Official Pioneer Kuro Reddish Tint Problem Thread - Page 94 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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View Poll Results: Does your Kuro have a reddish tint to the blacks?
KRP-500M/KRP-600M - NO 14 13.86%
5020FD/6020FD - NO 4 3.96%
111FD/151FD - NO 15 14.85%
101FD/141FD - NO 9 8.91%
Other/Older Model (please post) - NO 7 6.93%
KRP-500M/KRP-600M - YES 24 23.76%
5020FD/6020FD - YES 14 13.86%
111FD/151FD - YES 8 7.92%
101FD/141FD - YES 6 5.94%
Other/Older Model (please post) - YES 3 2.97%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 101. You may not vote on this poll

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post #2791 of 2861 Old 02-16-2015, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbrady3324 View Post
Thanks for the help! Just did a quick touch-up to my ISF night settings last night. I did notice that the ISF Night settings come out of black much slower with the voltage tweak than Pure Mode does. Interesting. I knocked down each of the S1, S3, S4 settings another 10 clicks with no issues. Tempted to keep going, but the blacks are black enough. Not sure how much deeper they can get

But man, with the tweak, it is like watching a brand new TV. The contrast and black levels are literally jaw dropping ( And I thought the TV was jaw dropping when I bought it 7 years ago ).
I just checked my 101 with 3900 hours , RSTP 001
S1 = 127
S3=117
S4=138
SAD=073
I used the WOW disc to check for any glow on an all black input , no glow at all on full black screen , none ,checked for artifacts on Monsters Inc. Door scene ,none ,I found the sweet spot on this panel , I also have a 101 with 800 hours that took to tweaking better than this panel , the lower hours may be the difference .
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post #2792 of 2861 Old 02-16-2015, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qwknuf6 View Post
I just checked my 101 with 3900 hours , RSTP 001
S1 = 127
S3=117
S4=138
SAD=073
I used the WOW disc to check for any glow on an all black input , no glow at all on full black screen , none ,checked for artifacts on Monsters Inc. Door scene ,none ,I found the sweet spot on this panel , I also have a 101 with 800 hours that took to tweaking better than this panel , the lower hours may be the difference .
I can attest to this. My 101fd (with 750 hours at the time) tweaked like a champ until I idiotically reset it. After reset, best I could get it at with no artifacts was around stock level.
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post #2793 of 2861 Old 02-17-2015, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post
I can attest to this. My 101fd (with 750 hours at the time) tweaked like a champ until I idiotically reset it. After reset, best I could get it at with no artifacts was around stock level.
I think this is probably true as well. My 500m has about 1000-1500 hours on it ( I will double check when I do a full recalibration ) and I was able to tweak down to

RSTP 01
S1 - 98
S3 - 88
S4 - 109

I could probably go down even further if I wanted to push it a bit further but honestly, the blacks and black enough that I can never tell the difference between the bezel and blacks even on a full black screen.
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post #2794 of 2861 Old 02-25-2015, 02:54 PM
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Pio 5080HD 8G, about to turn 26k hours.

No red tint, hasn't had any service menu adjustments or repairs, still working great.

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post #2795 of 2861 Old 03-22-2015, 02:23 PM
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Hooked up the laptop today.

1736 hours since my last reset. As I said before no red tint return on my 500M. I lowered RSTP from 12 to 1. Even though the black levels are great being a tech nerd I had to tweak a bit. I'll know if it made things even better once I can go full lights out.

The television screen is the retina of the mind's eye.
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post #2796 of 2861 Old 03-22-2015, 10:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VidPro View Post
Hooked up the laptop today.

1736 hours since my last reset. As I said before no red tint return on my 500M. I lowered RSTP from 12 to 1. Even though the black levels are great being a tech nerd I had to tweak a bit. I'll know if it made things even better once I can go full lights out.
Can you tell me what other adjustments you've made? I've had to reset my 500M about 4 - 5 times since December 2013, due to the red tint returning. Thanks.
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post #2797 of 2861 Old 03-23-2015, 04:21 AM
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Hi,

I initially followed the reset guide posted here on avs a while back. I reset the panel twice. The red tint was gone after the first reset. I think I reset twice because I wanted a fresh start since I think I may have screwed up the first reset.
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post #2798 of 2861 Old 04-27-2015, 12:07 PM
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So can the red push be fixed?
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post #2799 of 2861 Old 04-27-2015, 12:22 PM
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At least for me the red tint has not mad a comeback.

