Official Pioneer Kuro Reddish Tint Problem Thread - Page 79 - AVS Forum
View Poll Results: Does your Kuro have a reddish tint to the blacks?
KRP-500M/KRP-600M - NO 10 15.63%
5020FD/6020FD - NO 4 6.25%
111FD/151FD - NO 7 10.94%
101FD/141FD - NO 6 9.38%
Other/Older Model (please post) - NO 5 7.81%
KRP-500M/KRP-600M - YES 15 23.44%
5020FD/6020FD - YES 10 15.63%
111FD/151FD - YES 5 7.81%
101FD/141FD - YES 3 4.69%
Other/Older Model (please post) - YES 1 1.56%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 64. You may not vote on this poll

First ... 77  78  79 80  81  ... Last
Plasma Flat Panel Displays > Official Pioneer Kuro Reddish Tint Problem Thread
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 02:54 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by pg_ice View Post

as he didnt lower the MLL "that" much what i have heard i doubt there was any more tweaks done.

makaveddie:
no i wouldnt smile.gif

He reduces only to where there are no visible artifacts or black rain... perhaps his program determines the optimal values.

makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 02:55 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

Yes he did , let me guess your RSTP is 002

Bingo.
qwknuf6's Avatar qwknuf6 02:57 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

He reduces only to where there are no visible artifacts or black rain... perhaps his program determines the optimal values.

You also have to take into account how the panel works 1000 hours later or 10,000 hours later
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 03:04 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

My 151 panel settings S1 and S3 and S4 are low also , 72-82-129

Looks like Shockfett was spot on when he stated that S4 needed to be raised (effectively increasing the spacing between S3 and S4) on the 60 inchers to remove artifacts, as your S1 and S3 are only 7 above the minimum, while S4 is 18 above minimum.

On the 50 inchers, you have to reduce the spacing between S3 and S4.

I think his program takes into account hours, thresholds and other factors to come up with ideal values.
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 03:05 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

You also have to take into account how the panel works 1000 hours later or 10,000 hours later

Raising till there are no issues is accounting for hours. The panel won't let you do anything is doesn't like period.
qwknuf6's Avatar qwknuf6 03:08 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

Looks like Shockfett was spot on when he stated that S4 needed to be raised on the 60 inchers to remove artifacts, as you S1 and S3 are only 7 above the minimum, while S4 is 18 above minimum.

I think his program takes into account hours, thresholds and other factors to come up with ideal values.

I thought 47 was the factory spacing between S3 and S4
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 03:11 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

What i did on this last reset was, since i figured pioneers sets the voltages and then resets, i set everything at default except for rstp (at 2) and then reset.

Will now let the panel settle in for 200 hours by running slides and some content. If by then i am not happy with blacks, then ill reduce s1,s3,s4.

Can't wait to see what happens.

Where is our guide to red tint bro :drool: smile.gif
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 03:14 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

I thought 47 was the factory spacing between S3 and S4

Oops did my match wrong... So he did reduce all three by the same amount.

You could probably get lower blacks if you reduce 134 more, but he probably left them there to avoid artifacts.
qwknuf6's Avatar qwknuf6 03:17 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

Oops did my match wrong... So he did reduce all three by the same amount.

You could probably get lower blacks if you reduce 134 more, but he probably left them there to avoid artifacts.

no lower blacks for this panel , I tried , I get bad magenta trails on moving images from black to light ,
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 03:18 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShockFett View Post

Can't wait to see what happens.

Where is our guide to red tint bro :drool: smile.gif

The guide should only apply to non-reset panels. Once you reset, there is no standard way of removing artifacts, though it seems like raising SUS tackles some of them.

I didn't have to touch anything after resetting mine, as I had no artifacts. My panel only had 900 hours when I reset it, so the low hour count must factor in here. All I did was reduce RSTP. As you know, this was not the case with your 141fd after reset, as you had a laundry list of artifacts.
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 03:20 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

no lower blacks for this panel , I tried , I get bad magenta trails on moving images from black to light ,

Yeah man! Trails are a characteristic of 60". You just have a panel that really can't be tweak. Sorry I have one too.
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 03:20 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

no lower blacks for this panel , I tried , I get bad magenta trails on moving images from black to light ,

This is the same artifact Shockfett experienced on his 141FD. Looks like DNice found the perfect sweet spot.

