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post #1 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 01:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Took my wife to the stores tonight to look at the Panasonic plasmas and the Samsung LCDs that I've narrowed my search down to. As we sat watching a P50S1 in Sears, I noticed that on brighter scenes (lots of white on screen) I noticed flicker.

I'm not talking about judder, 24p mode or anything of the sort. I'm talking about refresh rate flicker. I've always been sensitive to it. I've worked IT/software for 10+ years, and when CRT monitors were prevalent, I could tell from across the room when someone had their monitor set on 60Hz refresh rate.

My question is, are there any plasma owners who share my flicker-sensitivity, who are comfortable with their plasma? e.g. you may notice the flicker once in a while but it doesn't bug you? I realize that's completely subjective, but I know that I was standing there staring at that screen *trying* to see anything wrong with it that I could find. And I only saw the flicker when the scene was bright (really, only when there was a lot of white on the screen). My wife really likes the look of plasma over LCD, and I am right in the middle, so if this is something that likely won't bug me then we'll go with the plasma.

Thanks for any feedback.
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post #2 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 05:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Alright... anyone that's bothered by flicker had that be a determinant in *not* choosing a plasma set? That is probably a question better asked in the LCD or general panel forum, but I'll try here first.
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post #3 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 06:07 PM
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I guess everyone is different, but what the heck.

I'm extremely bothered by CRTs lower than 85Hz.

I'm somewhat bothered by florescent lighting in the workplace.

I'm extremely bothered by CCFL backlights in common LCD displays.

LED LCD's are great for my eyes. Plasma TV's are great for my eyes.
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post #4 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderhouserules View Post

Took my wife to the stores tonight to look at the Panasonic plasmas and the Samsung LCDs that I've narrowed my search down to. As we sat watching a P50S1 in Sears, I noticed that on brighter scenes (lots of white on screen) I noticed flicker.

I'm not talking about judder, 24p mode or anything of the sort. I'm talking about refresh rate flicker. I've always been sensitive to it. I've worked IT/software for 10+ years, and when CRT monitors were prevalent, I could tell from across the room when someone had their monitor set on 60Hz refresh rate.

My question is, are there any plasma owners who share my flicker-sensitivity, who are comfortable with their plasma? e.g. you may notice the flicker once in a while but it doesn't bug you? I realize that's completely subjective, but I know that I was standing there staring at that screen *trying* to see anything wrong with it that I could find. And I only saw the flicker when the scene was bright (really, only when there was a lot of white on the screen). My wife really likes the look of plasma over LCD, and I am right in the middle, so if this is something that likely won't bug me then we'll go with the plasma.

Thanks for any feedback.

In my experience PDP flicker was/is the most noticeable when observing both LCD and PDP together (e.g. - in a retail invironment). The 100% duty cycle of LCD is such a contrast to the 30-40% duty cycle of PDP the flicker in the PDP stands out and is more percievable (especially in peripheral vision). When I got the display home the perception of flicker has completely dissapeared.

However, human visual systems vary greatly. This is only my experience.

Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind
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post #5 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 07:19 PM
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I, too, am one of those people who used to get annoyed when OTHER people's monitors were set to a refresh rate less than 85Hz or so. I would always have to "fix" their screens ASAP.

Anyway, I consider myself very sensitive to flicker, and I have found that while watching movies, it really does NOT bother me, and in some ways it reminds me of the experience of watching a film in a theater. As for the 48Hz "film mode" found on Panasonics, the flicker is too obvious for me to bear.

One important correlation that I am not sure has been fully discussed is the ability to see green phosphor trails much more easily the more sensitive you are to low refresh rates. I find that I often see green "flashes" as my eyes move back and forth across the screen, usually just on high contrast images. It is something that really bothered me initially, but after just a few weeks of viewing I tend to ignore it / not see it. It is most apparent while viewing black and white content.

One last thought on the flicker issue: at 60Hz, plasmas are cycling at the same rate that CRTs do, so if you got used to CRTs (and most likely you did), you will probably get used to a plasma screen.
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post #6 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 08:22 PM
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Quote:


I, too, am one of those people who used to get annoyed when OTHER people's monitors were set to a refresh rate less than 85Hz or so. I would always have to "fix" their screens ASAP

And I thought I was the only one

Back to the OP - never even gave it a second thought on my plasma. I've never noticed it, never even thought to look for it, and in fact just turned mine on to see if it bothered me now - nope...
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post #7 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 08:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Sweet, thanks guys.

Yes, I always went over and showed the person how to change their monitor refresh rate to 75Hz at least. Drove me nuts.

