Am I better off waiting for the new 2013 plasmas or should I go with the 2012 - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 12:42 PM
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Originally Posted by turbe View Post

Plasmas are not for everyone, DLP are not, LCD etc... No Display or tech is perfect.
Hockey is interesting, It's acceptable to me on my Pioneer 9G Monitors, the Panasonics.. well, I don't want hockey anyways..

Agreed on the hockey but sadly we don't have to worry about that this year frown.gif I'd be the first to admit Plasma's flaws but for me personally the pluses out weigh the minuses.

For the OP not sure you are going to duplicate a Plasma picture on anything other than a CRT.

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post #32 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by SiGGy View Post

Cool. Ya I wasn't quoting the window size used. Just the fact that if you change window sizes you end up with different readings. And different responses between Samsung and Panasonic due to the abl differences.
A lot of folks quote peak brightness all the time but never mention what size window was used. Without knowing that its difficult to compare.
I'll read that thread. I didn't know that effort had been put forth I was doing some testing of my own with my own patterns. But I gave up smile.gif It's time consuming.

Siggy, also check out the older Thread from Zoyd, I linked in in the one linked above.. if you can't find it, let me know and I'll post it..

good stuff.

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A lot of folks quote peak brightness all the time but never mention what size window was used. Without knowing that its difficult to compare

Yes, it can be difficult - there are many Enthusiasts now using methods not commonly used by Professionals....

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post #33 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by davelanger View Post

What is closer to a plasma in terms of picture quality? LED or LCD. I know I cant afford an OLED.
LED is LCD but uses a different backlighting technology. I suggest you do more research before buying.

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post #34 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by rahzel View Post

Hockey is about the only thing that hits the ABL hard. If you look at the second page of the thread turbe linked to, you'll see the average APL of various content.
FWIW, using a 14% sized window, I can get close to 50fL on my 60ST50. With a 10% window I can get just over 50fL.

Cool. Ya that's close to the 47 I get with a 10%. I see the abl all the time on the VT50. Even now watching rango. I can see the clouds shift occasionally. Ya hockey I assumed was the worst. I've seen zoyds APL info before. I'll checkout the 2nd page.

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post #35 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 12:55 PM
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it would be interesting to have data presented like the following (for recent models), which compared two Pioneer models series from 4-5 years ago - Pioneer 9G Monitors perform better in this regard smile.gif


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post #36 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

If this is in regards to the VE Shootout, 1% is Absolutely Not True! Need to get that out of the way before it spreads..
10-11% sized windowed patterns were used.
I do understand what you are saying in the above posts.. CRT's have this behavioral (similar) but to a lesser extent..
There have been good discussions about this and here in the recent one (with data): http://www.avsforum.com/t/1446386/abl-effects-measured-for-comparison

I read part of it, good stuff. Chad was focusing on gamma and WB. In my tests I was focusing on ABL interaction vs color tracking (real time consuming... Lots of data points). Maybe I will contribute to the thread if I can correlate my data cleanly.. Well, and finish doing it. wink.gif

Thanks again.

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post #37 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 12:58 PM
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Check out the data / posts I did on Page 2 in Chad's recent Thread


there is an older Thread that Zoyd started (or posted a lot in)... having issues getting link right now, damn forum search

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post #38 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 01:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe View Post

Check out the data / posts I did on Page 2 in Chad's recent Thread

Wow. 2nd page had a lot more info. Both Tom's and your data/conclusions are interesting. But I leaves me with more questions than answers. However it also confirms some of my suspicions.

I wonder how much more linear an LCD panel is. It shouldn't suffer a lot of the issues mentioned. I'll continue posting over in the other thread. Thanks for showing it to me!

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post #39 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 02:10 PM - Thread Starter
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how bad is hockey on the GT50?
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post #40 of 47 Old 01-01-2013, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by davelanger View Post

how bad is hockey on the GT50?

What do you mean by "how bad"? Are you talking about the ABL? Or the Hockey Flash hysteria from several months ago?

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post #41 of 47 Old 01-02-2013, 08:22 AM
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From Kevin Miller:

"No we used 18% windows. We are fully aware of the ABL circuitry in Plasma, how it works and what it does. It would not change the results. Frankly, LCD display technology has some many other negatives that there is no contest against the PQ of a plasma as good as the VT50 series Panasonics. And it is not Marketing! I ahve nothing to gain in my evaluations"

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post #42 of 47 Old 01-02-2013, 09:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

What do you mean by "how bad"? Are you talking about the ABL? Or the Hockey Flash hysteria from several months ago?

Yes didnt hockey games have issues with brightness pops or something like that?
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post #43 of 47 Old 01-02-2013, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by davelanger View Post

Yes didnt hockey games have issues with brightness pops or something like that?

No, during the hysteria it turned out that all TVs showed Hockey Flashes. Several of us in that thread tuned to the games on our other TVs (various other Plasmas, LCDs, and even DLPs) and all of these TVs displayed the Hockey Flashes similarly. It wasn't the fault of the TV afterall.

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post #44 of 47 Old 01-02-2013, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post

No, during the hysteria it turned out that all TVs showed Hockey Flashes. Several of us in that thread tuned to the games on our other TVs (various other Plasmas, LCDs, and even DLPs) and all of these TVs displayed the Hockey Flashes similarly. It wasn't the fault of the TV afterall.
How well do they display a Formula 1 Ferrari passing all the competition?!eek.gif

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post #45 of 47 Old 01-02-2013, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by joe52985 View Post

I will NOT game on the st50 for fear it will burn in. It's bad enough that I moved it to my bedroom and went another route for gaming and things with letterboxing (projection)
Panny has been getting worse and worse on almost every aspect of the TVs besides picture quality. I see no reason why 2013 will improve IR. It's my opinion that whatever panny is doing to create such bright punchy images is having an adverse affect on IR and 3d performance.



Interesting...I have a 50" ST50 and used a 55" version as well a lot and have not had any IR issues on either set. I haven't gamed but watched plenty of letterbox content and even displayed static images like a computer desk on it.

The only time I had IR is when I put the set on vivid mode and IR was terrible.

I know for a fact depending on your picture settings you can get IR very easily. There might be a difference on your calibration thats causing it or its just simply you have a panel thats prone to it.
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post #46 of 47 Old 01-02-2013, 11:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Bubbleboyjones View Post

Interesting...I have a 50" ST50 and used a 55" version as well a lot and have not had any IR issues on either set. I haven't gamed but watched plenty of letterbox content and even displayed static images like a computer desk on it.
The only time I had IR is when I put the set on vivid mode and IR was terrible.
I know for a fact depending on your picture settings you can get IR very easily. There might be a difference on your calibration thats causing it or its just simply you have a panel thats prone to it.

what settings do you use
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post #47 of 47 Old 01-03-2013, 09:18 AM
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what settings do you use

I was using dnice's ST50 settings.
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