2011 Panasonic Plasma [NO PRICE TALK] - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_B View Post

The AR filter appears to be better on the VT30 series compared to the ST/GT30's.

" New A/R screen filter (different from new A/R screen filter on P65VT30)"

Yes, but there is this:

Quote:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1305229

A secondary consideration is the single sheet of glass design, which some people like and some don't (because of the reflection some see between the front glass and the glass behind).

I keep asking if the one-sheet of glass design introduced an extra pane of glass. If true, this could actually reduce the picture quality versus the G series.

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post #722 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 08:33 AM
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I am confused. Is the VT30 the online line that has the single sheet of glass? What is the difference between "single sheet" and "Flush Glass Design"?



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post #723 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 08:36 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post

I am confused. Is the VT30 the online line that has the single sheet of glass? What is the difference between "single sheet" and "Flush Glass Design"?

This "single sheet" is where the glass goes all the way across, no indention for bezel.

The black bezel you see is not on top of the glass, the glass runs all the way across on top of the black area

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post #724 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 08:45 AM
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Yeah I understand that and thanks but do the VT and GT both have this or is there a difference in the two?

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Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

This "single sheet" is where the glass goes all the way across, no indention for bezel.

The black bezel you see is not on top of the glass, the glass runs all the way across on top of the black area





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post #725 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 08:50 AM
 
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http://ces.cnet.com/1801-32500_1-50098428.html

This video leads me to believe the GT is a one sheet of glass design, but has two panes of glass, where the VT is one sheet/one pane, but I dunno.

This year the VT has it's own panel, while the GT and ST share another version.
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post #726 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 08:56 AM
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Awh, thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

http://ces.cnet.com/1801-32500_1-50098428.html

This video leads me to believe the GT is a one sheet of glass design, but has two panes of glass, where the VT is one sheet/one pane, but I dunno.

This year the VT has it's own panel, while the GT and ST share another version.




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post #727 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_B View Post

The AR filter appears to be better on the VT30 series compared to the ST/GT30's.

" New A/R screen filter (different from new A/R screen filter on P65VT30)"

Yes, they all have new A/R filters, but the P65VT30 has a better one, which one would expect given the much higher cost.
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post #728 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 09:16 AM
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So given the "better AR filter", the VT30 line should handle lit windows/lights better and the picture shouldn't be as negatively affected compared to the ST/GT series (or the 2010 line as well). At least that is how I interpret it. We shall see (hopefully) soon.
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post #729 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

This "single sheet" is where the glass goes all the way across, no indention for bezel.

The black bezel you see is not on top of the glass, the glass runs all the way across on top of the black area


Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

http://ces.cnet.com/1801-32500_1-50098428.html

This video leads me to believe the GT is a one sheet of glass design, but has two panes of glass, where the VT is one sheet/one pane, but I dunno.

This year the VT has it's own panel, while the GT and ST share another version.

When the panel has a extra sheet of glass there are actually 3 sheets of glass. I am not convinced the CNET girl is very technical. The G Series was 2 sheets without the extra glass last year and it does appear that the bezel is on-top of the glass.

However, while I some have said that there is no extra pane of glass, I have not had anyone back that information up with a source, so I remain skeptical.

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post #730 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fairchild99 View Post

Meaning it's going to be their lowest end 1080p model for 2011. It's their only 1080p plasma thus far without 2D.

What a bummer, you have to watch everything in 3D?
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post #731 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 11:50 AM
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I just can't seem to find enough information if the rest of the 2011 line has the one sheet of glass or not. I remain skeptical as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

When the panel has a extra sheet of glass there are actually 3 sheets of glass. I am not convinced the CNET girl is very technical. The G Series was 2 sheets without the extra glass last year and it does appear that the bezel is on-top of the glass.

However, while I some have said that there is no extra pane of glass, I have not had anyone back that information up with a source, so I remain skeptical.

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post #732 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 12:10 PM
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So, re the glossy bezel, didn't anyone here go to CES and see a display model? With all the insiders posting here surely someone has seen an advance demo unit. Don't be shy - clue us in! Thanks.

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post #733 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 12:32 PM
 
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Ok, here is a tidbit:

Quote:


the gt30 has what we call "flush design" where if you run your finger across you'll feel a very tiny bezel but next to non. the vt30 is flat entire way around with metallic accents around the outside.


