Panasonic 11G/12G/13G black levels have seemingly doubled overnight? - Page 363 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #10861 of 11930 Old 08-09-2013, 04:21 PM
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Great to hear there is finally a fix for this. I have to ask, has anyone checked if newer Panasonic Plasma models still have the slow rise over time? My experience with the G10 and V10 have left me very uneasy about buying another Panasonic...
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post #10862 of 11930 Old 08-09-2013, 07:23 PM
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The newer Panasonic televisions do not have the same voltage algorithm.

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post #10863 of 11930 Old 08-09-2013, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PENDRAG0ON View Post

Great to hear there is finally a fix for this. I have to ask, has anyone checked if newer Panasonic Plasma models still have the slow rise over time? My experience with the G10 and V10 have left me very uneasy about buying another Panasonic...

From what I have read the 20/25 and 30 series panasonics also have rising black levels but do so at a slower rate than the 10 series.

The 50 and 60 don't seem to have this flaw.


If a device gets developed that can reset the G25 black levels I would gladly purchase it!
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post #10864 of 11930 Old 08-10-2013, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moondog46 View Post

I too would be interested in a pre-built magic unit.

Me too!!!

Main HT Room: Panny TC-P65VT60 (calibrated by Chad B), Denon AVR-4311, Comcast X1 DVR, Apple TV3, Sony BDP-S5100, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers, Sierra Horizon and HTM-200SE, Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
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post #10865 of 11930 Old 08-10-2013, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Steve Kuester View Post


On my V10, I was surprised to see +5V on that pin even with the TV powered off. That is how I verified the pinout as that connector is horizontal on the V10, vs. vertical on the G's and S's.

 

Oh, that's actually pretty great news.  I'll verify on my TV later this weekend or next week.  I have a few deadlines to tackle today before I can get started on this.  I also have some overtime coming up at work, so timing isn't the greatest, but I'm super excited to tackle this so I'll work some time in each week to work on it.  If I had nothing else going on, I could likely knock it out in a few days.  Life dictates otherwise right now though. :)  That's why I'm giving myself weeks rather than days..  :)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Goo View Post

If a device gets developed that can reset the G25 black levels I would gladly purchase it!

 

I have no G25 to test with (I only have a 50G10), nor any other models (S, VT, etc).  Again, I'm hoping that my price targets will be low enough that people with these models don't mind just trying it out..  I'm trying to make this as simple as possible, on everyone else (both end user "experience" as well as pocketbook), and on myself (no warranty, etc).  I'm not trying to start a business here, so keeping it simple is key.

 

I will go back to mironto's website a few more times and read through some stuff and start probing around my TV in a few days..

 

thanks all,

..dane

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post #10866 of 11930 Old 08-12-2013, 06:12 AM
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Keep us all updated!
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post #10867 of 11930 Old 08-12-2013, 10:55 AM
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Id also be interested in a pre-built unit. Im not sure I trust myself enough.
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post #10868 of 11930 Old 08-13-2013, 10:29 AM
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Id also be interested in a pre-built unit. Im not sure I trust myself enough.

Meto
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post #10869 of 11930 Old 08-13-2013, 11:46 AM
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(Not really supposed to be working on this until next week, but I had a free lunch break, so ...  :) )

 

I've gotten the service manual for my 50g10..  Seems the 11pin connector is called A18 (at least on my 50G10).  However, there's an A17 connector that is 20 pins, that has the same necessary connections but also a new one called "Panel LED."  Well, by golly, this might be the easiest way to measure "on-time" imaginable ..  especially if the +5V signal is always present (which makes sense, since the schematic calls it STB5V, as in "standby power").  Now I'm not sure if A18 is as easily accessed, however, as A17.  Nor do I know yet if A18 is even populated.  (It may just be blank solder pads on the board, whereas A17 has a connector mounted.)  I'll get a flashlight out tonight and see on the back of my TV if both A17 and A18 are accessible through the service port, and if they both have connectors.  I sure hope so.

 

I will also need to start gathering relevant service manuals for all the models in question.  I am REALLY hoping that I don't need separate pig-tail connectors for each model.  That would just stink. BTW, if anybody already has a packaged-up zip of all the service manuals for the affected models in this thread (or could gather them), it would save me tons of time.  :)   I'll only print out mine, but I will need to cross reference every other model to ensure the connector PN and pinout match.  I didn't account for that in my time estimates, but needs to be done to ensure everyone can use the same little board.  Otherwise I'll have to make different versions for different people.  That won't be fun, and may add a few bucks to the cost. :(  I really don't want that to happen.

