Official Panasonic ST50 Series Discussion Thread [No Street Price Talk] - Page 84 - AVS Forum
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post #2491 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 12:16 AM
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3:2 is not displaying proper film cadence. I don't know what your talking about. Don't let the lack of 72hz, 96hz, 120hz, etc of the ST50 convince you otherwise. The ST50 should have this from the factory.
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post #2492 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 01:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PathofNeo View Post

3:2 is not displaying proper film cadence. I don't know what your talking about. Don't let the lack of 72hz, 96hz, 120hz, etc of the ST50 convince you otherwise. The ST50 should have this from the factory.

I believe that the European models of the ST50 DO have a 96HZ-mode. Am I correct in assuming that in that case the problem with unwanted motion smoothing doesn't apply?
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post #2493 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 02:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by undeclinable View Post

I believe that the European models of the ST50 DO have a 96HZ-mode. Am I correct in assuming that in that case the problem with unwanted motion smoothing doesn't apply?

Yes that's correct with proper film cadence (no 3:2 pulldown) there will be no unwanted motion artifacts, anomalies, added judder, or motion smoothing.
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post #2494 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 09:19 AM
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Hi guys, I see a very feint vertical band on the right side of my ST50. It's about two inches in thickness and is very very feint and only mostly visible on test slides. Even then it's tough to see.

Someone mentioned to me that this was discussed in this very thread. Is that true? Are there people who experience this as well?

I want to make sure that I am making it clear that this is very feint and sometimes even I have issues seeing it.

Any info would be appreciated.
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post #2495 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 09:54 AM
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Regarding the vertical line, this seems to be somewhat common. I have noticed the same thing on my ST50, and others have mentioned it here as well. Nobody yet has actually confirmed anything as to whether the sets that have this have some sort of defect, or if all of them have it as part of the manufacturing process and many just don't notice it. As you said, it's very very faint - you can barely see it.

It does bother me, not that I can see it during regular viewing, but just because I know it's there and I wonder if it's normal for this tv or not. Maybe its time for some people to call Panasonic. As I have mentioned earlier here regarding a discussion I had with a Panasonic rep, we can complain here all day, but Panasonic will do nothing if they don't receive calls about the issues we have. And maybe they could actually explain what this is we're seeing.

I'd really like to know what the line is all about myself.
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post #2496 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 10:18 AM
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Okay guys, I called Panasonic about the line. The rep didn't mention one way or the other if he had any information on it, but he made a case # for me, and asked me to take some pictures of the line and email them to Panasonic with my case # and copy of my receipt, and then call back in about a day to follow up and maybe set up a service call.

So that's where things stand with the line issue for me. I really wish others would now call in as well. It's the only way Panasonic will look into this. Maybe it's something, maybe it's nothing. But it seems to be at least something, so lets see if we can find out what that is. The more calls they get on this, the more likely they'll be to investigate it.
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post #2497 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 10:22 AM
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Yes I agree that just knowing that it's there is annoying enough. Well at least it's no where near as bad as the green blob issue last year. Thanks for the response eagle.
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post #2498 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 10:24 AM
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I'll make a call as well. I didn't really look through the thread. Were there a lot of posts on this?
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post #2499 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 10:37 AM
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I can't say a lot, but it seems to get mentioned throughout the thread on and off by different owners.

Thank you for deciding to call Panasonic on this. It's really the only way we'll figure out what it's all about.
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post #2500 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 11:10 AM
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I have a GT50 and notice a faint vertical line on the far right side of the panel, maybe an inch, half inch in width. Don't really notice it with static slides but more obvious with panning screens ie. soccer or hockey although to a lesser extent than the green background. Unfortuately, it seems so be present will all inputs blu-ray, cable, etc. I'm still in a timeframe where I can return the TV so I'm trying to speed along the break in period with slides to see if it improves or changes with more hours on the panel.
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post #2501 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 12:02 PM
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I'm about to click the purchase button for a ST50 but two things concern me:

1. I'm really picky when it comes to noise an I really worry about buzzing. I live in a newly built house with excellent electrical wires. Does this help or maybe it has nothing to do with. The electricity?

2. I probably will play some true 23.927 content. If I use a HTPC with a blueray-player, can it output 60hz or will I need a standalone BR-player for this?

Thanks!
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post #2502 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfrey0118 View Post

I have standard 480i digital cable upconverted by my DVD Recorder to 480p on my 42" ST30, and I also watch DVD's @ 480p on it. I also have Comcast xfinity HD cable in the living room with a 60" ST30. The Comcast channels appear to be noticeably superior to the standard cable/480p DVDs.

