Samsung F8500 - new industry standard? [please use links to newer thread] - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I've been following this thread since you posted your impressions but have been away. I am sorry that you've been abused by some. I know you earnestly want to add value and to be a valuable member of the forum. I think you've made it perfectly clear with caveats that you never had any intention of rendering a final or even quasi-professional judgment of the set. I took your impressions with a grain of salt while being grateful that someone had sent eh set in a store setting.

Well said! And to rrolens, thanks for taking the time to post your your thoughts on the TV.

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post #632 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 05:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I've been following this thread since you posted your impressions but have been away. I am sorry that you've been abused by some. I know you earnestly want to add value and to be a valuable member of the forum. I think you've made it perfectly clear with caveats that you never had any intention of rendering a final or even quasi-professional judgment of the set. I took your impressions with a grain of salt while being grateful that someone had sent eh set in a store setting.

What is interesting and depressing is how certain people act when the news isn't what they want to hear. They shoot the messenger. I say they can their lazy arses down to a store, spend time fiddling with the set like you did, take the time and muster the courage to post to AVS like you did, and open themselves up to anonymous arses throwing garbage at them like you did -- or they can shut the heck up and leave you alone.

Thank you for your support. You are very kind. And again, I have said that I will purchase either a 64F8500 or a 654ZT60 this year. I do hope my first impression does turn out to be wrong, and really want the opportunity to get the best settings from folks on this Forum so I can really see what it can do!
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post #633 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 06:02 PM
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Originally Posted by yamvmax View Post

Exactly what I was trying to say.

+1.

All I know is that anyone who is in the market for a top-of-the-line (and expensive) TV owes it to themselves, and their pocketbook, to wait, if at all possible, for the results of The Shootout. I know the folks at VE do the very best job possible to insure a fair, non-biased, and completely through and comprehensive side by side review of the best of the best TVs. There is nothing like it in the world, and that's why the world awaits the results.
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post #634 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrollens View Post

Thank you for your support. You are very kind. And again, I have said that I will purchase either a 64F8500 or a 654ZT60 this year. I do hope my first impression does turn out to be wrong, and really want the opportunity to get the best settings from folks on this Forum so I can really see what it can do!
RRollens:
Were all the picture settings the same as the E8000 like the four picture modes and cell light adjustment or has this area been revamped as well? Is there a full CMS like the VT50 has in it's menu settings?
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post #635 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 06:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glashub View Post

I've been following this thread since you posted your impressions but have been away. I am sorry that you've been abused by some. I know you earnestly want to add value and to be a valuable member of the forum. I think you've made it perfectly clear with caveats that you never had any intention of rendering a final or even quasi-professional judgment of the set. I took your impressions with a grain of salt while being grateful that someone had seen the set in a store setting.

What is interesting and depressing is how certain people act when the news isn't what they want to hear --even when it isn't the final news. They shoot the messenger. I say they can their lazy arses down to a store, spend time fiddling with the set like you did, take the time and muster the courage to post to AVS like you did, and open themselves up to anonymous arses throwing garbage at them like you did -- or they can shut the heck up and leave you alone.
This deserves another bump. The underhanded attacks are some of the more shameful moments I've witnessed on the forum. And yes, the ones who have been the most exuberant about the prospect of this panel are the ones who are coming unhinged. Pitiful display of behavior.
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Originally Posted by Ilovetightbass View Post

Yes sir Mr. Cleveland. That is exactly what I was talking about. Me. Just an average onlooker Could have picked a better selection of TVs for the reviewers than VE. At least they could hidden their bias agenda a little better. Sony on the other hand is very expensive but probably worth it.
Right, "probably worth it." You've convinced me. Name brand isn't every thing, chief, and not everyone has an agenda. You would have a hard time finding better TVs than those which appeared in last year's shootout.

Another pitiful display (and by display I don't mean flat panel).
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post #636 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rrollens View Post

+1.

All I know is that anyone who is in the market for a top-of-the-line (and expensive) TV owes it to themselves, and their pocketbook, to wait, if at all possible, for the results of The Shootout. I know the folks at VE do the very best job possible to insure a fair, non-biased, and completely through and comprehensive side by side review of the best of the best TVs. There is nothing like it in the world, and that's why the world awaits the results.
I fully agree.- Bill
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post #637 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted by schnura View Post


Sorry to disagree, but if you take a look at the Shootout Youtube video from last year you will see Robert explain why Sony's HX929 was not included in the competition. Basically here's what he said.... Sony's HX929 is a carry over from 2011 and this event is for 2012 models. He also added the HX929 is an excellent display (I think it came in third in the 2011 shootout), but when it was compared to the latest flagship models it just did not stand up to the technology advancements of the past year.

