Official Panasonic GT30 Series Discussion Thread [No Price Talk] - Page 3 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 06:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Grendell View Post

The big question for me is, has the issue regarding rising black levels in Panasonic Plasma displays been resolved with the S/G/VT30's? I guess the only way to know for sure is to wait and see. Given Panasonic's stance on the issue ("It's a feature not a bug") I personally have a hard time trusting them.

They said the 2011 models black levels won't rise after initial use. It's all been discussed a lot in the various 2011 Panasonic threads which you apparently aren't reading . Time will tell though.


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Originally Posted by Grendell View Post

My mistake. I was using Panasonic's web site as a source (obviously I haven't been shopping yet). Kind of pathetic when you can't trust the manufacturer's web site! (It doesn't even list VT at all.)

What's not to trust?? They only put up the models and sizes that are currently available. They aren't making the larger 60" and 65" STs and GTs yet, and they aren't making any VTs yet which is why they don't have them on their website. Once they are about to be released, they'll appear on their website.

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post #62 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 06:39 AM
 
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Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

They said the 2011 models black levels won't rise after initial use. It's all been discussed a lot in the various 2011 Panasonic threads which you apparently aren't reading . Time will tell though.



They also said the GT30 will have GT25 (.005) mll and D-nice's reading says otherwise...
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post #63 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 06:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Nobl3 View Post

They also said the GT30 will have GT25 (.005) mll and D-nice's reading says otherwise...

Did you expect them to nail it on the head? He got .0065 on a 6 hour old panel. Will the MLL improve at all by the time the panel reaches 100+ hours?

I do remain a little skeptical myself, but i have confidence that they have made improvements or even corrected the issues of the past few years.

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post #64 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 07:42 AM
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Originally Posted by hdtvnuby
I can get this TV for under $800 - should I buy even though my wife will kill me?

Seriously - what is likelihood I can unload this on craigslist for $1000 if she makes me get rid of it (no return option)?

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How about be a grown man and tell your wife that you will spend your money how you want?

I mean, come on.

Why not just tell dude to wait until the Christmas season when these sets will include freebies and sell for much lower prices?

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post #65 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 09:24 AM
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I wouldn't trust d-nice's measurement yet. Even he says it might not be accurate.

The important thing is that the GT30 was measured at .0042 fL and had a visually lower MLL than the GT25 when set side by side, and the GT25 we know is .005 fL.
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post #66 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 09:28 AM
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The problem doesn't seem so much black level measurement but people are paying more for THX and it's crap.

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post #67 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 09:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

The problem doesn't seem so much black level measurement but people are paying more for THX and it's crap.

Will firmware fix Gamma? That too me seems like the single most important question.
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post #68 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 10:03 AM
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I don't know if firmware can fix gamma. I also don't know what Panasonic's history is for fixing things like this with firmware either.

However, this problem seems to be limited to THX. Being the owner of a G25, which I adore, until someone tells me, or I see, that theres a significant difference in shadow detail/contrast, no flashing blacks and no flashing luminance I won't believe that GT30 is worth the extra $$ when considering the ST30.

Also, I'm not convinced that there's not a set out there as good or better in the same price range when all things are considered including user tools.

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post #69 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

I don't know if firmware can fix gamma. I also don't know what Panasonic's history is for fixing things like this with firmware either.

However, this problem seems to be limited to THX. Being the owner of a G25, which I adore, until someone tells me, or I see, that theres a significant difference in shadow detail/contrast, no flashing blacks and no flashing luminance I won't believe that GT30 is worth the extra $$ when considering the ST30.

Also, I'm not convinced that there's not a set out there as good or better in the same price range when all things are considered including user tools.

THX and gamma being broken on just that setting is why I would optimistically think this could be adjusted. The realist sees a products release as the end of the road of a major project and the company moving to the next one without looking back in a lot of instances. Hope that is not the case!
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post #70 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 11:58 AM
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"The important thing is that the GT30 was measured at .0042 fL and had a visually lower MLL than the GT25 when set side by side, and the GT25 we know is .005 fL."

