Panasonic ST50 image retention, please help! - Page 25 - AVS Forum
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post #721 of 758 Old 03-23-2013, 10:05 AM
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My 60gt50 is a November build and I've had it for a few weeks. The first night I got it i set it up, I plugged in hd master's day settings and began watching it. I don't check slides for IR but I run the scrolling bar periodically just to check for it out of curiosity. I have had zero noticeable IR thus far.
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post #722 of 758 Old 03-23-2013, 10:06 AM
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Double post.
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post #723 of 758 Old 03-23-2013, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stansbrand1 View Post

My 60gt50 is a November build and I've had it for a few weeks. The first night I got it i set it up, I plugged in hd master's day settings and began watching it. I don't check slides for IR but I run the scrolling bar periodically just to check for it out of curiosity. I have had zero noticeable IR thus far.

You must have horrible vision then or you are being dishonest rolleyes.gif Don't you know every single panel has IR ? I guess that makes me vision challenged and dishonest also because I had my Vt50 for about 10 days now and not even a hint of IR and I have looked on slides for it.

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post #724 of 758 Old 03-23-2013, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by ser_renely View Post

time and fullscreen content...I would guess.

Interesting, never heard of that before, although I am newbie to plasmas.

Overnight with full bright picture settings and anytime your are not using the set.
Could take a few days and with extreme IR (NBC Olympics logo) a few weeks.wink.gif
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post #725 of 758 Old 03-23-2013, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by prateek33 View Post

The trigger is pulled 60ST60 ordered. Now lets see what the future holds for my tv

Congrats!!! Its a great tv.

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post #726 of 758 Old 03-23-2013, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by chunon View Post

You must have horrible vision then or you are being dishonest rolleyes.gif Don't you know every single panel has IR ? I guess that makes me vision challenged and dishonest also because I had my Vt50 for about 10 days now and not even a hint of IR and I have looked on slides for it.

Yes, because comments like these are really necessary.rolleyes.gif
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post #727 of 758 Old 03-23-2013, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by sonyfan View Post

Overnight with full bright picture settings and anytime your are not using the set.
Could take a few days and with extreme IR (NBC Olympics logo) a few weeks.wink.gif

I would also say it can take more than a few weeks for IR to leave(for slides).

94 minute soccer game with me switching for half time and running scroller for about 10 minutes resulted in IR that is still present on slides 3 weeks later. Contrast was relatively low as well.

It doesn't bother me, as I can't see it in normal viewing, but I can't imagine what would happen if i watched the Olympics for a day....NBC would own my tv.

It did seem that when I ran my tv on vivid fullscreen my IR diminished relatively quickly, so this is good advice above.

Between the Panasonic "Menu" and the fox soccer logo, I have not really seen anything else(minus a couple quick 10 min IRs). Although I use my zoom button and flip positions every 10 minutes or so....I shouldn't have to do that, but ce la vie. smile.gif

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post #728 of 758 Old 03-24-2013, 04:52 PM
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"MgO Sputtering" <-- I'd never heard of this before (well, someone did mention magnesium oxide in a thread about the Samsung IR performance, but didn't explain the connection). It does accurately describe the IR behavior of every 2012 Panasonic plasma I've seen (1 returned ST50, 1 GT50 I've kept, and a friend's ST50... so a small sample, but they've all had identical IR results).

I found this post that had a description of it: http://www.hifivision.com/television/10741-plasma-burn-has-anyone-ever-seen-burned-set.html#post149505
And found this discussion from these forums: http://www.avsforum.com/t/1338766/plasma-burn-in-and-100-000-hour-life-displays#post_20517171

...but otherwise haven't been able to find any solid information. The thread above mentions papers published by Pioneer on the subject and I'd be interested in taking a look at those, even if they're excessively technical. Does anyone know more about this, or maybe have some good links on the subject?

I'd love to have a scientific reason to believe that I could reduce how much I baby my GT50. So far I've had several cases of distinct IR (I use the TV primarily for PC gaming, so HUDs and whatnot), but they've all faded after several days. In theory real "burn in" should take huge amounts of uneven wear (especially later in the TV's life), but it's hard to convince myself to listen to that logic when I see stuck ghost images that can last for days. An actual scientific explanation for the long-duration IR phenomenon would put my mind at ease to some degree.
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post #729 of 758 Old 03-24-2013, 05:16 PM
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Go to post 132 of this thread for MGO Sputtering.
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post #730 of 758 Old 09-02-2013, 03:23 PM
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Well I am sorry to say I have IR of MSNBC bar and logo on the upper portion of my brand new 60ST60 after a little more than two month of purchasing it. AND I AM NOT HAPPY ONE BIT. And its even more upsetting because I have three other Panasonic Plasma going back to 2006 that stil looks beautiful and none of them have any IR or "burn in". I love the picture and features of this TV, but this has now made me very upset. I been running the Screen Wipe and have the Pixel Orbiter set to on. And I have seen only a slight reduction in the IR/ Burn In. The same program is being watched on my other Plasma and there's no issues with IR. Piss me off. For $1500, this is unacceptable. MSNBC with the logo is never watched for more than 3 hours per day, on the ST60, yet it's the one now with this irritating issue.

