The Official Panasonic TC-PXXS2 Owner's Discussion Thread [NO Price talk] - Page 19 - AVS Forum
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post #541 of 2271 Old 08-25-2010, 09:55 PM
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Picked up the 42" today. Seemed like the best model I could find for the price. Hoping to find a way to get the gamma working better, but regardless, it's a nice picture from this tv.

The front filter didn't really bother me, the blacks were better than the lower end models and the S looked close to the G series, that I couldn't really justify the cost increase of a G25.

Looks like the build date is July, so blacks should hold on longer than I expected.

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post #542 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 03:02 AM
 
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I don't see where July has anything to do with blacks.

As far as gamma goes, a proper calibration will help the curve, other than that, you can spend $900 on a DVDO Duo and dial in whatever gamma you want.
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post #543 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 05:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

I don't see where July has anything to do with blacks.

This was posted on another thread:

Originally Posted by Orta
They extended the time span this algorithm (or whatever you would call it) operates over with April (and later) build dates according to D-Nice. The measurements you're referencing were on pre-April builds. He has suggested that with April and later builds, most people will be buying new models before the MLL increases enough to really bother them.

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post #544 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:17 AM
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[quote=ElwayLite;19021345]OK, got about 80 hours on it now, so I used DVE, Spears and Munsil and the AVS 709 disc to get some temp adjustments. I'll prob check again in a few weeks, just to see. Will continue slides for next 3 nights or so while we sleep.


I'm close to going for one of these.
Only thing putting me off is this 100 hour burn in.
I would have no TV for days.

Am I reading the above correct that you can use the TV out of the box and do this burn in thing in between using it or am I way off?
Appreciate any feedback.
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post #545 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:18 AM
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Burn in is only necessary if you want to use D-Nice's calibration settings. The TV is ready to use out of the box.
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post #546 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:20 AM
 
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TV is ready out of the box, with careful use. Break in is not only for Dnice, it was around before his settings. It's to even age the cells, AND to get the process outta the way faster, especially if you have a calibrator coming. I ran mine for 4 days straight, then enjoyed.
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post #547 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:23 AM
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Thousands of people buy these TVs and are not at all aware of this forum. They just plug in their TVs and enjoy them. Its fine.
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post #548 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

TV is ready out of the box, with careful use. Break in is not only for Dnice, it was around before his settings. It's to even age the cells, AND to get the process outta the way faster, especially if you have a calibrator coming. I ran mine for 4 days straight, then enjoyed.

Normal TV watching will evenly age the phospors. If you have a professional calibrator coming, then yes you would want to break it in, as the image will change as the phosphors age (in my case, the colors became much more natural looking and the blacks improved slightly). Although I'm just guessing that I'm up around 100 hours. I've had the TV for about a month and watch it about 3-4 hours a day.
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post #549 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:37 AM
 
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It does improve as you get more hours on it. From my reading and talks, Ill disagree that tv viewing "evenly" ages the cells.
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post #550 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

As far as gamma goes, a proper calibration will help the curve, other than that, you can spend $900 on a DVDO Duo and dial in whatever gamma you want.

I'm not sure that the S2 can do 2.2 gamma. ChadB and D-Nice were unable to set it there.

What controls gamma anyway? Does the Brightness setting change gamma or using Black level: Dark?

If there was a cheaper video processor that could toy with the gamma, maybe I'd look into that.

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post #551 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

It does improve as you get more hours on it. From my reading and talks, Ill disagree that tv viewing "evenly" ages the cells.

Too any real noticable degree?
I wasn't planning on paying for it to be calibrated.
I'm about blowing a budget on the TV plus a console stand so....!!
Think I'll go to Best Buy and look at it.
From what I've been reading it's a great TV.
I think the softer side of plasma is more to my preference.
I've heard the un-natural feeling of LCD and LED quite often.
I'm upgrading from a Toshiba rear projection HD box. About 6 years old I guess.
Should be a jump up I hope.
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post #552 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 08:57 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmarceau View Post

I'm not sure that the S2 can do 2.2 gamma. ChadB and D-Nice were unable to set it there.

