Panasonic 11G/12G/13G black levels have seemingly doubled overnight? - Page 34 - AVS Forum
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post #991 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

So this increase is purposeful then?

An adjustment is purposeful. What is going on with the 11/12G consumer Panasonics is not.
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post #992 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

So this increase is purposeful then?

D-Nice,

Also, what is the purpose for the voltage change? Why is Panasonic degrading the performance?

Larry
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post #993 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pukemon View Post

according to your reading and comprehension skills you're a "i can't say on this forum". and you're reporting skills are even worse. and how old are you? 10? all your posts are negative, condescending, tattletelling. you contribute nothing but negativity. honestly, i think your discopaul's brother and have nothing better to do than try and dis panasonic. go watch your samsung, vizio or whatever brand and/or goto a videogame forum where persons like you thrive off this type of nonsense.

This will be my last post responding to your attacks. You started this by making a blanket statement that Samsung has poor quality panels and that Panasonic has much better black levels . I simply corrected you by stating Panasonic has defective black levels and noted your facts were incorrect. You then went on several mad rants about how I have t.v. envy and no support for my statement correcting you. You then stated that the black level problem does not exist for the majority of Panasonic owners and I simply reported your statement in this thread where a very large number of forum users are complaining about Panasonic black levels. I even tried to distance myself by telling you I was happy you enjoyed your new t.v. and I hoped you didn't experience the Panasonic black level defect yet you still continue to attack me. You do realize you are guilty of everything you wrongly accuse me of above, don't you? Hypocrite.
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post #994 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

An adjustment is purposeful. What is going on with the 11/12G consumer Panasonics is not.

Is there a fix for this? Can Panasonic modify what is happening through a firmware update or is this a hardware issue?
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post #995 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

You like to read.... find it on the forum. I will say that it is during the second drive adjustment.


You said "specified" hours, not the vagaries that have been posted on the forum.
If thats not what you meant ("random" instead of "specific"), please correct your post as its already being misunderstood.
If you have "specified" hours d-nice then just post them with out all the illusion and bs.
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post #996 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

Well if you would take the time and find out who D-Nice is and his connections with Panasonic (and others), you may change your mind. All the information you need is in this forum. You just have to learn how to search for it.

Thanks for the inside info, D-Nice.

Larry

I'm familiar with D-Nice and have been following all the threads on the 12G Panasonics since mid-August. I was just looking for specifics on the source of that information other than the general "Panasonic" answer.

While it's generous of him to post info here and we're all thankful, D-nice is often a bit vague which can be frustrating especially knowing that he probably does know more. Of course I'm also aware he probably cannot divulge all knowledge on the subject for professional reasons.

Still, I cannot say I agree with all this stuff about automatically rising black levels on all the 12G Pannys. I wouldnt consider myself your average joe consumer, so I know I would notice any degradation in picture quality on my tv--which I havent as well as many others that have had their tv for months now.

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post #997 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:40 PM
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D-Nice, any word on if this will be fixed for the 2010 models?

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post #998 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hammer MGS4 View Post

This will be my last post responding to your attacks. You started this by making a blanket statement that Samsung has poor quality panels and that Panasonic has much better black levels . I simply corrected you by stating Panasonic has defective black levels and noted your facts were incorrect. You then went on several mad rants about how I have t.v. envy and no support for my statement correcting you. You then stated that the black level problem does not exist for the majority of Panasonic owners and I simply reported your statement in this thread where a very large number of forum users are complaining about Panasonic black levels. I even tried to distance myself by telling you I was happy you enjoyed your new t.v. and I hoped you didn't experience the Panasonic black level defect yet you still continue to attack me. You do realize you are guilty of everything you wrongly accuse me of above, don't you? Hypocrite.

lmao. wow. it's obvious your buttering up your statements. and i attacked you? please refer back to your link and try again. and i made it very obvious i said i read samsung outsourced low quality panels. whether they do or not, i, and only i, made a decision based upon something i read. it's common for corp's to outsource things like that, and it's not uncommon for display models to be cherry picked or in house. anyways, you were very specific in your "attacks" in the other thread, and now you are being more accurate with your generalizations here. and then you come to another thread making false accusations. please refer back to your link, numbnuts. i just got the tv a week ago. my black levels are not defective nor do i fall under your imposed assumptions. if and when my black levels do rise, numbnuts, you can hee and haw all you want at me? fair enough?
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post #999 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 02:51 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pukemon View Post

according to your reading and comprehension skills you're a "i can't say on this forum". and you're reporting skills are even worse. and how old are you? 10? all your posts are negative, condescending, tattletelling. you contribute nothing but negativity. honestly, i think your discopaul's brother and have nothing better to do than try and dis panasonic. go watch your samsung, vizio or whatever brand and/or goto a videogame forum where persons like you thrive off this type of nonsense.

You must either be Auditor55's little brother or one of his Royal Highness' minions.
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post #1000 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 03:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VFR View Post

You said "specified" hours, not the vagaries that have been posted on the forum.
If thats not what you meant ("random" instead of "specific"), please correct your post as its already being misunderstood.
If you have "specified" hours d-nice then just post them with out all the illusion and bs.

