Panasonic 11G/12G/13G black levels have seemingly doubled overnight? - Page 368 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #11011 of 11930 Old 12-16-2013, 06:58 PM
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I didn't know that pixel "misfire" could be corrected or not just by adjusting the hours so the TV puts out a closer voltage match for the panel that's needed.I was under the impression pixel misfire could damage the panel. I think I'll buy the parts and give it a try.

Thanks miranto.
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post #11012 of 11930 Old 12-24-2013, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mironto View Post

Probably because he has European VT20 and Panasonic changed the service connector in 2010 for some reason? Would somebody with US GT20/VT20 confirm, if he has the same connectors on his set or the 11-pin is the same JST PH as on 2009 models?

Haven't checked back here in a while. I don't know know if this is still relevant, because I just skimmed the posts so far but here's a pic of the panel on the back of my VT25, the us version of the 20 I believe?

http://i.imgur.com/VcY4MnO.jpg

I'm going back to better read through these posts to see if I can fix my 2010.
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post #11013 of 11930 Old 12-25-2013, 05:15 PM
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I wonder, will mironto's DIY guide work with my different A18 connector? It carries the same name, but I wonder if the pin arrangement is different than the EU models. With the resistors disabled on the arduino board is there any danger to hooking it up wrong? Is finding out if it's hooked up correctly as simple as turning the TV on, getting the black screen, and being able to read the eeprom?
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post #11014 of 11930 Old 12-29-2013, 02:47 PM
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Will this method work for 10th generation panasonic th-42pz77u? I also have th-42pz80u that I may thy this method on.
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post #11015 of 11930 Old 01-02-2014, 01:51 PM
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I got my arduino today and failed to jury rig a connection to this tiny A18 connector. Pins too close together. So I ordered what I hope is the correct mating hardware from digikey. I'll let you guys know if it works, or if I have any problems with my 13g when it gets here.
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post #11016 of 11930 Old 01-02-2014, 05:51 PM
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Hello all:  I have a TCP54G10 model and stumbled across this forum when researching.  I'm new to AVS but just wanted to say there is great information here.  Audio Dane, I would definitely be interested in buying one of those PCMv1? products to "restore" mine to original levels.  I'm really not sure I could handle getting through the "do it yourself guide" process that has been posted as i'm not confident enough in my technical abilities to attempt something like that.  Thanks for the information and I'll be following closely to see if and when the product becomes available to help those of us who have these affected models.  That being said, 4 years later I still do love this TV.

 

Thanks

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post #11017 of 11930 Old 01-04-2014, 06:50 PM
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Just got the hardware in this afternoon, hooked it all up as best I could and followed mironto's guide for my 13g us model VT25. It seems it worked. Here's and imgur album to compare, forgive my crap camera skills.

http://imgur.com/a/oM8D1#0

I took 3 pics each of the black image, before and after, and 1 pic each of the batman scene, which is harder to see a difference. The camera settings were the same each round, and same amount of ambient light was present, that is very little. When I first sat down to look at the screen I didn't think anything had changed, but I suppose the camera has the upper hand here, and it proves a lower black level.

Oh yeah, pin 1 on my 13g model was towards the center of the tv. I ordered the 455-1601-ND connector which seems to be the same for the later UK models posted here, and I ordered the mating terminal pins, but couldn't get them to work with a pliers for crimp, they wouldn't fit into the holes after crimping and they're tiny as hell, annoying to work with. I used the male pins you find on 3 and 4 pin fan connectors you use in PCs. Seen here. I spent around $25 to "fix" my TV.

Thanks Mironto!
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post #11018 of 11930 Old 01-04-2014, 10:30 PM
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hermeslyre, what i2c programmer did you buy and where?
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post #11019 of 11930 Old 01-04-2014, 10:40 PM
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I ordered this guy for $23 with the prime trial so I got it in 2 days,

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00F6JCV20/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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post #11020 of 11930 Old 01-05-2014, 08:27 PM
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Awesome thank you.
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post #11021 of 11930 Old 01-09-2014, 11:04 AM
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Hello all.  Long time no post.  As expected, the holidays were quite busy.  But I'm back on the job now.  Small update on PMCv1 posted on my site.  Availability page updated with the models that I have reviewed for support.  A good number on the yes list, thank goodness.  More to do, but this is all I have time for this week.  Back to work!  :)

 

cheers,

..dane

 

ps.- something I forgot to mention in the update that I'll try to remember next time; The best I can do is look at hardware service manual support.  I have no idea if other models change the location of their hour-count data that this fix relies on.  That will be part of the user-testing necessary per-tv-model.  But that's also why I have an undo-switch included in the design..  :)

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post #11022 of 11930 Old 01-09-2014, 03:32 PM
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audiodane,

 

Thanks for the update and the time you are putting into this.  Much appreciated. Thanks.

