Jumping from LCD/LED to Plasma, need reassurance. (Lots of questions) - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 17 Old 07-01-2012, 07:51 PM - Thread Starter
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*If you don't feel like reading this little novel I've written here, feel free to skip to the bottom where I just list my main questions and concerns.*



Hey everyone. It's been years since I last posted here mainly because I only post when I am switching to a new TV. You guys definitely give the best answers and back things up with actual technical knowledge which really helps me further my knowledge when it comes to televisions. I thank you for that! smile.gif

I'm in the market for a new TV and I am going to jump to plasma which is uncharted territory for me. However, I was on vacation this year and the place I was staying at had a fairly new plasma TV so I decided to hook my Xbox 360 up to it to see how it looked. I was blown away and I really loved the picture quality. I also LOVED the fact that there (as far as I could tell) were no uniformity issues whatsoever.

The main problem I've had with LCD and LED backlit displays are the issues with clouding and banding. Uniformity issues distract and bother the hell out of me, and as far as I know, plasma's do not suffer from any sort of these issues, correct?

I've been using a Sharp LC-46LE700UN for the past 2 years and it's pretty damn good compared to the other garbage edge lit nonsense on the market. However it does suffer from some pretty bad banding and it's always been a bother. This was never intended to be a keeper. I knew I'd be buying a new display within a few years, and here I am.

What worries me is what pretty much worries everyone else who has little experience with a Plasma display. Image Retention. I am a huge gamer and 90% of my time using a display is spent gaming. The other 10% is watching Blu-Rays. The Sharp happened to have some very low input lag of 11ms and overall was a great TV for the price and time, but I'd like to move on. Even though I've gotten used to the banding over the years, it still bugs me and I want a TV without those kinds of issues.

I have no interest in 3D, Smart TV features, or any of that other (in my opinion) gimmicky stuff. I just want a solid display with good picture quality, 1080p support, and low input lag. So after doing a little research the Panasonic TC-P50U50 caught my eye and I'm about to make the jump and pick it up. I've heard great things about Panasonic's plasma line up and from what I've read about the U50, it has low input lag which is great for my video games, and it has great picture quality to boot. It seems like a good set that has all the features I am looking for. I just don't know much about Plasma televisions and even though I know IR and Burn in are not even close to being as bad as they used to be, they are still present.

I'm ok with image retention. As long as I can REMOVE IT, I'm fine. I'm just worried about permanent damage. A little IR is no biggie because it goes away.

So I guess my main questions/concerns are as follows -

- If anyone here has personal experience with the Panny 50U50 or it's 3D brother the UT50, please tell me your thoughts!
- I've heard about "breaking-in" a Plasma. What exactly does that mean? And why does it have to be done?
- I will be gaming on this TV for long periods of time. Should I be concerned about burn-in?
- Does the IR protection setting (I think it's called a pixel orbiter or something) have an effect on input lag? I'd like to keep it on to protect my TV but if it raises the input lag significantly that isn't good.
- Should I be concerned about clouding/banding or any other uniformity issues on a plasma? I absolutely HATE those defects. They are the main reason why I am abandoning LCD displays.

Any other advice to a plasma newbie would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you very much for your time! smile.gif
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post #2 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 12:03 PM
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I have a 42GT25 and it has served me very well.

As far as "break in" goes, SOME people choose to run a set of colored slides on the screen for many hours to have the phosphors evenly broken in. This isn't necessary and I didn't do it but I watch a lot of movies.

That said, the first 100 hours or so are the worst for IR and possible burn in, I haven't seen this myself but it's been said. SO it's recommended that you watch a lot of varied content for the first 100 hours or so. Being a gamer you might find it advantageous to run some break-in slides to get those hours on the TV before you start having game marathons. (You can find more info about it since I'm not an expert.)

Input lag should be less of a problem on plasma than LCDs overall. The pixel orbiter MIGHT increase input lag but you won't know until you try. Most retail places let you return within 30 days so you can run the TV for more than 100 hours and test the lag well within those 30 days. I would guess that the plasma would still be faster than the LCD even with the orbiter on.

