Official Panasonic 2011 TC-PxxST30 Thread [No Price Talk] - Page 36 - AVS Forum
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post #1051 of 8449 Old 03-27-2011, 11:18 PM
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I ran an input lag test on the ST30. For those that don't hang out in the LCD forum, I use the frito method for measuring lag (CRT monitor baseline, verified zero frame buffer lag, verified zero Windows lag (Aero), 1080p/60 cloned video, 1/60th shutter speed, using only pictures that have zero ghosting, etc). The one weakness in my setup is that I use the flatpanelshd exe timer instead of the SMTT timer. But from comparing my flatpanelshd results to SMTT results by others, my results only vary by 0-1 frame of lag. So still pretty solid and accurate. And here are the results...

Panasonic TC-P50ST30 (all processing turned off) = 1-2 frames of lag (15-32 ms)
Panasonic TC-P50ST30 (all processing turned on/strong) = 4-8 frames of lag (62-125 ms)

Note1: in the 'all processing turned off' test, relabeling the HDMI input to 'Game' or 'Monitor' had no effect on lag.
Note2: in the 'all processing turned off' test, these are actually D-Nice settings.

Also, although I don't have any plans on using a plasma as a computer monitor, I ran the 4:4:4 chroma test anyways. And the result... it fails. You can see the result here: link. In case you're wondering what proper 4:4:4 rendering looks like, see this: link.



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post #1052 of 8449 Old 03-27-2011, 11:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

no its off center ..

you successfully got my hopes up for a moment there

Really? I have my HTPC hooked up right now at 1080p and when I turn off pixel orbiter, the image seems pretty centered (top, bottom, left, and right). Its only when I turn on pixel orbiter, and leaving the TV on for about 5 minutes, does the image become off centered.

Maybe your source device is natively off centered by a tad bit?
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post #1053 of 8449 Old 03-27-2011, 11:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thepoohcontinuum View Post

Really? I have my HTPC hooked up right now at 1080p and when I turn off pixel orbiter, the image seems pretty centered (top, bottom, left, and right). Its only when I turn on pixel orbiter, and leaving the TV on for about 5 minutes, does the image become off centered.

Maybe your source device is natively off centered by a tad bit?

no .. its off center
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post #1054 of 8449 Old 03-27-2011, 11:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thepoohcontinuum View Post

Panasonic TC-P50ST30 (all processing turned off) = 1-2 frames of lag (15-32 ms)
Panasonic TC-P50ST30 (all processing turned on/strong) = 4-8 frames of lag (62-125 ms)

Note: in the 'all processing turned off' test, relabeling the HDMI input to 'Game' or 'Monitor' had no effect on lag.

Someone posted awhile back that it was 17.5 ms in game mode with all processing off.

Ahh well, 31 ms isn't to bad.
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post #1055 of 8449 Old 03-27-2011, 11:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morbid View Post

Someone posted awhile back that it was 17.5 ms in game mode with all processing off.

Ahh well, 31 ms isn't to bad.

they used a laptop ..

he used a crt ..

that probably explains the difference ..
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post #1056 of 8449 Old 03-27-2011, 11:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thepoohcontinuum View Post

I ran an input lag test on the ST30. For those that don't hang out in the LCD forum, I use the frito method for measuring lag (CRT monitor baseline, verified zero frame buffer lag, verified zero Windows lag (Aero), 1080p/60 cloned video, 1/60th shutter speed, using only pictures that have zero ghosting, etc). The one weakness in my setup is that I use the flatpanelshd exe timer instead of the SMTT timer. But from comparing my flatpanelshd results to SMTT results by others, my results only vary by 0-1 frame of lag. So still pretty solid and accurate. And here are the results...

Panasonic TC-P50ST30 (all processing turned off) = 1-2 frames of lag (15-32 ms)
Panasonic TC-P50ST30 (all processing turned on/strong) = 4-8 frames of lag (62-125 ms)

Note: in the 'all processing turned off' test, relabeling the HDMI input to 'Game' or 'Monitor' had no effect on lag.

Also, although I don't have any plans on using a plasma as a computer monitor, I ran the 4:4:4 chroma test anyways. And the result... it fails. You can see the result here: link. In case you're wondering what proper 4:4:4 rendering looks like, see this: link.

