 of 7070 Old 06-24-2011, 01:44 AM
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I have an additional question. I have a very good offer here on PDP-LX5090H in mint condition, it's like 2 times less than what I see on 500A offers (approx. 1500$). What would I loose in terms of PQ and functionality (i.e. in-built functions, CMS?). I've read the comparison thread but didn't quite get that point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

You should seek to understand the 500M, first point: it's not the same as a 500A.

Thanks for the reply, bodosom! I've read about the differences between 500A and 500M. It's just not clear what set I'll get the chance to buy thus I used "/" slash. I coudln't care less about additional connectivity or digital tuners on 500A, my only concern is PQ which is the same for 500A/500M, I believe?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

It's helpful to actually ask the questions you're interested in. In this case why would you send YCC from a computer to a panel that accepts RGB and has a PC-mode? And if you're still concerned about CUE and you insist on sending YCC then send 4:4:4.

I actually asked what I was interested in. There's no way to know whether your TV actually supports 4:4:4 Full RGB or properly handles 4:4:4 YCbCr signal without practically testing it. For example, my Panasonic has unfixable black crush when I choose Full RGB as a pixel format option, and it doesn't matter what other format I choose there's always an error of 4:4:4 chroma upsampling which I described in my post. So sending 4:4:4, be it YCbCr or Limited RGB, doesn't solve anything. And I believe this problem is not CUE of which you're talking about (I've read that article).

So please, do me some good and walk through the test!
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post #6199 of 7070 Old 06-24-2011, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

So please, do me some good and walk through the test!

You're confused. As an example you asked about power consumption and claimed the information wasn't in the manual. See page 101 of the 101FD manual, page 105 of the 500M manual or page 108 of the 500A/P manual.

Your assumptions are essentially all incorrect. If you get a 500M feel free to ask questions about it, if you get a 500A, LX5090 or other EU model I suggest you go to AVForums in the UK where they talk about the EU models.
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post #6200 of 7070 Old 06-24-2011, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

See page 101 of the 101FD manual, page 105 of the 500M manual or page 108 of the 500A/P manual.

How could I've missed it! Even though I've read good half of the manual. I guess I expected it to be near the very end. Thanks. I guess I should write about it in another thread.
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Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

You're confused. As an example you asked about power consumption and claimed the information wasn't in the manual.

You can't use it as an example to falsify everything else I've asked, to claim that I'm confused about everything. It's not wise to say the least.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

Your assumptions are essentially all incorrect. If you get a 500M feel free to ask questions about it, if you get a 500A, LX5090 or other EU model I suggest you go the AVForum in the UK where they talk about the EU models.

Now I can clearly see that you're biased because I'm new here. From your very first answer everything you write looks so authoritative yet you seem to lack the will to help. I realize you might have an authority here but that doesn't give you the right to bash others. It's like you single-handedly forbid me to write here.
That will be my only off-topic post here. And I'll take your advice to try other forums.
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post #6201 of 7070 Old 06-24-2011, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

I realize you might have an authority here but that doesn't give you the right to bash others. It's like you single-handedly forbid me to write here.
That will be my only off-topic post here. And I'll take your advice to try other forums.

??? This is an American site where people discuss American models. If anything, bodosom is being helpful telling you you'd be better off going to a place like AVForums that deals with Euro models.
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post #6202 of 7070 Old 06-24-2011, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by p59teitel View Post

??? This is an American site where people discuss American models. If anything, bodosom is being helpful telling you you'd be better off going to a place like AVForums that deals with Euro models.

He has been helpful. However, the idea of his last messages are essentially this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by bodosom View Post

You're confused.
Your assumptions are essentially all incorrect.

And my initial request is totally forgotten...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

Can I ask someone with 500M/600M/101FP to view some test images for me? All images are 1920x1080 and must be viewed in native resolution at pixel-accurate mode.
1) Convergence Horizontal Lines. You must see no space between red, green and blue lines, all colored pixels must be vivid, sharp and crisp.
2) Convergence Vertical Lines. Same as above.
3) Tint Blue RGB. All colored text should be sharp. There must be no shadows of rectangles on the blue background.

Thank you in advance!

And the results shouldn't be different on European models.
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post #6203 of 7070 Old 06-25-2011, 02:43 PM
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Any one looking for speakers for the 500M? If so PM me.

I have a set of PRO-111FD speakers for cheap. Need to get rid of them.
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post #6204 of 7070 Old 06-26-2011, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac13 View Post

Is there any quick/easy way to copy the same settings (such as D-Nice's Pure settings) to multiple inputs and input memories? I know you can view this in KuroReader but I didn't know if you could like save the settings and then apply them to another input/memory. I seem to always have a different input resolution so it has the default settings and I would like to apply the same settings to all of my memories. Thanks!

Anyone?
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post #6205 of 7070 Old 06-26-2011, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac13 View Post

Is there any quick/easy way to copy the same settings (such as D-Nice's Pure settings) to multiple inputs and input memories?

Try KuroControl.
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post #6206 of 7070 Old 06-28-2011, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post
3) Tint Blue RGB. All colored text should be sharp. There must be no shadows of rectangles on the blue background.
Saw Samsung PN51D8000 today and it did 4:4:4 chroma upscaling very well, unlike my Panny. http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/62758

And I still weren't able to find out about how 500M/600M performs in this aspect.
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post #6207 of 7070 Old 06-28-2011, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post
Saw Samsung PN51D8000 today and it did 4:4:4 chroma upscaling very well, unlike my Panny. http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/62758

And I still weren't able to find out about how 500M/600M performs in this aspect.
What are you talking about? I don't know what this is or what the screenshot comparison is supposed compare. Can someone please fill me in to what kind of benchmark we are looking at?

Thanks!
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post #6208 of 7070 Old 06-29-2011, 06:31 PM
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*Bump* ???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

Saw Samsung PN51D8000 today and it did 4:4:4 chroma upscaling very well, unlike my Panny. http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/62758

And I still weren't able to find out about how 500M/600M performs in this aspect.

Also, I just enabled the ISF modes on my 500M and was wondering how ISF-Auto works. Does it start with ISF-Day if it is really bright and then dim down to ISF-Night based off of how much light there is? Is there any way to check what the current settings of ISF Auto are? I used KuroReader to check the settings but it just showed the initial settings I put in and didn't actually show what the numbers for the adjusted picture were (contrast, sharpness, etc..)
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post #6209 of 7070 Old 06-30-2011, 02:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac13 View Post

What are you talking about? I don't know what this is or what the screenshot comparison is supposed compare. Can someone please fill me in to what kind of benchmark we are looking at?

It's not a benchmark and it's not like anyone's looking at it except me But if you've got your 500M connected to a PC surely it wouldn't be hard for you to look at it either? http://plasmon.rghost.ru/11892731.image
All colored text should be sharp. There must be no shadows of rectangles on the blue background.
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post #6210 of 7070 Old 06-30-2011, 07:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elix View Post

It's not a benchmark and it's not like anyone's looking at it except me But if you've got your 500M connected to a PC surely it wouldn't be hard for you to look at it either? http://plasmon.rghost.ru/11892731.image
All colored text should be sharp. There must be no shadows of rectangles on the blue background.

Gotcha thanks for the clarification. Unfortunately I don't have my 500M hooked up to a PC :/
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