Official Samsung 2011 PNxxD8000 Thread [No Price Talk] - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 5101 Old 03-17-2011, 08:10 PM
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Will u still need to let these new set run on low settings for like 100 or 500 hours before turning up the settings?
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post #32 of 5101 Old 03-17-2011, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khoop View Post

Will u still need to let these new set run on low settings for like 100 or 500 hours before turning up the settings?

Yes, but more like the low end of that spectrum.
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post #33 of 5101 Old 03-17-2011, 08:20 PM
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So where are you getting yours from and what part of the country?. I have my 64" on order from BB that said it would be delivered on April 2nd.
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post #34 of 5101 Old 03-17-2011, 08:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khoop View Post

Will u still need to let these new set run on low settings for like 100 or 500 hours before turning up the settings?

Actually this has never been tested and is a job for myth busters ! We actually will be doing this in the future, but the test will take a while to run.
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post #35 of 5101 Old 03-17-2011, 08:38 PM
 
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I am glad you got the 51 inch version. I want to see if Samsung is giving its smaller sizes the same blacks as the bigger 64" sizes this year. I can't wait for the review.
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post #36 of 5101 Old 03-17-2011, 08:41 PM
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So jealous! I'm going to have to wait weeks until I can even place an order for one from a dealer I like since they're not due out in the UK until at least April.

Is it sad that I'm already 'saving up' content to watch on the new TV? Saving up Stargate Universe at the moment and I'm sure other shows and films will follow. :S
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post #37 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 12:42 AM
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I'm almost 100% sure that Samsung must have changed the color of the bezel between CES and now (retail). In the early photos and CES videos, the bezel was definitely a light silver. Now with the pics on the front page, the color is definitely anything but that.

And they also did the same thing with the D7000 LCD; it was first introduced with a ToC red line around the border, but the final product apparently doesn't have that.
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post #38 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 12:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mad Mule View Post

What I'm most curious about (and I'm sure others are too) is whether there is any noticeable PQ difference between the D7000 and D8000. If the LCE of the D8000 doesn't do anything really beneficial, then the D7000 would definitely suffice for most people.


Ditto here.
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post #39 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 01:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

The all New PNxxD8000 is looking really good in her dark titanium skin! About an inch thick, very light !



Dark Titanium bezel will make me look very hard at this TV.Probably still with the d7000 64 inch.

so has it been confirmed that the d7000/d8000 dont have the mjc or any feature to give these sets the soap opera effect?
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post #40 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 04:37 AM
 
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GAH!!!


The wait for this review is killing me!
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post #41 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 04:37 AM
 
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GAH!!!


The wait for this review is killing me!
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post #42 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 05:14 AM
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when can we expect the review to be online ?
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post #43 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 05:15 AM
 
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As long as the D8000 really has .004 Mll, cinema smooth fixed, and no major buzzing, I am getting it. Especially since rising blacks are still a possibility on Pannys.
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post #44 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 06:24 AM
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Awesome set, but you'll have to wallmount it. That stand is just too hideous for words.
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post #45 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 06:29 AM
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The stand is awful...wonder if any other stand could be used?
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post #46 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 06:36 AM
 
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Originally Posted by casjen View Post

The stand is awful...wonder if any other stand could be used?

Of course you can buy a seperate stand.


One things for sure, thats the sexiest tv I have even seen.
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post #47 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

The D8000 is a very, very dark titanium color. ( In the pic above, you can see the color in the center ) Not even close to the bright silver in the stock photos on the net ! Most AVS members will be just fine with the D8000 look

Side note, we would review more units out there, if there was a way to donate to the cause.....any ideas PM us.

You could offer free break in and calibration if someone lets you use the TV they purchase from you for a review. Doesn't the publicity of the review help sales?
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post #48 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 06:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QZ1 View Post

You needed Cnet to tell you that?

The top-of-the-line TV is rarely, if ever, the best value; that should be common sense.