What controls gamma anyway? Does the Brightness setting change gamma or using Black level: Dark?

If there was a cheaper video processor that could toy with the gamma, maybe I'd look into that.

The DVDO Edge only handles video processing, so the cheapest I know of is the DVDO Duo. Gamma adjustments are made within the Duo while it's in between the source and the TV. It is true the S2 only does a 1.9 by itself, but thats where the Duo comes in. You calibrate the display, until it's doing the best it can, then you use the onboard color management system and gama/grayscale adjustments to fine tune. One thing thats good about many LCD's is, they have an easy gamma slider in the user menu. Panasonic plasmas just give you what they give you, and you are stuck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by demonstimpy View Post

Too any real noticable degree?
I wasn't planning on paying for it to be calibrated.
I'm about blowing a budget on the TV plus a console stand so....!!
Think I'll go to Best Buy and look at it.
From what I've been reading it's a great TV.
I think the softer side of plasma is more to my preference.
I've heard the un-natural feeling of LCD and LED quite often.
I'm upgrading from a Toshiba rear projection HD box. About 6 years old I guess.
Should be a jump up I hope.

If you just buy the Spears and Munsil Blu-ray off Amazon, or wherever, and calibrate the tv with it, you'll be very happy in Cinema mode. I like the natural look too. I'd wait until 100 hours or so to use the calibration disc. You can watch in Cinema mode for break in, if you dont wanna do slides.
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post #553 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:00 AM
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"You can watch in Cinema mode for break in, if you dont wanna do slides."

So cinema mode is darker I am guessing?
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post #554 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:02 AM
 
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Really, you can watch any mode as long as your lower the contrast to a decent level. I always recommend Cinema, because to be honest, it looks the best to me on the Panasonics, unless you have a THX mode.
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post #555 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:03 AM
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Okay. So based on I can watch it out of the box, use cinema (for 100 hours?) I should be good to go. If that's the case I think I'm dropping $2200 tonight.
Plus a stand. Yikes. Oh well. That'll be the wife's pick I guess!
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post #556 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:06 AM
 
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I'd watch Cinema, Brightness around 60, and Contrast around 60 to 70, and enjoy. Self Calibrate after 100 hours or so with the S&M Blu-ray. Just try and avoid static images for a long time till it gets broken in a bit.

If you have an SD card, download the images and run them while you sleep/work. Will get hours on faster.
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post #557 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:07 AM
 
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Here is Panny's 2010 stance:

"When your plasma TV is initially installed, the first 100 hours of use is known as the "break-in period." While there are no special requirements for the break in period, to minimize any risk of image retention, you may want to be aware of the following information, 1. Make sure the plasma TV is in a viewing mode (aspect ratio) that completely fills the screen. The panel is shipped in this condition, in what is called the "Just" mode. 2. Change the Picture Mode from Vivid to Standard or Cinema. Cinema would be best. 3. Briefly engage the 4:3 aspect and confirm the side bars are set to "Mid", or "Bright". This can be adjusted in the Set Up menu. 4. Always return the display mode that fills the screen (such as Just, Zoom, Full, or H-FILL). 5. Try not to view channels with stationary backgrounds or logos for extended periods of time. 6. Avoid extended display of static images (video games, computer images, DVD title screens, etc.). No fixed image should appear on the TV for more than 15% of the viewing week."
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post #558 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:14 AM
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Super. Thanks for the feedback.
Answered my question and more.
Looks like I'll be going for it.
Appreciate it.
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post #559 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:16 AM
 
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Enjoy the set, its a nice one for the price.
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post #560 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

Enjoy the set, its a nice one for the price.

Appears that way.
Certainly from what I've read it's a better value than a Samsung etc for the same kinda money.
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post #561 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:23 AM
 
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My only complaint right now is the lower gamma, but it still looks better than my LED LCD.
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post #562 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:24 AM
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My only complaint right now is the lower gamma, but it still looks better than my LED LCD.

