Panasonic VT25 IR/Burn in - Page 2 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #31 of 51 Old 05-28-2011, 09:29 AM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 318
Quote:
Originally Posted by haloimplant View Post

Yeah I object to the notion that burn-in can be avoided with simple 'common sense'. Common sense to me is that if I spend $3k on a display I can display whatever I want with it.

That said those of us here have more than common sense we have a large amount of information and shared experiences at our disposal. In the end I decided I simply couldn't tolerate the deficiencies of LED-LCD displays and so I went plasma knowing the issues and begrudgingly willing to make some effort to mitigate them.


When I said common sense, maybe I was being a bit presumptuous. But I was referring to burn in not IR, which as I keep trying to explain, is technically not the same. The real problem is the fact that when people buy plasmas, they aren't educated on it's short comings. More for your reading pleasure:
http://dvice.com/archives/2008/05/shift-image-ret.php


Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 51 Old 05-28-2011, 06:52 PM
Newbie
 
jec0995's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 12
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dayton View Post
And you've avoided the source of the IR during those 4 months?
Yep, outside of watching one baseball game that I couldn't pass up. Otherwise, ESPN never gets put on the G20.
jec0995 is offline  
post #33 of 51 Old 05-29-2011, 07:47 AM
Member
 
Jeipii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Whooptidoo, I'm not sure if I'm just imagining it, but it seems that my burn in / ir has reduced just a tiny little bit. Though I must stress out that this could be me just imagining things.

Anyway, no Madden 2011 with my plasma as long as that hud is visible on tv. It would be nice if people with burn in / super stubborn ir would post here if it has faded over time. I'll try to run break in slides next week and see what that does to the ghost image.
Jeipii is offline  
post #34 of 51 Old 05-29-2011, 09:14 AM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 318
Quote:
Originally Posted by jec0995 View Post

Yep, outside of watching one baseball game that I couldn't pass up. Otherwise, ESPN never gets put on the G20.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeipii View Post

Whooptidoo, I'm not sure if I'm just imagining it, but it seems that my burn in / ir has reduced just a tiny little bit. Though I must stress out that this could be me just imagining things.

Anyway, no Madden 2011 with my plasma as long as that hud is visible on tv. It would be nice if people with burn in / super stubborn ir would post here if it has faded over time. I'll try to run break in slides next week and see what that does to the ghost image.


Have you tried running a white snowy screen? Panasonic recommends that you run the set that way, several hours a day, for as much as 2 weeks to remove stubborn IR.

And no more sport casts and gaming you two!





Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
post #35 of 51 Old 05-29-2011, 11:25 AM
Member
 
Jeipii's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post

Have you tried running a white snowy screen? Panasonic recommends that you run the set that way, several hours a day, for as much as 2 weeks to remove stubborn IR.

And no more sport casts and gaming you two!

Ian

Nice emoticon.

I live in europe and my G20 does have this dimming feature which dims the screen a lot when there is no change in the picture.

When I turn on my analog tuner and put the snowy screen on, after five minutes the screen turns less bright which makes it less efficient in trying to take care of burn in. I've turned off all options that could affect this but the auto dimming cannot be turned off.

Maybe I'll try the break in slides or turn on the white scrolling bar from service menu.
Jeipii is offline  
post #36 of 51 Old 06-20-2011, 11:09 AM
Newbie
 
crimsontime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Hi guys, I have had the same issues with burn in. My wife played Fallout 3 for about a month. The tv was used for other uses, but the HUD burned in. This was back in February and we still have the burn in. I ran slides, JScreenFix, scrolling bar for a couple hundred hours no luck. So I'm with all of you who say this TV is really unfit for gamers or people who watch tv with static logos. It was an expensive mistake for me to buy the vt25, not only for the burn in, but because I bought the tv with gaming in mind and can't use it that way. Even watching lots of standard definition tv seems bad and we end up running the scrolling bar and slides regularly. Here is my thread on another forum if you are interested: http://www.avforums.com/forums/plasm...y-way-fix.html
crimsontime is offline  
post #37 of 51 Old 06-20-2011, 11:21 AM
Newbie
 
crimsontime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post

True, but technically they're not the same. Image retention refers the residual electrical charge of a pixel which acts like a capacitor and will fade over time. Burn in refers to damaged pixels whose phosphors have been prematurely aged. Unless they are abused, most of the newer plasmas today do not experience burn in, but IR is very common, even though it can last for quite some time.