The VT30 won't be the best value compared to the GT30 and ST30; (it remains to be seen, which of the latter two will be best value.)

the difference is that the highest end C8000 model from last year actually did offer up some worthwhile improvements (for me anyway) which actually made the 8000 worth the extra $$--better black filter being the main one...but this year the 8000 does not make such a compelling upgrade (unless the LCE really turns out to be something special)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

The D8000 is a very, very dark titanium color. ( In the pic above, you can see the color in the center ) Not even close to the bright silver in the stock photos on the net ! Most AVS members will be just fine with the D8000 look

Side note, we would review more units out there, if there was a way to donate to the cause.....any ideas PM us.

why the heck does the stock photos make the bezel look silver while actual end user photos show a much darker grey bezel?...difference is like night and day and looks much much better in your photos...did Samsung alter their stock photos?...I think I agree with one of the other posters in this thread who stated that Samsung must have changed the color at the last minute after hearing all the complaints
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post #49 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:16 AM
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ChadB has posted his D8000 review over at HDJ.

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post #50 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:26 AM
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Samsung's D8000 plasma is a beautifully designed, super thin 3D display that has the forums on fire. Considering it's predecessor's great picture, that comes as no surprise. As I sit here at Cleveland Plasma, I'm thoroughly enjoying taking in it's beautiful picture. I also took some time to compare it to a couple other brand new models sharing the floor with it, an LG 60PZ550 plasma and Samsung's UN46D8000 LED LCD.

Since many owners do not have the luxury of total light control in their living rooms and some prefer watching with a small lamp on at night, the screen's ability to stay dark and mute reflections can be very important. Manufacturers have made significant advancements in the last couple of years in filter design, and the PN51D8000 shows that off quite well. Though not as black in bright environments as the LED LCD beside it, the PN51D8000's screen resists washout more than most plasmas I've seen. Reflections, though muted quite effectively, could still be a distraction depending on your room layout. Fortunately, with a little planning, it will display a picture with rich contrast in most moderately lit living rooms. The clean, modern design also helps the PN51D8000 look good in your home, whether it's in use or not.

I began my evaluation by checking out the various picture mode presets, and quickly found that Movie mode looked the most natural and true to life. Without making any other changes to the picture besides choosing Movie mode, I put in some familiar Blu Ray demo material. I also chose the best modes for the neighboring UN46D8000 and LG 60PZ550, and fed them all 1080i and 1080P/24 via a high quality HDMI distribution amp. The room was dark except for the light output of the three TVs on display.

Before calibration:

The PN51D8000's picture had very good pop, but I felt it looked a bit too contrasty (with bright objects highlighted and dark objects too dark). I was impressed with the fine detail in the picture. The PN51D8000 appeared to have the best and most consistent contrast of the bunch. Black bars were slightly brighter than the bezel, but not distractingly so. The image was smooth, but at times I saw hints of blurring from noise reduction. Flesh tones looked very good; much better than I normally see with non calibrated factory settings. Shadow detail was slightly subdued, however, meaning dark objects sunk down into the black background a little too much. Overall, it had the best, most exciting image of the three displays.

Calibration:

Like other recent top of the line offerings from Samsung, the PN51D8000's picture menu is extremely thorough and, for the most part, well designed. Samsung made some improvements in the menu's cosmetics and operation over the C8000. Tweakers and calibrators will love the full CMS (color management system), white balance adjustments, gamma selection, and 10 step gamma/grayscale adjustment once they become familiar with their operation and the inevitable quirks. Most of these adjustments should be done with a high quality meter interfaced with a laptop rather than by eye. I used the i1Pro meter with CalMAN 4.2 software for most of the calibration. Colors dialed in perfectly, and grayscale and gamma were both improved with the 10 point fine tuning. The 10 point adjustment can be frustrating, however, as it's alignment can get displaced if the contrast is set too low; and it's adjustment steps are coarse with darker images. With patience it can give a welcome improvement.