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post #11023 of 11930 Old 01-10-2014, 11:21 AM
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Hi! I am from Europe and i have a Panasonic TX-P42V10 with the crushed blacks. I am looking foward to a friendly solution and i think this is a great approach to this problem. Will follow the developments on the subject and hope to buy one PMCv1 soon :-)
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post #11024 of 11930 Old 01-11-2014, 08:33 AM
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Hi Everyone,

 

I stumbled upon this thread a few months ago and a couple of days ago I followed Mironto's guide to restore black level on my TC-P58V10. There is an improvement, but I am not quite sure that the black level is back to 0h/out of the box level. The black level still seem much lighter than I remember it back at 0h. My eyes are probably playing tricks on me because I am comparing it to my TC-P65VT60.

 

After the restoration I noticed that the panel is brighter for the 1st few seconds after turning it on and then gets darker. I do not have any equipment to measure anything so this is all based on what my eyes are seeing in a dark room. I am not sure if it always has been like that or if that is the result of zeroing out the hours. 

 

I also have a TC-P42GT25 and tried to attempt to restore the black level on it using Mironto's guide. 1st thing I noticed that the service connector is smaller than on the V10, but still an 11 pin connector. I attached the Arduino I2C and 0V wires as in the same fashion as on the V10. I could not read any bytes. I wonder if the EEPROM I2C address is different than on V10 and it doesn't respond. I don't have a service manual for GT25 or for the V10 so I am not quite sure on just how different they are inside. Has anyone restored black level on their GT25? If so, can you share some details on how you did it? Thanks.

 

Bart 

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post #11025 of 11930 Old 01-11-2014, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EEbart View Post

Hi Everyone,

I stumbled upon this thread a few months ago and a couple of days ago I followed Mironto's guide to restore black level on my TC-P58V10. There is an improvement, but I am not quite sure that the black level is back to 0h/out of the box level. The black level still seem much lighter than I remember it back at 0h. My eyes are probably playing tricks on me because I am comparing it to my TC-P65VT60.

After the restoration I noticed that the panel is brighter for the 1st few seconds after turning it on and then gets darker. I do not have any equipment to measure anything so this is all based on what my eyes are seeing in a dark room. I am not sure if it always has been like that or if that is the result of zeroing out the hours. 

I also have a TC-P42GT25 and tried to attempt to restore the black level on it using Mironto's guide. 1st thing I noticed that the service connector is smaller than on the V10, but still an 11 pin connector. I attached the Arduino I2C and 0V wires as in the same fashion as on the V10. I could not read any bytes. I wonder if the EEPROM I2C address is different than on V10 and it doesn't respond. I don't have a service manual for GT25 or for the V10 so I am not quite sure on just how different they are inside. Has anyone restored black level on their GT25? If so, can you share some details on how you did it? Thanks.

Bart 

A couple posts up is my experience with my VT25. Pin arrangement was the same, I'm assuming because the fix worked. Pin 1 was towards the center of the TV. The connector I mentioned, I bought from digikey, very cheaply, and USPS got it to me in like 2 days.

My VT25 also displays the brightness shift when first turning it on. I remember this happened before I reset the counters, at least I think I do, does it happen on your GT25? It may be more apparent with a better black level.
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post #11026 of 11930 Old 01-11-2014, 08:32 PM
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GT25 does shift black level on PWR-up as well. The GT25 service connector pins 1 and 11 were marked on the silkscreen, so my connections were done the same way as on V10. Anyhow, I could not read any bytes back. 

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post #11027 of 11930 Old 01-11-2014, 09:41 PM
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It should work on your GT25 when It worked on my same generation. Might be worth it to spend the couple bucks for the connector and hook it up that way. I couldn't manage to get proper contact without it.
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post #11028 of 11930 Old 01-12-2014, 06:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audiodane View Post

Hello all.  Long time no post.  As expected, the holidays were quite busy.  But I'm back on the job now.  Small update on PMCv1 posted on my site.  Availability page updated with the models that I have reviewed for support.  A good number on the yes list, thank goodness.  More to do, but this is all I have time for this week.  Back to work!  smile.gif

cheers,
..dane

ps.- something I forgot to mention in the update that I'll try to remember next time; The best I can do is look at hardware service manual support.  I have no idea if other models change the location of their hour-count data that this fix relies on.  That will be part of the user-testing necessary per-tv-model.  But that's also why I have an undo-switch included in the design..  smile.gif


Thanks Dane!!!


smile.gif
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post #11029 of 11930 Old 01-13-2014, 01:10 AM
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@audiodane - If necessary and if it helps , i have acess to Service Manuals, from Panasonic Plasmas models from 2009-2011 range. I have already send my TX-P42V10E Service Manual to see if my model can be fixed, but i can also send another manuals.