http://hdguru.com/plasma-tv-burn-in-fact-or-myth/826/

http://www.plasmadisplaycoalition.org/results/image.php



Ian

I've come to believe sincerely that the conclusions reached in the above links are incorrect. For one thing, the testing periods are far too short. HD Guru tested for 10 hours. The plasma display coalition tests were 8 hours. They don't account for watching a channel every day for a few hours for a couple weeks or a month on end. The forums are littered with plasma tv buyers who became casualties because they assumed this information would allow them to play games or watch channels with static logos without fear. These "experts" claimed the images would fade -if they ever appeared in the first place. But no study has been performed that I have seen that follows actual usages patterns like we have discussed here. I think the results of such a study would be enlightening.
crimsontime is offline  
post #38 of 51 Old 06-20-2011, 04:00 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 318
Quote:
Originally Posted by crimsontime View Post
I've come to believe sincerely that the conclusions reached in the above links are incorrect. For one thing, the testing periods are far too short. HD Guru tested for 10 hours. The plasma display coalition tests were 8 hours. They don't account for watching a channel every day for a few hours for a couple weeks or a month on end. The forums are littered with plasma tv buyers who became casualties because they assumed this information would allow them to play games or watch channels with static logos without fear. These "experts" claimed the images would fade -if they ever appeared in the first place. But no study has been performed that I have seen that follows actual usages patterns like we have discussed here. I think the results of such a study would be enlightening.
Did you read my other post? It was a follow up to some of what you are saying. IR can be a real problem and it can take weeks and even months to fade away.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post20498154

Also worth noting:


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post20515687


Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
post #39 of 51 Old 09-29-2011, 09:57 AM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
incircles1138's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 9
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Well after several months of running the snow pattern from Pixel Protector several times a week overnight, I think I can conclude that I have permanent burn in.

Depressed isn't the right word to describe my state of mind.
incircles1138 is offline  
post #40 of 51 Old 09-29-2011, 11:54 AM
Member
 
Kbueno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 108
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Well that sucks....we've had our Wii setup since beginning of this year. I make sure they don't play more than 2 hours at a time, then run full screen TV. I haven't seen any burn in to date. 58VT25. Are some sets just more sensitive to this? I was thinking of playing some PC games off the VT25, but I think that's a bad idea since sometimes I go 3 hrs.
Kbueno is offline  
post #41 of 51 Old 09-29-2011, 11:58 AM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 318
I watched about 4 or 5 games in a row with little or no full screen content and then I noticed the YES logo when viewing a bright blue or white background image. It was barely visable. I then did the screen wash for several days and it was gone. Since then I do a 30 minute wash after each game, especially if I'm not going to be watching any regular full screen programming afterwards and it's been fine. Sorry about your TV, but look on the bright side, the Yanks are in the playoffs and Boston is not.


Regards,
Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
post #42 of 51 Old 09-29-2011, 12:13 PM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
incircles1138's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 9
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Yeah it was nice to see the Red Sox choke big time.

I only see it on light content as well. Light blue or white images in that area. I first noticed it while watching golf (I remember it well, it was during the Masters) and since then anything like that. The Hoth scenes in Empire Strikes Back are depressing to watch now because of the BI. It's just slightly darker than everything else. The sky should not say YES while AT-AT's are stomping around.

I guess there's nothing I can do. It depresses me violently. I've run the Pixel Protector snow pattern dealie for 8 hours plus on vivid probably 30 times. No improvement. Assuming at this point its quite permanent.

The worst of it is now I'm afraid to watch ANYTHING on the TV, especially YES, that is anything but 100% full screen pristine content. There's a pile of ps3 games sitting in my cabinet that I'm not playing out of fear of causing more problems.