 

Is this thread the best place for me to share 'development work' as I progress?  Methinks the thread should really only be major announcements-- maybe i should setup a blog feed that people can subscribe to if they want more nitty-gritty updates..   any recommendations?  something easy..  with support for occasional pictures and diagrams without much fuss..

 

cheers,

..dane

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post #10870 of 11930 Old 08-16-2013, 08:28 PM
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I have no idea what goes into the engineering of PDP's, just spit-balling potentials that may or may not even exist. jPYb
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post #10871 of 11930 Old 08-19-2013, 07:23 PM
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So, MY G10 has both A17 and A18..  Woot!

 

However, I'm not sure, looking at the picture's of Miro's TV from his site, that he has both.  That means different models may have different connectors installed. Major Bummer..

 

I think that A17 would be a better solution, but A18 may be a more universal solution.Going with A18 requires at least one button and an LED (so the user can initiate the process and know what mode we're in through the process), and a way the user can GET to them, .. that complicates things.  I can still make it simple, just not as much as I'd like.

 

If anyone has a chance to check the back of their TV for one or both connectors' presence and give me feedback, it would help me understand how to move forward. I'm setting up a blog page right now; in a day or two I'll try to post up a poll. I don't want to clog this thread with replies saying, just a17, a18, or both.  I'll post back in a couple days when I have a poll setup..  (if I can add a poll to this post, show me how!)

 

thanks,

..dane

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post #10872 of 11930 Old 08-20-2013, 02:51 PM
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Okay, I have a basic blog setup with a feedback form to get some useful information from those interested in this little doodad that we're talking about.

 

Panasonic MLL Reset Widget / Feedback Request Form

 

RSS Feed (Panasonic MLL Reset Widget)
 

I'll post updates there rather than clogging things up here.  Will only post things here with it's more important..

 

cheers,

..dane

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post #10873 of 11930 Old 08-20-2013, 04:05 PM
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Thanks Dane!

I filled it out, and for those that dont know how to check, I have an S1 and it has both the A17 & A18 connectors

- Lambo
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post #10874 of 11930 Old 08-20-2013, 06:45 PM
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Dane,

As I mentioned earlier, I am very interested in this miracle cure and I would love to aid you in your efforts, but I must reveal my utter newb-ness. Can you (or anyone) please tell me how to remove the plastic cover that will reveal the connectors on my set? I can find it OK thanks to the picture on your poll blog post, but I can't figure out how to safely remove it.

Thanks!
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post #10875 of 11930 Old 08-21-2013, 04:26 AM
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I have a 2009 V10 model. Do I need to remove it from the wall to access this plastic cover? Also what does the widget plug into, these PIN connectors?

Main HT Room: Panny TC-P65VT60 (calibrated by Chad B), Denon AVR-4311, Comcast X1 DVR, Apple TV3, Sony BDP-S5100, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers, Sierra Horizon and HTM-200SE, Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
Basement HT Room: Panny TC-P58V10 (Black Level Restored!), Denon AVR-E300, Comcast X1 STB, Sony BDP-S590, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics CBM-170SE (L/R), Ascend Acoustics CMT-340SE-C, Wave Crest HVL-1 (Surr) and Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
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post #10876 of 11930 Old 08-21-2013, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gov View Post

I have a 2009 V10 model. Do I need to remove it from the wall to access this plastic cover? Also what does the widget plug into, these PIN connectors?

Depends on how tight your set is mounted to the wall. I did not need to take my set off the wall - a little telescoping mirror is all you need. The plastic cover is right on the back edge of your set, just down from the SD card slot. It pops right off without much of an issue at all.

I turn the sharpness on my TV all the way up, because that's how I like my picture... real sharp.
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post #10877 of 11930 Old 08-21-2013, 09:13 PM
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I hope this isn't viewed as negative towards what dane is trying to do, because I really don't mean it to be at all.

To those of you wanting to reset your black level, have you taken 10 minutes to read through the guide that mironto put together? He steps you through so amazingly well, I really think anyone could follow along and do it. That's how I reset mine. Now that I've done it, it will literally be a 2 minute process every couple of months to keep my V10 looking like new.

I would bet mironto would be willing to help if you are unsure of something, and I would have no problem answering any questions about what I did as well.

If you have already looked at his guide, take a second look and read step by step - you'll see how simple it really is.

Order the hardware you need tonight, and you'll be enjoying your set with those deeps blacks you vaguely remember in a week or so.