PM if necessary :-)
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post #11030 of 11930 Old 01-14-2014, 01:00 PM
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Could someone (maybe mironto?) confirm, if this Arduino is ok to start the firsts steps of the restoring black level´s?

the site is portuguese, but the specifications are on english. My question is that the board Arduino Ver 3, appears to be slighty diferent from the one, used by mironto: http://www.coisas.com/Uno-r-3-compativel--cabo-usb-100-arduino-mega-tron-atmel,name,219885055,auction_id,auction_details

Can someone confirm it, so i can buy it? Thanks in advance
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post #11031 of 11930 Old 01-14-2014, 03:22 PM
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I somehow missed the notification about new post in the thread about a month ago (probably because of that P50ST60E replacing my P42G10E just before Christmas biggrin.gif).

@hermeslyre: Thanks a lot for the confirmation of successful reset on a VT25 model. I'll update the guide with your info regarding the connector and pinout (which should be the same as G10, right?). Could you please let me know the exact model of your TV?

@tpaxadpom: AFAIK 10G models SHOULD NOT be affected by the risen MLL, th-42pz80u as an 11G set is.

@EEbart: the MLL on V10 after the reset is 99.99% for sure the out-of-the-box black level (which isn't that great compared to today's models but was excellent back then). I've been having about 3-4 MLL changes on power-on before and after reset on my G10 so this is normal for V10 as well. Regarding the GT25, I bet it's a problem with contact as hermeslyre suggested.

@samdrlvt: I am not sure about the Arduino, it says it uses ATmega328 but the ones I found on eBay state ATmega328P (which might be the same thing and they missed one letter). If you can wait about two weeks, you can the exact same one as mine and even cheaper from HongKong/China. e.g. http://www.ebay.com/itm/UNO-R3-development-board-microcontroller-2012-MEGA328P-ATMEGA16U2-Arduino-Compat-/301068115910?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item46190edfc6.

Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #11032 of 11930 Old 01-14-2014, 04:03 PM
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Thanks for reply, mironto.

I am not good at soldering, so, i was thinking getting male-to-female jumper cables, to make a service cable that can make the connection between the arduino and the TV.

Can this be a good option to a "ready-to-use" cable connector? Example (among a lot of options): http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/40-Male-To-Female-Jumper-Breadboard-Wires-Arduino-20cm-/171212068026?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item27dd08d4ba
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post #11033 of 11930 Old 01-14-2014, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mironto View Post

@hermeslyre: Thanks a lot for the confirmation of successful reset on a VT25 model. I'll update the guide with your info regarding the connector and pinout (which should be the same as G10, right?). Could you please let me know the exact model of your TV?

It's a TC-P54VT25. The pinout was the same.

Enjoy your new set and thanks again, It's almost like getting a new TV!
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post #11034 of 11930 Old 01-15-2014, 12:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mironto View Post


@tpaxadpom: AFAIK 10G models SHOULD NOT be affected by the risen MLL, th-42pz80u as an 11G set is.
Mironto,thank you for the reply. My 10G panasonic is about 6 years old and I have a total of 324hrs. It's a bedroom tv and not being used that much. I've calibrated the tv after I've got it and mll measured at 0.012fl and now it measured at 0.029ftl. I could see the worsening of the black level with naked eye. It was probably triggered ~300hrs.
th-42pz77u has the eeprom that stores the hours of operation but the service manual doesn't have "eeprom write" next to service connector. Reference designator for that eeprom is even the same as for th-42pz80u which is 11g (though the panasonic part number is different, I haven't looked at the pinout yet). I don't know if I can overwrite that eeprom or not. If I purchase the programmer I may play with it. Perhaps I can decode the number of turn on cycles if I read the first bytes from eeprom. It would be great if someone could take at look at the service manual as the pinout is a bit different. I want to make sure I can disable other devices on I2C bus with the signals routed to service connector. If it was only designed to read the contest of eeprom (unlikely) then it won't be possible. I can e-mail the service manual or it can be downloaded from the elektrotanya website.

