Samsung PNxxD450/PNxxD490 Owners Thread - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 1860 Old 07-29-2011, 12:59 PM
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you can get colour ones:
http://www.ikea.com/us/en/search/?query=dioder
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post #722 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 01:12 AM
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just ordered myself an i1d2, will post up settings once i've had a chance to play. i wouldn't copy them though, i've never used a calibrator before
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post #723 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 05:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimmy84 View Post

No19:

I could do that, but keep in mind that I am using color correction (which in turn will affect the greyscale) through pixel shaders, which in turn affect my greyscale.

You could, of course, use this pixel shader as well, based on my primaries, which i think will be very similar.


First you should set both windows and mpc hc settings to NOT expand levels (doing so will add posterisation).

Cell = 20
Contrast = 90 (but verify this with a pattern!)
brightness = 13 (but verifiy this with a pattern!)
sharpenss = 50

gamma = 0

warm 2

roffest 26
goffest 23
boffest 16
rgain 5
ggain 25
bgain 27


Finally, the calculated matrix that are to be pasted as part of the pixel shader code (see the url I posted earlier)

1.02558944045726,-0.0116663937147538,0.000605953678796678,0,
-0.010602342361834,1.01345726166248,-0.00777680937301937,0,
0.0117218036053817,-0.014032416415533,1.00730340909549,0,
0, 0, 0, 0

Without the color correction by pixel shaders (that requires EVR custom presenter in MPC-hc), the greyscale might be somewhat off.

However, next week I plan to calibrate from scratch with CALMAN (instead of Colorhcfr) and are going to write down the calibrated results WITHOUT color correction. I don't remember 100% but I think the white balance settings without color correction are the same as in 1080p24 (earlier post).

So if you are NOT going to use color correction (which might be tricky to use without a colorimeter because you will have a hard time verifying if you are doing it right!), start from the settings for 1080p24, increase contrast to 90-95 (to compensate for 16- 235 levels) and adjust brightness according to a test pattern (AVSHD709 is EXCELLENT for this). Keep in mind that 2% above black should be barely visible while black stays true black.

Thank you vary much mister. You are amazingly informative. I'am loking forward for your CALMAN setings. Respect.
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post #724 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 12:47 PM
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I have purchased a D490 and wondered while reading the calibration settings, posted here, why no one uses the "standard" picture to start with as opposed to "warm2"? Warm 2 on my set leaves the picture more red while the standard setting appears to be more natural. What am I missing here? I am not attempting to start an argument but rather am hoping to gain understanding as to how I should calibrate this set.

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post #725 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tburg View Post

I have purchased a D490 and wondered while reading the calibration settings, posted here, why no one uses the "standard" picture to start with as opposed to "warm2"? Warm 2 on my set leaves the picture more red while the standard setting appears to be more natural. What am I missing here? I am not attempting to start an argument but rather am hoping to gain understanding as to how I should calibrate this set.

i thought the same. i tend to change mine between warm 2 and standard depending on how the picture is.
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post #726 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 01:41 PM
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I am interesting in PN43D490 for my bedroom. It will be replacing a Samsung LN37A550. This set seems to come in at a nice size and price point plus I would like to get my feet wet in the Plasma world.

A lot going on right now and we got 3 vacations coming up over the next 2 months. None of the local electronic retailers stock the D490. They have plenty of D450's but not the 3D version of this set for some odd reason. BB told me they could still get it but only have 5 left in the big warehouse in California.

My game plan was to wait it out until October and make my purchase but they are telling me its discontinued along with the D550 series plasma's. Wow it seems like these models just came out and a bit surprised its already been discontinued. However sometimes Samsung does that (remembering the LN60C650 CCFL backlit LCD that came out briefly last year).

So now my thinking is to just wait and see what comes out next? However I don't want to hit a dry spell and have to wait until next year. Big River is likely the best place to go but concerned about it arriving when I can't be here. Really I would just like to pick it up locally when the time is right.

Are these sets in fact discontinued and if so is Samsung working on something better? I know the TV market is highly competitive and they all have new tricks up there sleeves but I kind of thought the D490 would have its place in the TV world.
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post #727 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tburg View Post

I have purchased a D490 and wondered while reading the calibration settings, posted here, why no one uses the "standard" picture to start with as opposed to "warm2"? Warm 2 on my set leaves the picture more red while the standard setting appears to be more natural. What am I missing here? I am not attempting to start an argument but rather am hoping to gain understanding as to how I should calibrate this set.

Warm 2 on Samsungs tends to bring the TV the closest to the 6500k level that calibrators look for. It will often look more red as most people have a set that is set too "cool" (blue push) it will take some getting used to, but it will look normal after a bit and you will start to notice how off other TVs can be. In the end though everyone has a different opinion on what they want the picture to look like. Use the settings you find here and elsewhere as a baseline and adjust to you liking.
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post #728 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 08:38 PM
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When I play CoD black ops or BFBC2 I can see some white transparent bars of light it looks like on the screen. Is that how plasmas are lit or is something wrong?

