Black levels on LG good enough for first time plasma-er??? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 12:53 AM - Thread Starter
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I'm in my preliminary stages of shopping for a new TV and so far all I have narrowed down is that I do want a plasma (my living room is never intensely lit and I do most of my viewing at night in low light) and size (50"). I have an entry level budget and was looking at the 720p sets from Panasonic and Samsung, but I came across the LG 50PS11 for a good price. The only thing I ever hear about LG's is that they have "really bad" black levels, but that everything else is fairly solid outside of no AR coating vs similar priced competitors. My current TV is a 4 year old Magnavox LCD. I'm assuming that the "bad " black levels on the LG would seem like a huge jump forward for me. Are they only bad for a keen eye comparing to other plasmas or are they inexpensive LCD bad (can't imagine that they are). Really like the idea of going with a 1080p set for possible limited pc use but still staying in the $850 budget.
Please don't just tell me to go to the store and look at them as the only place I have found the LG is Costco (extremely bright) and they do not provide a remote to play around with to make sure both it and the panny next to it are ideally configured for my preference.
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post #2 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 01:16 AM
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personally, i think you're better off with a samsung or panasonic. they both make great tv's. lg's hardly get any mention around here and there's a good reason. panny and sammy are much better.
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post #3 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 05:21 AM
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It'll be fine as long as you don't have a Kuro right next to it to compare it to.
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post #4 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 01:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the replies. That is exactly what I'm looking for, except for the reasoning behind it. I have never seen a high end PDP in person as here in Santa Barbara County in CA, if it cost a lot and isn't the most green option nobody will carry it in stock. So I have really been limited to the entry level panels. That works for me because I don't know what I'm missing. Is there another issue with LG vs the others that would be more obvious to the less trained eye? Keep in mind I am looking at ENTRY LEVEL screens (x1, etc). I would be using it in a living room with well controlled lighting for what I imagine will be the next 3-5 years.
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post #5 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 01:06 PM
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why not get a Panasonic 50S1?
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post #6 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 01:26 PM - Thread Starter
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The S1 is out of my budget unless the price drops to the low $800 range or maybe a bit more if Costco has it ($100 gift card ) I would like the NeoPDP but I don't see it dropping into my price range even with the 2010 models on the horizon. I am patient and can wait a while, but I am not familiar with price trends with plasma. Would I get more bang for my buck by holding out until the 2010 models? When do manufacturers generally roll out their new lines (Spring? Summer?)
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post #7 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sparko2019 View Post

The S1 is out of my budget unless the price drops to the low $800 range or maybe a bit more if Costco has it ($100 gift card ) I would like the NeoPDP but I don't see it dropping into my price range even with the 2010 models on the horizon. I am patient and can wait a while, but I am not familiar with price trends with plasma. Would I get more bang for my buck by holding out until the 2010 models? When do manufacturers generally roll out their new lines (Spring? Summer?)

Check Sears current price (good thru Saturday) on the 50" Panny S1. If you have a large Sears anywhere close they should have both the 50" S1 and the LG50PS11 on display.

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post #8 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Steve S View Post

Check Sears current price (good thru Saturday) on the 50" Panny S1. If you have a large Sears anywhere close they should have both the 50" S1 and the LG50PS11 on display.

What he said.... Hurry up to visit your nearest sears and snag a 50" S1, they're right at the price you want them. I got myself a 50" G10 this Monday for a sweet price.
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post #9 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 01:45 PM
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I just got a new 60PS11 and blacks are ok not kuro but again nothing out there is, not even panasonic which some have said the blacks get worse longer they own it. I own a samsung plasma which has ok blacks. I'm sure you will be happy with an LG just remember to give it 100-300 hrs to break in a little, blacks should get better after a few hundred hours. If your a videophile you won't be happy with anything but kuro. I have seen pioneer against panny and samsung and it makes their blacks look like gray.
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post #10 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted by integra1972 View Post

I just got a new 60PS11 and blacks are ok not kuro but again nothing out there is, not even panasonic which some have said the blacks get worse longer they own it. I own a samsung plasma which has ok blacks. I'm sure you will be happy with an LG just remember to give it 100-300 hrs to break in a little, blacks should get better after a few hundred hours. If your a videophile you won't be happy with anything but kuro. I have seen pioneer against panny and samsung and it makes their blacks look like gray.

How does the LG hold up the Samsung, and which model Samsung do you have ?
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post #11 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 05:19 PM
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I have the Samsung 50A450 which is not known for blacks it was free as well as my LG PS6011 was free. The blacks are OK on my samsung, it got better after 150 hrs and kept getting little better. LG, I just hooked up around 4 pm yesterday and less than 16hrs on it. Jeanette Lee is on American Chopper in all black as well as a lot of other blacks being showed. I'm really surprised how good this set looks at this rate in another 100-200 hrs it should look pretty good for such a low end set, I think after some tweaking and some time for normal plasma break it will more do the job for me. I'm more picky about color than blacks. Even if Paid retail for this LG I don't know how one can complain for the little they ask.
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post #12 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 05:22 PM
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Apparently the '10 series have much improved blacks, that was a point they emphasized during their CES keynote.
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post #13 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 08:56 PM
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I think someone is nit picking wayyyy too much.
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post #14 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 09:27 PM
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Both Costco and Sears often demonstrate the Panasonic P50X1 right next to the LG 50PQ20/30. Dismissers aside, on picture alone when seen in those two venues, it's hard to see how one would choose the Panasonic over the LG.