There shouldn't be any uniformity issues since each pixel phosphor creates it's own light unlike LCDs. Banding would only occur if there is a defect with the screen. So keep an eye out and remember the warranty. Or buy it at a place like Costco which increases the warranty just because you bought it there.

Personally I would pull the trigger and give it a try. Also, like I said about the warranty places like Costco increase it so see if you can pick one up there. Also check your credit card (if you have one) some have the added bonus of increasing the warranty just because you bought it with your card. I think American Express does it so check.

Last thing, if you are paranoid about IR, take a break every little while (it's good for your eyes too) and run the scrolling bar or switch to cable for a few minutes while you get a beer (if you're legal), make a snack, and take a leak. The thing most likely to cause IR will be a game's HUD.

Edit: Also check with the U/UT owner's thread about gaming.
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post #3 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 12:28 PM
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I have around 300 hours on my U50 up to this point, and it still gets image retention. My tv is used for mostly gaming, and there are huds stuck in the bottom right of the screen, MENU is stuck in the upper left, and the bottom left has the slide show menu thing stuck in it also lol. It does seem to go away, as long as you never let those huds appear in the same spot again. It took approximately 1 week for the left 4 dead hud to disappear.
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post #4 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 12:39 PM
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I left my Sammy PN43E450 on 24/7 for the first 10 days.
Just wanted to let those phosphor's cook.
Watched Dish and a few movies.
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post #5 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 12:43 PM
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I've had my VT 50 for a couple of weeks and have seen zero IR. I ran slides and watch mixed content, including news networks with fix logos. I do not game. Every now and then I do a quick channel change so fixed logos are not on the screen for extended periods of time. I occasionally run the scroll bar. That's about it. No IR. Knock on wood.

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post #6 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 01:27 PM
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when you said you game alot, plasma is thrown out the window. local dimming lcd will serve you better. imo
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post #7 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 01:46 PM
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The IR on my U50 isn't noticeable with actual content use though, just those solid colored slides mostly. FWIW, I also have a Panasonic C1, that tv gets diddly squat in regards to IR.
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post #8 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyano View Post

*If you don't feel like reading this little novel I've written here, feel free to skip to the bottom where I just list my main questions and concerns.*


So I guess my main questions/concerns are as follows -
- If anyone here has personal experience with the Panny 50U50 or it's 3D brother the UT50, please tell me your thoughts!
- I've heard about "breaking-in" a Plasma. What exactly does that mean? And why does it have to be done?
- I will be gaming on this TV for long periods of time. Should I be concerned about burn-in?
- Does the IR protection setting (I think it's called a pixel orbiter or something) have an effect on input lag? I'd like to keep it on to protect my TV but if it raises the input lag significantly that isn't good.
- Should I be concerned about clouding/banding or any other uniformity issues on a plasma? I absolutely HATE those defects. They are the main reason why I am abandoning LCD displays.
Any other advice to a plasma newbie would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you very much for your time! smile.gif

I have gone from a rear projection tv to lcd and now a plasma tv. I enjoy the plasma more then both the rear projection and lcd. my lcd did have the clouding problems as well.

1) I own the panasonic gt25. its a 3d set. it works great.
2) I didnt do the break in. I did watch alot of show at 1.78 for the first 100 hours or so.
3) I would recommend not doing much video games in the first 100 hours. should be fine after that.
4) I have no idea. I used it a bit in the beginning. I have not used it in a while.
5) no
Jacob
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post #9 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 03:58 PM
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Running static/snow on the screen will also help with stubborn IR. If it's a problem.
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post #10 of 17 Old 07-02-2012, 04:17 PM
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I just got the 50UT50 from Amazon, and the picture is great. There's a whole owners thread about it with tons of discussion, and, I seem to remember some discussion of the difference between it and the u50.

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post #11 of 17 Old 07-03-2012, 07:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the replies guys!

