Official Panasonic ST50 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 39 - AVS Forum
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post #1141 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:27 PM
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Some people will be perfectly happy with the ST50. They won't be bothered by the dithering and less shadow detail. If they don't look at a GT50 or VT50 they won't be disappointed and knowing that they got a good deal for their $$ will make them that much more delighted.

Everyone doesn't require the same from their tvs. If they did then we'd all be buying VTs. They just want the best that their money can buy and the ST50 is that for many people. It's a great tv.

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post #1142 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adrian s View Post

So after 50 hours my 60ST50 hit a .0029 mll. I have it calibrated to a very bright 45fl. (living room isn't light controlled). All in all the set is pretty amazing. Having a little trouble on the low end, it seems a sacrifice has to be made - less shadow detail for less dithering (this may just be a DIY beginner issue).

I've been thinking on what you said. I recall D-Nice mentioning dithering and I wonder if you didn't tweak a bit in the opposite direction to tone down the dithering and he went for a better gray scale.

I'm glad to see that you got it that bright. What did you have to do to achieve it? My den isn't light controlled either.

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post #1143 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:35 PM
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We have yet to see a NA GT50 review, so I dunno where you guys are getting this from, specifically that the GT50 has less dithering and better shadow detail.
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post #1144 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

I've been thinking on what you said. I recall D-Nice mentioning dithering and I wonder if you didn't tweak a bit in the opposite direction to tone down the dithering and he went for a better gray scale.

I'm glad to see that you got it that bright. What did you have to do to achieve it? My den isn't light controlled either.

The metal privacy blinds are amazing for light control literally not a speck of light comes through the front as they are privacy blinds so when they are closed people cant see anything no matter how hard they try to look and metal is not translucent to light like plastic is. I forget the sites but many people sell them. They will cut them to your exact measurements and you can even choose the thickness of aluminum you want to use. Tons of colors to pick from and they look really clean and modern.
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post #1145 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

We have yet to see a NA GT50 review, so I dunno where you guys are getting this from, specifically that the GT50 has less dithering and better shadow detail.

avforums said due to the higher gradation shadow detail was better. We are assuming the NA version will do the same thing.
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post #1146 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:39 PM
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Any word on the X5? Just curious. You can get a 50" X3 $599 CAD, while the new 50" X5 is $849. yikes. A little steep for a new 720p model.
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post #1147 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

Any word on the X5? Just curious. You can get a 50" X3 $599 CAD, while the new 50" X5 is $849. yikes. A little steep for a new 720p model.

Not many people bother reviewing the low end 720p models. When you are spending bargain basement prices those people usually arent hardcore videophiles.
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post #1148 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

We have yet to see a NA GT50 review, so I dunno where you guys are getting this from, specifically that the GT50 has less dithering and better shadow detail.

You're right an NA model has not been reviewed. Did someone say it had less dithering?

I have yet to buy a tv yet and will not until all the reviews are in, the sets are in the stores for me to view and I know that owner's aren't discovering problems. I don't want buyer's remorse over a couple of hundred dollars.

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post #1149 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:47 PM
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I'm sorry this is an ST50 thread and I won't post anymore about the GT50.

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post #1150 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

I'm sorry this is an ST50 thread and I won't post anymore about the GT50.

Yes we should be punished
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post #1151 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by laststop311 View Post

avforums said due to the higher gradation shadow detail was better. We are assuming the NA version will do the same thing.

They stated this based on the specifications, not by visually seeing a difference. Nowhere in their review did they state that the GT50 has better shadow detail and less dithering. On paper sure it sounds good. But I doubt it's going to make a noticeable difference. If Panasonic doesn't make the GT50 at least look better on paper, why would anyone buy one.

Being the same panel, screen filter and having the same set of calibration control, with minor differences in the software side, I just don't see the GT50 being noticeably better than the ST50, or at least I don't see it being worth the price difference. D-Nice has even said that he doesn't think that the GT50 is worth the price difference.
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post #1152 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

They stated this based on the specifications, not by visually seeing a difference. Nowhere in their review did they state that the GT50 has better shadow detail and less dithering. On paper sure it sounds good. But I doubt it's going to make a noticeable difference. If Panasonic doesn't make the GT50 at least look better on paper, why would anyone buy one.

Being the same panel, screen filter and having the same set of calibration control, with minor differences in the software side, I just don't see the GT50 being noticeably better than the ST50, or at least I don't see it being worth the price difference. D-Nice has even said that he doesn't think that the GT50 is worth the price difference.

Did you watch the video reviews?

Also, did D-Nice say that based on paper or because he had both calibrated?

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post #1153 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 10:56 PM
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well i only said its worth the price difference if you never plan to have it profesionally calibrated because the thx out of box measurements are fantastic.
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post #1154 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

Did you watch the video reviews?

Also, did D-Nice say that based on paper or because he had both calibrated?

I just watched the GT50 review... still didn't hear any mention of shadow detail or dithering vs the ST50.

I don't think D-Nice has calibrated a GT50 yet. But he's a very smart man... he knows the technology inside these TVs as good as anyone, so he could make a very good educated guess.