On a disappointing note, I could find no hint of the rumored LCE (Local Contrast Enhancer), either in the menu or in the set's performance. It may be that Samsung came up with a new thing to call the same old Black Tone, Dynamic Contrast, and/or Motion Lighting selections, all of which I tried and found either to make no improvement or to actually be very detrimental to the picture. I tried looking at black level and contrast performance in the different picture modes, thinking maybe LCE was tied in with only certain modes, with no success. Furthermore, Chris and I pulled out a Panasonic ST30 plasma and compared the minimum luminance level of it and the PN51D8000, and the ST30 was noticeably darker. So, if the LCE is real and not just hype, unfortunately it was not making itself known.

On Samsung's C8000 and C7000 models, I found that the black level measured and looked very significantly better (darker) on the 58 and 63" panel sizes than the 50" panel I initially reviewed. I have a feeling that may be the case with the D8000 as well. Using a Chroma5 colorimeter that is rated to read accurately down to at least .014 fL and measuring in a dark room, I measured a black level of .0165 fL without Cinema Smooth engaged. With a 1080P/24 input and Cinema Smooth turned on, as most videophiles would greatly prefer to watch their Blu Rays, the black level deteriorated to .0225 fL. The modified ANSI contrast ratio measured a good 1564:1. The PN51D8000 can make a nice and bright image; I could get 54-55 fL of light output with no compromise in performance. That, along with the dark screen filter, combine to help the PN51D8000 look much punchier and dynamic than the average plasma in a typical room.

After calibration:

(dark room, 1080P/24, Cinema Smooth engaged)
The first thing that struck me was the beautiful color; it was saturated and rich but still natural. There was lots of pop in bright scenes, but blacks had a slight glow in dark scenes. Whites were pure and vibrant. Shadow detail was excellent- well balanced and neutral. I saw very detailed resolution. The image was very slightly grainy when sitting close to the screen with NR off, but it looked smooth from a more typical viewing distance. The picture was stable, with no pumping or floating blacks. Flesh tones were natural. Pans and motion were good. I experimented with turning Cinema Smooth off and on; it was hard to see the black level penalty when engaging CS because of the large, bright menu screen, but it did seem to be slightly perceptible.

In every regard except MLL and dark scene contrast, I absolutely loved the image I saw on the PN51D8000. I have not seen any other display that exceeds it's picture quality in many respects. Is the black level performance enough to tame your enthusiasm for the PN51D8000? If you're hard core like my buddy, who liked his CRT front projector's blacks so dark that seeing his hand held up between his eyes and the screen could be a challenge, then yes. If your tastes are more moderate and you watch with a little light in the room, then sit back and enjoy that beautiful picture!

Update 4-19-2011: I just calibrated the 64" version of this TV, and I am very happy with the improvement in black level over the review sample! Before I attempted any black level readings and before I engaged Cinema Smooth, I could plainly see the minimum luminance level and contrast were

significantly improved. In a darker than average room, the contrast looked outstanding even with dark scenes. No, it was still not in the same league as the Kuro 101FD I calibrated yesterday, but it looked similar to the higher end Panasonics and at least as good as last year's 63D7000/8000.
I have determined that my Chroma5 meter, which is rated to be accurate down to approximately .014 fL, at least gives gives ballpark readings from that level down to approximately .008 fL. The PN-64D8000's readings were below that threshold with both a black screen and the black section of the ANSI checkerboard pattern. While I cannot provide a reliable exact number for the black level, it is definitely lower than that of the PN-51D8000, and it is probably very close to the best Panasonic plasmas.
With a 1080P/24 input and Cinema Smooth engaged, I got a consistent reading of .012 fL.
As was the case last year, the contrast is dramatically improved with the larger panel size, and picture quality is a significant notch higher as a result.