Samsung 43D490 3D Plasma owner
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post #729 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 08:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob1511 View Post

So ive ordered a Samsung PN43D450 and i was mainly gonna watch 720p mkvs from my pc. im reading that my dvi to hdmi cord wont let me send 1024x768 to the tv because thats not in hdmi specs or whatever. they say you gotta use a vga cord but from what ive seen this tv has no vga input.

so am i stuck just doing dvi to hdmi and outputting like 1280x720 and having a blurry picture?

how are you PN43D450 owners with (1024x768) res hooking your pc's upto this tv with the sharpest txt and video? im using a radeon4870.

from threads ive read i found that outputting 1024x768 via vga and then using vlc player with the monitor pixel aspect ratio option gives the best results but no vga input on the tv and the info im reading is all old stuff from 2006-2009.

will a dvi to component cable let me send 1024x768 to the tv? is that even the best way to do it? i just wanna watch movies and shows with the best quality possible.

ok my dvi to hdmi cable works fine sending 1024x768 to the tv in clone mode.
the desktop is stretched but txt is clear. vlc with monitor pixel aspect ratio set to 4:3 gives me the right aspect for movies and tv shows. loving this tv.

one thing thats wierd is i turn on my 360 then goto hdmi2 and it says no signal for a few secs then the 360 goes to the bootscreen like i had just started the console, but i turned it on like 10secs ago. so im playin and it looks great but i gotta use the bathroom so i pause and switch the source to tv mode to avoid ir or burn. when i come back and change the source to hdmi2 the console reboots and goes back to the dashboard. it does this everytime i tried both hdmi ports.

does this happen with anybody elses set? if i need to leave a game on pause im thinking use that screen wipe feature while im paused so the tv doesnt restart the console.
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post #730 of 1860 Old 07-30-2011, 08:54 PM
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When I play CoD black ops or BFBC2 I can see some white transparent bars of light it looks like on the screen. Is that how plasmas are lit or is something wrong?

Where I look in the sky its most noticeable.

Samsung 43D490 3D Plasma owner
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post #731 of 1860 Old 07-31-2011, 10:46 AM
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Thanks Ph8te, much appreciated. I must say it does take a little to get comfortable with those settings however the wife liked it so it stays. I don't post here much but find this board one of the more useful ones around due to it's members.

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post #732 of 1860 Old 07-31-2011, 12:43 PM
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Purchased a 51d490 this weekend at Best Buy w/free 3d Glasses. Calibrated it last night and it looks great. 3d has left me wanting more resolution for the impact value. Does the D550 process 3d the same way? Is it not until you jump up to the D6500 that 3d really shines?

I used a D5500 samsung 3d bluray player to watch a bit of tangled in 3d and the effect is nice but the decreased resolution has me not so excited about it. Watching it in 2d has a much sharper image and more dynamic range in the image. I mainly bought the tv for directv viewing 90% of the time. I have a dedicated theater for movie watching.

Here are my settings:
Contrast 89
Brightness 59
Sharpness 33 (tried 20, sharpness pattern wants 5, but actual image to me I liked 33 before it got too soft on fine detail)
Color 53
Tint R49 G51
Gamma -1
Roffset 16
goffset 25
boffset 16
rgain 41
ggain 25
bgain 37
Eco auto level thing on, min set to 0. (have a light controlled room)
Color Temp Warm 2 (default was close to d6500K. but red and blue were a bit low in the higher IRE) Pretty good for out of the box.
all extras and features turned off

I'm debating on returning it for the D550 model but my intentions of 90% tv viewing is keeping me from it where it does a fantastic job.

I did have to tweek the 3d video settings when in 3d mode:
cell light 10
contrast 89
brightness 43
color 43
sharpness 33
tint 50
gamma -3
black level off
Red offset 12
g offset 25
b offset 26
r gain 14
g gain 25
b gain 14

I watched Rango on it last night and it was great! Anyone else have experience with comparisons of a 51D490 to a 51D550?
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post #733 of 1860 Old 07-31-2011, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nutdotnet View Post
Alright. Done calibrating my PN51D450 (US Model). Grayscale is great, color gamut eh. But that is pretty common for cheap/er Plasma's (over saturation of green).


Mode Movie
Cell 10
Constrast 86
Brightness 59
Sharpness 0
Color 52
Tint 50/50
Gamma 0
Color Temp Warm 2
W/B
R-Off 23
G-Off 25
B-Off 22
R-Gain 15
G-Gain 27
B-Gain 25

Whatever settings are not listed. Should be turned off/set to 0/etc....
Got the 51D450 delivered today. After watching for a few hours, tried these settings and they are a big improvement on the factory defaults.