I've had nothing but CRT TVs my whole life, so this is my first HDTV of any kind. I've never had a problem watching CRT TVs which have a noticeable flicker if you pay attention and watch for it, I suppose. Just wanted a little reassurance I guess.
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post #8 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderhouserules View Post

Took my wife to the stores tonight to look at the Panasonic plasmas and the Samsung LCDs that I've narrowed my search down to. As we sat watching a P50S1 in Sears, I noticed that on brighter scenes (lots of white on screen) I noticed flicker.

I'm not talking about judder, 24p mode or anything of the sort. I'm talking about refresh rate flicker. I've always been sensitive to it. I've worked IT/software for 10+ years, and when CRT monitors were prevalent, I could tell from across the room when someone had their monitor set on 60Hz refresh rate.

My question is, are there any plasma owners who share my flicker-sensitivity, who are comfortable with their plasma? e.g. you may notice the flicker once in a while but it doesn't bug you? I realize that's completely subjective, but I know that I was standing there staring at that screen *trying* to see anything wrong with it that I could find. And I only saw the flicker when the scene was bright (really, only when there was a lot of white on the screen). My wife really likes the look of plasma over LCD, and I am right in the middle, so if this is something that likely won't bug me then we'll go with the plasma.

Thanks for any feedback.

I have a Panny 50G10 & overall I love the set. But I do experience exactly what you are seeing. Flicker (or perhaps brightness shift) on bright areas especially on faces which tend to be the bright area & I am the same a guy who always fixes peoples CRT monitors that are set to 60 Hz. I also am sensitive to frame rate drops & screen tearing. Long time PC gamer BTW.

So its hard to say. I am trying hard to ignore it & enjoy whats really great about the set & there is so much to like. The contrast & black levels are superb but I do see this effect too. So its hard to say as I do believe its in the eye of the beholder. But you must realize all types& brands of tv's have their good & bad & Panny's seem to flicker a bit from what I have read around investigating this effect.

Cam
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post #9 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 10:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, this flicker, and the possibility of the blacks-rising bug are about the only thing I can really chalk up against the Panasonics as of now.

The great price/larger size, great picture, etc. are all weighing heavily against those two things and I'll just have to put up with it if it ends up bothering me. It'll be worth it.
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post #10 of 26 Old 01-08-2010, 10:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderhouserules View Post

Well, this flicker, and the possibility of the blacks-rising bug are about the only thing I can really chalk up against the Panasonics as of now.

The great price/larger size, great picture, etc. are all weighing heavily against those two things and I'll just have to put up with it if it ends up bothering me. It'll be worth it.

That's basically where I'm at. I don't like the flickers & I am concerned about the Black Level Rise too potentially. But the set is a beauty overall nonetheless.

Cam
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post #11 of 26 Old 08-04-2012, 07:07 PM
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Holy cow! I guess I never realized this effected so few people. I am very sensative to low refresh rate flicker. Without realizing it, I just purchased a 55" gt50 plasma and it is bothering the heck out of me.. Didn't realize this was still an issue with plasmas.
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post #12 of 26 Old 08-04-2012, 07:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhoenixLev View Post

Holy cow! I guess I never realized this effected so few people. I am very sensative to low refresh rate flicker. Without realizing it, I just purchased a 55" gt50 plasma and it is bothering the heck out of me.. Didn't realize this was still an issue with plasmas.

Don't have a cow man.
It's normal untill it's broken in and those phosphor's need time to cook.
My e450 had noticeable flicker the first 5 days when it was bellowing
out some major heat from the front and back.
It was a different kind of flicker compared to my SonyXBR 36" CRT and not nearly as bad.
It is a little freeky at first but it will go away and in time look rock solid.
New plasmas screens need time to settle, their is now way around it.
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post #13 of 26 Old 10-08-2012, 08:45 AM
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Originally Posted by sonyfan View Post

Don't have a cow man.
It's normal untill it's broken in and those phosphor's need time to cook.
My e450 had noticeable flicker the first 5 days when it was bellowing
out some major heat from the front and back.
It was a different kind of flicker compared to my SonyXBR 36" CRT and not nearly as bad.
It is a little freeky at first but it will go away and in time look rock solid.
New plasmas screens need time to settle, their is now way around it.

I hope you are right. Just picked up a Panasonic TC-P55ST50 and the flicker is pretty obvious when watching high contrast material. Though it has been under 100 hours. Hoping to see some things settle. Other than that the display is gorgeous.
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post #14 of 26 Old 10-10-2012, 02:59 PM
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Interesting. I've never noticed any flicker on my 65VT50 even on 96hz. I do notice the "phosphor trails" I believe they are called. I also see dlp "rainbows."

NHT speakers, Denon 4520, 65VT50
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post #15 of 26 Old 10-10-2012, 05:42 PM
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Yes, I do notice flickering when there's large amounts of white on the screen.