Sears will usually let you play with the remotes to your heart's content; Costco gives you a second year of warranty.
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post #15 of 44 Old 01-07-2010, 11:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input. Unfortunately the closest sears doesn't have the S1 in stock and there is no chance of making it elsewhere before the sale ends. For right now I am ruling it out as an option unless it drops before I find time to purchase something else. I really haven't heard of anyone who is upset with their purchase of an LG (outside of manuf. defects that are realistically just as likely to occur to any product, they all have that 5% that has something). I'm just really struggling with the idea that to my eye (at the store) the LG looked better than the panny in every way except for the x1 not having anywhere close to the amount of reflection of the BRIGHT costco overhead lighting. I don't think I would be disappointed in the black level of ANY plasma vs what I am used to. So.... besides black level and reflection, what makes it inferior to the panny? Is there something I am missing about LG's that I wouldn't discover until I get it home? I'm giving license to give me fact, opinion, speculation, hate... whatever about the budget 1080p sets from LG.
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post #16 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 04:55 AM
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sparko2019, I think you will be happy with the LG. Like I said earlier, I just hooked up my LG6011 and sit 8 feet away and I'm really surprised how well this set does. After reading and reading on this forum and everyone saying how bad the blacks are on this LG and how bad the IR is. I'm really pleased with how well this set is doing out of the box. Things I have notice so far 1, the colors are off so it will take some playing and adjusting, 2 after about 15 hrs it has smoothed out more. 3 it doesn't like direct light hopefully after the first few hundred hrs I can crank up the contrast and that will help, plus the black out blinds I'm going to order, 4 it seems to be brighter than I was expecting. Overall all for the price it's a heck of a deal.
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post #17 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 05:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sparko2019 View Post

Thanks for the replies. That is exactly what I'm looking for, except for the reasoning behind it. I have never seen a high end PDP in person as here in Santa Barbara County in CA, if it cost a lot and isn't the most green option nobody will carry it in stock. So I have really been limited to the entry level panels. That works for me because I don't know what I'm missing. Is there another issue with LG vs the others that would be more obvious to the less trained eye? Keep in mind I am looking at ENTRY LEVEL screens (x1, etc). I would be using it in a living room with well controlled lighting for what I imagine will be the next 3-5 years.

We have two LGs in the family, and both have suffered with failures. One was the power supply, found a used one for $200 installed. The other was a tuner card failure, a week out of warranty, $380 to fix that one. Both sets are under two years old.

And then there was my LG washer and dryer... They have both been sold on CraigsList after a catastrophic failure that flooded the house, and thank God we were home. If not for the Sears Warranty, the repair would have cost near a grand out of pocket. Replaced with an old fashioned set of new Speed Queens...

We are very leery of LG in this household...

For what it is worth.

Have you looked at Vizio? They seem to be getting better and better reviews and seem to be in your price range.
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post #18 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by localnet View Post

We have two LGs in the family, and both have suffered with failures... Both sets are under two years old.

To reiterate: Costco gives a second year of warranty (along with a 90-day return period). That's where I'd buy any of them, if possible.
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post #19 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 07:59 AM
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I'm looking at the LG 60PS80 (it's the model with the NetFlix capability).

It's on Amazon for $1859 with free scheduled delivery and no tax.

Good deal?
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post #20 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 08:20 AM
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That's an OK deal, though at that price you could also get a 58" Samsung/Panasonic.

The best deal in big plasmas these days is the LG 60PS11, which can be had for several hundred less than the one you cite.
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post #21 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by PrimeTime View Post

That's an OK deal, though at that price you could also get a 58" Samsung/Panasonic.

The best deal in big plasmas these days is the LG 60PS11, which can be had for several hundred less than the one you cite.

I really like the features on the LG model. The Netflix, and network connectivity is a big plus for me.

I also like the aesthetics better on the LG. I've seen it in person and it looks nice since the front is like a single pane of glass. Looks really slick.

I saw deal on the 60PS11, but doesn't have the network connectivity. I haven't seen it in person though, I wonder if it has that single glass pane design in the front as well.
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post #22 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 09:23 AM
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Originally Posted by IBJanky View Post

I really like the features on the LG model. The Netflix, and network connectivity is a big plus for me.

I also like the aesthetics better on the LG. I've seen it in person and it looks nice since the front is like a single pane of glass. Looks really slick.

I saw deal on the 60PS11, but doesn't have the network connectivity. I haven't seen it in person though, I wonder if it has that single glass pane design in the front as well.

The 60ps11 does not have the single glass pane design.

