Official Panasonic TC-PxxST60 Series thread - Page 39 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1141 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 06:40 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
If I recall correctly, the entire Panasonic line should be at a review event today. Hopefully we will have some updated impressions of the VT and ZT series shortly. I am still getting a ZT but the ST60 I bought to fill its place until release has really surprised me in a good way. Unless the VT and ZT have some serious improvements over the ST60, this is likely the best value proposition this year in the pdp market. I almost feel bad that this panel will be relegated to the exercise room when the ZT is released.
Phatal One is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #1142 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 06:43 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Ph8te's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,966
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 613 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatal One View Post

If I recall correctly, the entire Panasonic line should be at a review event today. Hopefully we will have some updated impressions of the VT and ZT series shortly. I am still getting a ZT but the ST60 I bought to fill its place until release has really surprised me in a good way. Unless the VT and ZT have some serious improvements over the ST60, this is likely the best value proposition this year in the pdp market. I almost feel bad that this panel will be relegated to the exercise room when the ZT is released.

If you are talking about the Engaget one thats the 9th I think wink.gif
Ph8te is offline  
post #1143 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 06:49 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

If you are talking about the Engaget one thats the 9th I think wink.gif

Good catch! I am getting a bit restless for new ZT information!! smile.gif
Phatal One is offline  
post #1144 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 06:59 AM
Member
 
random205's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 37
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Purchased this gem on Saturday @ Best Buy, had a wedding all weekend so I haven't had a chance to open it. Can't wait to unleash it tonight. My first plasma, I'm very excited!

candoan likes this.
random205 is offline  
post #1145 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:09 AM
Member
 
crea78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I am looking to buy a new HDTV in the next few months and currently own the Pioneer Kuro 5020fd. The Kuro has been flawless for the past 4 years I have owned it. From several choices (still deciding on LED or Plasma) I decided to possibly get the TC-P60ST60. Besides a bigger screen, Smart apps, and possibly being thinner to mount on the wall, what other benefits will I be seeing upgrading from the Kuro? If I do decide on the Panasonic, I'll be giving my parents the Kuro so I could still watch it when I am at their house. Thanks in advance....
crea78 is offline  
post #1146 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:17 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Ph8te's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,966
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 613 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatal One View Post

Good catch! I am getting a bit restless for new ZT information!! smile.gif

Personally Im holding out until it gets into the hands of pros calibrators and end users....While these events are great they are usually controlled with a tight leash so any observations will be "controlled".......

Quote:
Originally Posted by crea78 View Post

I am looking to buy a new HDTV in the next few months and currently own the Pioneer Kuro 5020fd. The Kuro has been flawless for the past 4 years I have owned it. From several choices (still deciding on LED or Plasma) I decided to possibly get the TC-P60ST60. Besides a bigger screen, Smart apps, and possibly being thinner to mount on the wall, what other benefits will I be seeing upgrading from the Kuro? If I do decide on the Panasonic, I'll be giving my parents the Kuro so I could still watch it when I am at their house. Thanks in advance....

If your coming from a Kuro I would suggest the VT\ZT or Samsung 8500.......Those will probably be the "closest" to the Kuro as far as pic quality goes......The ST60 is a great set dont get me wrong the reviews and reports have been overly positive, but "improvements" are highly subjective and its up to the end suer to make those decisions. Numbers are only part of the story and I would suggest once the VT\ZT get released going to see all of the Plasmas in a local store to see which one appeals to you the most...
Ph8te is offline  
post #1147 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:20 AM
Member
 
crea78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

If your coming from a Kuro I would suggest the VT\ZT or Samsung 8500.......Those will probably be the "closest" to the Kuro as far as pic quality goes......The ST60 is a great set dont get me wrong the reviews and reports have been overly positive, but "improvements" are highly subjective and its up to the end suer to make those decisions. Numbers are only part of the story and I would suggest once the VT\ZT get released going to see all of the Plasmas in a local store to see which one appeals to you the most...

If that's the case, I will keep the Kuro since $1600 is all I can spend on a new HDTV since I am moving soon. I guess the best thing for me is to invest in some better front speakers. Thanks again for the reply
crea78 is offline  
post #1148 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:33 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
I can't say the ST60 is going to beat your Kuro in every area. I'd leave those comparisons to people who have experienced both. (My reference point to this set is from my 2007 Panasonic 750U.) The first thing I noticed was how dramatically the thickness and weight on pdp's has shrunk; I was shocked when I first got it. The year I bought my 750U Panasonic was actually advertising plasmas with decorative framework (like a picture frame) because the bezels were so thick. I am also very pleased with the black levels and overall color performance. Input lag is not much of an issue for me as I do not do much gaming on the panel. I have maybe 200 hours on the set now and have had no IR problems from the few times I have used it to watch sports.

If there was ONE thing I would say that would swing me in the direction of these new PDPs over keeping your Kuro is how the built-in apps can completely transform your viewing experience. I really underestimated how they would change my viewing habits and they were an afterthought... until I started using them. With Amazon, Netflix, and Hulu Plus apps available on the TV itself, I rarely use my cable box or home media server any more. Plus, during the crucial early hours on the set, it is nice to be able to watch HD TV shows/full screen movies through these services without any white/static logos to concern me.