I went off subject there and got confusing. Definitely the HD channels are superior. My point is that individual programs on HD channels can look really bad if poorly converted. This is much less of an issue now than seven years ago when I first got HD programming, but still happens. Most content nowadays is easily better on an HD station, but there are times when SD looks better. For example much college football is upconverted 480i from ancient stadium equipment, and often looks better on the standard definition station where it has seen less processing than the HD station where it is upconverted then mixed with the banners and sportstickers in HD, then re-compressed at the station, then de-compressed by your cable box or TV. All that compression leaves artifacts all over, and you end up with a horrible picture with an HD banner slapped on top.
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post #2503 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HIMS View Post

Simple question, I currently own a 65s1, for those with some experience with both, would it be a significant upgrade in pq to go to the 65st50? Thanks.

I upgraded from a 42s1 to a 50st50 and it is a night and day difference. When I got the S1 I was happy that I could get a decent plasma under $1000 despite the fact that it's blacks and colors left something to be desired. I allways liked the picture of my S1, but in dark scenes it looked "good for a flatpanel" not nearly CRT good. This st50 has me wanting to get my eyes back on a 36" XBR just for a comparison, the blacks are that much better. Not to mention the set has streaming, a browser,3D, better styling, and is half the thickness of my S1.
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post #2504 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 12:43 PM
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Hey guys I just bought the samsung un55d8000y because I've read good things but am pissed with the amount of bleeding and overall SU. I have a pretty bright room and game a lot but I hear amazing things about this set. Anybody think this would be a deal breaker?
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post #2505 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swillis55 View Post

I have a GT50 and notice a faint vertical line on the far right side of the panel, maybe an inch, half inch in width. Don't really notice it with static slides but more obvious with panning screens ie. soccer or hockey although to a lesser extent than the green background. Unfortuately, it seems so be present will all inputs blu-ray, cable, etc. I'm still in a timeframe where I can return the TV so I'm trying to speed along the break in period with slides to see if it improves or changes with more hours on the panel.

This seems to present on most Panasonic panels this year to some degree or another. Chances are that a replacement set would have it as well. I see it VERY faintly on my ST50 with the dark gray slides and hardly at all during normal viewing.
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post #2506 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD70GUY View Post

I upgraded from a 42s1 to a 50st50 and it is a night and day difference. When I got the S1 I was happy that I could get a decent plasma under $1000 despite the fact that it's blacks and colors left something to be desired. I allways liked the picture of my S1, but in dark scenes it looked "good for a flatpanel" not nearly CRT good. This st50 has me wanting to get my eyes back on a 36" XBR just for a comparison, the blacks are that much better. Not to mention the set has streaming, a browser,3D, better styling, and is half the thickness of my S1.

Awesome. Thanks for the response.
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post #2507 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 03:36 PM
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i have 3 vertical bands on my st50. 1 on the left and 2 on the right side of the screen and is going back for a replacement. i have the uk version.
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post #2508 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 04:28 PM
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My UT50 has a faint line on the left side. It's only visible during certain panning shots. It's hard to see, but it's there. Not a huge deal since the everything else about the display is so amazing.
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post #2509 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 06:08 PM
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I think for the money we're spending on these sets, we should not have to "settle" for lines on the screen. These tvs, including the ST50, are supposed to be amongst the best of the best. The ST50 is in a very small group of plasmas that are considered best of the year, along with the GT50, VT50, and Samsung's E7000 + E8000 sets.

Overall I'm blown away by the image quality of the set. I really am. But the line is a bit troubling because it's not the type of thing you would associate with such quality televisions. Of course neither are green blobs (Panasonic 2011), fluctuating brightness (Samsung 2011/2012), etc. - it's a shame each set has to have their own set of issues. They're all so close to being amazing, but they fall short with some silly issues.

I still think the ST50 is an amazing set. The image is so stable. Not a hint yet of fluctuating brightness within scenes. That alone puts Panasonic at the top this year as far as I'm concerned. I hope I'll hear some info on the line from Panasonic.
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post #2510 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 08:19 PM
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Well I just tried to take some pictures of the ST50 with the line visible for Panasonic, but the camera just couldn't pick it up, even with the slides playing. It's just too subtle to show up with the camera trying to focus on the screen. I tried different color slides, different angles, zooms, nothing worked. So I'll have to call Panasonic tomorrow and tell them I can see it but the camera can't. I wonder how that's gonna go?
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post #2511 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 08:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpippel View Post

This seems to present on most Panasonic panels this year to some degree or another. Chances are that a replacement set would have it as well. I see it VERY faintly on my ST50 with the dark gray slides and hardly at all during normal viewing.

Suppose I might be able to convince myself that our ST50 (60") has a Very Faint vertical "shadow" that shows up about 1-inch in from the right edge of the screen - but can only see it on ONE of the darker gray slides, and even then it is such a Slight variation that it is difficult to be Absolutely sure it is even there.

Certainly have not noticed any hint of it during normal viewing, & we got Real Good at spotting screen uniformity issues with our 4 (working) 2011 panels....
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post #2512 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 09:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xophile View Post

I'm about to click the purchase button for a ST50...... I'm really picky when it comes to noise an I really worry about buzzing. I live in a newly built house with excellent electrical wires. Does this help or maybe it has nothing to do with. The electricity?