Also regarding your remark that you could select better TVs, what could be better than every major manufacturers flagship model?

I live nearby his store and I'm attending the 2013 Shootout and expect to enjoy learning about all of these new TVs and being a part of evaluating the winner.

That reasoning is a load of bullocks. The 2012 HX950 could be considered a carry over of the 929 so with his logic they would never put a Sony flagship model into the shootout.

Sorry but it does indeed reek of bias.
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post #638 of 1868 Old 03-17-2013, 11:50 PM
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This plasma looks good.

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post #639 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 05:08 AM
 
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Originally Posted by EmmortalOne View Post

That reasoning is a load of bullocks. The 2012 HX950 could be considered a carry over of the 929 so with his logic they would never put a Sony flagship model into the shootout.

Sorry but it does indeed reek of bias.

The only problem with your statement is that the HX950 did not come out until months after the 2012 Shootout.

Try watching the video in its entirety or attend the 2013 Shootout in person before you make such bold statements. This guy works very hard and spends tons of money to put this event together and it has the endorsement of the industry top calibrators, a/v enthusiast and all of the media.
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post #640 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 05:25 AM
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Originally Posted by rrollens View Post

+1.

All I know is that anyone who is in the market for a top-of-the-line (and expensive) TV owes it to themselves, and their pocketbook, to wait, if at all possible, for the results of The Shootout. I know the folks at VE do the very best job possible to insure a fair, non-biased, and completely through and comprehensive side by side review of the best of the best TVs. There is nothing like it in the world, and that's why the world awaits the results.

+1
I agree totally and unlike some here I am not dismissing your review at all, with the claims Samsung has made about this TV I would have expected you or me to be WOW'd out of my pants when I saw this TV(bright as a led and best blacks & contrast they ever had).. Obviously you weren't which to means to me we shouldn't expect this to be the holy grail of Plasmas.. My size limitations makes my choices for a new TV either F8500, ST60 OR some new 50" LED that surprises everyone with plasmalike PQ.
That said as you posted I certainly owe myself and my wallet to wait until the dust settles and get whats best for me and that includes seeing these TVs in person.
Reviews from noted reviewers should roll out later this week or next (Chad has already stated on another thread he won't have his review up until the middle of next week, these TVs need to get at least a 100 hours of burn in time before reviews and testing can be done).

Thanks again rrolens, like I said before your review was honest and what you thought and no one can/should bitch about that!!
Although I'm still clinging on to a little hope that the F8500 you saw was a bad or defective panel which made it look much less then "The New Industry Standard" lol
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post #641 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 07:23 AM
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^^^ We choose to review the sets as they come out, who wants to wait for a review..........???
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Originally Posted by schnura View Post

The only problem with your statement is that the HX950 did not come out until months after the 2012 Shootout. .
Yep, and that is why the current XBR-xxHX929 should have been done / added.........
Quote:
Originally Posted by rrollens View Post

All I know is that anyone who is in the market for a top-of-the-line (and expensive) TV owes it to themselves, and their pocketbook, to wait, if at all possible, for the results of The Shootout. I know the folks at VE do the very best job possible to insure a fair, non-biased, and completely through and comprehensive side by side review of the best of the best TVs. There is nothing like it in the world, and that's why the world awaits the results.
I think you need to read about what a few members that have attended this event in the past have said about the statement you have made above. "I have never been at the shootout" but there are many that would say they feel these statements above are just not true "from what I have read".........In fact there are people challenging this right now in this thread. I would attach the links here in AVS that I have read on past events but I bet I would be looking for the posts for a long, long time. To each his own. Anyone can go and make there own choice wink.gif
.
.
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post #642 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 07:29 AM
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I have dangerously ordered the F8500 without any professional reviews. I still appreciate rrolins' advice (although I ordered it on 3/12) and clearly hope that impression was a one off. I'll admit that I have never done something like this before. I'll be testing this set vigorously for the first 29 days I own it and am happy to post results here. I really hope this ships soon. Samsung doesn't even have it up on their product list yet. Fingers crossed!
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post #643 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by jacomus View Post

I have dangerously ordered the F8500 without any professional reviews. I still appreciate rrolins' advice (although I ordered it on 3/12) and clearly hope that impression was a one off. I'll admit that I have never done something like this before. I'll be testing this set vigorously for the first 29 days I own it and am happy to post results here. I really hope this ships soon. Samsung doesn't even have it up on their product list yet. Fingers crossed!