Oh... my dad has a 46" G15. He watches nothing but sports and CNBC. He has 0 burn in, ir, whatever. Nothing. And he pauses all the time for 15-20 minutes. He didn't bother breaking his in either, despite my urging him to do so.

So i baby mine and get screwed, he doesn't and has no problems. SIGH
incircles1138 is offline  
post #43 of 51 Old 09-29-2011, 01:35 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 318
Quote:
Originally Posted by incircles1138 View Post

Yeah it was nice to see the Red Sox choke big time.

I only see it on light content as well. Light blue or white images in that area. I first noticed it while watching golf (I remember it well, it was during the Masters) and since then anything like that. The Hoth scenes in Empire Strikes Back are depressing to watch now because of the BI. It's just slightly darker than everything else. The sky should not say YES while AT-AT's are stomping around.

I guess there's nothing I can do. It depresses me violently. I've run the Pixel Protector snow pattern dealie for 8 hours plus on vivid probably 30 times. No improvement. Assuming at this point its quite permanent.

The worst of it is now I'm afraid to watch ANYTHING on the TV, especially YES, that is anything but 100% full screen pristine content. There's a pile of ps3 games sitting in my cabinet that I'm not playing out of fear of causing more problems.

Oh... my dad has a 46" G15. He watches nothing but sports and CNBC. He has 0 burn in, ir, whatever. Nothing. And he pauses all the time for 15-20 minutes. He didn't bother breaking his in either, despite my urging him to do so.

So i baby mine and get screwed, he doesn't and has no problems. SIGH


I never broke my set in either. Panasonic just recommends using a calibration disc on their web site. There is nothing in their manual that mentions break-in. I just think you have a defective set. Unfortunately it's hard to prove due to the fact that are people who are careless with their TV's and you were not.

Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
post #44 of 51 Old 09-29-2011, 01:58 PM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
incircles1138's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 9
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Yeah that's the real root of my frustration. I was very nice to it, yet got burned (bad pun I know) by what's probably defective tech. But there's no way to prove it and I can't blame Panasonic for not believing me and/or wanting to do anything about it. It would be a poor way to run a business. I still emailed them earlier today though. I might even try calling. it's bothering me more and more though for whatever reason. Maybe there's a known issue with x # of serial #'s, or something.

I can dream right?

At least I get to drown my sorrows in postseason baseball tomorrow night.
incircles1138 is offline  
post #45 of 51 Old 09-29-2011, 04:03 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 318
Quote:
Originally Posted by incircles1138 View Post

Yeah that's the real root of my frustration. I was very nice to it, yet got burned (bad pun I know) by what's probably defective tech. But there's no way to prove it and I can't blame Panasonic for not believing me and/or wanting to do anything about it. It would be a poor way to run a business. I still emailed them earlier today though. I might even try calling. it's bothering me more and more though for whatever reason. Maybe there's a known issue with x # of serial #'s, or something.

I can dream right?

At least I get to drown my sorrows in postseason baseball tomorrow night.


Go Yanks!


Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
post #46 of 51 Old 10-02-2011, 09:47 AM
Member
 
HoundBaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Denville New Jersey
Posts: 57
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I have the same problem with my Panasonic 55GT30 which I purchased May 2011. I watch the Yankees just about every game on Yes . I noticed the Yes burn in too in the upper left this past Monday just after Sunday's double header. I did run the breakin slide's for the first 100 hours and after that just HD programs, no gaming. I am now running the white noise from an analog channel for the past 12 hours. I have a 40 in Toshiba LED which I picked up last month with no problem's and a great picture. I should have purchaced a Samsung on Sony LED for my main set. This stuff about no burn in on Plasma set is all BS. I have to say I really babied this set and now College BB will be starting on ESPN, will I get the same burn in on the score ticker on the botton of the screen?
HoundBaby is offline  
post #47 of 51 Old 10-02-2011, 10:47 AM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
incircles1138's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 9
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
How are you able to get the snow/noise pattern to display? When I go to my analog channel it shows for only a second then switches to a black screen with a "channel not available (no signal)" in a floating box. I'd love to get that snow pattern working. I have this irrational dream that it will be more effective at alleviating the burn in. (i know, it won't, i said it was irrational)

