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post #1 of 24 Old 04-07-2012, 07:21 PM - Thread Starter
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I've been out of the game for a while now, but my Sanyo Z4 FP is on the fritz and we want to replace it with a plasma.

My dilemma is:
Should I get the 65GT30 or the 60ST50? They are almost the same price on Amazon.

Is the newer model worth the 5" size drop?

Any thoughts are appreciated.
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post #2 of 24 Old 04-07-2012, 07:47 PM
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I am in the same situation and I believe I will be buying the 60ST50 or possibly the 60GT50. From what I have read the latest Infinite Black Pro Panel might be the better panel. In my room I believe the 65" display would be overkill as I sit 9' away.

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post #3 of 24 Old 04-07-2012, 07:50 PM
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My gut (well, really everything I've read) tells me the ST50 is better than the VT30 in almost all regards picture quality wise... For me the decision would be easy.

-SiGGy
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post #4 of 24 Old 04-07-2012, 08:02 PM
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easy answer for me : 65 GT30 , TV's get smaller as you watch them.
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post #5 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 07:04 AM
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The ST50 is a better display than the GT30. As for size, it really depends on how far you will sit from the display. If it was me, I'd spend the extra and get a larger ST50.
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post #6 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillP View Post

The ST50 is a better display than the GT30. As for size, it really depends on how far you will sit from the display. If it was me, I'd spend the extra and get a larger ST50.

I've seen the ST30 and ST50 side by side and they're no difference in PQ in my eyes. Same inputs and calibrated with DVE HD Essentials!
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post #7 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 08:30 AM - Thread Starter
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Is there any awesome new features the ST50 has that the GT30 doesn't?

Thanks for all the response so far.
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post #8 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 09:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace1965 View Post

I've seen the ST30 and ST50 side by side and they're no difference in PQ in my eyes. Same inputs and calibrated with DVE HD Essentials!

DVE alone isn't enough to do a proper calibration.

The ST50 has better color, blacks and is brighter, so it looks noticeably more punchy. Maybe the viewing environment you were in didn't allow you to see the differences, but they are there. Whether you saw them or not is another matter and it's up to the individual whether it's worth the price difference or if it's worth sacrificing picture quality for size.
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post #9 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 11:09 AM
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This forum always obsesses on picture quality, which in general is good, but the fact is we are often arguing about the 1% in terms of perceivable quality. I would much rather get a 50 over a 30, but not so much that I would ever compromise on screen size. I would take an ST30 65" over a VT50 60" myself (or suck it up until I could afford the VT50). I have a 65" and sit only 6 feet away from it and would be happy if it was a 70-80", so this "depends how close you sit" or how big your room is argument I don't buy, for me personally. There probably is such a thing as too big, but none of the commercially available options qualify for that statement. Even my wife, who indulged me in getting a 64" now wants to upgrade to that size for our bedroom because now our big screen there seems to tiny for her. I would take an LCD before I would ever go smaller again.

To each there own...
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post #10 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

DVE alone isn't enough to do a proper calibration.

The ST50 has better color, blacks/contrast and is brighter. Maybe the viewing environment you were in didn't allow you to see the differences, but they are there. Whether you saw them or not is another matter and it's up to the individual whether it's worth the price difference or if it's worth sacrificing picture quality for size.

I really really want to see an improvement but is just is not there. Both have fantastic pictures but differences: Nope
JMO: PQ has gotten so good that any improvement in it is NOT perceivable.
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post #11 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 05:49 PM
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What you saw with your eyes is your opinion. But again... the differences are there. I'm not saying that everyone will see the difference. But the numbers don't lie, and a properly calibrated ST50 and ST/GT30 should have enough difference that it will be perceivable by the human eye. Let others decide for themselves whether the differences are worth the extra money or not, because a lot of people make purchasing decisions based solely on what they read here. I just wanted to make it clear that there are differences.

The improvements made every year are getting smaller. But you have to understand... most of us here are videophiles; we can see differences that the average joe don't see, and to many of us, these things that may seem 'small' are worth the price difference... that's up to the individual to decide. The 2012 Panasonic plasmas have actually improved over their predecessors more so than previous models.
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post #12 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

What you saw with your eyes is your opinion. But again... the differences are there. The numbers don't lie, and a properly calibrated ST50 and ST/GT30 should have enough difference that it will be perceivable by the human eye. Whether or not you see these differences is your opinion, but let others decide for themselves whether the differences are worth the extra money or not, because a lot of people make purchasing decisions based solely on what they read here.