The one minor complaint I have is that I seem to lose the ability to change zoom modes with the apps active. This may just be a user issue though, as I am not one for reading instructions. biggrin.gif
Phatal One is offline  
post #1149 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:34 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Ph8te's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,966
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 613 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by crea78 View Post

If that's the case, I will keep the Kuro since $1600 is all I can spend on a new HDTV since I am moving soon. I guess the best thing for me is to invest in some better front speakers. Thanks again for the reply

If your happy with your Kuro then keep it wink.gif Of course a bigger screen is great and smarrt apps are "cool"....Each person has something different they are looking for, before making a decision go out and see the set(s) to see if the difference in picture is great enough for you to upgrade. With a rouku\apple TV I can have the smart apps of most any tv though wink.gif .......I highly recommend going to see the set(s) in person as you may change your mind and personally think its worth the upgrade......Of course if you save your money and wait (I ahve suggested this too) then not only will you ahve a bigger budget, but give time for the other sets to come out and get reviewed.....
Ph8te is offline  
post #1150 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:44 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ph8te View Post

Personally Im holding out until it gets into the hands of pros calibrators and end users....While these events are great they are usually controlled with a tight leash so any observations will be "controlled".......

Well I've been waiting a LONG time to buy a new TV for my home theater. I was originally going to buy the Sony XBR 950 until I heard the number of zones for back lighting was unchanged and then reports of significant banding issues popped up in the 65" models. That was back in November! I have been patiently waiting on the ZT since it was announced. I won't take away much from the controlled demo but it will help tide me over until the professionals get panels to review. biggrin.gif

I only bought the ST60 as my gap filler because I could not believe how good the early feedback was in comparison to the price tag. Turns out the early praise is well deserved.
Phatal One is offline  
post #1151 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:51 AM
Member
 
crea78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 16
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatal One View Post

I can't say the ST60 is going to beat your Kuro in every area. I'd leave those comparisons to people who have experienced both. (My reference point to this set is from my 2007 Panasonic 750U.) The first thing I noticed was how dramatically the thickness and weight on pdp's has shrunk; I was shocked when I first got it. The year I bought my 750U Panasonic was actually advertising plasmas with decorative framework (like a picture frame) because the bezels were so thick. I am also very pleased with the black levels and overall color performance. Input lag is not much of an issue for me as I do not do much gaming on the panel. I have maybe 200 hours on the set now and have had no IR problems from the few times I have used it to watch sports.

If there was ONE thing I would say that would swing me in the direction of these new PDPs over keeping your Kuro is how the built-in apps can completely transform your viewing experience. I really underestimated how they would change my viewing habits and they were an afterthought... until I started using them. With Amazon, Netflix, and Hulu Plus apps available on the TV itself, I rarely use my cable box or home media server any more. Plus, during the crucial early hours on the set, it is nice to be able to watch HD TV shows/full screen movies through these services without any white/static logos to concern me.

The one minor complaint I have is that I seem to lose the ability to change zoom modes with the apps active. This may just be a user issue though, as I am not one for reading instructions. biggrin.gif

The built-in apps would be nice, but I do currently have a Sony Blu-Ray player and Roku 2 that can do the same thing. With the Panasonic, that would eliminate the Roku all together. Plus I guess 3D is a bonus, but a gimmick nonetheless.
crea78 is offline  
post #1152 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 07:55 AM
Member
 
supermandlb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Dulles, VA
Posts: 71
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 22
I have had the 50inch ST60 for about 2 weeks now and it is NOT worth the extra money. I must have compared the ST, GT and VT for weeks and finally pulled the trigger on the ST60. After using a calibration disc... it it looks just as good as the high end models. I am very happy with this TV.

There is no TV too BIG, only rooms too small
supermandlb is offline  
post #1153 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:00 AM
Advanced Member
 
Moonchilde's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 104
Updating thread: So today I did some input lag tests (not scientific, not exactly 100% controlled) using a camera and CRT method. I'm getting average 80 ms to 100 ms (assume that it's not accurate so give or take 10 ms and it matches what the input lag testers are getting with other sites) with game mode on and 1080p pixel direct off. With 1080p direct on it adds about an extra 20 to 30 ms, or it could simply a fluke estimation from deciphering motion blur stop watch numbers. Game mode really seems to disable motion smoothing, kind of a worthless option if you ask me since you could you know, just turn off motion smoothing and disables 24 Hrz mode. That's ALL game mode does. It does not turn off any other processing, it just automatically disables motion smoothing and 24 Hz playback. Edit: Forgot to mention that I tested both game mode on and off, and it really didn't seem to make a difference for input lag.

One final note: My final picture that I took was crystal clear and no numbers were motion blur changing, and the final input lag with Game mode on was 107 ms.