I totally forgot about the 30 day warranty. I don't like to buy large expensive items online and I don't have a credit card so I'm just going to my local Best Buy and picking the set up. It was on sale last week for 799.99 so I hope it goes on sale again soon and I'll grab it then (I live in Canada btw). If I don't like it within that 30 day period or if any problems arise, I'll just bring it back and look for something else.

Within the first 100 hours I'll make sure not to play any games with a static HUD, just in case. I'll watch some 1.85.1 Blu-Rays (the ones that fill up the entire screen) so that the display can get some break in time without black bars. When I go off to grab something to eat or take a phone call or something, I'll turn on some snow or a test screen to wipe away any IR. I'll do my best to take care of it!

In response to Ace1965, I don't want to deal with LCD displays anymore. The poor black levels, poor motion, awful uniformity issues, and high input lag have made them a bitch to pick through. I'm thinking that the pros of a Plasma FAR outweigh the cons, and hopefully the U50 will serve me well. Also, I hate paying 50% more for LED/LCD TV's only to be stuck with product with a ton of issues.

I'll grab the U50 sometime soon and if I run into any issues or have any more questions I'll be sure to come back here. You guys are a ton of help.
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post #12 of 17 Old 07-03-2012, 10:51 AM
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You mean 1.78:1, and there seem to be a lot of reports of IR with this year's pannys, so I wouldn't count on break-in to resolve that. Last year's Samsung D series seems to have very few reports of burn (and IR), so you might want to also consider a PN51D550 ($699 refurb on amazon right now).

edit: well, I found a few, but I still feel these panels were pretty good - here's some advice from an expert (and gamer):
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1339743/pnxxd550-advanced-calibration-unlocked-calibration-thread/390#post_21003091

Another thing I like about Samsung plasmas is their built in scrolling feature, specifically designed to remove IR.
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post #13 of 17 Old 07-03-2012, 12:22 PM
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I'd also do a search on plasma uniformity. If the banding you are talking about is the uniformity issues seen during pans in sports, movies, etc. you might still find it on plasmas. No clouding though.
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post #14 of 17 Old 07-03-2012, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AvidHiker View Post

You mean 1.78:1, and there seem to be a lot of reports of IR with this year's pannys, so I wouldn't count on break-in to resolve that. Last year's Samsung D series seems to have very few reports of burn (and IR), so you might want to also consider a PN51D550 ($699 refurb on amazon right now).
edit: well, I found a few, but I still feel these panels were pretty good - here's some advice from an expert (and gamer):
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1339743/pnxxd550-advanced-calibration-unlocked-calibration-thread/390#post_21003091
Another thing I like about Samsung plasmas is their built in scrolling feature, specifically designed to remove IR.

Panasonic's plasmas also have a built-in scrolling feature that can be enabled to help remove any IR.
Actually the 2012 Panasonic plasmas appear to be prone to IR mostly during the first 100-200 hours, so using slides during that intial period can help get past it quickly along with avoiding puttting up any bright white text/logos that might cause some early IR.
After that initial 100-200hour active period, the sets appear to be more resistant to getting IR from bright white text and logos and haven't appeared to get IR from black bars at all.
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post #15 of 17 Old 07-04-2012, 05:11 AM
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Good to know. Time will tell!
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post #16 of 17 Old 07-09-2012, 08:37 AM
 
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who ever is looking to go to plasma from a LCD LED - is going to be very happy - its so much better in the blacks - and everything else - as long as you can deal with the day time viewing - in the right situation - night time viewing etc, - you cant beat it -

i love my plasma - even though i just got an LED for my bedroom and might return it - not sure - i want it bright but the blacks suffer alot compared to a plasma - i would get the best plasma you can buy on your budget- i would lean on panasonic -
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post #17 of 17 Old 07-09-2012, 10:57 AM
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Once you see black you never go back.
Buy a Samsung as they have greatly reduced the IR problems that effect other plasmas
and you are a big gamer so Samsung is the way to go.
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