The television screen is the retina of the mind's eye.
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post #2800 of 2861 Old 05-17-2015, 08:21 AM
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Searched this thread but couldn't find an answer to my question.

Was there any definitive answer to which Kuro models were affected by the red tint issue?

Were the Kuro batches that were manufactured in 2008 are the ones having the problem or is it a random issue that could affect any date manufactured Kuro?

Thanks
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post #2801 of 2861 Old 05-17-2015, 08:44 AM
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Pretty sure any model and build date can get the red tint.

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post #2802 of 2861 Old 05-17-2015, 09:34 PM
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Is it likely that every Kuro will have this issue? Should I adjust my 101FD before there is a problem?
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post #2803 of 2861 Old 05-18-2015, 07:48 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azmodien View Post
Is it likely that every Kuro will have this issue? Should I adjust my 101FD before there is a problem?
red tint and elevated blackleves goes hand in hand.
if you have red tint you also have elevated MLL

to measure it you need a colormeter as the i1Display pro which can read down to the default blacklevel for the 101s (0.002Y)
measure the blacks and you will know if you need to "adjust" it or not.

a meter is a must here as it is hard to tell if you have lets say 0.002 or 0.004Y (-50% contrast ratio)
the meter will show it right away.

Last edited by all clear; 05-18-2015 at 08:09 AM.
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post #2804 of 2861 Old 05-18-2015, 09:38 AM
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0.001 ftL is the stock MLL of the LX5090, a 101/500M will go lower.
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post #2805 of 2861 Old 05-18-2015, 09:48 AM
 
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the numbers was with cd/m2

101 KRP 0.0005fL = 0.0017cd/m2
so its on the lowest limit of what the i1Display Pro can read.

if you dont get any reading at all with the i1D3 then you are probably close to stock

Last edited by all clear; 05-18-2015 at 09:51 AM.
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post #2806 of 2861 Old 05-18-2015, 07:51 PM
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I appreciate the replies,

I have 5900 hours on my panel, and had no idea about this issue until I stumbled on this thread. I am wondering if I should be proactive.

I am also intrigued about being able to tweak the blacks even lower, but maybe it is better to leave well enough alone.

Thanks.
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post #2807 of 2861 Old 05-18-2015, 11:02 PM
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If your screen does not have it, then don't touch it. There's nothing proactive to do, only pray you will never get affected.
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post #2808 of 2861 Old 05-19-2015, 03:39 PM
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My LX5090 has 17,000 hours on it. To get rid of the red tint I needed to adjust RSTP to 001 and SAD to 88 (from 128). I increased VOL SUS to 193 (from 113) initially but there is a flickering pixel. If I lower VOL SUS it ends up being a dead pixel, increase it and it flickers back to life. I went up to 228 with the VOL SUS setting but the pixel still flickers.

My problem is that I can't get rid of this flickering pixel unless I go back to default settings which brings back the red tint. Are there any other adjustments in the service menu that I can make that would fix this flickering pixel?
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post #2809 of 2861 Old 05-19-2015, 04:05 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegeta View Post
I increased VOL SUS to 193 (from 113)
volsus at 193 is crazy! lol
you will burn out the panel and the components in a few years from now trust me.
volsus that high will put an enormous stress to the panel and the components.
the overall temp also rises.

who told you to adjust volsus?

volsus that high will also bring out misfires near black
thats what you probably have right?

the better way is to lower YSUS_B and XSUS_B at the same amount until you get a clean white field.
set volsus back to 128

also with 17k hours its probably better to do a reset and set back all voltages to default.
at 17k hours the aging algorithms has messed up the panel pretty good.

if you want to try how a reset will work on your 5090 there is a new reset and evaluate method posted on the last pages of the reset guide thread.
use that one
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post #2810 of 2861 Old 05-19-2015, 04:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by all clear View Post
volsus at 193 is crazy! lol
you will burn out the panel and the components in a few years from now trust me.
volsus that high will put an enormous stress to the panel and the components.
the overall temp also rises.
Coming from the guy who pretty much disables ABL on his set, causing it to power down when displaying white fields. Funny, I gave you the same warning about your high ABL value shortening the life of your display and you completely shrugged it off by saying you'd just buy another one. Here's a refresh of our interaction.