Is there anywhere we can go to read this comparison report? thanks, j
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post #71 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 12:12 PM
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Yep that number looks good, but if detail isn't there and/or black & color is deminished because of rising to quickly how good is that black really then? IMO performance is equally important and not only compared to the GT25 either.

I'm waiting for more information and to see the sets myself. In the meantime I'll keep my eye on what people are saying about the others. That's the good thing about these forums- reading what other people experience.

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post #72 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

Well the good news is that early reports indicate that the GT30's black level is a little lower than on the ST30.

I'm a little concerned about how the HDMI ports point the cables to the side which might force people to bend them sharply to keep them from being seen.

My issue with the G20 was how the HDMI ports pointed backward giving a tight snug in the back where it could damage those ports. I since have moved the TV, so I'm worried about it, but it stinks that Panasonic is not smart about port location and placing these downward.
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post #73 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jl4069 View Post

"The important thing is that the GT30 was measured at .0042 fL and had a visually lower MLL than the GT25 when set side by side, and the GT25 we know is .005 fL."

It's entirely possible that their GT25 accumulated enough hours since their last measurement that it had it's first programmed black level rise. They measured .003 on the GT25 a few weeks ago and now it's at .006 according to their new measurement.
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post #74 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by CaptainZombie View Post

My issue with the G20 was how the HDMI ports pointed backward giving a tight snug in the back where it could damage those ports. I since have moved the TV, so I'm worried about it, but it stinks that Panasonic is not smart about port location and placing these downward.

Maybe one of these port savers or 90 degree adapters might help you.

http://www.monoprice.com/products/su...04&cp_id=10419

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post #75 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 01:36 PM
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I just purchased a P50GT25 from Costco for a great price about a week ago. I love it so far. Today the EPP Panasonic site has the P50GT30 for even cheaper (insane deal right now). I've done some research online and the only big difference I've noticed is that the P50GT30 has built in wireless.

Other than that, what are the main differences? Is it worth it return my 50GT25 TV to Costco for the newer 2011 50GT30 (plus save $100)? Is the P50GT30 a "better TV"?

Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance!
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post #76 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

It's entirely possible that their GT25 accumulated enough hours since their last measurement that it had it's first programmed black level rise. They measured .003 on the GT25 a few weeks ago and now it's at .006 according to their new measurement.

.003 was a bogus number. GT25 is .005 and ST30 is .008.

If it had gone through the first black level rise, then it would be at least as bright as the ST30 or brighter. But in the comparison it was still visually darker than the ST30.
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post #77 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

It's entirely possible that their GT25 accumulated enough hours since their last measurement that it had it's first programmed black level rise. They measured .003 on the GT25 a few weeks ago and now it's at .006 according to their new measurement.

Where is this information at? I have yet to read a GT25 measure at .003 (even my own measurements are very close to the .005). Measured that way from day 1.
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post #78 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Chad B View Post

Once you start actually measuring TVs, you find that manufacturer's claims are more like goals while looking through rose colored glasses, and their settings labels are more like Christmas wish lists...

Ok, so even if the TV has the option to set it to 2.2 or 2.4 and it isn't exactly accurate, can't you get close? I have to imagine that if you have gamma settings, there is at least a setting in the bunch that get you closer than "bad" or "way" off. I have never understood why Gama can't at least always be close by at least tweaking said setting rather than completely off.

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Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

The problem doesn't seem so much black level measurement but people are paying more for THX and it's crap.

I love my THX mode from my 2008, and I have no indicators that it has gotten worse, only that the TV's have gotten better. So unless the gamma setting is "broken" (and people are saying it was tweaked "to" 1.9 in THX mode, which I find confusing since they also said gamma cannot be adjusted in THX mode...), I am wondering if it really "looks" bad, since one of the reasons I loved my 800u and am going back to Panasonic again is for that very accurate and solid looking THX mode that I have already been enjoying a 3 year old set.
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post #79 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 02:47 PM
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It doesn't really matter if the panel is .005 or .006 even, because even going from .008 to .006 increases the ANSI contrast by around a 1000 more than the ST30. That'll amount to a big difference on screen.