ST30 has a larger bezel
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post #734 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 12:35 PM
 
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Another:

Quote:


From what I remember seeing and being told, the VT, GT and ST we're all single sheets of glass, meaning that they have the subtract glass and a final (top) glass panel, which has the filter and anti-glare coating applied directly on the surface

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post #735 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 01:20 PM
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@Bigham16
LOL, I've read the whole day's posts and I've seen you ask the same question over and over and not get an answer. I will finally answer (though you might not be happy with it!). The 2011 VT has the Infinite Black Panel Pro, which is definitely better than the 2010 GT25's Infinite Black Panel. The 2011 VT30 has the Infinite Black Panel Pro 2, which is definitely going to be better than the 2011 GT30's Infinite Black Panel 2. So, the question becomes, is Infinite Black Panel 2 better than Infinite Black Panel Pro 1? It's not even worth arguing because I don't think any reps have even taken a stab at this one yet! Personally, though, I think the ST30/GT30 will be very, very similar to the 2010 VT25.

RE: Single layer glass design
Getting the information of whether it's 2 or 3 pieces of glass is hard and I don't think anyone here knows. We know that all plasmas need the pixels encapsulated between two layers of glass, but there's no way of knowing whether the outside layer of glass is the necessary 2nd pane of glass or if it's a 3rd just thrown in for looks, like on the more expensive Sharp Quattron LEDs. What do you think?

Diagram 1: Mid-range LG plasma PK550
Diagram 2: Higher-range LG plasma PK750

Judging from this, the PK750 has no unnecessary glass. Thoughts?

And, someone on here mentioned that the Panasonic PZ800U had the normal 2 layers of glass, and a 3rd layer thrown on the tops just for looks. The diagram, again, doesn't suggest this: PZ800U Diagram
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post #736 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 01:36 PM
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LOL!! Seems to happen on most forums. I was thinking the same thing that the 2011 GT would be close if not the same as the 2010 VT25. I pulled the trigger today on the 58VT25 at BB. Couldn't pass up the price I was offered and I understand it's a "nice" TV . Cool diagrams and thanks for the links. To bad Panasonic doesn't share more right now.

Could you build your own plasma from Sears?

Thank you for the feedback.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjdean01 View Post

@Bigham16
LOL, I've read the whole day's posts and I've seen you ask the same question over and over and not get an answer. I will finally answer (though you might not be happy with it!). The 2011 VT has the Infinite Black Panel Pro, which is definitely better than the 2010 GT25's Infinite Black Panel. The 2011 VT30 has the Infinite Black Panel Pro 2, which is definitely going to be better than the 2011 GT30's Infinite Black Panel 2. So, the question becomes, is Infinite Black Panel 2 better than Infinite Black Panel Pro 1? It's not even worth arguing because I don't think any reps have even taken a stab at this one yet! Personally, though, I think the ST30/GT30 will be very, very similar to the 2010 VT25.




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post #737 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 01:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjdean01 View Post

@Bigham16
LOL, I've read the whole day's posts and I've seen you ask the same question over and over and not get an answer. I will finally answer (though you might not be happy with it!). The 2011 VT has the Infinite Black Panel Pro, which is definitely better than the 2010 GT25's Infinite Black Panel. The 2011 VT30 has the Infinite Black Panel Pro 2, which is definitely going to be better than the 2011 GT30's Infinite Black Panel 2. So, the question becomes, is Infinite Black Panel 2 better than Infinite Black Panel Pro 1? It's not even worth arguing because I don't think any reps have even taken a stab at this one yet! Personally, though, I think the ST30/GT30 will be very, very similar to the 2010 VT25.

RE: Single layer glass design
Getting the information of whether it's 2 or 3 pieces of glass is hard and I don't think anyone here knows. We know that all plasmas need the pixels encapsulated between two layers of glass, but there's no way of knowing whether the outside layer of glass is the necessary 2nd pane of glass or if it's a 3rd just thrown in for looks, like on the more expensive Sharp Quattron LEDs. What do you think?

Diagram 1: Mid-range LG plasma PK550
Diagram 2: Higher-range LG plasma PK750

Judging from this, the PK750 has no unnecessary glass. Thoughts?

And, someone on here mentioned that the Panasonic PZ800U had the normal 2 layers of glass, and a 3rd layer thrown on the tops just for looks. The diagram, again, doesn't suggest this: PZ800U Diagram

AFAIK the 3rd glass panel is not just for looks. It is there to act as a substrate for the AR filter.

Pioneer used something called a bonded filter which means the AR filter is directly bonded to the surface of the 2nd layer of glass eliminating the need for a 3rd layer.