From post 1676 of the reset guide thread:
Pioneer 8G 9G Kuro Reset Guide

Quote:
Originally Posted by all clear View Post
i have done alot of testing right now
probably one hour with a few shutdowns due to a too high abl value.

these combi masks probably uses more power than a regular white field does so thats why i got the shutdowns.
i think i was to close to the upper limit before.

the problem was that the tv was shutting down with one of the combimasks running.
so as soon as i plugged in the power cable and powered on the tv that mask was displayed for one second.
then the tv shut down again.
From post 1682 of the reset guide thread:
Pioneer 8G 9G Kuro Reset Guide

Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post
Man, I feel bad for your Kuro. A very brief lifespan awaits it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by all clear View Post
dont worry im going to buy another one just in case.
The highest VOL SUS can be adjusted to is 255 and the panel will never shut off. An increase from 128 to 255 will cause a peak light output increase of about 3 to 4 ftl, which is nothing compared to your ABL approach.

Quote:
Originally Posted by all clear View Post
volsus that high will also bring out misfires near black
thats what you probably have right?
Increasing VOL SUS on the 101fd and 500M will cause white sparkles on an all black field that are not visible at normal viewing distance. Not the case on the 9th generation panels.

Quote:
Originally Posted by all clear View Post
the better way is to lower YSUS_B and XSUS_B at the same amount until you get a clean white field.
set volsus back to 128
These two did nothing on my non reset panel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by all clear View Post
also with 17k hours its probably better to do a reset and set back all voltages to default.
at 17k hours the aging algorithms has messed up the panel pretty good.

if you want to try how a reset will work on your 5090 there is a new reset and evaluate method posted on the last pages of the reset guide thread.
use that one
If he's getting artifacts after tweaking below minimums, his panel will look like a Christmas tree if he decides to reset. The reset with rollback method may be a good choice if he decides to reset.

Last edited by makaveddie81; 05-19-2015 at 05:02 PM.
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post #2811 of 2861 Old 05-19-2015, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegeta View Post
My LX5090 has 17,000 hours on it. To get rid of the red tint I needed to adjust RSTP to 001 and SAD to 88 (from 128). I increased VOL SUS to 193 (from 113) initially but there is a flickering pixel. If I lower VOL SUS it ends up being a dead pixel, increase it and it flickers back to life. I went up to 228 with the VOL SUS setting but the pixel still flickers.

My problem is that I can't get rid of this flickering pixel unless I go back to default settings which brings back the red tint. Are there any other adjustments in the service menu that I can make that would fix this flickering pixel?
I had the same behavior on my 101fd.

There was an intermittent aqua colored stuck pixel prior to tweaking. After the tweak, the pixel would never get stuck and was working properly. If I increased SAD, the stuck pixel would return, so I kept SAD at 108 as not only did it net better blacks, but also got rid of the stuck pixel eye sore.

After I idiotically reset and scrambled to correct it by increasing voltages, the stuck pixel returned. Increasing VOL SUS or SAD (or both) brought the stuck pixel back. What I ended up doing was I left VOL SUS at default and only increased SAD to the point where the stuck pixel wouldn't show up despite having misfires on the internal patterns.

You probably increased VOL SUS to clear misfires on internal patterns, correct? If so, keep RSTP at 1 and SAD at 88 and reduce VOL SUS 10 ticks at a time until the stuck pixel ends up being a dead pixel. A dead pixel is much less noticeable than a stuck one.
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post #2812 of 2861 Old 05-19-2015, 06:49 PM
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Finally got a chance to upload the Pioneer Kuro Summer 2008 demo. This is the one that contains material for testing black rain/lag.