Does anyone have any suggestion? Panasonic will be hearing from me about this BS.
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post #731 of 758 Old 09-02-2013, 04:16 PM
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I've had the best luck with the "Pixel Jogger". Similar to the pixel flipper on the Disney WOW disc, it alternates rapidly between black and white.

http://www.mediafire.com/?hq5rv78qu1d9dhd

Any IR I've ever had on my ST50, that cleared it up better than the scrolling bar seemed to.
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post #732 of 758 Old 09-03-2013, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermolicious84 View Post

I've had the best luck with the "Pixel Jogger". Similar to the pixel flipper on the Disney WOW disc, it alternates rapidly between black and white.

http://www.mediafire.com/?hq5rv78qu1d9dhd

Any IR I've ever had on my ST50, that cleared it up better than the scrolling bar seemed to.
I agree, try a pixel jogger or Disney WOW pixel flipper. The Pixel Orbiter is useless, imo, and I keep it off. The scrolling bar on my set times out so I don't use it either. I can run the WOW pixel flipper as long as I like.
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post #733 of 758 Old 09-04-2013, 04:38 PM
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Thanks guys,

Your suggestions and help is greatly appreciated.
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post #734 of 758 Old 09-05-2013, 04:40 PM
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This thread is why I will probably get an LED set. I shouldn't have to change channels, not watch movies with black bars, or turn down the contrast to watch my tv without worry. It just sucks that LCD TVs can't match the PQ of plasma. The SONY w900a is a very nice set though
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post #735 of 758 Old 09-05-2013, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by SDB30 View Post

This thread is why I will probably get an LED set. I shouldn't have to change channels, not watch movies with black bars, or turn down the contrast to watch my tv without worry. It just sucks that LCD TVs can't match the PQ of plasma. The SONY w900a is a very nice set though

Yeah you should if that's your philosophy on plasmas. You can watch any channel, any movie with black bars, play games with no worries. I have since day one , with absolutely no problems. All panels are different, not all are the same.
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post #736 of 758 Old 09-06-2013, 10:51 AM
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Yeah you should if that's your philosophy on plasmas. You can watch any channel, any movie with black bars, play games with no worries. I have since day one , with absolutely no problems. All panels are different, not all are the same.
I second that sentiment. I also watch whatever I want as well. I've yet to have any noticeable IR with normal TV or blu-ray viewing on my ST50.
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post #737 of 758 Old 09-07-2013, 03:54 PM
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I am sure with everybody tips here I will get the IR out eventually. All my TV are Panasonic Plasma and I have seen IR in another one of them that eventually went away. But you have to be looking to see it most times unless it really bad. And that TV is over six years and is still simply stunning. When it comes to TV technology, I still refer Plasma over LCD, CRT and the rest. Plasma to me still have the deepest black and warmest black and reproduce a picture that to me is always very warn and natural looking.

I do wonder if OLED will have similar issues with IR. Cause that's where I am going next for my TV technology unless SED comes back into play and cheaper.
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post #738 of 758 Old 09-23-2013, 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Latinoheat View Post

Yeah you should if that's your philosophy on plasmas. You can watch any channel, any movie with black bars, play games with no worries. I have since day one , with absolutely no problems. All panels are different, not all are the same.

his point is completely valid. IR is a HUGE problem with plasmas, and completely unacceptable for some people (like myself). i own an St50. the IR is ridiculous. my wife cant even watch netflix with subtitles for a few hours or there will be 2 darkened areas at the bottom of the screen where the subtitles were for WEEKS. it destroys the viewing experience.

saying that you have never had IR problems blows my mind. i can only think that what you are saying is a complete and total lie. EVERY plasma has IR issues. watch TV with a white logo in the corner for more than an hour or two? IR. play a game with a white UI for more than an hour or two? IR. leave a menu up on the screen for a little while? IR. i dont care what you say, or what set you have, you are going to get IR in these situations. people saying that IR doesnt exist in plasmas now are flat out wrong.

