Moving from LCD-LED to PLASMA. (Eyes on D7000) - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 14 Old 11-30-2011, 12:29 AM - Thread Starter
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Hello guys!

Well, as the title implies, I'm looking to purchase another TV... I've had bad luck with my LCDs and its replacements so I retired it to my dad's room. (All Sony) Being the hard-headed and brand-blinded person that I am, still bought the Sony EX720 TV (3D) and I've got the worse screen uniformity issue of all the TVs I've had. (DIrty Screen Effect, all over!)

Now I'm asking if it is advisable to move into PLASMA? What are the common issues here?

I'm very particular with screen uniformity, and I know that PLASMA will produce deeper blacks than LED could ever do. Question is, are there common issues with PLASMAs that I should look out for?

I'm eyeing the D7000 series mainly because of its good reviews on CNET, Television Info, and the likes. It's cheaper too over here in the Philippines than my Sony EX720 so I figured I'll place it on our Living Room and will mainly use it for gaming, movies. (Seldom 3D use)

How's the set? How's PLASMA in general this year? Thank you in advance guys!
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post #2 of 14 Old 11-30-2011, 01:23 AM
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I was in your position not to long ago. I had a 7000 LED but got tired of the uniformity, flashlighting and fake looking picture (no, I'm not talking about the SOE). It even looked fake without all of that useless crap like Auto Motion Plus turned off. In fact, I had to run it in Game Mode in order to get a half way decent picture. Anyhow, I exchanged it for a 7000 Plasma (first Plasma TV I've owned) and haven't looked back. Seriously, this is the best change I've ever made. I am still amazed at its picture 2 months later.

Trust me, you won't be disappointed.
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post #3 of 14 Old 11-30-2011, 01:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks Jester...

I think I won't be disappointed. My current set is now my fourth LCD and each and everyone of them had something to irritate me. Clouding, Vertical Green Bar, and now the dreaded Dirty Screen Effect which I though only existed on Kuros/Plasmas.

I'm reading some more and may I ask, how bad are the current issues? They say that black levels go lighter as the plasmas age... how are the screen uniformity?

I'm not at all super-picky. In fact, I tend to just ignore the small issues but when it comes to screen issues that directly affect the normal viewing condition, I'm irked! Sony EX720 is a tad expensive here, and it's hard earned money for me. Shame that exchange programs from Sony here sucks, retailers are better negotiators.
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post #4 of 14 Old 11-30-2011, 02:58 PM
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Both Samsung and Panasonic plasma have great PQ.
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post #5 of 14 Old 11-30-2011, 03:47 PM
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Just keep in mind that the full field whites on a plasma will not be able to touch your LED. For example if you watch something like hockey, the ice will not be anywhere near as white as it would be on a LED set. If thats not an issue for you, then plasma's destroy LED for overall picture quality.

You probably already knew this, but going from LED to plasma there might be an adjustment period to a panel that isn't as bright as you might be used too.


Good luck.

Mike
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post #6 of 14 Old 11-30-2011, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tunnel View Post

Just keep in mind that the full field whites on a plasma will not be able to touch your LED. For example if you watch something like hockey, the ice will not be anywhere near as white as it would be on a LED set. If thats not an issue for you, then plasma's destroy LED for overall picture quality.

You probably already knew this, but going from LED to plasma there might be an adjustment period to a panel that isn't as bright as you might be used too.


Good luck.

Mike

This may be true about the whites, but at least you will only see 1 puck, not many!
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post #7 of 14 Old 12-01-2011, 01:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tunnel View Post

Just keep in mind that the full field whites on a plasma will not be able to touch your LED. For example if you watch something like hockey, the ice will not be anywhere near as white as it would be on a LED set. If thats not an issue for you, then plasma's destroy LED for overall picture quality.

You probably already knew this, but going from LED to plasma there might be an adjustment period to a panel that isn't as bright as you might be used too.


Good luck.

Mike

Yup, I'm aware of it... Maybe it's going to be a bit of an adjustment too, kinda like the adjustment between Neutral to Warm 2.

I'll still have the LED in the bedroom, but will mainly use the Plasma for Gaming/Movie Viewing now. I can live with the Whites not reaching that of a LED if the trade off is the screen uniformity. Also, I'm already amazed by my current set's black level. What more if I'm able to experience the Plasma black level.