 

Samsung PN51D8000 movie.pdf 177.546875k . file
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post #51 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:27 AM
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I'm hoping that Samsung once again is offering the better blacks and hopefully the elimination of the CS bug on their 'larger' 59" and 64" sets...otherwise I have to admit I'm a bit disappointed...the black level measurements with/without CS seem worse then last year's C series

part that stood out for me from Chad B's review:

"On Samsung's C8000 and C7000 models, I found that the black level measured and looked very significantly better (darker) on the 58 and 63" panel sizes than the 50" panel I initially reviewed. I have a feeling that may be the case with the D8000 as well. Using a Chroma5 colorimeter that is rated to read accurately down to at least .014 fL and measuring in a dark room, I measured a black level of .0165 fL without Cinema Smooth engaged. With a 1080P/24 input and Cinema Smooth turned on, as most videophiles would greatly prefer to watch their Blu Rays, the black level deteriorated to .0225 fL"
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post #52 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:32 AM - Thread Starter
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^^^ On the 50" size the black levels are BETTER than last years The unit tested excellent. I hope we do not go where the other reviews have went this year so far. See this unit in person, see for yourself it is a great set !!
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post #53 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Cleveland Plasma View Post

^^^ On the 50" size the black levels are BETTER than last years The unit tested excellent. I hope we do not go where the other reviews have went this year so far. See this unit in person, see for yourself it is a great set !!

I know what you're trying to say that black levels should not be the main focus of the review but the fact that Samsung claimed .004 black levels and a fix for the CS bug has somewhat spoiled me
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post #54 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by TitusTroy View Post

I know what you're trying to say that black levels should not be the main focus of the review but the fact that Samsung claimed .004 black levels and a fix for the CS bug has somewhat spoiled me

I suspect the black levels will (hopefully) be .004 on the 59"/64" models. For some reason Samsung always seems to have higher black levels on their 50"ers.

The bezel looks pretty good though. But if the only real difference between the 7000 and 8000 is the "LCE" feature--which can't be found--what's the point in paying more for the 8000?
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post #55 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:41 AM
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Yeah, I measured .026 on the 50" C7000. I then got .006-.007 on the 63" C7000. This is quite a bit lower going by size. Hopefully the larger panels will follow suit.
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post #56 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by hhaller View Post

I suspect the black levels will (hopefully) be .004 on the 59"/64" models. For some reason Samsung always seems to have higher black levels on their 50"ers.

The bezel looks pretty good though. But if the only real difference between the 7000 and 8000 is the "LCE" feature--which can't be found--what's the point in paying more for the 8000?

the mystery LCE feature is something that needs to be explained by Samsung...no one seems to be able to find this setting on their sets...is it hidden in the Service Menu?...then again this makes the D7000 seem even more appealing but on the other hand will they have also borked some of the high end PQ improvements on the D7000 as well (black level, CS etc)?

I agree that Samsung has a history of offering up the much better black levels on the 'larger' screen sizes but is it possible to fix the CS bug on only certain models as well?...I'm still excited about the D8000 especially after seeing the new bezel color but am also a bit more concerned
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post #57 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 07:51 AM
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might be a newbie question but I notice in Chad B's picture's that the TV is shown without the stand attached...is this normal for these thin plasmas?...we have to assemble it ourselves?...it doesn't come with the stand attached?

Chad can you also take a few pics with the stand attached?...is the stand the same Titanium color as the bezel?...the silver stand on the box cover actually contrasts nicely with the Titanium finish on the TV itself
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post #58 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 08:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Chad B View Post

Yeah, I measured .026 on the 50" C7000. I then got .006-.007 on the 63" C7000. This is quite a bit lower going by size. Hopefully the larger panels will follow suit.

Thanks for the review!

Just one question. To me brightness is a problem in the past 3D sets.

And about this Samsung? Brigthness it's higher than ST30 or Samsung 2010 models? PN50C7000 you found 45 fL but you comentted that can go higher.

"I calibrated peak white to match 2 other plasmas nearby to facilitate a three way comparison at around 45-47 fL, though it could have easily gone higher. "
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post #59 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TitusTroy View Post

might be a newbie question but I notice in Chad B's picture's that the TV is shown without the stand attached...is this normal for these thin plasmas?...we have to assemble it ourselves?...it doesn't come with the stand attached?

Chad can you also take a few pics with the stand attached?...is the stand the same Titanium color as the bezel?...the silver stand on the box cover actually contrasts nicely with the Titanium finish on the TV itself

The stand does not come attached. The stand is crome.......
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post #60 of 5101 Old 03-18-2011, 08:10 AM
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virtually every tv you buy nowadays does not have the base attached.

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