Agree to Disagree
I will put my 2010 model up against the ST50 anyday! the vt25 would win!
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post #13 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 06:07 PM
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Agree to disagree. But fact of the matter is... you're wrong, plain and simple.
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post #14 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 06:21 PM
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Yeah, a VT25 with a mll of .005-.006 before the rise is going to compete with a brighter display whose mll has been measured under .003. The ST50 will have a much higher ANSI contrast ratio than a VT25.
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post #15 of 24 Old 04-08-2012, 06:33 PM
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Hard to say since I am by no means anywhere near experienced enough to give a valid opinion, but I have always been told to "buy the biggest screen your budget allows." With that said, I voted for the ST50 for two reasons:
1). I read on this forum that the ST50 is better than the VT30, and since VT30>GT30 then ST50>GT30, and
2). To me, 5" sacrifice in size would be worth trading for a better picture.

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post #16 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace1965 View Post

I've seen the ST30 and ST50 side by side and they're no difference in PQ in my eyes. Same inputs and calibrated with DVE HD Essentials!

If your eyes cannot see the obvious difference between these two displays then you're not qualified to say there's no difference. The ST50 is definitely better. Everyone else thinks so too.

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post #17 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

If your eyes cannot see the obvious difference between these two displays then you're not qualified to say there's no difference. The ST50 is definitely better. Everyone else thinks so too.

I am holding out for the ST60/70 by then the ST50 will be considered a horrible set.

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post #18 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 07:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

If your eyes cannot see the obvious difference between these two displays then you're not qualified to say there's no difference. The ST50 is definitely better. Everyone else thinks so too.

Totally agree here.
Saw an ST50 fully calibrated through a Radiance Mini that is stunning. Compared to the GT30 which it replaced it was night and day.

Mike

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post #19 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 01:00 PM
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Please, I have tried and tried to see a difference between the ST30 and ST50, It is just not there. I am really interested in what some of the most experienced calibrators would say! Not us no-names. I am just giving my honest 20/20 vision opinion. Please don't discredit people's opinion and I really know what to look for but I am not a pro! People that are not calibrators, it is just your opinion too.
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post #20 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace1965 View Post

Please, I have tried and tried to see a difference between the ST30 and ST50, It is just not there. I am really interested in what some of the most experienced calibrators would say! Not us no-names. I am just giving my honest 20/20 vision opinion. Please don't discredit people's opinion and I really know what to look for but I am not a pro! People that are not calibrators, it is just your opinion too.

Meter's don't give opinions. I have no idea what an ST30 would measure in luminance or how accurate the colors are but compared to the GT30 that the ST50 I saw replaced there is a huge difference.
You could look at D-Nice's review or Chad B's review. I think they might have a different opinion than yours.

Mike

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post #21 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 02:50 PM
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I'd go for size. The ST50 series is a better set, no doubt, but have both of them calibrated and the difference will be less. Still there, but less. But today, I'd rather have the bigger set. Wait a few years and you can have a set that's better than the ST50, the same size as the ST30, and less money.

Caveat: This depends on light levels in the viewing room. The xx50 series is noticeably brighter than the xx30 series. That could make a significant difference in a brighter room. In a dimmer room, it's less critical.
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post #22 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace1965 View Post

Please, I have tried and tried to see a difference between the ST30 and ST50, It is just not there. I am really interested in what some of the most experienced calibrators would say! Not us no-names. I am just giving my honest 20/20 vision opinion. Please don't discredit people's opinion and I really know what to look for but I am not a pro! People that are not calibrators, it is just your opinion too.

Many of us do calibrate ourselves and have enough knowledge to understand the numbers posted by the in-depth technical reviews.

No one is discrediting your opinion, we're just taking for what it's worth... your opinion. I was just making it clear that your opinion is not a fact, and the fact is, there are differences between the two, and it IS enough to be discernible by the human eye.

And if you must know, even the pros have said that there are differences.
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post #23 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace1965 View Post

Please, I have tried and tried to see a difference between the ST30 and ST50, It is just not there.

But the difference it IS there, you're just somehow incapable of seeing it. You're lucky - since you can't personally see the improvements then you can save yourself a ton of money and buy just any old TV.



Quote:


I am really interested in what some of the most experienced calibrators would say! Not us no-names.

Several of the well known experience calibrators and reviewers have already told us of their findings, and that is that the ST50 is a substantial improvement over the ST30. Where have you been? Read some of the ST50 and 2012 Panny threads - all the info is already there, and it's very positive.


Quote:


I am just giving my honest 20/20 vision opinion.

We're not questioning your vision, but your perception is poor. Nobody else that has checked out the ST50 (members, calibrators, reviewers) shares your opinion.


Quote:


Please don't discredit people's opinion and I really know what to look for but I am not a pro! People that are not calibrators, it is just your opinion too.

But based on your own statements, you can't possibly know what to look for. I'm not a pro, and i see a very big difference between the two TVs.

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post #24 of 24 Old 04-09-2012, 09:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I just ordered the 60ST50. After taking careful measurements we decided the 65 would be too big for the location we plan to mount it. We also finally found a local store that had both set up (side by side even) and uncalibrated with both set to Cinema mode there was obvious differences in the picture quality.

Thanks to all who voted and responded.
Ryan
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