[IMG]http://i807.photobucket.com/albums/yy352/floatpoo/tv_testing/panasonic_TC-P50ST30_p1_lag.jpg[/IMG

[IMG]http://i807.photobucket.com/albums/yy352/floatpoo/tv_testing/panasonic_TC-P50ST30_p2_lag.jpg[/IMG

Thanks for the detailed work and report pooh. Looks like about the same results as the more accurate CRT tests on last year's models, I'll be sure to add it to the lag thread.
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post #1057 of 8449 Old 03-27-2011, 11:57 PM
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great ..

i just discovered a dead pixel ..

so uniformity issues, off center screen, and now a dead pixel ..

im seriously considering calling amazon now and swapping it out ..

*sigh
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post #1058 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 12:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

they used a laptop ..

he used a crt ..

that probably explains the difference ..

Yeah, I didn't know what the other guy was using. He just posted 2 pics in the dark.

But none the less 31 aint bad.

Would be cool if we could get some game shots of this thing in game mode with all processing features off.
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post #1059 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

great ..

i just discovered a dead pixel ..

so uniformity issues, off center screen, and now a dead pixel ..

im seriously considering calling amazon now and swapping it out ..

*sigh

That sucks... I keep reading people having lemons. If I get one I'm just going to return it and wait till later in the year to get one when they fix manufacturing issues.
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post #1060 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 12:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

what information for what problems are you referring to ??

Start reading at Motion Resolution.

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post #1061 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 04:36 AM
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I noticed the bigger border on one side also when running blu-ray and using size2. Then it would move from one side to the other. Come to find out it is the pixel orbiter.
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post #1062 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 06:22 AM
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Heads up: Amazon has a REALLY good price on the 55" right now. Sears is running the set a bit more, but will probably price match the online retailer. Pay tax, but pick up immediately and no waiting if you get a lemon.

XBL Gamertag: RagingPhinsFan
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post #1063 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

Start reading at Motion Resolution.

oh you mean about the dithering ..

yeah .. that motion only dithering they are talkinga bout doesnt seem to explain why i have significant dithering in black/grey test pattern still images ..

but im honestly at peace with the dithering ..

3x tvs in a row all with the same amount .. so .. i yield ..

but ty for sharing

i have 3x issues besides dithering ..

uniformity .. several distinct light blobs, a couple verticle bands, and most of the center screen is plagued by dirty screen effect ..

off center screen .. the left border is roughly 2.5x the width of the right ..

dead/stuck pixel .. always dark .. its hard to tell but i think its stuck in dark red ..

too much for me ..

i was being forgiving by accepting the uniformity and deciding to keep the tv .. but these new issues are the final straw ..

im calling amazon as soon as i submit this ..
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post #1064 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

oh you mean about the dithering ..

yeah .. that motion only dithering they are talkinga bout doesnt seem to explain why i have significant dithering in black/grey test pattern still images ..

but im honestly at peace with the dithering ..

3x tvs in a row all with the same amount .. so .. i yield ..

but ty for sharing

i have 3x issues besides dithering ..

uniformity .. several distinct light blobs, a couple verticle bands, and most of the center screen is plagued by dirty screen effect ..

off center screen .. the left border is roughly 2.5x the width of the right ..

dead/stuck pixel .. always dark .. its hard to tell but i think its stuck in dark red ..

too much for me ..

i was being forgiving by accepting the uniformity and deciding to keep the tv .. but these new issues are the final straw ..

im calling amazon as soon as i submit this ..


Man Lord Spanky i feel for you. I read your other thread a week or so ago and, I have had the same problems you did with the GT25. I went through 3 of them with the same issues (all September builds). I finally gave up and I am getting a refund. Now I'm looking at the ST30. Let us know how the new one is. I hope the dithering improves for you because it seems like you have a good eye for it as do I.
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post #1065 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by ctadman View Post

Man Lord Spanky i feel for you. I read your other thread a week or so ago and, I have had the same problems you did with the GT25. I went through 3 of them with the same issues (all September builds). I finally gave up and I am getting a refund. Now I'm looking at the ST30. Let us know how the new one is. I hope the dithering improves for you because it seems like you have a good eye for it as do I.

i have little hope that the dithering will improve ..

as i said .. ive honestly come to accept it the way it is ..

