Official Panasonic TC-PxxST60 Series thread - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 05:05 PM
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Chad,

How did screen uniformity appear with the 100% full screen? Was the fairly common reddish effect of ABL loading evenly distributed across the screen? Maybe the answer will have to wait until you can play with the set in a dark environment.

Larry
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post #452 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 05:11 PM
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It's actually possible that this might measure a little deeper in mll down the road, since the panel only had 30-40 hours on it. Also with a K-10 meter, this might read below .002 ft/L and maybe the 60"+ sizes still have the mll advantage that's been apparent for Panasonic panels in the past.

Seems like an amazing value.

Still waiting to see what magic 2014 may bring as I'm thinking they'll be building them from the ground up again, but this is a tempting set.

Chad, thanks for the great review.

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post #453 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 05:17 PM
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One thing that stuck out in Chad's review on 50ST60 was that black measured .00232. His same equipment measured .0025 on the 64F8500 with the black optimizer on. I know other calibrators have measured .0017 on the F8500 but Chad's numbers are apples to apples.

These numbers on the ST60 bode well for the upcoming VT and especially ZT series.
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post #454 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 05:24 PM
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Quote:

Thanks for the reference!
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post #455 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 05:30 PM
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I have a Pioneer Kuro pro 60" 151 downstairs and I had to get a bigger tv for my bedroom. I originally ordered an LG full array local dimming
led back lit model and in the end most of the top performing sets were plasma even with just 7% market vs LCD sets. I went to Best Buy today
and picked up a Panasonic TC-P50ST60, took it home and made a few picture adjustments and I was really shocked at how good it looks out
of the box. I put it into a custom cinema mode adjusted contrast and brightness down out of torch mode and now I don't have to look at my 2 year
old Sony 32" LCD. So, the future of televisions may be bright if Plasma doesn't go the way of LCOS, women didn't like them because they were
so thick and unsightly. , merciful heavens, A vizio rep told me that LCD backlit LED sets with full array local dimming sets were going the same way
because once again, women were complaining about the horrible thickness of these sets and Vizio could save an 1/8" by eliminating that, and
he was serious. Nobody mentions that LCOS is still the top front projection technology. If you guys ever wondered what happened to sofas that
a man could sit on and lean back and put his head on the top cushion, women didn't like the way they looked as well and now the only way to get
something to kick back on is buy a recliner

when you always do what you've alway done, you always get what you always got.
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post #456 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 05:36 PM
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post #457 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryInRI View Post

Chad,

How did screen uniformity appear with the 100% full screen? Was the fairly common reddish effect of ABL loading evenly distributed across the screen? Maybe the answer will have to wait until you can play with the set in a dark environment.

Larry
Lower intensity full fields looked very uniform. Didn't see any problems. Didn't look at brighter fields.

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post #458 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pwiss View Post

One thing that stuck out in Chad's review on 50ST60 was that black measured .00232. His same equipment measured .0025 on the 64F8500 with the black optimizer on. I know other calibrators have measured .0017 on the F8500 but Chad's numbers are apples to apples.

These numbers on the ST60 bode well for the upcoming VT and especially ZT series.
Well, I will have an apple to apples comparison very very soon.

BTW my measurement of the 64F8500 matched another calibrator's measurements (Kevin).
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post #459 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Well, I will have an apple to apples comparison very very soon.

BTW my measurement of the 64F8500 matched another calibrator's measurements (Kevin).

Where can we find your ST60 review?
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post #460 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 06:57 PM
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Where can we find your ST60 review?
Don't expect to see one until I've had at least 2 full weeks with the display. I am very thourough with evaluations.
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post #461 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Don't expect to see one until I've had at least 2 full weeks with the display. I am very thourough with evaluations.
Which is why they are worth the wait.
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post #462 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Well, I will have an apple to apples comparison very very soon.

BTW my measurement of the 64F8500 matched another calibrator's measurements (Kevin).

It seems Chad's posted mll readings across all his reviewed sets are a bit higher than yours or other calibrators. Which must be due to the equipment used. If yours and Kevin's are the exact same on the 8500 then you must be using similar equipment to his and possibly that equipment gets more accurate readings that what Chad is using. If this all adds up the ST60 could end up in the .0015 range which definitely tops the VT50. Looking forward to your analysis of the ST60.
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post #463 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pwiss View Post

It seems Chad's posted mll readings across all his reviewed sets are a bit higher than yours or other calibrators. Which must be due to the equipment used. If yours and Kevin's are the exact same on the 8500 then you must be using similar equipment to his and possibly that equipment gets more accurate readings that what Chad is using. If this all adds up the ST60 could end up in the .0015 range which definitely tops the VT50. Looking forward to your analysis of the ST60.

Or Kev and D-Nice measured the same 8500 tv
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post #464 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:16 PM
 
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^Quite right, that can't be overlooked.
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Originally Posted by pwiss View Post

It seems Chad's posted mll readings across all his reviewed sets are a bit higher than yours or other calibrators. Which must be due to the equipment used. If yours and Kevin's are the exact same on the 8500 then you must be using similar equipment to his and possibly that equipment gets more accurate readings that what Chad is using. If this all adds up the ST60 could end up in the .0015 range which definitely tops the VT50. Looking forward to your analysis of the ST60.
Which leads me to conservative minimum hypothetical predictions of the VT60 reaching 0.00125 and the ZT60 reaching 0.001. ;p
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post #465 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:16 PM
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Are the majority of you under the impression that the ST60 performs equal to or better than the VT50?