Wow! That sounds like a terrible idea. I saw the f8500 in person at ces....but I'm still waiting for actual reviews/ and seeing it in person on the production model.
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post #644 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 08:20 AM
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As long as I know where the set stands before the 30 day window is up I am not too concerned. It's like an insurance policy. :-) I do find it awfully deceptive to display anything other than the production model at CES but I can only imagine that is common practice.
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post #645 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by jacomus View Post

As long as I know where the set stands before the 30 day window is up I am not too concerned. It's like an insurance policy. :-) I do find it awfully deceptive to display anything other than the production model at CES but I can only imagine that is common practice.

That's just the tip of the iceberg. They also like to show side-by-side comparisons with previous models that have rigged results by doing a less than optimal calibration of the older models compared to the new. Every year they (Panny and Sammy) claim the new models are 2x, 4x better in measured results than the year before and in most years the actual final results are a small fraction of that -- usually (but not always) better, but incrementally so. Sometimes the results aren't even definitively better. Sammy's black level has improved has improved from a few years ago, for example, but their brightness got worse.
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post #646 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 09:34 AM
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That is awful but not in the least bit surprising.
I really hope this is a good set that is no more susceptible to IR than previous lines.Thanks for reality check!
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post #647 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 10:06 AM
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Although there is still nothing on Samsung's website, this looks like it would be a copy\paste of what would be there

http://www.onecall.com/samsung-pn60f8500-60-inch-3d-plasma-tv
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post #648 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 10:38 AM
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Nice. Although, it's 95% marketing lingo until we can see the panel for ourselves but that has always been the case.
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post #649 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacomus View Post

As long as I know where the set stands before the 30 day window is up I am not too concerned. It's like an insurance policy. :-) I do find it awfully deceptive to display anything other than the production model at CES but I can only imagine that is common practice.

exactly! thats what return period is for... i had no choice, didn't have time to wait for prof. reviews. my 42" (need i say more!) 4 yr old lg lcd crapped out on me, got the e7000 and return window was up. logically based on new cell structure i am assuming pq has to be at least somewhat improved. the e is awesome so i can't imagine the f being anything less! tho i will have 60 days to see for myself....

Samsung PN51F8500. Marantz SR5008. Oppo BDP 103D. Sony BDP S5100. Emp Tek E55TIB LR, E5CIB, E55WIB. Sennheiser Momentum. Sennheiser 598.
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post #650 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

And what 'bias agenda' would that be? They're about as objective as you'll find anywhere.

Um, huh?

LOL this has to be one of the single funniest thing's I've read on this web board. LOL

Unless I completely misunderstand what you're trying to say?

The "shootout" is nothing BUT Bias.

D-nice HATES Samsung, and sat there during the entire "show" pushing Panasonic.

Robert LOVED Panasonic, until this year, when all the sudden he seems to LOVE Samsung.

etc etc etc.

This "shootout" is a show, not a "shootout". It's not even close to a comparison test with the number of people sitting there explaining to the "judges" why one is better then another.

Please don't insult us.

buytme
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post #651 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by agkss View Post

Don't waste your time Ken for this guy in every forum (AVForums, HDTV Test and this forum) NOTHING can match his KURO. He hate Panasonic too.


Excuse me. You are extremely rude to say the least.


Your desperation for the Kuro to "be beat" smells.(stinks in fact)


And a naysayer to boot.



All because it's not (WHAT YOU) want to hear.


Grow up.
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post #652 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Stu03 View Post

Excuse me. You are extremely rude to say the least.


Your desperation for the Kuro to "be beat" smells.(stinks in fact)


And a naysayer to boot.



All because it's not (WHAT YOU) want to hear.


Grow up.

This Monitor MAYBE a KURO killer, who knows until they are out..

http://www.tedpublications.com/news/exclusive-panasonic-65zt60-plasma-tv-preview/

Every day above ground is a good day.
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post #653 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 01:30 PM
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I choose panasonic vt50 over a kuro 5080 any day any time. A pioneer pdp lx5090 and krp500 is still better to my eyes. I hope this will change this year with the f8500 and zt60. ( i am sure it will wink.gif )
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post #654 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by David_B View Post

Um, huh?