3x tvs in a row must mean that .. although i know not all of them share this level of dithering .. it must be all too common ..

however .. with these three new issues i have i feel like im having too make one too many compromises with my new purchase ..

i have already talked with amazon .. they were .. as always .. very friendly and made the transaction very easy ..

i asked the guy .. off the record .. if the thought i was being unreasonable and he said heck no ..

if the dithering does improve i will be shouting those praises loudly in this forum and i will msg you to let you know ..

having already come to accept the uniformity issues on this tv .. if the new one doesnt have them i will be all too pleased ..

things i would be ok with ..

same dithering ..

same stuck pixel ..

same off center ..

no uniformity issues ..

or

same dithering

no stuck pixel ..

no off center ..

same uniformity issues ..

..

so im not terribly picky at this point ..
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post #1066 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 08:34 AM
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That's a pain in the ass to read man.
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post #1067 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

i have little hope that the dithering will improve ..

as i said .. ive honestly come to accept it the way it is ..

3x tvs in a row must mean that .. although i know not all of them share this level of dithering .. it must be all too common ..

however .. with these three new issues i have i feel like im having too make one too many compromises with my new purchase ..

i have already talked with amazon .. they were .. as always .. very friendly and made the transaction very easy ..

i asked the guy .. off the record .. if the thought i was being unreasonable and he said heck no ..

if the dithering does improve i will be shouting those praises loudly in this forum and i will msg you to let you know ..

having already come to accept the uniformity issues on this tv .. if the new one doesnt have them i will be all too pleased ..

things i would be ok with ..

same dithering ..

same stuck pixel ..

same off center ..

no uniformity issues ..

or

same dithering

no stuck pixel ..

no off center ..

same uniformity issues ..

..

so im not terribly picky at this point ..

So what tv will you be replacing it with? another gt25 or will you be getting the gt30?
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post #1068 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by turbo94gt View Post

So what tv will you be replacing it with? another gt25 or will you be getting the gt30?

im currently st30 .. so im going that route again ..

gt30 doesnt come in 42 inch .. otherwise i would have never even considered getting the st30 ..
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post #1069 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 08:52 AM
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So just over the past few days I got around to changing all my (applicable) TiVo Season Passes over to their HD counterparts. Everything has been fine so far except The Simpsons.
Throughout the entire show the brightness kept wavering on a fairly regular basis, almost as if clouds were rolling overhead and kept blocking the sunlight. I didn't notice it on commercials and and haven't noticed it on any other shows either.
Also, just a few days earlier was the first time I noticed that the TV dims when you turn the lights off. I remember seeing the setting, but hadn't thought much of it until I caught it happening. I tried watching parts of the show with the lights on and off, and either way the brightness kept going up and down.
Anyone else notice this or have any thoughts?
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post #1070 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Joey P View Post

So just over the past few days I got around to changing all my (applicable) TiVo Season Passes over to their HD counterparts. Everything has been fine so far except The Simpsons.
Throughout the entire show the brightness kept wavering on a fairly regular basis, almost as if clouds were rolling overhead and kept blocking the sunlight. I didn't notice it on commercials and and haven't noticed it on any other shows either.
Also, just a few days earlier was the first time I noticed that the TV dims when you turn the lights off. I remember seeing the setting, but hadn't thought much of it until I caught it happening. I tried watching parts of the show with the lights on and off, and either way the brightness kept going up and down.
Anyone else notice this or have any thoughts?

those eco settings are adjustable ..

if turned off the tv shouldnt adjust to ambient lighting ..

as far as the simpsons i would say it seems to be source related since you dont observe it with any other material .. so no worries imo ..

try turning off that setting and tell us what happens ..
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post #1071 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

im currently st30 .. so im going that route again ..

gt30 doesnt come in 42 inch .. otherwise i would have never even considered getting the st30 ..

ok sorry that would make sense since this is a st30 thread. Didnt read the entire thread so thought you still had a 2010 model. thanks.
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post #1072 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by turbo94gt View Post

ok sorry that would make sense since this is a st30 thread. Didnt read the entire thread so thought you still had a 2010 model. thanks.

np mate ..

i do sometimes mention the fact that i have already been through 2x gt25s .. so i understand the confusion on your part ..
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post #1073 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

those eco settings are adjustable ..

if turned off the tv shouldnt adjust to ambient lighting ..

as far as the simpsons i would say it seems to be source related since you dont observe it with any other material .. so no worries imo ..

try turning off that setting and tell us what happens ..

