Samsung F8500 - new industry standard? [please use links to newer thread] - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 12:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Very slick industrial design.

They state it will have the same brightness levels and 8 times the black expression of a regular LED. That could be a very bright plasma. I believe typical LEDs can hit 300+ cd/m2 easily. Some around 400. Current e7000/e8000s are around 170 cd/m2. I've always thought cranking up the brightness on Plasmas was asking for trouble.

Wonder what kind of power usage we'd be looking at.

No word on redesigned remotes.

Cool looking TV.

Will it buzz?

http://global.samsungtomorrow.com/?p=21335

new thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1463454/official-samsung-pnxxf8500-series-discussion-thread-no-street-price-talk
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post #2 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 12:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Oops. Looks like there is a section of the forums, which I never visit, where this is already being discussed.


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post #3 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 06:38 AM
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We can discuss that over here...that's a UK site and a completely different board....

First of all, 8 times deeper blacks would put it at something like .0001 ft/L, probably not going to happen.

If this is some sort of 10 lumen model, etc, then maybe we're going to get all these perks. I'm guessing this won't get blacker than the ZT60, but if they've resolved the issues of the E series, this will be a compelling plasma.

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post #4 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 08:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Ah, so it is. That's what I get for looking at TV stuff late at night. And on an iPad at that.

I haven't seen any information on step down F7500/F6500 Models. But if they'll exist (which surely, they will, right?) I wonder what features will get dropped and whether they will relate to PQ or other 'less important' stuff like voice control. smile.gif

Interestingly, Samsung seems to be fairly proud of their new Plasma tech but, according to CNET, they're halving the offerings. Only this flagship and two "entry level models" whatever that means.

http://reviews.cnet.com/tvs/samsung-pn60f8500/4505-6475_7-35566923.html
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post #5 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 08:30 AM
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Lg give any info on their plasmas?
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post #6 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 10:52 AM - Thread Starter
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If so, I haven't seen or heard anything about them.
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post #7 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boondongle View Post

Current e7000/e8000s are around 170 cd/m2.
Current Samsung plasmas can only reach ~120cdm2, a large reduction from 2011.
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post #8 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 11:08 AM
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I prefer the design of the 8500 over the new Panasonics. I just hope it offers the performance to match.
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post #9 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boondongle View Post

I haven't seen any information on step down F7500/F6500 Models. But if they'll exist (which surely, they will, right?) I wonder what features will get dropped and whether they will relate to PQ or other 'less important' stuff like voice control. smile.gif

not according to HDGURU. It seems that Samsung is cutting down their plasma models to just two:
Quote:
For 2013 Samsung drops the 7000 series models seen in 2012 with the next model down being the F5500 which replaces its 1080p entry level E550 series. According to Samsung, the new F5500 will have picture improvements, but won’t have the same panel, drive and filter as the F8500.

So we at least know the 7000 series is axed, and it calls out the entry-level 550 as the next model down the line. It doesn't specifically mention replacements aren't going to be available for the E6500, E530 and 720p E450, but from information currently available we can infer that Samsung is following suit with Panasonic and LG and reducing their plasma line by quite a bit. It does make sense, when you think about it, since even Samsung had too many models available last year. Keep a top of the line model for the enthusiasts (not three top of the line models with essentially the same PQ like in 2011 and 2012), and a value-packed budget line for those who don't really care about ultimate PQ.

I really love the design of this F8500, and I'm usually not one for Samsung's industrial design. It reminds me of a slimmed down and updated take on their old RPTV designs, and love even better that it appears that it's all black/charcoal. The real test will be how it performs. Samsung had a very strong showing in 2011 with their D series plasmas, and they kind of stagnated, even got worse in some ways, in 2012. It would seem Samsung's plasma line is an afterthought compared to their new focus on OLED and LED, so who knows how much work they put in 2013's line.

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post #10 of 1868 Old 01-08-2013, 05:40 PM
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http://cnettv.cnet.com/samsung-promises-blacker-blacks-f8500-series-tvs/9742-1_53-50138592.html
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post #11 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 01:41 AM
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from David Mackenzie "HDTVtest" (aka "Lyris" on AVS Forum) about the Samsung F8500 :

http://forums.hdtvtest.co.uk/index.php?topic=7591.90
Quote:
Samsung F8500 PDP is probably the most impressive considering OLED is still a while away from being affordable.

http://forums.hdtvtest.co.uk/index.php?topic=7591.msg27218#msg27218
Quote:
Yes. The contrast performance of the F8500 is outstanding. Samsung gave me a hands on demo. It is the closest thing to OLED without actually being OLED".

http://forums.hdtvtest.co.uk/index.php?topic=7591.msg27222#msg27222
Quote:
"My source tells me that the MLL discrepancy is gone on the F8500.

There will probably be a little bit (like there is on Panasonic) but it seems to have been leveled out.

We'll know for sure when we get a sample".
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post #12 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 03:03 AM
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Best of ces 2013 from cnet :

http://ces.cnet.com/best-of-ces/

And there`s not any samsnug plasma frown.gif
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post #13 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 04:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alucard3 View Post

Best of ces 2013 from cnet :

http://ces.cnet.com/best-of-ces/

And there`s not any samsnug plasma frown.gif

I prefer the honest judgment of D-Nice or David Mackenzie than this type of "best of".