PS: I just noticed that 100IRE light output is 23.8ftl versus 14ftl with the same settings. It is possible someone was messing with the settings (myself included) and didn't return them back. But regardless of what happened black level got worse.
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post #11035 of 11930 Old 01-15-2014, 12:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samdrlvt View Post

Thanks for reply, mironto.

I am not good at soldering, so, i was thinking getting male-to-female jumper cables, to make a service cable that can make the connection between the arduino and the TV.

Can this be a good option to a "ready-to-use" cable connector? Example (among a lot of options): http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/40-Male-To-Female-Jumper-Breadboard-Wires-Arduino-20cm-/171212068026?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item27dd08d4ba

It is possible to use the jumper wires (I used them myself during the first reset before I got hold of the JST connector), but the black female plastic won't fit into the connecotr housing so you must remove it first. Also, the crimps are 2.54mm while service connector pins are 2.0mm, so they won't hold in place. You have to squish them a bit with plyers. But pittsoccer33 used different jump wires that fit perfectly to the connector in this post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpaxadpom View Post

Mironto,thank you for the reply. My 10G panasonic is about 6 years old and I have a total of 324hrs. It's a bedroom tv and not being used that much. I've calibrated the tv after I've got it and mll measured at 0.012fl and now it measured at 0.029ftl. I could see the worsening of the black level with naked eye. It was probably triggered ~300hrs.
th-42pz77u has the eeprom that stores the hours of operation but the service manual doesn't have "eeprom write" next to service connector. reference designator for that eeprom is even the same as for th-42pz80u which is 11g. I don't know if I can overwrite that eeprom or not. If I purchase the programmer I may play with it. Perhaps I can decode the number of turn on cycles if I read the first bytes from eeprom. It would be great if someone could take at the service manual as the pinout is a bit different. I want tomake sure I can disable other devices on I2C bus with the signals routed to service connector. If it was only designed to read the contest of eeprom (unlikely) then it won't be possible. I can e-mail the service manual or it can be downloaded from the elektrotanya website.

PS: I just noticed that 100IRE light output is 23.8ftl versus 14ftl with the same settings. It is possible someone was messing with the settings (myself included) and didn't return them back. But regardless of what happened black level got worse.

From what I remember, there were reports in this thread that 10G model should stay the same. Atm. I can only think of LarryInRI's measurements, but maybe there are more (but it's still possible, that your set is affected).

Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #11036 of 11930 Old 01-15-2014, 12:39 AM
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Thanks mironto

one more question (sorry, but i am trying to gather all info prior to reset my set).
I have a TX-P42V10E, and the service connector has 11 pins. When you describe diferent "pin 1" locations (G10 vs V10) on your guide, i should always follow the connections on the image available at http://panasonic.mironto.sk/restoring_black/service_connector/ , right?
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post #11037 of 11930 Old 01-15-2014, 01:47 AM
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Yes, the pinout is the same and you always connect to pins 3,8,9,10. I just noted where pin 1 is located so you start counting from the right end.

Edit: corrected first pin from 4 to 3.

Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #11038 of 11930 Old 01-15-2014, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mironto View Post

Yes, the pinout is the same and you always connect to pins 4,8,9,10. I just noted where pin 1 is located so you start counting from the right end.

Hi

just to be on the safe side, i have checked the service manual on my TX-P42V10E, and there´s the following scheme, about the service connector (11 pins):




In that scheme, the pin number 10 has a diferent description from the service connector scheme on your guide.

However, with that in mind and the previous remarks, can i make the connections on the pin connectors, in the same order, as described on your guide?:



Sorry to be a somewhat annoying noob, but i am very curious to follow your project and i am trying to make an effort on following a guide on a "strange" language / procedures... one thing is positive: on my research on this subject i have learned a lot about arduino language and electronics (a subject that previously i don´t read/learn about :-)
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post #11039 of 11930 Old 01-16-2014, 06:05 AM
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The manual might have different label on the pin 10, but it's I2C control for sure. You can go ahead and connect it according to the guide. And you don't need to appologise for asking questions, six month ago my knowledge about I2C/Arduino/EEPROM was almost non-existent biggrin.gif
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Panasonic plasma black level restoration
Step-by-step guide for restoring the initial MLL on a Panasonic G10 plasma
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post #11040 of 11930 Old 01-16-2014, 07:01 AM
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Thanks! Already bought the Arduino UNO rev. 3 (i went the safe route and bought an original one - 18 euros) and bought the cable jumpers (first try, let´s see if they fit or not)... and next week, i have all the material to test and give my V10 the treatment :-)

Will report back the results :-)
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