I agree completely about the burn in BS. You're 100% right. It's indeed BS. Judging by the shear # of threads about this just on these forums, it's reality. As far as I can tell, plasmas are for watching full screen, HD movies. Nothing else. Sports, which they are praised because of their motion stuff - hell no. Every sporting event now has a graphic that could potentially BI. TV... most channels have a bug now too, even the transparent ones make me nervous. And HEAVEN FORBID you want to play games. SIGH. I"m about to move my PS3 onto my 37" seven year old Sharp LCD in the bedroom. Mutter.

Oh, I've had a little contact with Panasonic. Suffice it to say, they told me tough. The Viera Concierge chat was useless. The rep's english was poor and just did some copy/pasting from the script book. Then at exactly 9 PM she said "call back between 9 and 9, we're closed now" and disconnected the session. Nice service there. The email support basically just said "it's not covered under warranty, use the snow patterns".

If I could find someone to buy this off me for a grand, I'd do it in a heartbeat. I want to be able to use my TV for you know, anything, not worry.
incircles1138 is offline  
post #48 of 51 Old 10-02-2011, 12:34 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mailiang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Springsteen Country
Posts: 6,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked: 318
Quote:
Originally Posted by incircles1138 View Post

How are you able to get the snow/noise pattern to display? When I go to my analog channel it shows for only a second then switches to a black screen with a "channel not available (no signal)" in a floating box. I'd love to get that snow pattern working. I have this irrational dream that it will be more effective at alleviating the burn in. (i know, it won't, i said it was irrational)

I'm not sure why certain Panny owners can't get a white snowy screen. I just switch on the TV input. Make sure your ant option is set to on and don't do a channel set up scan.


Ian

The best way to succeed in life is to act on the advice you give to others

mailiang is offline  
post #49 of 51 Old 10-02-2011, 05:26 PM
Member
 
HoundBaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Denville New Jersey
Posts: 57
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
In the setup menu under the wrench.

1. Ant/Cable, Sel Antenna
2. Manual program Edit. I selected Channel 11, Add, yes, Return on remote then apply.
3. Then Just key in 11 on the remote and you should get the white noise.
4. Then to run this all night you need to go to the ECO/Energy Savings and turn off the no signal and activity timers.

I read somewhere that in THX mode the Pixel orbiter is disabled in the Anti Image retention menu. Checked my set and it sure is disabled and greyed out. Now if you used THX mode all the time watching the YES network could that cause the screen burn ? Gonna run the white noise again tonight. My burn in is a light grey and you see is clearly when there is a light background. I like the Yankees but I don't need the YES logo branded on the TV.
HoundBaby is offline  
post #50 of 51 Old 12-03-2012, 12:42 AM
Newbie
 
Sipsey Bandit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I just bought an unused (stored new) 58VT25 and I'm very paranoid about IR and burn in. Before getting this plasma my family would watch whatever on our LCD without worry. Most channels have static images so I'm very concerned after reading numerous blogs. Please provide updated instructions for break in and long term care in regards to the VT25. Thanks
Sipsey Bandit is offline  
post #51 of 51 Old 12-13-2012, 02:53 PM - Thread Starter
Newbie
 
incircles1138's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 9
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
My burn in has actually faded to the point where I'd go out on a limb and say it's gone. Of course it took over 2 years, but it did. Or maybe it's my eyes going bad...

Anyway, my advice...

Baby the TV a lot at first. Run the slides / exerciser dvd's daily for hours the first few months you have it. Avoid the sports channels with static graphics for at least a week or at least change the channel off and on often. Also, AS SOON as you get the TV, turn on the anti-image retention settings. I have the pixel mover thing on its lowest setting. Doesn't hurt, as far as I can tell, only helps.

Hope this helps. Enjoy the TV. It really is a beaut. I enjoy the 3D on it a lot. Just watched Avengers recently smile.gif
incircles1138 is offline  
Reply Plasma Flat Panel Displays

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off