As to the the original poster, my 60PS11 looks great and I have had no issues with it. Glare and reflections will be noticeable though as it has no reflective coating. If however you could get the panny s1 for the same price I would go for it. Nothing wrong with the 50ps11 though. Good value and great picture.

Lorenzo
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post #23 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 12:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the help. I'm going to plan on getting the LG for now, but realized today that I desperately need to take a look at a new tv stand first to fit the larger set. Unfortunately that bridges the gap between home theatre and furniture, so I have to find one my wife likes for a price I like. SPEED BUMP. Does anyone know when the 2010 models would be rolling out?
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post #24 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sparko2019 View Post

The S1 is out of my budget unless the price drops to the low $800 range or maybe a bit more if Costco has it ($100 gift card ) I would like the NeoPDP but I don't see it dropping into my price range even with the 2010 models on the horizon. I am patient and can wait a while, but I am not familiar with price trends with plasma. Would I get more bang for my buck by holding out until the 2010 models? When do manufacturers generally roll out their new lines (Spring? Summer?)

Sears has the 50S1 for $899 through 8/9. Thinking about getting it myself! Either that or the 54S1 which also is on sale.
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post #25 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 07:36 PM
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I have been using a 42PG20 (which is one of their entry level plasmas) for the past year and a half. I have had NO problems with it. I calibrated it with an eye-one display using color HFCR software and a DVE HD calibration disc . The picture is great. Color accuracy, grey scale, gamma all set giving this set the best picture it can have considering it's price point. The black level is 'slightly' less dark that the other plasmas of it's time but I would imagine the newer LG's are better. I do get a little IR but it goes away quickly. One thing great about the newer LG's is the level of adjustabilty they give one in the menu system (like a 10 point grey scale tracking adjustment...of which mine is only a 2 point). I think you will be very satisfied with your purchase.
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post #26 of 44 Old 01-08-2010, 09:42 PM
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Sears has the 50S1 for $899 through 8/9. Thinking about getting it myself! Either that or the 54S1 which also is on sale.

I think you mean thru Jan 9th.

Steve S.
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post #27 of 44 Old 01-09-2010, 04:50 AM
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I have the LG 60PS80 plasma. After turning off the energy saver feature and making the color adjustments I have been amazed at the vibrant colors and yes the deep blacks. Awesome shadow detail. I was leaning toward a Sammy or Panny but when making the right adjustments the picture is great. I miss my 61" JVC but this plasma rocks! As mentioned here the cabinet esthetics are the best of any brand.
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post #28 of 44 Old 01-09-2010, 06:14 AM
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I have the LG 60PS80 plasma. After turning off the energy saver feature and making the color adjustments I have been amazed at the vibrant colors and yes the deep blacks. Awesome shadow detail. I was leaning toward a Sammy or Panny but when making the right adjustments the picture is great. I miss my 61" JVC but this plasma rocks! As mentioned here the cabinet esthetics are the best of any brand.

I have the LG 60PS11, about 25hrs on it, and I'm noticing subtle changes the more i use it colors getting better, and blacks getting better, the one thing I have noticed is garbage in garbage out. blu-ray looks very-good, DirecTV depends what your watching some stuff looks really good and some total crap.
So far very impressed with this set. IMO this set has less noise than the S1 and is just as good if not a little edge in color.
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post #29 of 44 Old 01-10-2010, 05:24 AM
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Originally Posted by integra1972 View Post

I have the LG 60PS11, about 25hrs on it, and I'm noticing subtle changes the more i use it colors getting better, and blacks getting better, the one thing I have noticed is garbage in garbage out. blu-ray looks very-good, DirecTV depends what your watching some stuff looks really good and some total crap.
So far very impressed with this set. IMO this set has less noise than the S1 and is just as good if not a little edge in color.

Integra1972, I have read if the horizontal bars are as black as the tv frame then you have excellant black levels. I have that and it's better than my JVC. Did you activate Orbiter? I have no signs of IR but decided to activate it. This should be the best selling plasma given the value and excellant picture.
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post #30 of 44 Old 01-10-2010, 05:49 AM
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Integra1972, I have read if the horizontal bars are as black as the tv frame then you have excellant black levels. I have that and it's better than my JVC. Did you activate Orbiter? I have no signs of IR but decided to activate it. This should be the best selling plasma given the value and excellant picture.

Yes, that's what they say if they look inky black or match your tv frame blacks are good, it's all subjective to the user. I have seen the pioneer Kuro against panny, samsung and LG and Kuro is truly black. I'm not an videophile so I don't worry about it to much, I'm way more picky about color, I'm really pleased with this LG in that respect for 60in tv this thing really holds it's own. I'm trying to decide if I want to get it calibrated at the moment. I'm wondering if Chad B. could squeeze the max blacks and color out of it. I have seen IR but it goes away quickly when changing video source, I have mine set on standard, but I'm going to switch it to orbiter and see what it does. The only thing I don't like about the tv is reflections, I'm going to be buying some blackout cellular blinds to remedy this.
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