BTW the defaults for 151FD are as follows:

VOL YNOFS1 D = 86
VOL YNOFS3 D = 96
VOL YNOFS4 D = 143

So yours were lowered to the point where there were no artifacts. What pattern are you guys using to see these trails? I'd like to include it in my tutorial.

Lowering to minimum and working your way up is the best approach, as evident by the results Hitman was able to accomplish with that method.
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 03:22 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

The guide should only apply to non-reset panels. Once you reset, there is no standard way of removing artifacts, though it seems like raising SUS tackles some of them.

I didn't have to touch anything after resetting mine, as I had no artifacts. My panel only had 900 hours when I reset it, so the low hour count must factor in here. All I did was reduce RSTP. As you know, this was not the case with your 141fd after reset, as you had a laundry list of artifacts.

60" are a whole different ball game. Yes I had server issues. I don't recommend reseting a 60" period.
qwknuf6's Avatar qwknuf6 03:25 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShockFett View Post

60" are a whole different ball game. Yes I had server issues. I don't recommend reseting a 60" period.

I have seen MLL posted of .0002 on 60" D-Nice tweaked panels , maybe just the 60" panles with 9.5 G sauce can be tweaked to very low MLL .
-Hitman-'s Avatar -Hitman- 03:25 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

I get bad magenta trails on moving images from black to light ,

I got that when I first started changing the voltages and they were too low, the panel wasn't being driven enough.
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 03:25 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

This is the same artifact Shockfett experienced on his 141FD. Looks like DNice found the perfect sweet spot.

BTW the defaults for 151FD are as follows:

VOL YNOFS1 D = 86
VOL YNOFS3 D = 96
VOL YNOFS4 D = 143

So yours were lowered to the point where there were no artifacts. What pattern are you guys using to see these trails? I'd like to include it in my tutorial.

Lowering to minimum and working your way up is the best approach, as evident by the results Hitman was able to accomplish with that method.

Combi 1 9 10 are best for 60"

9 is top priority. 10 will show popping in the white outline of the squares. 1 shows when you are way off. 9,10 are perfect for fine tuning.
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 03:26 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post

I have seen MLL posted of .0002 on 60" D-Nice tweaked panels , maybe just the 60" panles with 9.5 G sauce can be tweaked to very low MLL .

Which is why I have been hunting for one of these for awhile now.
qwknuf6's Avatar qwknuf6 03:34 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

Which is why I have been hunting for one of these for awhile now.

me too smile.gif
vinnie97's Avatar vinnie97 03:39 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShockFett View Post

This volts and ranges are spot on guys. If you are at min with no issues IMO thats the best the panel is going to perform without issues long term. Others with certainly disagree. But I'm not going to argue the engineers on the ranges. If plasma was meant to be oled while functioning normally (safely) pioneer would of created it that way. Why wouldn't they? All plasmas have a slight glow. Unless under volting.
I guess you have to actually go through the tweaking process before you get any credibility with these types of statements around here. wink.gif
-Hitman-'s Avatar -Hitman- 03:41 PM 02-25-2014
Vinnie, they're missing you in the Panny forums, I'm sure rolleyes.gif
vinnie97's Avatar vinnie97 03:42 PM 02-25-2014
There aren't any "Panny forums" at AVS.
pg_ice's Avatar pg_ice 04:32 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShockFett View Post

If plasma was meant to be oled while functioning normally (safely) pioneer would of created it that way. Why wouldn't they? All plasmas have a slight glow. Unless under volting.

One more take on this.

Active pixels that is constantly changing on regular content doesnt need the same power to work properly.
They can be underdriven without showing any black rain.
Thats why you can have these deep blacks with underdriving without any issues on regular content.

You know how it is on monday mornings.
It takes a nukelear bomb to wake up.

The same goes for pixels that hasnt been active in a while.
As for the black bars on blu ray movies.
Or a menu that suddenly pops up and wakes the sleeping pixels from a black background.
Thats where you need more power and thats when you notice the lag.

