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Plasma Flat Panel Displays

Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007
08:19 PM Liked: 921
post #9001 of 13230
11-04-2013 | Posts: 12,695
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenbear94 View Post

House of Cards, as an example, shows as 'Super HD' in the Viera Netflix app for me.
SuperHD is what it displays when you hit the "Info" button during playback?
jhutchinson4's Avatar jhutchinson4
08:57 PM Liked: 10
post #9002 of 13230
11-04-2013 | Posts: 7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc_G View Post

Perhaps WiFi not reaching the set location? Perhaps your WiFi uses Mac address limitations and you need to add the MAC to your approved list on the router?

That bit about the USB is strange.

I thought about that, but it's not even showing any of the available networks.  It's not even scanning for networks before the error pops up.


goldenbear94's Avatar goldenbear94
09:11 PM Liked: 11
post #9003 of 13230
11-04-2013 | Posts: 52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

SuperHD is what it displays when you hit the "Info" button during playback?

In the app. As I understand it, Super HD won't be displayed as a format if it's not supported. Mind you, I don't really care....it's all compressed. I have 100Mbps fiber and I can't say I notice a difference between Super HD and standard HD.
Jason626's Avatar Jason626
09:11 PM Liked: 84
post #9004 of 13230
11-04-2013 | Posts: 410
Joined: Aug 2010
Try doing factory reset see if that helps.
jhutchinson4's Avatar jhutchinson4
09:13 PM Liked: 10
post #9005 of 13230
11-04-2013 | Posts: 7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason626 View Post

Try doing factory reset see if that helps.

If you are talking to me...

 

Factory reset on the router or TV?

I just got the TV and it was giving me the error message right out of the box.


Bond 007's Avatar Bond 007
09:27 PM Liked: 921
post #9006 of 13230
11-04-2013 | Posts: 12,695
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenbear94 View Post

In the app. As I understand it, Super HD won't be displayed as a format if it's not supported. Mind you, I don't really care....it's all compressed. I have 100Mbps fiber and I can't say I notice a difference between Super HD and standard HD.
Thats what I was trying to establish. Just because it says its available in SuperHD when you look at the shows description doesnt necessarily mean youre going to be watching it in SuperHD. I get SHD sometimes on my PS3 but I dont think Ive ever gotten it on my Panasonic.
samijubal's Avatar samijubal
02:33 AM Liked: 85
post #9007 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 817
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkasanic View Post

Where do you get your data?  Would be interesting to compare the incidence of failure pre and post 2006 when the lead free solder was introduced.  I know it's not very scientific to draw conclusions from this but just Google lead free solder joints and see how much is out there regarding the fear prior to it's introduction and now with some real world examples to support the intial fears.

Consumer Reports on the Panny plasmas.

I used to see bad solder joints on PCBs long before lead free solder, sometimes they were obvious, other times they would look good but not be good, those can be very hard to find. The circuit boards I've seen on newer electronics actually have better solder joints than they did a decade or two ago.
iserum's Avatar iserum
08:15 AM Liked: 14
post #9008 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 368
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most of the circuit boards are done on pick and place machines and wave soldered, not much human interaction, the soldering is very precise, most of the boards will fail because of bad design (to much thermal event on the PCB) or bad components (caps, resistor, micros etc). Tier 1 companies usually don't use cheap components, that leave the design as main factor for multiple failures of similar issues. this is why the CR says the failures are very low on Panasonic plasmas based on their testing.
rich2k4's Avatar rich2k4
08:41 AM Liked: 12
post #9009 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 62
Joined: Nov 2007
sorry for all the questions,

Sometimes, depending on the content, my blacks have a red tint to them, especially with D'Nice's settings. I heard that this might be caused by the brightness being set too high. I lowered the brightness by 3 clicks and it seemed to have improved somewhat.

However, when I put on test footage, like the trailer to Dark Knight Rises, the black bars will be black, but the black levels in the actual content in the middle will have a red tint to it, when that section goes to a black screen. I can actually see the red pixels in there.

any ideas?
Bob_Collins's Avatar Bob_Collins
09:00 AM Liked: 28
post #9010 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rich2k4 View Post

sorry for all the questions,

Sometimes, depending on the content, my blacks have a red tint to them, especially with D'Nice's settings. I heard that this might be caused by the brightness being set too high. I lowered the brightness by 3 clicks and it seemed to have improved somewhat.

However, when I put on test footage, like the trailer to Dark Knight Rises, the black bars will be black, but the black levels in the actual content in the middle will have a red tint to it, when that section goes to a black screen. I can actually see the red pixels in there.

any ideas?