Guide is located here...http://panasonic.mironto.sk/

I turn the sharpness on my TV all the way up, because that's how I like my picture... real sharp.
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post #10878 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 04:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moondog46 View Post

Dane,

As I mentioned earlier, I am very interested in this miracle cure and I would love to aid you in your efforts, but I must reveal my utter newb-ness. Can you (or anyone) please tell me how to remove the plastic cover that will reveal the connectors on my set? I can find it OK thanks to the picture on your poll blog post, but I can't figure out how to safely remove it.

Thanks!
This is how the plastic cover looks like on an European P42G10:

You need to insert flathead screwdriver in the right part and pry towards the inner of the cover to release the latches.

@Steve Kuester: Yes, the guide is pretty straight forward and easy, but it still requires some basic electronics skills like soldering and such. That might be a show-stopper for many users.

Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #10879 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 04:46 AM
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^^^^^Thanks, Mironto!! Can't wait to get this widget! Looks like I don't even have to remove the display from the wall!

Main HT Room: Panny TC-P65VT60 (calibrated by Chad B), Denon AVR-4311, Comcast X1 DVR, Apple TV3, Sony BDP-S5100, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers, Sierra Horizon and HTM-200SE, Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
Basement HT Room: Panny TC-P58V10 (Black Level Restored!), Denon AVR-E300, Comcast X1 STB, Sony BDP-S590, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics CBM-170SE (L/R), Ascend Acoustics CMT-340SE-C, Wave Crest HVL-1 (Surr) and Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
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post #10880 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 05:50 AM
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Incredible Job Mironto!

First time on this thread.
I have a Panny 50V20E, is it possible to fix this model?

Thank you
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post #10881 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 05:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mironto View Post

@Steve Kuester: Yes, the guide is pretty straight forward and easy, but it still requires some basic electronics skills like soldering and such. That might be a show-stopper for many users.

???

I didn't solder anything.

I also didn't play around with the test bed either. I just copied your code, loaded it onto the Arduino, and connected to the TV. Is that where you did some soldering, on the test bed?

I turn the sharpness on my TV all the way up, because that's how I like my picture... real sharp.
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post #10882 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 07:04 AM
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Depends on how you connect cables from Arduino to the PH service connector. If you have the crimps and crimp tool, you can just strip the insulation and attach crimps on one end and insert bare wire into Arduino on the other. I created a more permanent cable so I did some soldering but yes, you can do even without...

Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #10883 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by nunofcp View Post

Incredible Job Mironto!

First time on this thread.
I have a Panny 50V20E, is it possible to fix this model?

Thank you

I am 99% possitive it can be done on 50V20E following the same steps. A few pages back user bastek888 posted a hack on his P50VT20E where he unsoldered the A-board's EEPROM from the PCB and connected to I2C bus master. He reset the exact same memory bytes as all of us did on 12G models so the only question is whether the V20/VT20 models feature the same JST PH service connector/schematics that you could talk over I2C bus to A-board's EEPROM. You could give it a try and report back to help other users with the same model.

Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #10884 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by audiodane View Post

Okay, I have a basic blog setup with a feedback form to get some useful information from those interested in this little doodad that we're talking about.

Panasonic MLL Reset Widget / Feedback Request Form

I have a question ... are you sure the A18 connector has 20 pins, and not 11 pins??

BackOfTV_sm_labeled.jpg

That which may be known of God is evident within man, for God has shown it to them, so that they are without excuse. (Romans 1:19-20)
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post #10885 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 10:51 AM
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I have a question ... are you sure the A18 connector has 20 pins, and not 11pins?

It's a typo. You are right, it's 11pins.

Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #10886 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 04:21 PM
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I'll try my best to catch up..

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by moondog46 View Post

As I mentioned earlier, I am very interested in this miracle cure and I would love to aid you in your efforts, but I must reveal my utter newb-ness. Can you (or anyone) please tell me how to remove the plastic cover that will reveal the connectors on my set? I can find it OK thanks to the picture on your poll blog post, but I can't figure out how to safely remove it.

 

I think this was answered by Miro.. If you still have questions, let us know.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gov View Post

I have a 2009 V10 model. Do I need to remove it from the wall to access this plastic cover? Also what does the widget plug into, these PIN connectors?

 

Hopefully you won't need to take it off your wall.  I have a "narrow" mount from Monoprice, where the gap between the back of the TV and the wall face is around 1.5", and I was able to get it off with a little fiddling and a flathead screwdriver.  A hand mirror would work if you don't have a telescoping one.  Heck once the cover's off, you could probably just feel around with your fingers for a long connector and a skinny connector.  Nothing beats visual identification, though.  :)

As always, to be on the safe side, remove power from the TV before doing anything..  Disconnect from wall power, and then try to turn the TV on (it won't, hopefully!), to be the most safe.  Better safe than sorry!