May try Grimmy's settings in a few days to compare but these are great so far. thanks!
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post #734 of 1860 Old 08-01-2011, 11:36 AM
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Thanks for explanation Kpm197

Definitely EU and US models are different even on PQ and calibration

The one i ve has loud Buzzin , dirty screen effect and judder and i m not
going to return it cause EU models are like that and look great with HD..

I dont think also black level is 0.03 cd/m2 as said in some reviews
cause Panasonic G30 is 0.02 cd/m2 and its blacks are much more
deep than the D450 ones
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post #735 of 1860 Old 08-01-2011, 03:03 PM
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I don't know if the G30 is a huge improvement over the G20 in terms of black depth (I doubt it), but my friend owns a G20, well calibrated, and we both find the blacks on the D450 to be pretty much at the same level, so 0.03 cd/m2 seems about right.
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post #736 of 1860 Old 08-01-2011, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gatsou View Post

I don't know if the G30 is a huge improvement over the G20 in terms of black depth (I doubt it), but my friend owns a G20, well calibrated, and we both find the blacks on the D450 to be pretty much at the same level, so 0.03 cd/m2 seems about right.

The 450 closer matches the S class from Panasonic rather than the G series. The D7k would be the equivalent of the G30, so IRS a good thing that the TV matches last years 2nd tier model .
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post #737 of 1860 Old 08-01-2011, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimmy84 View Post

These are the settings for 1080p24 (should be the same for 720p) based on standard with game mode turned on:

Cell at max
Contrast at 85
Brightness 42
Color 46
tint 50/50 (untouched)
colorspace AUTO (important!) and all fancy options turned off
Warm 2
Gamma 0 for around 2.2-2.3 gamma. You might want to use -1 for dark room and possibly +1 for a really bright room.

in white balance r-offest increased to 26
b-offest reduced to 17
r-gain reduced to 6
b-gain increased to 26
green-offest and g-gain left alone

As in the other mode, what is important is to reduced red until the purle tone is removed. Changing the blues are not as important as they are trade offs anyway because the blue gamme tracking is far from flat. It will be quite good anyway you deal with it.

Tried these settings with my laptop today. A huge improvement for me over the defaults. Will keep these as my laptop picture settings.

thanks!
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post #738 of 1860 Old 08-02-2011, 12:35 AM
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I have measured the black level to be 0.027 cd/m2, so I think you are all right in the discussion. However, keep in mind that there is more to perceived black level than this number. Proper ambient lightning is crucial for one thing. This TVs screen is more reflective than, say, a G20 (I have a friend with one) meaning that in some situations the black level will be poor due to reflections. This set performs best in a nearly dark room with some very dim lightning behind or beside it.

No019:

I have to disappoint you but I am not able to give the figures for calibration without the color correction without pixel shader. The reason for this is that I have done some experimenting with LUT correction to even out the gamma tracking of the diffrernt color with good result. However, this also means that my current settings now (as of today!) are not transferable, since I have adjusted other things (and to make things worse through an auto-adjust program connected to my meter) outside of normal control.

Anyhow, the deal with 1366*768 without color correction (which I think should not be applied without access to a meter because it is quite tricky and sometimes messes things up) is to use about the same settings for white balance as I (and others) have posted regarding 1080p24. There may be small difference, but there is also small diffrences between diffrent sets.

You should really take advantage of 16 - 235 levels (without upconverting) as this means a lot less posterisation, which in turns means more detail. Also the settings for 0 - 255 are quite diffrent, so everything I say from now on assumes 16 - 235.

What is diffrent, then, is the brightness and contrast setting (always keep cell at max) These should be set with a pattern (AvsHD709 on this site). First you should decide what gamma you want. Gamma = 0 is roughly 2.2 and often the best choice. However, it goes down to around 2.1 and may thus be a little bit to reaveling in dark scences, especially in a dark room. If you have a really dark room then gamma = -1 is better and it translates to a gamma of roughly 2.4 You should not use the other gamma settigs other than for special situations (e.g., gamma = + 1 for gaming).

Turn up contrast to get a bright enough picture. This is mostly a matter of taste and how dark you room is. You can turn this up all the way to about 95 without getting any side effects. This may seem high, but it is because you have 16 - 235 levels.

After setting contrast, you should set brightness using a pluge pattern (or similar, such as the near black scale on colorhcfr part of avsd709) and adjust it so that black is pure black (no moving pixels) and so that you can BARELY see 2% above black. In 16- 235 levels this should be somewhere between 10 and 20 (depending on the contrast and gamma setting!).