Pioneer Kuro Summer 2008 Demo Download
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post #2813 of 2861 Old 05-19-2015, 10:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makaveddie81 View Post
I had the same behavior on my 101fd.

There was an intermittent aqua colored stuck pixel prior to tweaking. After the tweak, the pixel would never get stuck and was working properly. If I increased SAD, the stuck pixel would return, so I kept SAD at 108 as not only did it net better blacks, but also got rid of the stuck pixel eye sore.

After I idiotically reset and scrambled to correct it by increasing voltages, the stuck pixel returned. Increasing VOL SUS or SAD (or both) brought the stuck pixel back. What I ended up doing was I left VOL SUS at default and only increased SAD to the point where the stuck pixel wouldn't show up despite having misfires on the internal patterns.

You probably increased VOL SUS to clear misfires on internal patterns, correct? If so, keep RSTP at 1 and SAD at 88 and reduce VOL SUS 10 ticks at a time until the stuck pixel ends up being a dead pixel. A dead pixel is much less noticeable than a stuck one.
Yeah, I increased VOL SUS to clear misfires but I noticed one setting that was not at the factory default. VOL OFFSET was at 137 instead of 113 which was causing the flickering subpixel (previous owner probably messed about with settings) so I set that back to default and also VOL SUS to 128. I haven't reset the panel.

I ended up changing these settings from default to get rid of the red tint and misfires:

RSTP=001
S4=169
SAD=088

I've not done any extensive testing but didn't see any misfires on the all white combi mask but have seen some black lag. The blacks are incredibly deep now as I can't even tell the TV is on in complete darkness.

Last edited by Vegeta; 05-19-2015 at 10:34 PM.
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post #2814 of 2861 Old 05-25-2015, 05:51 AM
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Damn this thread.

I can see it now when I look for it. It doesn't seem to effect the color overall, but the black bars have a magenta cast.

Still debating about messing with the service menu, the picture is still awesome.
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post #2815 of 2861 Old 05-25-2015, 05:57 AM
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Don't touch anything if you're still happy with it.
It won't affect colors, the cells in standby state have that red push, while they are displaying something they don't.
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post #2816 of 2861 Old 05-25-2015, 07:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azmodien View Post
Damn this thread.

I can see it now when I look for it. It doesn't seem to effect the color overall, but the black bars have a magenta cast.

Still debating about messing with the service menu, the picture is still awesome.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lnarbi View Post
Don't touch anything if you're still happy with it.
It won't affect colors, the cells in standby state have that red push, while they are displaying something they don't.
Sorry, like most defects once you've seen it there's no way you'll ever un-see it.
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post #2817 of 2861 Old 05-31-2015, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShockFett View Post
Quote:Originally Posted by gardear1

Thanks for the reply. I'll give it a try. Found a service manual and printed it off. HUGE. I'll see if I can wrap my head around it. So far it's reading like another language.


Here are a few pages of interest regarding this topic. Page 89 starts the commands list. It goes past this page as well.

<a class="attachment loginreq" href="/attachments/76159" title="">image.jpg 270k .jpg file

<a class="attachment loginreq" href="/attachments/76160" title="">image.jpg 148k .jpg file

<a class="attachment loginreq" href="/attachments/76161" title="">image.jpg 205k .jpg file
Do you have one for the 151? Or since it shares the same panel as 141 it should be the same? Looking at some of the numbers they do match my display.

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post #2818 of 2861 Old 05-31-2015, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
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Do you have one for the 151? Or since it shares the same panel as 141 it should be the same? Looking at some of the numbers they do match my display.
All 60" are the same as far a voltage(offsets) go.
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post #2819 of 2861 Old 06-02-2015, 12:25 PM
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Hello All, So I have a pro 141 model which clearly has red tint. I have acquired a service remote for the 141. What's next ?
Thanks; pcarel
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post #2820 of 2861 Old 06-02-2015, 08:59 PM
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Hello All, So I have a pro 141 model which clearly has red tint. I have acquired a service remote for the 141. What's next ?
Thanks; pcarel
Lower RSTP to 002 , Lower S1 to 72 S3 to 82 and S4 to 129 , recheck for artifacts and red tint , if there are none you are done .
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