However, unless I use the TV as a computer monitor, it's extremely rare to have large amounts of white on the screen for prolonged periods. It happens so infrequently that's it not really an issue. And even when it flickers it's definitely not CRT @ 60 Hz bad.
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post #16 of 26 Old 11-27-2012, 01:29 PM
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To those bothered by the flicker: did it go away as you broke in the TV, or is it just as annoying?

I just switched from LCD to plasma and am seriously bothered by the flicker and am trying to find a solution around this problem.
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post #17 of 26 Old 11-27-2012, 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by nikseldon View Post

To those bothered by the flicker: did it go away as you broke in the TV, or is it just as annoying?
I just switched from LCD to plasma and am seriously bothered by the flicker and am trying to find a solution around this problem.

Its been over 400 hours on this set. The hot flashes as id call em are still there. You do get used to it and depending on the movie I dont see them at all. Get some bias lighting and use D-NICE settings you should be happy.
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post #18 of 26 Old 11-27-2012, 05:18 PM
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I just got a new Plasma (Samsung PN60E530) and I wanted to confirm what everyone is describing as flicker. I'm watching a basketball game right now on ESPN and I see occasional "white" flashes almost like you are seeing a camera flash every so often. Is this the flicker everyone is describing? Or do I have something else going on?

Not sure if I'm seeing things but it almost looks like the "flashing" I'm seeing on the ESPN basketball game is lights actually flashing inside the basketball arena. They showed a shot of the upper level where you could see the arena lights up there and I saw a few lights flashing in the screen. Seems weird and I can't tell if I'm just seeing this "flashing" that everyone's describing in this thread.
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post #19 of 26 Old 11-27-2012, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Midwest User1 View Post

I just got a new Plasma (Samsung PN60E530) and I wanted to confirm what everyone is describing as flicker. I'm watching a basketball game right now on ESPN and I see occasional "white" flashes almost like you are seeing a camera flash every so often. Is this the flicker everyone is describing? Or do I have something else going on?
Not sure if I'm seeing things but it almost looks like the "flashing" I'm seeing on the ESPN basketball game is lights actually flashing inside the basketball arena. They showed a shot of the upper level where you could see the arena lights up there and I saw a few lights flashing in the screen. Seems weird and I can't tell if I'm just seeing this "flashing" that everyone's describing in this thread.

Pretty much. The easiest way to reproduce the phenomenon is to flick your eyes around the screen refocusing on different points. From side to side left to right or right to left. Any image that will be very dark next to white or yellowish bright highlights I see blue/white hot flashes. You can minimize the effect by lowering the contrast and using bias lighting.
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post #20 of 26 Old 11-27-2012, 06:48 PM
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Only notice it when up close to tv.far away dont notice it.the brightest bright whites to me look a bit overly bright on plasmas but some calibrating surely would reduce it.you will notice the dull all bright screens on it.
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post #21 of 26 Old 11-28-2012, 01:31 PM
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I pretty much use it as my only monitor for the PC and it is fairly annoying on white backrounds... Like right now, as I am writing this post...
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post #22 of 26 Old 11-28-2012, 03:50 PM
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More info. What's odd is I only see this white flashing on ESPN and only with a basketball game on. During commercials of that same channel there are no white flashes. I also only see the flicker when ESPN shows highlights of those same basketball games. Another weird one is that ESPN did a picture in picture where they put the current basketball game into a small window and ONLY the small window with the basketball game had the white flashes. It almost appears like those white flashes are in the source of those basketball games. If I rewind the game those flashes are still there in the same spots. I'm starting to wonder if those flashes are inside of the basketball arena (i.e. part of the lit up bill board banners) and the cameras are seeing them therefore so am I. Anyone else notice this while watching basketball games?
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post #23 of 26 Old 11-28-2012, 04:12 PM
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It's a flash in the source as I just put the same Wisconsin Badger basketball game on in my sons room and the same flashing is visible and he has an LCD TV. I'm just surprised I never noticed this before with my old Sony XRD LCD TV. Oh well I know it's not my TV at least smile.gif
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post #24 of 26 Old 11-29-2012, 12:47 AM
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That's camera flash bulbs.The op is referring to a refresh rate thing. Maybe try turn down the gains and turn up the bias controls.

the 2 plasmas I've had have been overly bright in the small brightest white patches on screen, torch mode like.
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post #25 of 26 Old 02-13-2014, 07:39 PM
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I am seeing the same thing with basketball games.  It is most prevalent on espn but also see the flicker on the big ten network.  Is this a directv thing or an espn thing?

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post #26 of 26 Old 02-13-2014, 10:18 PM
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Turn dynamic contrast off,lower contrast setting,lower sharpness setting,brighter gamma,warmer color tone.
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