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post #466 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmarceau View Post

It's actually possible that this might measure a little deeper in mll down the road, since the panel only had 30-40 hours on it. Also with a K-10 meter, this might read below .002 ft/L and maybe the 60"+ sizes still have the mll advantage that's been apparent for Panasonic panels in the past.

Seems like an amazing value.

Still waiting to see what magic 2014 may bring as I'm thinking they'll be building them from the ground up again, but this is a tempting set.

Chad, thanks for the great review.
Life's short, though 2014 that be the 5-year point for me. If this trend of lower black levels for each succeeding model continues, the only obstacle that would keep me from splurging is financial.
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post #467 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:25 PM
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Are the majority of you under the impression that the ST60 performs equal to or better than the VT50?

Chad was asked this question so I will agree with him hehe biggrin.gif.

" Even overall from my impressions so far. The ST60 actually measures imperceptibly lower in the blacks (I usually measure > .003 on the VT50). I like brightly lit faces a bit better on the VT50, but keep in mind the caveats mentioned in my review. I have alot more experience viewing the VT50 in different lighting conditions than I do the ST60, so this should be considered tentative."
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post #468 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:32 PM
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Are the majority of you under the impression that the ST60 performs equal to or better than the VT50?

Yes
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post #469 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Don't expect to see one until I've had at least 2 full weeks with the display. I am very thourough with evaluations.


D-Nice,

In addition to your annual Panasonic calibrations, are you planning to post some Samsung reports this year?

Looking forward to any and all reports you post.

Larry
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post #470 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:39 PM
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If the ST60 proves to equal or better the VT50, then I'll be excited about the VT60. Is the VT60 expected to ship before the ZT60? This could be a great year for plasma.

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post #471 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:46 PM
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I am going to keep an eye on this because this TV is on the short list for TVs to replace my 46" Mitsubishi.

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post #472 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:48 PM
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VT60s are due in april I think
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post #473 of 12981 Old 03-30-2013, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by jh901 View Post

If the ST60 proves to equal or better the VT50, then I'll be excited about the VT60. Is the VT60 expected to ship before the ZT60? This could be a great year for plasma.

Yes VT60 before ZT60 from what I have seen, but dont ahve any confirmation beyond that.....
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post #474 of 12981 Old 03-31-2013, 04:13 AM
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Hi Chad

Did you see some potentional problems of -IR- on ST60.Did you try it with some channels logos?
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post #475 of 12981 Old 03-31-2013, 05:42 AM
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Could any of you st60 owners post a pick of the new custom settings layout since previous st and gt models did not have this.

I just want to see if its laid out like the VT series as the ST sounds like one heck of deal.

Also can any expand on the viera connect experience.Does it seem fast and smooth,since its only one core?
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post #476 of 12981 Old 03-31-2013, 05:47 AM
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^Quite right, that can't be overlooked.
Which leads me to conservative minimum hypothetical predictions of the VT60 reaching 0.00125 and the ZT60 reaching 0.001. ;p

Which would put the ZT60 in the same .0016-.0017 ballpark of the F8500, just slightly better. Using Chad's own description of 'imperceptibly lower' to describe a similar MLL disparity between the ST60 and VT50, then we wouldn't be far off-base in predicting that if your .001 holds up, it too will be imperceptibly lower to the eyes compared to the F8500.

This kind of gets to what I said in another thread about 'diminishing returns'. These panels are getting so good, their performance in some key areas is getting more and more tightly clustered.
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post #477 of 12981 Old 03-31-2013, 06:05 AM
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Which would put the ZT60 in the same .0016-.0017 ballpark of the F8500, just slightly better.

All else being equal, then I'll take "slightly better" every time.

If the ST60 or VT60 are the equal of (or the better of) the F8500 and the ZT60 sits squarely on top of all of them, then why settle for less? If I had a brand bias, then it would be for Samsung since I have a Sammy tablet and smartphone. I'm hopeful that Sammy will hire Panny's best engineers if Panny gets out of plasma because until proven otherwise, there is only one king of plasma today.
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post #478 of 12981 Old 03-31-2013, 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Which would put the ZT60 in the same .0016-.0017 ballpark of the F8500, just slightly better. Using Chad's own description of 'imperceptibly lower' to describe a similar MLL disparity between the ST60 and VT50, then we wouldn't be far off-base in predicting that if your .001 holds up, it too will be imperceptibly lower to the eyes compared to the F8500.

This kind of gets to what I said in another thread about 'diminishing returns'. These panels are getting so good, their performance in some key areas is getting more and more tightly clustered.

It's basically splitting hairs. D-nice's prediction is that the ZT 60 won't beat a 9.5G Kuro . If this set is on par with the 8500 or just perhaps a little better the congrats to samsung for making a very competitive set.
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It's basically splitting hairs. D-nice's prediction is that the ZT 60 won't beat a 9.5G Kuro . If this set is on par with the 8500 or just perhaps a little better the congrats to samsung for making a very competitive set.

Isnt that what happens at this forum wink.gif people argue and chest puff over those split hairs biggrin.gif
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post #480 of 12981 Old 03-31-2013, 07:25 AM
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Could any of you st60 owners post a pick of the new custom settings layout since previous st and gt models did not have this.

I just want to see if its laid out like the VT series as the ST sounds like one heck of deal.

Also can any expand on the viera connect experience.Does it seem fast and smooth,since its only one core?

There is one subtle difference it does not have a full cms like the VT50, no cms control over the secondaries but even with that the numbers looked very good from Chad's review

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