Just tell me one thing... No color banding and dirty screen effect on Samsung/Panasonic right?
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post #8 of 14 Old 03-01-2012, 12:33 PM
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I'm about to make the exact same move for the same reasons...

How did your adjustment period go? We're you satisfied with the brightness of the plasma?

Thx
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post #9 of 14 Old 03-03-2012, 12:20 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliCool View Post

Thanks Jester...

I think I won't be disappointed. My current set is now my fourth LCD and each and everyone of them had something to irritate me. Clouding, Vertical Green Bar, and now the dreaded Dirty Screen Effect which I though only existed on Kuros/Plasmas.

I'm reading some more and may I ask, how bad are the current issues? They say that black levels go lighter as the plasmas age... how are the screen uniformity?

As a Kuro owner who originally was in the LCD camp, I can assure you the MURA from my prior Samsung LCD outweighs the occasionally noticed DSE in the irritability factor by a long shot, and I instantly forget about it when a dark scene brings the Kuro black level uniformity to life.
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post #10 of 14 Old 03-03-2012, 02:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaliCool View Post

Hello guys!

Well, as the title implies, I'm looking to purchase another TV... I've had bad luck with my LCDs and its replacements so I retired it to my dad's room. (All Sony) Being the hard-headed and brand-blinded person that I am, still bought the Sony EX720 TV (3D) and I've got the worse screen uniformity issue of all the TVs I've had. (DIrty Screen Effect, all over!)

Now I'm asking if it is advisable to move into PLASMA? What are the common issues here?

I'm very particular with screen uniformity, and I know that PLASMA will produce deeper blacks than LED could ever do. Question is, are there common issues with PLASMAs that I should look out for?

I'm eyeing the D7000 series mainly because of its good reviews on CNET, Television Info, and the likes. It's cheaper too over here in the Philippines than my Sony EX720 so I figured I'll place it on our Living Room and will mainly use it for gaming, movies. (Seldom 3D use)

How's the set? How's PLASMA in general this year? Thank you in advance guys!

I hope this helps and doesn't necessarily discourage you, but here are my experiences...(disclaimer - I'm in Australia so a couple of the following points may not be applicable to North American models)

I recently purchased the Panasonic GT30 (46" plasma), coming from a 68cm Loewe CRT.

There was an atrocious green blob on the first one and a much better but still noticeable green shadows on the second. As such they were returned. However, I learnt something more important than the severity of the Panny green blob issue (at least for my eyes anyway). Here are the long list of things that ended up bothering me - some specific to Panasonic and some inherent to plasma technology. Some I already knew of, and others I had not noticed (or had chosen to ignore) while researching my 'dream' TV. I hope this helps others.

Firstly, yes the picture quality of the plasmas is very impressive but if you have sensitive eyes...

*Phosphor decay / lag issues mean that if you are sensitive to this you will often see red and green 'shadows' either side of the leading edge of high contrast images. It drove me crazy! My partner couldn't see it and I started to think I was imagining things until I discovered a few long running threads on AVS on the plasma 'rainbow' effect (the 'it's official thread' is the best of these). I am unfortunately in a small club of people who see this. Sin city is a good test disc - high contrast and black and white. You should not be seeing colour in this movie.

*The Panny plasma's suffer a '50Hz bug' which (as best as I can determine) exacerbates the above effect (mentioned in very few reviews - but check the gt30 review on AVforums for more info. Not relevant for you if you're in North America)

*Plasma TVs do flicker and if you are sensitive to this this may be annoying. Particularly noticeable in your peripheral vision.

*Panning is quite jerky - more so than on LCDs I've seen. Not sure of the correct term for this. It is fixed by engaging the soap opera effect which I can't stand

*All plasmas buzz (don't let people tell you otherwise). It is faint but the tone/intensity of the buzz definitely changes as an image increases in brightness. Not a deal breaker for normal listening but annoying late at night with the sound low. Some sets buzz more than others so there's a bit of pot luck involved. It doesn't bother most people for the most part but still...

*The GT30 has a disturbing green push across all image modes, particularly the THX mode (there are more reports for this with the Australian/European models - not so bad in the North American models so I'm led to believe. My observations were confirmed by a local ISF cert calibrator). Can't believe how bad the colours are in this mode. This is mentioned in reviews but hard to accurately fix yourself. As an aside this is something that annoys me about TV reviews - yes a TV may well be capable of extremely accurate colour reproduction (as is the GT30) but unless you are prepared to fork out the $400 or so for an ISF calibration you are going to struggle to get it right yourself. I would have needed to have the GT30 calibrated despite not originally planning to do so. Turns out I'm fussier than I thought. Either that or my old Loewe TV was more accurate than I thought. Why don't all reviews assess the out of the box modes more thoroughly? Perhaps people's ultimate purchase might be different otherwise

*I forget the correct term for this (posterisation? dithering?) but if you are sensitive to this shades of the same colour will not smoothly be displayed. ie a blue sky won't have the blues smoothly blending but will have distinct bands.