 

To your second question-  Yes!  My goal is a little widget that plugs into one of these connectors.  Ideally, you'll plug it in and utterly forget about it.  I have some testing to do before I know if that's possible.  Second choice will involve a little pig-tail that dangles behind your TV with an LED and a button and it will reset when YOU tell it to.  That's less desirable, obviously.  I'll know in a couple weeks which approach it will require and will keep my blog updated..

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Kuester View Post

I hope this isn't viewed as negative towards what dane is trying to do, because I really don't mean it to be at all.

To those of you wanting to reset your black level, have you taken 10 minutes to read through the guide that mironto put together?

If you have already looked at his guide, take a second look and read step by step - you'll see how simple it really is.

Guide is located here...http://panasonic.mironto.sk/

 

Not taken as a negative at all, Steve, and thank you for the public reminder! And as a matter of fact, I'm building on what Miro has done myself, so I clearly don't want to downplay the wonderful work that he has done.  (Now that I think about it, I will go back and add a link on my site to Miro's- I should have done that all along, but was busy learning WordPress and getting this other stuff started! :( )

 

There will likely be plenty of people who want to go the approach you talk about- getting an arduino and downloading the software, and that's great!  I'm just offering another approach. My approach is smaller, even simpler (for those who say, "Ardu-what??"), and doesn't require a computer or a power supply.

 

By all means, I don't want anyone to think I'm doing anything "better" than Miro's solution; in fact it's the *SAME* solution!  Just a little more user-friendly.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomwil View Post


I have a question ... are you sure the A18 connector has 20 pins, and not 11 pins??

BackOfTV_sm_labeled.jpg

 

Oh no!!  You have NO IDEA how confusing this has been for me..  the higher-numbered connector (a18) has LESS pins.  The LOWER-numbered connector (a17) has MORE pins..  And I STILL made a goof making that image.  It's fixed now, thank you for catching this.  Luckily, all the answers received so far have been don't-know, or both.  Miro is the only one so far who has only ONE connector (A18, unfortunately).

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post #10887 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 05:12 PM
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Audiodane......I removed the cover and I have A17 and A18 on my 58V10 model. Thanks for all your efforts so far and I am looking forward to the widget!!!! biggrin.gif BTW, I was the one who completed your survey and initially did not know which PIN's my unit had.

Main HT Room: Panny TC-P65VT60 (calibrated by Chad B), Denon AVR-4311, Comcast X1 DVR, Apple TV3, Sony BDP-S5100, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers, Sierra Horizon and HTM-200SE, Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
Basement HT Room: Panny TC-P58V10 (Black Level Restored!), Denon AVR-E300, Comcast X1 STB, Sony BDP-S590, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics CBM-170SE (L/R), Ascend Acoustics CMT-340SE-C, Wave Crest HVL-1 (Surr) and Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
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post #10888 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gov View Post

Audiodane......I removed the cover and I have A17 and A18 on my 58V10 model. Thanks for all your efforts so far and I am looking forward to the widget!!!! biggrin.gif BTW, I was the one who completed your survey and initially did not know which PIN's my unit had.

Thank you, Gov!

My 65v10 is where the back is not easily accessible to check, but I'm 99% sure it is the same as the 58v10. I have not yet replied to the survey, as I did not have an answer. Now that I do... smile.gif

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post #10889 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 07:22 PM
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yes,I would not be surprised to find this in any PDP, and would simply calibrate after it occurs.thanks kec8
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post #10890 of 11930 Old 08-22-2013, 08:04 PM
Gov
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vader424242 View Post

Thank you, Gov!

My 65v10 is where the back is not easily accessible to check, but I'm 99% sure it is the same as the 58v10. I have not yet replied to the survey, as I did not have an answer. Now that I do... smile.gif


Yep...its gonna be the same smile.gif

Main HT Room: Panny TC-P65VT60 (calibrated by Chad B), Denon AVR-4311, Comcast X1 DVR, Apple TV3, Sony BDP-S5100, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics Sierra Towers, Sierra Horizon and HTM-200SE, Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
Basement HT Room: Panny TC-P58V10 (Black Level Restored!), Denon AVR-E300, Comcast X1 STB, Sony BDP-S590, Speakers: Ascend Acoustics CBM-170SE (L/R), Ascend Acoustics CMT-340SE-C, Wave Crest HVL-1 (Surr) and Dual Power Sound Audio XV15 Subwoofers
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