That color related? Sorry to sounds retarded.
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post #563 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:39 AM
 
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http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/what-...0080511108.htm

Here is a decent read on Gamma, if that's what you meant. Gamma of 2.2-2.35 is preferred. On the 2.35 end or higher, you lose shadow detail, lower than 2.2 gives you more shadow detail, but there is some washout/greying of blacks. I can see it in certain scenes, some folks may not even notice.

The LED suffered from blooming (local dimming), and was just not a good replacement for a plasma guy. Colors are better on the plasma and it does look less sharp/more natural.
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post #564 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/what-...0080511108.htm

Here is a decent read on Gamma, if that's what you meant. Gamma of 2.2-2.35 is preferred. On the 2.35 end or higher, you lose shadow detail, lower than 2.2 gives you more shadow detail, but there is some washout/greying of blacks. I can see it in certain scenes, some folks may not even notice.

The LED suffered from blooming (local dimming), and was just not a good replacement for a plasma guy. Colors are better on the plasma and it does look less sharp/more natural.

Interesting. So this isn't really adjustable? You said it was your only issue with it.
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post #565 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

Here is Panny's 2010 stance:

"When your plasma TV is initially installed, the first 100 hours of use is known as the "break-in period." While there are no special requirements for the break in period, to minimize any risk of image retention, you may want to be aware of the following information, 1. Make sure the plasma TV is in a viewing mode (aspect ratio) that completely fills the screen. The panel is shipped in this condition, in what is called the "Just" mode. 2. Change the Picture Mode from Vivid to Standard or Cinema. Cinema would be best. 3. Briefly engage the 4:3 aspect and confirm the side bars are set to "Mid", or "Bright". This can be adjusted in the Set Up menu. 4. Always return the display mode that fills the screen (such as Just, Zoom, Full, or H-FILL). 5. Try not to view channels with stationary backgrounds or logos for extended periods of time. 6. Avoid extended display of static images (video games, computer images, DVD title screens, etc.). No fixed image should appear on the TV for more than 15% of the viewing week."

When they mention not watching anything with stationary logo's (scoreboards on sports) for extended periods during break-in , just how long are they referring too ?

During the first 100 hrs you can't sit down and watch a baseball/football game in it's entirety ?

I'm here to learn , I'm really leaning toward plasma.
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post #566 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 10:14 AM
 
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When they mention not watching anything with stationary logo's (scoreboards on sports) for extended periods during break-in , just how long are they referring too ?

During the first 100 hrs you can't sit down and watch a baseball/football game in it's entirety ?

I'm here to learn , I'm really leaning toward plasma.

No worries, you have commercials to break the picture. I'd be more concerned with pausing a still image, or gaming with a HUD for 8 hours straight.
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post #567 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 10:16 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by demonstimpy View Post

Interesting. So this isn't really adjustable? You said it was your only issue with it.

Yeah, they don;t allow you to adjust. When you calibrate the grayscale, gamma will move up or down slightly, and with LCD's if you end up with a 1.9, you just use their menu slider to get it up to around 2.2. If Panasonic should give better gamma out of the box than 1.9.
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post #568 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

Yeah, they don;t allow you to adjust. When you calibrate the grayscale, gamma will move up or down slightly, and with LCD's if you end up with a 1.9, you just use their menu slider to get it up to around 2.2. If Panasonic should give better gamma out of the box than 1.9.

Ok. With the age of my current TV I think I'll see a big upgrade still. I hope!
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post #569 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 10:25 AM
 
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I like this tv regardless. I think it looks better than my 2008.
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post #570 of 2271 Old 08-26-2010, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

I like this tv regardless. I think it looks better than my 2008.

Good to hear. I'd say you've helped make my mind up it it appreciated.
Also gonna be a better year for the Seminoles I hope.
(FSU follower also)
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