How about getting some age on the panel and then having it calibrated? Using posted settings is not a guarantee that everything is right for YOUR set and is not a substitute for an actual calibration.
chunon's Avatar chunon
09:01 AM Liked: 567
post #9011 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 5,395
Joined: Dec 2007
That is most likely a greyscale issue, Dnice's setting will get in you in the ballpark but are not a perfect match for every set. If you were to put a meter on your tv measure the lower stimulus levels you would most likely see too much red in the greyscale.
Bob_Collins's Avatar Bob_Collins
09:04 AM Liked: 28
post #9012 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 264
Joined: Nov 2001
Quote:
Originally Posted by jhutchinson4 View Post

I thought about that, but it's not even showing any of the available networks.  It's not even scanning for networks before the error pops up.

Reset the TV, then if it still doesn't scan or offer to scan, try manually adding the connection information yourself (SSID, security, etc.). If this still doesn't work, then you may have a faulty wireless module in the set or perhaps they forgot to connect it to its internal antenna. If it were me, I would try an ethernet cable to be sure that the TV at least has functional networking capabilities, even if only temporarily strung across the floor. Also, if the reset doesn't do it, you might want to keep the appointment with Panasonic or notify the dealer you want a replacement ASAP!!!
Jason626's Avatar Jason626
11:15 AM Liked: 84
post #9013 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhutchinson4 View Post

If you are talking to me...

Factory reset on the router or TV?
I just got the TV and it was giving me the error message right out of the box.
Yeah try the reset on TV. I'm assuming the router has been working fine on all your other devices. Some routers have a hide network option so it's not visible but that's not usually enabled out of the box.
mytbyte's Avatar mytbyte
01:09 PM Liked: 25
post #9014 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 775
Joined: May 2008
Guys, I require some theoretical (or definitive if possible) answers to the following dilemma:

I have a EU version of the P50ST60 and have recently gotten hold of a copy of Total Recall BD Mastered in 4K with expanded color (x.v.Colour)...I played it from my Philips BD player with x.v.Colour support and I got the info that the TV is indeed receiving x.v.Colour data...how am I supposed to view the expanded gamut from the disc?:

a) just leave the TV's gamut selection on Normal (reasoning behind it being that the TV's LUT will automatically expand color as far as it could within the limits of the TV's native gamut, to match as closely as possible to the incoming x.v. signal of which it is now aware)

or

b) manually force Native gamut (which I suspect will always give saturated colors both when needed and not needed, in which case I should probably calibrate to x.v. colorspace, which I cannot)

I don't expect to experience dramatic change, but would like to get to the bottom of this, since Panasonic's manuals and websites don't give any, but any specifics...shame

Thx...
2907Laz's Avatar 2907Laz
02:58 PM Liked: 12
post #9015 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 21
Joined: Jul 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by rich2k4 View Post

sorry for all the questions,

Sometimes, depending on the content, my blacks have a red tint to them, especially with D'Nice's settings. I heard that this might be caused by the brightness being set too high. I lowered the brightness by 3 clicks and it seemed to have improved somewhat.

However, when I put on test footage, like the trailer to Dark Knight Rises, the black bars will be black, but the black levels in the actual content in the middle will have a red tint to it, when that section goes to a black screen. I can actually see the red pixels in there.

any ideas?

I had the same red tint when i was trying different settings from the net. From memory, try lowering the W/B Low R value from 3. Don't know if this has an unwanted effect on the picture as i'm now just using defaults for Colour, W/B etc.
jason22's Avatar jason22
03:45 PM Liked: 10
post #9016 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 32
Joined: Jan 2010
Just bought this tv today in favour of a led tv, and i must say i didnt know what i was missing. biggrin.gif Im just awed with this beautiful image quality.
Though there two things i need to ask, what is the correct aspect ratio for PC screen ?
The screen from pc is cropped no matter what aspect ratio i try, when i play a youtube video on full screen i cant see the play and exit buttons below because its cropped out, the sides are also cropped slightly. Resolution is set on 1920x1080 and AR on Just and 16:9 on the tv but both are cropping screen slightly, why ?.

Also is it safe to apply the D-nice setting on day one or is there any risk if i do that now ?

Cheers
cadett's Avatar cadett
03:59 PM Liked: 85
post #9017 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 823
Joined: Aug 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by rich2k4 View Post

sorry for all the questions,


Sometimes, depending on the content, my blacks have a red tint to them, especially with D'Nice's settings. I heard that this might be caused by the brightness being set too high. I lowered the brightness by 3 clicks and it seemed to have improved somewhat.