Now, the gamut is somewhat oversaturated and warped towards greeen in this mode without color correction, but it is really not that big of a problem and the better detail giving by 1366*768 (although you wont get judderfree as in 24p) is worth it as I see it.
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post #739 of 1860 Old 08-02-2011, 12:50 AM
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Tburg: Indeed, the warm2 is to red. However, it is almost spot on in terms of blue, which means that you only need to make major adjustments to red to get it right. Standard need major adjustments to both blue and red. This is incredibly hard to do without a meter. So if you are going to adjust white balance by eye, you should pick warm 2 and then reduce red-gain until the reddish part of whites have disappeared.

However, if you absolutely do not want to adjust white balance at all and simply pick a mode, then warm 1 is a good alternative if you find warm 2 to be to red (it is). Warm 1 is both too red and too blue, but it might be easier on the eyes then warm 2. Standard is very far off from a neutral greyscale.
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post #740 of 1860 Old 08-02-2011, 07:42 PM
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Any suggestions on an external hard drive to run through the USB port? I would prefer a 2TB or even a 3TB?
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post #741 of 1860 Old 08-02-2011, 08:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bachelor View Post

Any suggestions on an external hard drive to run through the USB port? I would prefer a 2TB or even a 3TB?

I don't have the TV yet but I two 2TB WD Elements drives and couldn't be happier. You can usually find a good.deal on.them here and there as.well (I.got mine for $7x each on.BF last year.)
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post #742 of 1860 Old 08-03-2011, 12:01 PM
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I have quite a few 4:3 TV shows. I would like to know - am I likely to harm my D450 if I play them on this screen? (I am not keen to watch a stretched picture so it has to be original format). Do the black bars cause problems (IR/burn)??
Thanks.
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post #743 of 1860 Old 08-04-2011, 08:49 AM
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diverdewearn: Very unlikely. What can happen if you watch a lot of 4:3 with BLACK bars is uneven usage of the screen which you MIGHT be able to see if you are close to the screen in a pitch black room. However, this will go away with time. Still if you watch, say, 90% 4:3 content, then this minor "burn-in" will likely stay there until you start watching more 16:9.

If you are at all worried, the TV has the option to have grey bars, which will eliminate your concerns altogether. The shade of grey is an average of screen content and hence the screen will age uniformely.

Also i need to emphasize that you are not going to get any burn-ins. What you might get is some temporary image retention. It is hardly noticeable, goes away quickly and is not harmful to the screen.

Of course, if one were to watch 90% of content on a channel with a high contrast logo, then that logo MIGHT still be visible during the other 10% content (although VERY faint).
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post #744 of 1860 Old 08-04-2011, 08:55 AM
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Thanks Grimmy84!
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post #745 of 1860 Old 08-05-2011, 05:02 AM
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I have the D490 and noticed on the non HD channels and only during ads, not the actual show, the screen appears to be flashing. Any thoughts on what I may have to adjust to get rid of this? It does not happen on the HD feed and again not during the actual show, only during the commercials.

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post #746 of 1860 Old 08-05-2011, 07:30 AM
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Finally got my settings the way that pleases my eyes the most (pn43d450 US/Can):

Movie
Cell Light 6
Contrast 87
Brightness 48
Sharpness 25 (looks like vaseline to me on 0, so I need a little sharp)
Color 48
Gamma 0
Warm 2
No other adjustments (everything else off basically).

This is on a HD PVR connected with Component cables.
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post #747 of 1860 Old 08-05-2011, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tburg View Post

I have the D490 and noticed on the non HD channels and only during ads, not the actual show, the screen appears to be flashing. Any thoughts on what I may have to adjust to get rid of this? It does not happen on the HD feed and again not during the actual show, only during the commercials.

I have the d490 as well and when I'm watching non HD content my screen appears to be flashing to0. Again, does anyone know whats going on with this? Or how I can make this go away.
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post #748 of 1860 Old 08-06-2011, 06:40 AM
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i ve changed the position and ilumination and finished break in period
and...yes Gatsou-Grimmie.... blacks looks real good right now,they re at
best with "good" HD sources :]

I think the goal is to calibrate in Standard mode till reach MOvie mode "skin tones"
and that does not include Warm 2 or game mode imho
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post #749 of 1860 Old 08-06-2011, 08:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diante View Post

I have the d490 as well and when I'm watching non HD content my screen appears to be flashing to0. Again, does anyone know whats going on with this? Or how I can make this go away.

I played around with the cable box settings...when set to 720p the flashing takes place...when set to 1080i or native the flashing disappears. I have Charter cable with a motorola box. Hope this helps.

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post #750 of 1860 Old 08-06-2011, 04:32 PM
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tv turns itself on or off sometimes

are those touch sensitive buttons very sensitive?
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