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post #738 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 03:16 PM
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What a bummer, you have to watch everything in 3D?

You can buy a 3D set and just use it for 2D and reap all the improvement.

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post #739 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 03:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xrox View Post

AFAIK the 3rd glass panel is not just for looks. It is there to act as a substrate for the AR filter.

Pioneer used something called a bonded filter which means the AR filter is directly bonded to the surface of the 2nd layer of glass eliminating the need for a 3rd layer.

It's looking like the VT30 will use the same design as that Pioneer, with the filter attached right to the glass. This would be so much better.

Do you have any way of knowing if certain TVs are like the Pioneer, or if they they have 3 layers? For example, that LG PK750 with the front "skin" glass sure is a lot heavier than the PK550, which we know only has 2 layers. Could the 750 have 3?
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post #740 of 3328 Old 01-18-2011, 04:49 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xrox View Post

AFAIK the 3rd glass panel is not just for looks. It is there to act as a substrate for the AR filter.

Pioneer used something called a bonded filter which means the AR filter is directly bonded to the surface of the 2nd layer of glass eliminating the need for a 3rd layer.


Yepp, and this is how the VT and GT are, unsure on the ST.
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post #741 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 04:39 AM
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"The G Series was 2 sheets without the extra glass last year and it does appear that the bezel is on-top of the glass."

Correct, the G bezel is not flush. "Tiny" as posted below yours? Um, whatever. It looks cheap. Of course, so does the silver edging.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working. (Oh, and plasma didn't die because of logistics problems, nor does OLED ship in big boxes because it comes from Korea.)
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post #742 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 05:20 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rogo View Post

"The G Series was 2 sheets without the extra glass last year and it does appear that the bezel is on-top of the glass."

Correct, the G bezel is not flush. "Tiny" as posted below yours? Um, whatever. It looks cheap. Of course, so does the silver edging.



Did you go to CES and actually see them? Or are you offering opinion off web pics?
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post #743 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 05:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post


Did you go to CES and actually see them? Or are you offering opinion off web pics?

VT 30 is the only one with one sheet of glass. I heard it from the panny rep myself at CES
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post #744 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 05:52 AM
 
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Originally Posted by amjustice View Post

VT 30 is the only one with one sheet of glass. I heard it from the panny rep myself at CES

We cleared that up already. I'm the one that posted the info earlier, my reference to him was his opinion of the looks. He's stated several times he's not happy with them, and Id like to know if thats just from some web pics, or did he look at them up close.
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post #745 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 06:04 AM
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Rogo is a recurring visitor of CES
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post #746 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 06:09 AM
 
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Originally Posted by specuvestor View Post

Rogo is a recurring visitor of CES

Thanks rogo. (j/k)

If thats the case, fine, I just wanted to know if he'd actually seen them. The personal pictures of the VT I saw, looked good IMO. But, as many things, design is subjective, or in the eye of the beholder.
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post #747 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 06:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amjustice View Post

VT 30 is the only one with one sheet of glass. I heard it from the panny rep myself at CES

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElwayLite View Post

We cleared that up already. I'm the one that posted the info earlier, my reference to him was his opinion of the looks. He's stated several times he's not happy with them, and Id like to know if thats just from some web pics, or did he look at them up close.

Really?

We know the font is a single sheet of glass.

Do we really know for certain that how many sheets of glass are used in the VT30? Is it 2 or 3?

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post #748 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 06:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjdean01 View Post

It's looking like the VT30 will use the same design as that Pioneer, with the filter attached right to the glass. This would be so much better.

Do you have any way of knowing if certain TVs are like the Pioneer, or if they they have 3 layers? For example, that LG PK750 with the front "skin" glass sure is a lot heavier than the PK550, which we know only has 2 layers. Could the 750 have 3?

Panasonic was already doing this last year with the G and VT series.

Only difference now is that the VT30 will have the outer glass extending all the way across the bezel.
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post #749 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 06:20 AM
 
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This is what I was told.

Quote:


the VT, GT and ST we're all single sheets of glass, meaning that they have the subtract glass and a final (top) glass panel, which has the filter and anti-glare coating applied directly on the surface.

This is exactly how the best Kuros were designed

The VT is the single sheet "design"
The GT has the slim bezel
Dunno on ST
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post #750 of 3328 Old 01-19-2011, 06:20 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H_Prestige View Post

Panasonic was already doing this last year with the G and VT series.

Only difference now is that the VT30 will have the outer glass extending all the way across the bezel.

Well said, I had a lot of jumbled info yesterday.
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