considering there are many LED TVs out there with excellent blacks now, i just dont see how people can keep buying plasmas with these issues. there is absolutely NOTHING about a TV that destroys the viewing experience more for me than IR and uniformity issues. both are consistent issues with plasmas, while only uniformity is an issue with LEDs, and you can easily resolve that issue by just returning sets until you get one that is flawless (might take 2 returns... if that these days). IR is -never- something that wont be a concern on a plasma.

the elitist idea that anyone that doesnt buy a plasma is an "av noob" just makes me want to slap people on these forums. some people just dont want to put up with babying their TV.... breaking it in for 200 hours.... using slides to fix screen issues...worrying about if what they are watching is going to cause IR....and with LEDTVs looking like they do now, there is just no reason to do it.
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post #739 of 758 Old 09-23-2013, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Dameaus View Post


saying that you have never had IR problems blows my mind. i can only think that what you are saying is a complete and total lie. EVERY plasma has IR issues. watch TV with a white logo in the corner for more than an hour or two? IR. play a game with a white UI for more than an hour or two? IR. leave a menu up on the screen for a little while? IR. i dont care what you say, or what set you have, you are going to get IR in these situations. people saying that IR doesnt exist in plasmas now are flat out wrong.

And you would be wrong.

Ironically the OP that started this recent debate in his own words said his other plasmas don't have this happen but you failed to comprehend that. LOL

"Well I am sorry to say I have IR of MSNBC bar and logo on the upper portion of my brand new 60ST60 after a little more than two month of purchasing it. AND I AM NOT HAPPY ONE BIT. And its even more upsetting because I have three other Panasonic Plasma going back to 2006 that stil looks beautiful and none of them have any IR or "burn in". "
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post #740 of 758 Old 09-23-2013, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by ebernazz View Post

And you would be wrong.

Ironically the OP that started this recent debate in his own words said his other plasmas don't have this happen but you failed to comprehend that. LOL

"Well I am sorry to say I have IR of MSNBC bar and logo on the upper portion of my brand new 60ST60 after a little more than two month of purchasing it. AND I AM NOT HAPPY ONE BIT. And its even more upsetting because I have three other Panasonic Plasma going back to 2006 that stil looks beautiful and none of them have any IR or "burn in". "

i am not wrong. you just sound like a plasma snob trying to spread misinformation.

IR exists on every plasma set. it is a drawback of the technology. saying a plasma doesnt have IR is like saying a human doesnt need to breath oxygen. they go hand in hand. like i said, some sets are better than others, but ALL will experience IR at some point. Panasonic plasmas in recent years seem to be more susceptible to this than in the past. seems like samsung plasmas, while having slightly worse blacks, are much more resistant to IR lately.
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post #741 of 758 Old 09-23-2013, 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Dameaus View Post

his point is completely valid. IR is a HUGE problem with plasmas, and completely unacceptable for some people (like myself). i own an St50. the IR is ridiculous. my wife cant even watch netflix with subtitles for a few hours or there will be 2 darkened areas at the bottom of the screen where the subtitles were for WEEKS. it destroys the viewing experience.

saying that you have never had IR problems blows my mind. i can only think that what you are saying is a complete and total lie. EVERY plasma has IR issues. watch TV with a white logo in the corner for more than an hour or two? IR. play a game with a white UI for more than an hour or two? IR. leave a menu up on the screen for a little while? IR. i dont care what you say, or what set you have, you are going to get IR in these situations. people saying that IR doesnt exist in plasmas now are flat out wrong.

considering there are many LED TVs out there with excellent blacks now, i just dont see how people can keep buying plasmas with these issues. there is absolutely NOTHING about a TV that destroys the viewing experience more for me than IR and uniformity issues. both are consistent issues with plasmas, while only uniformity is an issue with LEDs, and you can easily resolve that issue by just returning sets until you get one that is flawless (might take 2 returns... if that these days). IR is -never- something that wont be a concern on a plasma.

the elitist idea that anyone that doesnt buy a plasma is an "av noob" just makes me want to slap people on these forums. some people just dont want to put up with babying their TV.... breaking it in for 200 hours.... using slides to fix screen issues...worrying about if what they are watching is going to cause IR....and with LEDTVs looking like they do now, there is just no reason to do it.