So keep the pixels active.
Simple as that smile.gif

There should have been an algorithm for this that knows what pixels that is sleeping.
When they wakes up it should just add a voltage boost to them and keep the lower voltage for the rest.
qwknuf6's Avatar qwknuf6 04:47 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by -Hitman- View Post

Vinnie, they're missing you in the Panny forums, I'm sure rolleyes.gif

I wouldn't really say "missing"
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 04:52 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by pg_ice View Post

One more take on this.

Active pixels that is constantly changing on regular content doesnt need the same power to work properly.
They can be underdriven without showing any black rain.
Thats why you can have these deep blacks with underdriving without any issues on regular content.

You know how it is on monday mornings.
It takes a nukelear bomb to wake up.

The same goes for pixels that hasnt been active in a while.
As for the black bars on blu ray movies.
Or a menu that suddenly pops up and wakes the sleeping pixels from a black background.
Thats where you need more power and thats when you notice the lag.

So keep the pixels active.
Simple as that smile.gif

There should have been an algorithm for this that knows what pixels that is sleeping.
When they wakes up it should just add a voltage boost to them and keep the lower voltage for the rest.

Yeah I noticed this. When I was testing during low volts. Normal content would be fine during 2:40:1. Then I would switch to FULL screen and I could actually see were the bars where with lazy magenta pixels that lasted <2secs.
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 05:00 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by pg_ice View Post

One more take on this.

Active pixels that is constantly changing on regular content doesnt need the same power to work properly.
They can be underdriven without showing any black rain.
Thats why you can have these deep blacks with underdriving without any issues on regular content.

You know how it is on monday mornings.
It takes a nukelear bomb to wake up.

The same goes for pixels that hasnt been active in a while.
As for the black bars on blu ray movies.
Or a menu that suddenly pops up and wakes the sleeping pixels from a black background.
Thats where you need more power and thats when you notice the lag.

So keep the pixels active.
Simple as that smile.gif

There should have been an algorithm for this that knows what pixels that is sleeping.
When they wakes up it should just add a voltage boost to them and keep the lower voltage for the rest.

No wonder it only happens when displaying the menu for the first time. I guess the pixels are already awake on subsequent displaying of the menu.
pg_ice's Avatar pg_ice 05:20 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post

No wonder it only happens when displaying the menu for the first time. I guess the pixels are already awake on subsequent displaying of the menu.

Thats right
The sleeping pixels ruins the blacks
The whole panel must be overdriven to have enough power to wake those.
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 05:37 PM 02-25-2014
Ice have you tried Eds tweak?
pg_ice's Avatar pg_ice 05:56 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShockFett View Post

Ice have you tried Eds tweak?

Sure.
No problem here.
But i still have RSTP at the default value 16.
I have lowered 34 -10 instead.

Maybe i will do another reset and put RSTP at 2 and raise 34 +10 (default)
That should be equal or maybe better.

Im watching the mentalist in HD fullscreen right now.
The depth is outstanding!
No artifacts just a clean picture.

Its hard to change something this great.
ShockFett's Avatar ShockFett 06:42 PM 02-25-2014
Nice man! The 50" are definitely more tweak able then 60". I have 60 at min and still a glow. I can drop it further but then I have trails. :/. Oled can't come fast enough smile.gif

My 500m is deep like yours.

Seems the 60" get trails as the 50" get black rain. Both are entirely different when under volted.
makaveddie81's Avatar makaveddie81 06:45 PM 02-25-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by pg_ice View Post

Sure.
No problem here.
But i still have RSTP at the default value 16.
I have lowered 34 -10 instead.

Maybe i will do another reset and put RSTP at 2 and raise 34 +10 (default)
That should be equal or maybe better.

Im watching the mentalist in HD fullscreen right now.
The depth is outstanding!
No artifacts just a clean picture.

Its hard to change something this great.

Have you tried resetting with factory defaults (even SUS)? I wonder if you can maintain SUS at 128 if you keep everything else at default.

Otherwise, a reset variation of the tweak would involve setting everything to default (except for increasing SUS and reducing RSTP).
Tags: Pioneer , Pioneer Pdp 6020fd 60 Inch Class Kuro Plasma Hdtv , Lcd Hdtv , Pioneer Pdp 5020fd 50 Inch 1080p Kuro Plasma Hdtv , Playstation 3 160gb System
First ... 77  78  79 80  81  ... Last

Up
Mobile  Desktop