Buzzing has nothing to do with the house wiring. If the TV buzzes excessively, it's defective.

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post #2513 of 9986 Old 05-09-2012, 09:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PathofNeo View Post

3:2 is not displaying proper film cadence. I don't know what your talking about. Don't let the lack of 72hz, 96hz, 120hz, etc of the ST50 convince you otherwise. The ST50 should have this from the factory.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PathofNeo View Post

Yes that's correct with proper film cadence (no 3:2 pulldown) there will be no unwanted motion artifacts, anomalies, added judder, or motion smoothing.

You are under the impression that just because the refresh rates are multiples of 24 would lead to proper film cadence. The Sony KDL-xxEX500 (120 Hz) and the Vizio XVT473SV (240 Hz) both failed the film cadence test on cnet. Since I have not read every technical review on every TV ever made I do not assume anything. In fact, I was pleasantly surprised to find another 60 Hz TV that goes against conventional wisdom. The Sony Bravia KDL-32BX300 also produces proper film cadence according to cnet:

"We were surprised when this little TV handled 1080p/24 sources properly, delivering the proper cadence in our test with the helicopter flyover from Chapter 7. Motion resolution was what we'd expect for a 60Hz TV, coming in between 300 and 400 lines."

Unless you can explain, in depth, the technical merits of why a 120 Hz and a 240 Hz TV would fail the film cadence test while the ST50 and the sony passes the cnet test, it is unwise to assume anything beyond our control. Neither one of us have any real knowledge of what various software engineers are doing half way around the world. We can only critique the end results. In this case:

"...the TC-PST50 passed our 1080p/24 test in its 60Hz setting. It cadence was smooth and properly filmlike, indistinguishable from the look of the other sets in our lineup that handled 1080p/24 properly." - cnet
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post #2514 of 9986 Old 05-10-2012, 12:43 AM
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Has anyone setup a YHT S401 with the ST50?

Any issues or comments? I'm probably picking up one this weekend that I have on order but haven't really had much chance to do any deep reading into the matter.
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post #2515 of 9986 Old 05-10-2012, 04:27 AM
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jhck66- You have some good points and I agree that neither one of us have any real knowledge of what various software engineers are doing half way around the world. I'm just going by common knowledge of 24hz into 60hz. It's been noted by several ppl on the boards that it seems like a mild SOE is being applied. How true this is I don't know but even Cnet can get things wrong. As they said in there review, "indistinguishable from the look of the other sets in our lineup". That tells me nothing. I need concrete facts, and until I get an explanation I'll go by what I know. I have a 42UT50 and can tell you now that it's smoother motion than my 5020 Kuro. By all means motion is superb on it but there's something different. I'm willing to bet the 96hz mode for the VT50 will calm the motion down similar to my Kuro...but I could be wrong.
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post #2516 of 9986 Old 05-10-2012, 04:32 AM
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Will I notice a lack of punch to the picture by moving up to a 65ST50? I'm used to 50" and smaller sets and based on my experience with a 60ST30 it wasn't too pleasant. I loved the size but could immediately tell that it was dimmer and didn't have the same dynamic impact to the picture. It was a great picture but it just felt underpowered so to speak.

Can I expect the same from the 65ST50 or do you think it holds up well literally side by side to a 55ST50?
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post #2517 of 9986 Old 05-10-2012, 04:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PathofNeo View Post

jhck66- You have some good points and I agree that neither one of us have any real knowledge of what various software engineers are doing half way around the world. I'm just going by common knowledge of 24hz into 60hz. It's been noted by several ppl on the boards that it seems like a mild SOE is being applied. How true this is I don't know but even Cnet can get things wrong. As they said in there review, "indistinguishable from the look of the other sets in our lineup". That tells me nothing. I need concrete facts, and until I get an explanation I'll go by what I know. I have a 42UT50 and can tell you now that it's smoother motion than my 5020 Kuro. By all means motion is superb on it but there's something different. I'm willing to bet the 96hz mode for the VT50 will calm the motion down similar to my Kuro...but I could be wrong.

Panasonic introduced new motion technology this year, that probably accounts for the improvement you are seeing.

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post #2518 of 9986 Old 05-10-2012, 06:21 AM
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i was wondering how close is ST50 calibrated to a GT50 THX mode. is it better?
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post #2519 of 9986 Old 05-10-2012, 06:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PathofNeo View Post

I'm just going by common knowledge of 24hz into 60hz. It's been noted by several ppl on the boards that it seems like a mild SOE is being applied.

I see no SOE, and I'm extremely sensitive to that effect. I'd be more suspect of the user's TV settings honestly, as I've seen motion smoothing set different on different sources such as Internet vs. HDMI, and I noticed the last firmware update set my motion smooting back on.
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post #2520 of 9986 Old 05-10-2012, 06:42 AM
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i was wondering how close is ST50 calibrated to a GT50 THX mode. is it better?

From what Chad was saying THX was very accurate right out of the box.
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