However, when I put on test footage, like the trailer to Dark Knight Rises, the black bars will be black, but the black levels in the actual content in the middle will have a red tint to it, when that section goes to a black screen. I can actually see the red pixels in there.

any ideas?
If you go into the detailed white balance setting & lower the low red setting one click it will resolve the issue. Check your brightness setting afterwards.
mytbyte's Avatar mytbyte
04:09 PM Liked: 25
post #9018 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 775
Joined: May 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by jason22 View Post

Just bought this tv today in favour of a led tv, and i must say i didnt know what i was missing. biggrin.gif Im just awed with this beautiful image quality.
Though there two things i need to ask, what is the correct aspect ratio for PC screen ?
The screen from pc is cropped no matter what aspect ratio i try, when i play a youtube video on full screen i cant see the play and exit buttons below because its cropped out, the sides are also cropped slightly. Resolution is set on 1920x1080 and AR on Just and 16:9 on the tv but both are cropping screen slightly, why ?.

Cheers

You need to turn off underscan on your PC graphics card...if it's an ATI, bring the slider all the way to the right (0%) in Catalyst/My digital Flat-Panels/Scaling options
jason22's Avatar jason22
04:25 PM Liked: 10
post #9019 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mytbyte View Post

You need to turn off underscan on your PC graphics card...if it's an ATI, bring the slider all the way to the right (0%) in Catalyst/My digital Flat-Panels/Scaling options

Im using an nvidia driver and Win 7, i looked all over but i cant find an underscan option. Where is it hidden ?
Also video from pc seems not smooth in fast motion, any way to adjust that to natural movement ?
I was watching soccer earlier from my decoder and had no problem there so i assume there are some adjustments wrong.
jason22's Avatar jason22
05:39 PM Liked: 10
post #9020 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 32
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Okey i found the a way to get proper full screen with pc, i had to to go to "adjust desktop size and position" found overscan and underscan option there but it didnt help, i had to resize the screen there manually and drag the screen down. Weird i had to do this, am i the one who experienced this? I still find the fast motion quite unnatural compared to my old lcd and when viewing a huge landscape slowly, it not so smooth. Is this a plasma thing ?
htwaits's Avatar htwaits
05:50 PM Liked: 482
post #9021 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 24,868
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason22 View Post

Okey i found the a way to get proper full screen with pc, i had to to go to "adjust desktop size and position" found overscan and underscan option there but it didnt help, i had to resize the screen there manually and drag the screen down. Weird i had to do this, am i the one who experienced this? I still find the fast motion quite unnatural compared to my old lcd and when viewing a huge landscape slowly, it not so smooth. Is this a plasma thing ?
What you are describing isn't a plasma characteristic that I'm familiar with, so I suspect your computer settings are probably mismatched with your TV settings. There is a forum here at AVS dedicated to using computers in a home theater setup.
Marc_G's Avatar Marc_G
06:45 PM Liked: 36
post #9022 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 947
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Jason22- the way you sized your screen might not have gotten it actually perfect. I went through all this with my HTPC a few weeks ago after getting my 60ST60, and though I'm on an ATI graphics platform, most of it should transfer to NVidia. These are the things I did.

1. In NVidia, make sure you are at 1080p60 resolution (you almost certainly are; double check)
2. Turn off (for now) all graphics smoothing and other postprocessing on the NVidia side. You may enable some of these later, but for now go with very basic settings.
3. Also in NVidia, turn off any scaling. Just have it put out a regular 1080p signal.
4. In the Panasonic TV picture menu, turn ON the PIXEL DIRECT mode. I think it's in Advanced Picture settings. This should cause the picture to snap to exactly the right size to match pixel for pixel with your plasma panel.
5. You may notice sometimes a few pixels are missing around the perimeter. And it will seem to come and go. Before freaking out about fine tune scaling, go into the TV picture settings and turn off the Pixel Orbiter (the setting is ON by default, set it to Auto). This should clear it up.
6. In the ST60 TV picture settings, Turn OFF (all the way off!) Motion Smoothing. There's also a 3:2 pulldown; experiment with it both ways.

At this point you should have a picture exactly the right size (test with some sort of test pattern; I've used the AVSHD and Disney WOW patterns) when played with most players such as MPC-HC. Note, in most cases, Windows Media Center doesn't output the absolute rightmost column of pixels and does a weird scaling thing, which throws off the sharpness and has other odd effects. I have threads (several, on various forums) and never found a solution, so I only use the native WMC player for recorded TV. All my other media are played through MPC-HC set up as an external player from Media Browser3.

Next you'll need to match color output formats with the TV. On the ATI side, I went with RGB Limited (16-235) 4:4:4. This pairs nicely with the TV set to the default limited color range. I also have Game Mode on, as a recent tweak, and it seemed to take 1 frame worth of audio sync error out of the equation.