THX mode is very good for a preset, but it's not great. A calibrated ST50 is still better. Just look at the calibration reports for the ST50 after calibration and the GT50 in THX mode before calibration.
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post #1155 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 11:16 PM
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Razhel, I believe that what D-Nice was expressing was the value of this set and he is right. Nothing is going to change that. However, the GT is not just like the ST. According to the specs on the website, that difference is the shades of gradation.

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post #1156 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 11:22 PM
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post #1157 of 9988 Old 04-06-2012, 11:31 PM
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Well thank you for taking the time to dig all that out and for clearing it up.

And yes we'll just have to wait and see. I'm not rushing to buy, I'm anxious, but not in a rush.

Also, I just wasn't thrilled by the ST50 at BB. Next time I'll take the numbers with me and adjust it to see whats missing.

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post #1158 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 02:37 AM
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Does the 60" ST50 buzz?
I want to buy a 65" ST50...
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post #1159 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 05:07 AM
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Originally Posted by B7192 View Post

Does the 60" ST50 buzz?
I want to buy a 65" ST50...

My set has no noticeable buzzing, but then again im coming from a d8000 so anything less than a death ray is great!

consider the source
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post #1160 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 05:23 AM
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Originally Posted by sheshechic View Post

They won't be bothered by the dithering and less shadow detail.

I don't believe ST50 has less shadow detail than GT&VT50 just because Pana says ST50 has 12,288 Equivalent Steps of Gradation while GT&VT have 24,576. I think it's just a marketing gimmick.

I also think there is no difference in PQ between these TV's at all except little deeper blacks VT50 has.

I don't think I'm compromising from anything. I think others are just not worth it.

If you think otherwise, I'm waiting your facts with proofs.
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post #1161 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 07:00 AM
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We've only got hunches, so let's ALL stop talking like we have the facts. Gary
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post #1162 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adrian s View Post

So after 50 hours my 60ST50 hit a .0029 mll. I have it calibrated to a very bright 45fl. (living room isn't light controlled). All in all the set is pretty amazing. Having a little trouble on the low end, it seems a sacrifice has to be made - less shadow detail for less dithering (this may just be a DIY beginner issue). Was wondering, and D-nice you may have thoughts on this, should i invest in a DVDO DUO to have more cal. control or would the money be better spent on the VT?

If the cost of the Duo plus the price of the ST is cheaper than the VT, I don't see a reason why you would not.
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post #1163 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartquake View Post

I don't believe ST50 has less shadow detail than GT&VT50 just because Pana says ST50 has 12,288 Equivalent Steps of Gradation while GT&VT have 24,576.

You're right o this.

Quote:


I also think there is no difference in PQ between these TV's at all except little deeper blacks VT50 has.

The additional controls on the VT can improve the picture over the ST. However, do not expect it to be significantly better. If you do not have OCD when it comes to PQ (like I do) and do not care for the additional "whiz, bang" features, the ST is your display.
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post #1164 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 09:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rotti1975 View Post

no one can tell me, how good or bad the new speakers are? I think no one here have the ST50?

I have a 50ST50, for normal viewing at normal volume levels the audio is fine and in line with what one would expect from a quality modern flat panel.
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post #1165 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

The additional controls on the VT can improve the picture over the ST. However, do not expect it to be significantly better. If you do not have OCD when it comes to PQ (like I do) and do not care for the additional "whiz, bang" features, the ST is your display.

Sorry, my bad. Should use "significant or slightly better" instead of "no".
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OK...call me stupid...but what is OCD
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obsessive compulsive disorder
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post #1168 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 11:06 AM
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OK...call me stupid...but what is OCD

Google is your friend here. OCD is obsessive compulsive disorder, but if you just Google OCD, you'll get plenty of insight. In this case, it's meant to refer to someone who is really picky.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

On paper sure it sounds good. But I doubt it's going to make a noticeable difference. If Panasonic doesn't make the GT50 at least look better on paper, why would anyone buy one.

Yep. And so long as it looks better on paper, people will "see" differences in their TV, whether they are actually there or not.

There is no difference in HDMI cables. If you can see the picture without visible dropouts or sparklies, the cable is working at 100%. No other cable will display a better version of that picture. You're simply wrong if you think there is a better digital cable than one that is already working.
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post #1169 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adrian s View Post

So after 50 hours my 60ST50 hit a .0029 mll. I have it calibrated to a very bright 45fl. (living room isn't light controlled). All in all the set is pretty amazing. Having a little trouble on the low end, it seems a sacrifice has to be made - less shadow detail for less dithering (this may just be a DIY beginner issue). Was wondering, and D-nice you may have thoughts on this, should i invest in a DVDO DUO to have more cal. control or would the money be better spent on the VT?

Awesome. It might get deeper after you reach 100 hrs and then drop in mll again after 200+ hrs if the behavior on the 50" models is anything to go by. It might get under .002

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post #1170 of 9988 Old 04-07-2012, 12:18 PM
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Would any of you lucky owners out there mind posting some pictures of your STs? I'd like to see how they look in a home environment. Thanks in advance.

All persons, living and dead, are purely coincidental. - Kurt Vonnegut Jr.

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