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post #80 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 03:11 PM
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There was supposedly a shootout at VE the other night which included the GT30. Any news? I couldn't find out anything on their web site.
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post #81 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by BillP View Post

There was supposedly a shootout at VE the other night which included the GT30. Any news? I couldn't find out anything on their web site.

Information is not posted at the VE website, it is posted at the HDJ forums.
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post #82 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xMizzle View Post

I just purchased a P50GT25 from Costco for a great price about a week ago. I love it so far. Today the EPP Panasonic site has the P50GT30 for even cheaper (insane deal right now). I've done some research online and the only big difference I've noticed is that the P50GT30 has built in wireless.

Other than that, what are the main differences? Is it worth it return my 50GT25 TV to Costco for the newer 2011 50GT30 (plus save $100)? Is the P50GT30 a "better TV"?

Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance!

Get the GT30, it's a better tv.

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post #83 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post

It's entirely possible that their GT25 accumulated enough hours since their last measurement that it had it's first programmed black level rise. They measured .003 on the GT25 a few weeks ago and now it's at .006 according to their new measurement.

Well, the other thing is while the GT25 and the ST30 now measured the same, the GT25 is still looking darker on a 0IRE screen than the ST30, with the GT30 looking darker than that.

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post #84 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by jl4069 View Post

"The important thing is that the GT30 was measured at .0042 fL and had a visually lower MLL than the GT25 when set side by side, and the GT25 we know is .005 fL."

Is there anywhere we can go to read this comparison report? thanks, j

SO does the lack of reply mean that really no one knows where one could go to read up of the side to side comparison. Or are people on here , just being arrogant? thanks, j
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post #85 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by jl4069 View Post

SO does the lack of reply mean that really no one knows where one could go to read up of the side to side comparison. Or are people on here , just being arrogant? thanks, j

It's posted at HDJ forum. Google it. We aren't allowed to link to them or even say the full name because AVS will censor the link.
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post #86 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 07:00 PM
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It's posted at HDJ forum. Google it. We aren't allowed to link to them or even say the full name because AVS will censor the link.

thank you. j
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post #87 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 09:35 PM
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I was reading that the low gammas can be raise higher in the "in service" menu that only techs and calibrators know how to get into. Is this true? can someone confirm this? Is this tv even worth buying with 1.9 gamma, should i just save the money and get the ST instead?
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post #88 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 09:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by senkoskipper View Post

I was reading that the low gammas can be raise higher in the "in service" menu that only techs and calibrators know how to get into. Is this true? can someone confirm this? Is this tv even worth buying with 1.9 gamma, should i just save the money and get the ST instead?

The out of the box gamma is apparently 1.1 which is way, way lower than it should be. 1.9 was achieved after some calibration work.

I think it is too soon to say that this is a major problem, as it could be a service menu fix, or, hopefully Panasonic will own up to this and provide a firmware fix.

THX mode is one of the major step ups between ST30 and GT30 so it is mind boggling that THX does not have 2.2 gamma at a minimum.
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post #89 of 4166 Old 04-01-2011, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by senkoskipper View Post

I was reading that the low gammas can be raise higher in the "in service" menu that only techs and calibrators know how to get into. Is this true? can someone confirm this? Is this tv even worth buying with 1.9 gamma, should i just save the money and get the ST instead?

False
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post #90 of 4166 Old 04-02-2011, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by senkoskipper View Post

I was reading that the low gammas can be raise higher in the "in service" menu that only techs and calibrators know how to get into. Is this true? can someone confirm this? Is this tv even worth buying with 1.9 gamma, should i just save the money and get the ST instead?

Where did you read that and where they talking about this set specifically?

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