I understand there are some differences in color handling on NVidia versus ATI; so this is where my helpfulness ends. But at this point you should be outputting very close to an unaltered reference signal from the HTPC, and the TV should at this point be configured to play it without fighting over it and causing the artifacts you saw.

I hope this is helpful.

Marc
jason22's Avatar jason22
07:29 PM Liked: 10
post #9023 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 32
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@Marc_G
Thanks for the elaborate answer, you are right i didn't resize my screen properly at first and the solution was within Panasonic`s not so intuitive settings and not Nvidia so much. I had to change to H-size to h-size1 (whatever that is) in screen settings and bang, there was the fullscreen.
Cant believe one has to through this. However I didnt find Motion Smoothing setting, instead i found Intelligent Frame Creation (IFC) and turned that off. I believe it is the same.
On a positive note, i find the picture very bright in other words im not gonna miss my LCD. Just have to get used to the huge screen, im looking at a 65" from 9 feet . biggrin.gif
Dont know if i will able to wall mount this monster though seems quite heavy and the salesman couldn't offer me a suiting mount even.
Marc_G's Avatar Marc_G
08:17 PM Liked: 36
post #9024 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 947
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason22 View Post

...However I didnt find Motion Smoothing setting, instead i found Intelligent Frame Creation (IFC) and turned that off. I believe it is the same.

How strange! Where exactly is the IFC on your set? You've got a 65ST60, right? I've got the 60ST60 which should have the same menus... I've never seen IFC on mine. I checked, and Motion Smoother is in \Menu\Picture\ ...scroll down to make page 2 come up... and it's there on page 2. The 3:2 pulldown is in the advanced picture settings, as is the Pixel Direct, which will only be enabled if you are sending 1080p60 or 1080p24 signals, I believe.

Anyway, I'm glad you got things sorted. This set has plenty of brightness and once I sorted out the things mentioned here, I just needed to tweak brightness and contrast marginally to get proper color space using the flashing bars from the AVSHD patterns or similar other black/white level patterns. In another week or two I will do more home calibration things, then compare with the dNice and CNET settings.

I found the Cinema settings were very close to perfect for HTPC use and that's where I have my set now, with the minor tweaks mentioned above.
jason22's Avatar jason22
08:40 PM Liked: 10
post #9025 of 13230
11-05-2013 | Posts: 32
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Marc_G
I have the European version so that may the reason for different menu. Cant find motion at all. I have it on true cinema at the moment, i will dive into all the tweaks later since there seems to be a vast amount of them. Should be fun !
mytbyte's Avatar mytbyte
12:02 AM Liked: 25
post #9026 of 13230
11-06-2013 | Posts: 775
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Jason, IFC is there on non-US modesl as well! Only, if the input signal is 24p, then you get "24p smooth film" in place of IFC...if it's broadcast TV or 50/60Hz input, you get IFC instead...
jhutchinson4's Avatar jhutchinson4
04:40 AM Liked: 10
post #9027 of 13230
11-06-2013 | Posts: 7
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Thanks for the help, guys.  I reset everything like you said, but none of it worked.  However, I wake up this morning to try to show the problem to my wife and... it works now.  I don't understand it, but whatever.  I still have an appointment for Monday, so I'll give it another day or two before I cancel it to make sure it's going to continue to work.  Thanks again, everyone.


jason22's Avatar jason22
08:35 AM Liked: 10
post #9028 of 13230
11-06-2013 | Posts: 32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mytbyte View Post

Jason, IFC is there on non-US modesl as well! Only, if the input signal is 24p, then you get "24p smooth film" in place of IFC...if it's broadcast TV or 50/60Hz input, you get IFC instead...
Mine is european which makes it non-us model obviously. Is the IFC in place of the motion smoothing since i cant find it on my tv ? I have it set on off now , the options were off-min-med-max.
mytbyte's Avatar mytbyte
10:00 AM Liked: 25
post #9029 of 13230
11-06-2013 | Posts: 775
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"Motion smoothing" as available on US models is called "Intelligent Frame Creation" (IFC) on EU models...I assumed you didn't see IFC because you connected a 24p signal in which case you get 24p Smooth Film...

FYI, setting IFC to "max" mostly gets rid of the prominent multicolored false contouring "problem" from 50Hz sources since it doesn't run @ 100Hz double-scanned...
Valnar's Avatar Valnar
10:03 AM Liked: 11
post #9030 of 13230
11-06-2013 | Posts: 1,808
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OK, I'm a little late to the game, but I just bought the 50" ST60 - and this is also my first ever plasma.

Is there a cliff notes version of things I should change from the defaults to get a good picture? Or how to treat it the first few days? What are the recommended settings?

I realize these are are very subjective questions, but since I'm new to plasmas (buying one in the 11th hour of their existence), I have to start from the beginning.

Thanks.
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