I have the pleasure to know certain individuals within the industry. From those individuals, I am privy to non-public information, of which some is proprietary. With that being said, I am very careful with what and how I post information to ensure I do not insult my contacts/CE manufacturers, provide any sensive and/or proprietarty information on a PUBLIC forum.

It has always been like this when I post information on this PUBLIC forum and it probably will always be this way.
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post #1001 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 03:23 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

I have the pleasure to know certain individuals within the industry. From those individuals, I am privy to non-public information, of which some is proprietary. With that being said, I am very careful with what and how I post information to ensure I do not insult my contacts/CE manufacturers, provide any sensive and/or proprietarty information on a PUBLIC forum.

It has always been like this when I post information on this PUBLIC forum and it probably will always be this way.

Where do you get all those TVs from? Best Buy's 30-day loaner program?
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post #1002 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 03:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

An adjustment is purposeful. What is going on with the 11/12G consumer Panasonics is not.

Thanks for the investigation and confirmation D. Like Larry mentioned though, why in the world would they be doing this?
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post #1003 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 03:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by optivity View Post

Where do you get all those TVs from? The Best Buy 30-day loaner program?

***Off Topic***

I'm sorry Optivity, does it piss you off that I have the money to purchase multiple multi-thousand dollar displays?

I'm well aware of your despise for individuals who are better/respected more/make more money/can do more than you can/etc and do not share the same skin color as yourself (you feel as if you are in little India at your place of employment, correct?). Your particular species of "American" is on the endangered species list and will be extinct soon, so do yourself a favor and try to at least to spend your lasts days doing better that what you have been.
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post #1004 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 03:36 PM
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It sounds to me like components in the panel power supply are not holding their values, allowing the voltage output to drift up, causing an increase in mll OR it is programmed to change voltage at certain times either on purpose or by accident.

Great... One step forward, two steps back.

Also operating temperature of the power supply may change output as well. My TV's black gets darker after it warms up.
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post #1005 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Orta View Post

why in the world would they be doing this?

Have you ever wondered why plasmas looked "noisy" the first hundred or so hours and then the noise goes away? Drive voltage adjustment
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post #1006 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 03:43 PM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Have you ever wondered why plasmas looked "noisy" the first hundred or so hours and then the noise goes away? Drive voltage adjustment

so what happens if my plasma hardly had any noise?
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post #1007 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pukemon View Post

so what happens if my plasma hardly had any noise?

Adjustments may be programmed in to account for component and/or panel wear. Maybe as the panel breaks-in and then ages, voltage are increase to account for phosphours that are not quite as sensitive.

Just like tube back lit LCD's and CFL bulbs that dim with age, plasma panel power may need to be increased to maintain brightness.

The problem may be that people who watch alot of dimly lit scenes or have low a contast setting may not be wearing the panel as fast as expected, thus the brightness increase is more noticable. OR panasonic has messed up the programming. OR who knows.
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post #1008 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:06 PM
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[quote=D-Nice;17802592]Have you ever wondered why plasmas looked "noisy" the first hundred or so hours and then the noise goes away? Drive voltage adjustment [/

if that's true we can drive the voltage back to its initial value.... more voltage more noise....less voltage less noise. The noise didnt bothered me to much like the increased black issue so why in the hell the voltage its set up to decrease after so many hours. How can you drive the voltage .
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post #1009 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:08 PM
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Until today, only conjectures about it...
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post #1010 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:13 PM
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We need custom firmware.
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post #1011 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:15 PM
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i am going to run my tv all night at zero values on cinema mode to see if the voltage changes to compensate the dim picture.
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post #1012 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:15 PM
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We need custom firmware.

lol yea it wont happen
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post #1013 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:22 PM
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D-Nice

Looking back at your X1 calibration file link (the PDf) I see the MLL for blacks is 0.0157 fL. That was March 14, 2009. What is the black level like now? Measured value that is.
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post #1014 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:39 PM
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Hey guys, I'm not a videophile by any means but I ordered a G10 and it's coming tomorrow. Should I be worried about the black level problem? I'm very concerned about the picture quality.
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post #1015 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vistekrebel View Post

D-Nice

Looking back at your X1 calibration file link (the PDf) I see the MLL for blacks is 0.0157 fL. That was March 14, 2009. What is the black level like now? Measured value that is.

I don't know as I no longer have that panel.
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post #1016 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 04:56 PM
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Hey guys, I'm not a videophile by any means but I ordered a G10 and it's coming tomorrow. Should I be worried about the black level problem? I'm very concerned about the picture quality.

no since your not a videophile aka OCD... put on that TV and erase what negative things you hear about it and flip on a nice reference blu ray. you will be very happy with it. Its has very good PQ

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post #1017 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

I said there are voltage adjustments at specifed hours.

one more time there is any way to adjust the voltages
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post #1018 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 05:59 PM
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Phosphor trails and the black level doubling problems are really scaring me away from buying this tv.
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post #1019 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cristian_ro View Post

one more time there is any way to adjust the voltages

With the correct knowledge, software and equipment yes.
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post #1020 of 11218 Old 12-28-2009, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rpresner View Post

no since your not a videophile aka OCD... put on that TV and erase what negative things you hear about it and flip on a nice reference blu ray. you will be very happy with it. Its has very good PQ

Thanks. I am pretty OCD though. I'm very picky with my electronics :P. I hope this will be fixed someday.
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