Anyway, the green blob and phophsor decay issue / 50 Hz bug were the deal breakers. The rest I would gladly live with given the otherwise excellent quality of the image in a dim room. However I'm going to have to go LCD due to the phosphor lag in plasmas (unless they speed up the decay, or at least get the colours to decay at the same rate in future models - keeping fingers crossed for 2012 models). I'll have to spend twice as much too and suffer the LCD probs you have described (uniformity, blooming etc etc and the rest). Pick your poison... A note to those considering a plasma. You need to assess a plasma in a darkened home theatre room. Torch mode amongst all the other TVs under bright lights reduces the overall contrast and makes detecting flicker, phosphor lag etc extremely difficult in store. If you don't see these and other issues then you are lucky and I'm jealous.

Hope this helps you Calicool. Cheers
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post #11 of 14 Old 03-03-2012, 06:03 AM
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I too am now considering a Plasma, after having a recent terrible experience (and ultimately returning) with the Sammy UN55D8000 (2011 Flagship LCD). The flashlighting, DSE, and edge bloom on this set are plain awful. As an engineer, I was actually surprised that Samsung ever released this design. I'm looking at the 2012 lineup of LCDs from Samsung and LG, but honestly only the LM9600 gives me hope (full array backlight), so I'm also considering the 2012 plasmas.

I hope that aintree's experiences don't apply to the higher end models. I am quite concerned about black level decay. I need this set to last 5+ years, or at least until OLED matures and becomes affordable. The talk of a "rainbow effect" concerns me as well.

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post #12 of 14 Old 03-03-2012, 07:33 AM
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Hi.

Got a VT30. My first plasma. I am extremely happy with my purchase. My TV doesn't buzz at all. You have to stand behind it and really listen, then yes you can hear a buzz but if you stand 20cm infront of the tv, nothing. I guess I got lucky.

Gaming a lot on mine as well. Thought I made the wrong choice at first but now I won't look back.
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post #13 of 14 Old 03-03-2012, 07:44 AM
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Great - Im a 50" KURO owner that was looking to go bigger and have been eyeing the larger LED sets out there. Of course, after reading the complaints both here and on various other LED threads, Im getting very cold feet. Damnit.

See what happens when a top TV maker stops making TVs? It ruins the whole thing. Although weve probably outgrown the 50" and would like TVs with built-in services, I aint putting up with all the crap people are mentioning. And, Ive yet to hear that the viewing angle issue with LCD/LED sets is resolved.

To the OP - Plasma isnt perfect, including KUROS, but they seem to get more right than wrong. Im hoping that a 65" Panasonic model would work for me. Ill wait for the new sets to come out.
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post #14 of 14 Old 03-03-2012, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s2mikey View Post

Great - Im a 50" KURO owner that was looking to go bigger and have been eyeing the larger LED sets out there. Of course, after reading the complaints both here and on various other LED threads, Im getting very cold feet. Damnit.

See what happens when a top TV maker stops making TVs? It ruins the whole thing. Although weve probably outgrown the 50" and would like TVs with built-in services, I aint putting up with all the crap people are mentioning. And, Ive yet to hear that the viewing angle issue with LCD/LED sets is resolved.

To the OP - Plasma isnt perfect, including KUROS, but they seem to get more right than wrong. Im hoping that a 65" Panasonic model would work for me. Ill wait for the new sets to come out.

Keep an eye out for the LG LM9600. This is the one LCD that I have hope for, since (I believe) it's IPS and full array backlight. Otherwise, I'm VERY interested in the Panasonic VT50.

Calibration Equipment:

Meters: X-rite i1 Pro 2, X-rite i1 Display Pro

Software: Spectracal Calman DIY, ControlCAL

 

Televisions:

Panasonic TC-P65VT50 (currently own)
Samsung UN55D8000 (returned) Calibration and Settings Thread

 

Plasma IR Removal:

Post 1 - Post 2 - Post 3

 

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