I don't mind them being where ever the factory settings are, they haven't bothered me yet. In fact, like I said, until just the other day when I happened to be looking at the TV as I turned the light off, I didn't even know it was happening.
But with The Simpsons it was like watching the brightness go through a sine wave for 30 minutes. I'll have to see if it happens on other shows before I make any changes.
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post #1074 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctadman View Post

Man Lord Spanky i feel for you. I read your other thread a week or so ago and, I have had the same problems you did with the GT25. I went through 3 of them with the same issues (all September builds). I finally gave up and I am getting a refund. Now I'm looking at the ST30. Let us know how the new one is. I hope the dithering improves for you because it seems like you have a good eye for it as do I.

I think all 3 of us are in the same boat. My second GT25 is scheduled to go back to Amazon tomorrow.

If I knew I could get an ST30 without screen problems and with only minimal buzz, I think I'd go for it. But I just don't have any confidence in that possibility right now.

That's why I reluctantly went with a non-plasma TV for the first time since 2003.
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post #1075 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by fronesis View Post

I think all 3 of us are in the same boat. My second GT25 is scheduled to go back to Amazon tomorrow.

If I knew I could get an ST30 without screen problems and with only minimal buzz, I think I'd go for it. But I just don't have any confidence in that possibility right now.

That's why I reluctantly went with a non-plasma TV for the first time since 2003.

the buzzing on my st30 was initially very quite ..

however after over 70 hours logged the buzzing is now just as loud as my gt25 was ..

almost as if something is progressively becoming looser ..

buzzing is also something i can live with tho .. annoying as it is ..

i read i think that the st30 has less ir than the gt25 .. but im not so sure ..

i swear that this tv gets ir way ezier ..

just having the menu up for 30 seconds will put a 2 minute ir on the screen .. and thats with low contrast ..

hopefully after a couple hundred hours this will be much improved .. otherwise i dont know if i will be able to play games the way i intend ..

what tv did you go with ??
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post #1076 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord_Spanky View Post

the buzzing on my st30 was initially very quite ..

however after over 70 hours logged the buzzing is now just as loud as my gt25 was ..

almost as if something is progressively becoming looser ..

buzzing is also something i can live with tho .. annoying as it is ..

i read i think that the st30 has less ir than the gt25 .. but im not so sure ..

i swear that this tv gets ir way ezier ..

just having the menu up for 30 seconds will put a 2 minute ir on the screen .. and thats with low contrast ..

hopefully after a couple hundred hours this will be much improved .. otherwise i dont know if i will be able to play games the way i intend ..

what tv did you go with ??

Thats really weird about your IR issues. I played Call of Duty yesterday for an hour and went back to the dashboard and the IR was almost instantly gone. Def wasnt there for no 2 minutes for me.
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post #1077 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:53 AM
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Thats really weird about your IR issues. I played Call of Duty yesterday for an hour and went back to the dashboard and the IR was almost instantly gone. Def wasnt there for no 2 minutes for me.

perhaps you arent noticing it but its there ..

my eyes are fairly sensitive to changes in light output .. more than most ..
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post #1078 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 09:57 AM
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Is there any way to set the scrolling bar feature to a button? I like to run it inbetween matches of Call of Duty while waiting in the lobby. Would be convient if it was available at the push of a single button.
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post #1079 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by MASKOAA View Post

Is there any way to set the scrolling bar feature to a button? I like to run it inbetween matches of Call of Duty while waiting in the lobby. Would be convient if it was available at the push of a single button.

im not sure ..

but i just tested again ..

yeah my panel gets ir very ez ..

i left my samsung bluray player menu up for 30 seconds then switched to a no signal input and the ir was quite distinct ..

i left the screen blank for a few minutes but the ir didnt go away on its own ..

i ran the scroll bar for 30 seconds and that didnt get rid of it either ..

i would find it unusual for this to be a quality control issue ..
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post #1080 of 8449 Old 03-28-2011, 10:05 AM
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i guess with any new product people like to talk about speculations and first impressions.... but does anyone have some suggested calibration and settings?
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