The models presented in the CES are prototype, lets the real reviewers and pro analyse this plasma (F8500 for samsung and VT60/ZT60 for panasonic) to see who's the real king of HDTV wink.gif
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post #14 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 04:24 AM
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When is F8500 expected to be released?
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post #15 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 07:26 AM
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post #16 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by wesslan1 View Post

When is F8500 expected to be released?

+1000000000
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post #17 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 07:28 AM
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That stand doubles as a towel rack when you wall-mount the TV. I could use this in my master bathroom!
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post #18 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 07:32 AM
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That stand doubles as a towel rack when you wall-mount the TV. I could use this in my master bathroom!
Randy, your master bathroom isn't too big for this small palsma ?biggrin.gif
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post #19 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 10:05 AM - Thread Starter
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It's certainly better than the chicken foot on the bottom of my E7000….
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post #20 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 10:13 AM
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Extremely bright plasma... with frame interpolation(wonder if it works for 3D). Isn't that begging for IR and burn-in problems?

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post #21 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 10:25 AM
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Originally Posted by keyser View Post

Extremely bright plasma... with frame interpolation(wonder if it works for 3D). Isn't that begging for IR and burn-in problems?

Ir? A def possibility, but I'm tired of this whole burn-in crap. Its so over the top. Its not an issue, as long as the set is not being EXTREMELY abused.
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post #22 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 11:01 AM
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With CFI it will be displaying at least twice the frames.. Should make IR twice as bad and 4 times with 3D?

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post #23 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
"With this plasma we've worked on improving the picture quality of the plasma's cells," said Dilen Thakrar, TV Product Manager at Samsung UK, citing the 51F8500's use of a new Super Contrast Panel that improves black levels 40% in a darkened room and 60% in a light room.
Quote:
"We've improved the luminous on this plasma by 250 per cent so now it's at the point where it's equal to LCD. We know that there are real plasma lovers out there that love the technology, love the picture quality and deep black levels, and for us it was about making the best plasma we can - and that's what this is."







http://www.techradar.com/reviews/audio-visual/televisions/plasma-and-lcd-tvs/samsung-51f8500-plasma-tv-1124079/review
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post #24 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 11:32 AM
 
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ooh, someone do some quick math (who knows the MLL value). What is a 40% better black level than Samsung's best 2012 panel? wink.gif
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post #25 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 11:53 AM
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It's all just marketing numbers until we can get some real life data in here.

We are gonna need a new VE Shootout ASAP.
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post #26 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 11:58 AM
 
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That's 8 months away at least, going by previous years. I'd still like to determine what the theoretical target value should be, even if it a marketing spiel. Anyone know the mll/ftl value of Samsung's 2012 flagship panel?
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post #27 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnie97 View Post

That's 8 months away at least, going by previous years. I'd still like to determine what the theoretical target value should be, even if it a marketing spiel. Anyone know the mll/ftl value of Samsung's 2012 flagship panel?

Well, since the person quoted above was from the UK let's take David MacKenzie's review of the UK 64" E8000:

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/samsung-ps64e8000-201210292316.htm?page=Calibration

Let's take the black level there of 0.017 cd/m2 which works out to 0.005 fL. Knock off 40% and you end up with 0.003 fL

Then look at his review of the 65" VT50:

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/panasonic-tx-p65vt50b-201212152370.htm?page=Picture%20Quality

There with THX he obtained a black level of 0.005 cd/m2 and with Pro mode calibration 0.016 cd/m2 which works out to 0.00146 fL and 0.0047 fL respectively.

So ignoring the real quirkiness of black levels with the UK model re THX and pro modes (going with the THX mode which David chose) and I can believe the marketing spiel of the Samsung rep. In essence, the new Samsung will still have a black level double that of the current VT50 in THX mode but lower than the VT50 in Pro Mode.
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post #28 of 1868 Old 01-10-2013, 01:54 PM
 
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^Thanks for doing all the legwork, Peter! If this holds in actuality, it looks like I'll still be leaning toward the Panasonic (ZT), though they could be a wash. Still a considerable distance from 0.0004 ftl of the vaunted Kuro 9.5G. ;(
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post #29 of 1868 Old 01-11-2013, 10:04 AM
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Engineers from the future brought the Kuro to our time , LOL. I am just amazed that the 9G Kuro has not been beaten how many years is it now? Truly an engineering masterpiece. The black level and ansi contrast are amazing I just re read one of Tom Huffmans old reviews.
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post #30 of 1868 Old 01-11-2013, 10:34 AM
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A masterpiece that could only have been done at that time. Like Elvis showing up at the exact moment in time in the 50's when young people were ready for someone like him; the Kuro showed up when the world allowed beefy power supplies, panels with mercury and lead, etc. I think that Panny and Samsung are doing incredible things given they have eco/energy challenges Pio never had....and they have found a way to keep making plasma. wink.gif
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