LOL this has to be one of the single funniest thing's I've read on this web board. LOL

Unless I completely misunderstand what you're trying to say?

The "shootout" is nothing BUT Bias.

D-nice HATES Samsung, and sat there during the entire "show" pushing Panasonic.

Robert LOVED Panasonic, until this year, when all the sudden he seems to LOVE Samsung.

etc etc etc.

This "shootout" is a show, not a "shootout". It's not even close to a comparison test with the number of people sitting there explaining to the "judges" why one is better then another.

Please don't insult us.


I agree that there was/is bias. Huge plasma bias all around. The Sony and the Sharp Elite both should have been present, IMO. The goal should be a comparison of all the best sets from each manufacturer, assuming it can still be purchased new. It was a joke that the Panny LCD made the cut for review. I do believe they rolled out a Kuro for comparision, no?

Although I do believe D-Nice does have a personal beef with Samsung, if I'm not mistaken he ranked the Sammmy above the Panny VT50 overall because of better color reproduction.

IMO, Robert is biased to whatever he can sell (or whomever gives him the best incentives) He was a huge Toshiba supporter a few years back when they were still making shiny discs.
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post #655 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Stu03 View Post

Excuse me. You are extremely rude to say the least.


Your desperation for the Kuro to "be beat" smells.(stinks in fact)


And a naysayer to boot.



All because it's not (WHAT YOU) want to hear.


Grow up.

You Stink like a fanboy.

Grow up yourself or get married with your " Kuro"
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post #656 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Pinger View Post

+1
I agree totally and unlike some here I am not dismissing your review at all, with the claims Samsung has made about this TV I would have expected you or me to be WOW'd out of my pants when I saw this TV(bright as a led and best blacks & contrast they ever had).. Obviously you weren't which to means to me we shouldn't expect this to be the holy grail of Plasmas..

I am not disputing what rrolins saw as I've said before, but am I the only one who sees a severe disconnect between what he saw and what virtually everyone else saw at CES? Yes, one can claim that the CES was a 'prototype', but c'mon, you're telling me that the production model went from stellar in its prototype iteration to at best 'ho hum' in production mode?

Logic tells me something doesn't add up. It could be improper settings of the display that he saw, it could be a defective panel, it could be the admittedly poor environment he saw it in. But I'm really having trouble reconciling a display that was so raved about has now become nothing but ordinary at best.

I'll continue to wait until it's in more stores and homes and somewhere where I can see it.
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post #657 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 02:13 PM
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Maybe out of box settings might not be good, but it might look beautiful with custom settings
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post #658 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross 
I am not disputing what rrolins saw as I've said before, but am I the only one who sees a serre disconnect between what he saw and what virtually everyone else saw at CES? Yes, one can claim that the CES was a 'prototype', but c'mon, you're telling me that the production model went from stellar in its prototype iteration to at best 'ho hum' in production mode?

Logic tells me something doesn't add up. It could be improper settings of the display that he saw, it could be a defective panel, it could be the admittedly poor environment he saw it in. But I'm really having trouble reconciling a display that was so raved about has now become nothing but ordinary at best.

I'll continue to wait until it's in more stores and homes and somewhere where I can see it.

I hear you, kinda why I keep bringing up it may have been defective in some way. Just doesn't add up but I certainly didn't think rrollens was trying to be malicious in giving his opinion..
Now if was one of those paranoid kuro will never be matched guys it would be a open and shut case lol
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post #659 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 02:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Pinger View Post

Now if was one of those paranoid kuro will never be matched guys it would be a open and shut case lol
rolleyes.gif
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post #660 of 1868 Old 03-18-2013, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by floridaman View Post

RRollens:
Were all the picture settings the same as the E8000 like the four picture modes and cell light adjustment or has this area been revamped as well? Is there a full CMS like the VT50 has in it's menu settings?

Here are the answers to your questions:

1.The four picture settings are...Dynamic, Standard, Relax, and Movie

2. Yes there is a Cell Light adjustment

3. And yes, under Advanced Settings there are a number of CMS settings.

BTW, I plan to return to RC WIlley tonight to try out some adjustments that a very important and well qualified professional sent me to maximize the out of box viewing experience. Ill report what I see when I return. Id also like to post a couple of pictures if I can, but someone will need to tell me how to post a picture! Thx.
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