While IR is a problem with plasma technology, I stated that some panels are more prone to it than others . The fact that you got a set that easily gets it, doesn't mean all plasma models are the same.
You are accusing me of lying because I have a panel that doesn't get IR easily or at all. Have I ever seen it? Yes, when I first bought my panel from the menu screen. How long did it last? Not more than 10 seconds. Do I get it now? Not even if I tried. I can honestly tell you that I play Assasin's creed, Uncharted , various others games for a few hours on my PS3 and I don't get any IR. I watch Soccer games, hockey games, Football games , News etc for hours and no problems. They all have logos.
Uniformity issues are LCD issues from my experience, not to mention every other issues they have clouding,motion blur,terrible angle views and so on. I'm not bashing LCD they are some good panels out there, I just prefer plasma.
I'm not the only one that shares my experiences. I agree with you on people not wanting to baby their tv with slides and so forth, I'm one of them. I watched it normal from day one. Just like you said with LED, you could exchange them until you get a flawless one. Not one panel is flawless but what makes you think there are no panels out there with no IR issues. Hope you get a good panel next time around but don't judge them all the same because you had issues.

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post #742 of 758 Old 09-23-2013, 10:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dameaus View Post

i am not wrong. you just sound like a plasma snob trying to spread misinformation.

IR exists on every plasma set. it is a drawback of the technology. saying a plasma doesnt have IR is like saying a human doesnt need to breath oxygen. they go hand in hand. like i said, some sets are better than others, but ALL will experienc:mad:e IR at some point. Panasonic plasmas in recent years seem to be more susceptible to this than in the past. seems like samsung plasmas, while having slightly worse blacks, are much more resistant to IR lately.


Again you lack comprehension. Where did i spread misinformation? Where did I sound like a plasma snob. You know nothing about my sets or my preferences. Yes I have 4 pdps and I also have 7 lcd or LED-lcd panels. I am happy with all of them. ANd yes I have seen IR. 2 sets almost NEVER display any hint of it. 1 set is minor and I really have to look for it. The last one is on fact the worse but again only bothersome when I look for it (which most of the time is on switching inputs and that input is receiving no signal. It is not a problem like you make it out to be on the vast majority of sets. The pdps are preferred by my 3 sons for all gaming and many times for hours and hours per day after day. No problems. I watch football for hours and hours per day Thursdays, Saturdays, Sundays & Mondays again not a problem. None of that means I don't like or would not recommend lcd panels.
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post #743 of 758 Old 10-05-2013, 08:57 AM
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I bought a TH-P50ST60 almost a month ago, I get horrible IR, been there a few days after playing GTA V for only 2 and a half hours the hud is burnt in, I watched full screen movies to get rid of it and its still there, I am never buying another plasma again or a Panasonic TV.
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post #744 of 758 Old 10-05-2013, 09:03 AM
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when playing games with a static HUD, going to the pause menu or any other menu/screen that doesn't have the same HUD every once in a while is a good idea

you can even just hold down the PS button to show that menu (power off menu)



most TV channels I watch show the static logo during the actual program but it disappears during the commercials which occur pretty frequently
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post #745 of 758 Old 10-05-2013, 07:20 PM
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I did pause it now and again because I am aware of this problem but it still burnt in, this TV is garbage.
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post #746 of 758 Old 10-06-2013, 02:08 PM
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I did pause it now and again because I am aware of this problem but it still burnt in, this TV is garbage.
Try a pixel flipper like the Disney WOW pixel flipper for a few days.
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post #747 of 758 Old 10-06-2013, 08:48 PM
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I tried the scrolling bar for hours and watching full screen movies, no change at all.
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post #748 of 758 Old 10-08-2013, 09:17 AM
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I tried the scrolling bar for hours and watching full screen movies, no change at all.
The scrolling bar never works for me except to point out where exactly my IR is. Try a pixel flipper with the contrast dialed up. Worth a try, since the scrolling bar has not worked for you. Also, how old is your panel. If you panel is still very young, the IR may clear up on its own after a long while.
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post #749 of 758 Old 10-09-2013, 08:14 AM
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Panel is 2 weeks old, sent to Panasonic for to get checked before getting a refund, Im getting a LED TV, not taking any chances with plasma anymore.
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post #750 of 758 Old 10-31-2013, 09:58 PM
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The scrolling bar never works for me except to point out where exactly my IR is. Try a pixel flipper with the contrast dialed up. Worth a try, since the scrolling bar has not worked for you. Also, how old is your panel. If you panel is still very young, the IR may clear up on its own after a long while.

why is pixel flipper better? also does the scrolling bar have a time limit? i tried the scrolling bar for 40 min and didnt completely take care of it. The IR is from long ago it might seem.

edit: i just checked and only North american version has time limit, this explains why mine doesnt. Ive been thinking just to see if regular movie can do the trick, would a cartoon be better though?
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