I'm rather disappointed. How could the input lag double and nearly triple from last year? I mean seriously, that's just awful. If my final photo is truly accurate then we're talking between 6 and 7 frames of input lag vs 2 and 3. Granted, it doesn't feel that bad and games are still playable, but that's seriously disappointing. I wonder if it has to do with all the apps running in the background to be brought up at any given moment? I couldn't care less about that stuff, and I hate that when I turn the TV on I get that dumb menu on the top.

I wonder if it's possible to create a custom firmware that eliminates all the apps and crap and only leaves us with picture mode. Then, I wonder, what would be the input lag without all the extra processes running in the background. I'm really starting to think the firmware is completely bugged, service menu takes forever to load, service menu has huge amounts of overscan for no reason, service menu goes into torch mode, and game mode just doesn't do anything at all. Edit: I also forgot to mention, that during 3D, the left side of the screen gets cut off, for example the windows start orb. Why?
Moonchilde is offline  
post #1154 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:15 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by supermandlb View Post

I have had the 50inch ST60 for about 2 weeks now and it is NOT worth the extra money. I must have compared the ST, GT and VT for weeks and finally pulled the trigger on the ST60. After using a calibration disc... it it looks just as good as the high end models. I am very happy with this TV.

I'm sorry but your post is contradictory... on one hand you say you've had the 50ST60 for 2 weeks and it is NOT worth the extra money. On the other you say it looks just as good as the high end models and you are happy. Something does not compute.

The attraction of the ST60 is it performance relative to the prior year's ST50, GT50, and VT50 series. Secondly, there are no hard measurements and reviews on this year's VT60 and ZT60 yet. Until those come in it is impossible to state that it looks just as good as THIS year's high end models.
Phatal One is offline  
post #1155 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:19 AM
Member
 
supermandlb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Dulles, VA
Posts: 71
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Sorry, I meant it is not worth the extra money for the GT or VT models.

There is no TV too BIG, only rooms too small
supermandlb is offline  
post #1156 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:22 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by supermandlb View Post

Sorry, I meant it is not worth the extra money for the GT or VT models.

I will agree with you there. Panasonic made it very hard for an informed buyer to choose any 50 series panel over the ST60.
Phatal One is offline  
post #1157 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:23 AM
Member
 
supermandlb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Dulles, VA
Posts: 71
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 22
I was comparing the ST60 to the VT50 and GT50 ( I know the "50" is the 2012 high end model)

There is no TV too BIG, only rooms too small
supermandlb is offline  
post #1158 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:48 AM
Advanced Member
 
moshock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 819
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonchilde View Post

Updating thread: So today I did some input lag tests (not scientific, not exactly 100% controlled) using a camera and CRT method. I'm getting average 80 ms to 100 ms (assume that it's not accurate so give or take 10 ms and it matches what the input lag testers are getting with other sites) with game mode on and 1080p pixel direct off. With 1080p direct on it adds about an extra 20 to 30 ms, or it could simply a fluke estimation from deciphering motion blur stop watch numbers. Game mode really seems to disable motion smoothing, kind of a worthless option if you ask me since you could you know, just turn off motion smoothing and disables 24 Hrz mode. That's ALL game mode does. It does not turn off any other processing, it just automatically disables motion smoothing and 24 Hz playback. Edit: Forgot to mention that I tested both game mode on and off, and it really didn't seem to make a difference for input lag.

One final note: My final picture that I took was crystal clear and no numbers were motion blur changing, and the final input lag with Game mode on was 107 ms.

I'm rather disappointed. How could the input lag double and nearly triple from last year? I mean seriously, that's just awful. If my final photo is truly accurate then we're talking between 6 and 7 frames of input lag vs 2 and 3. Granted, it doesn't feel that bad and games are still playable, but that's seriously disappointing. I wonder if it has to do with all the apps running in the background to be brought up at any given moment? I couldn't care less about that stuff, and I hate that when I turn the TV on I get that dumb menu on the top.

I wonder if it's possible to create a custom firmware that eliminates all the apps and crap and only leaves us with picture mode. Then, I wonder, what would be the input lag without all the extra processes running in the background. I'm really starting to think the firmware is completely bugged, service menu takes forever to load, service menu has huge amounts of overscan for no reason, service menu goes into torch mode, and game mode just doesn't do anything at all. Edit: I also forgot to mention, that during 3D, the left side of the screen gets cut off, for example the windows start orb. Why?

Thank you for sharing your findings. I had a feeling Game Mode did not do anything short of disabling a few things (such as pixel direct and 24 hz mode) as well, so I share your opinion, but I wonder if a calibrator or someone with a little more Panny knowledge can comment. The results of the input lag are disappointing to say the least. And lastly, I too wonder if a software update can fix anything...
moshock is offline  
post #1159 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:50 AM
Senior Member
 
Stump909's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 212
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonchilde View Post

Updating thread: So today I did some input lag tests (not scientific, not exactly 100% controlled) using a camera and CRT method. I'm getting average 80 ms to 100 ms (assume that it's not accurate so give or take 10 ms and it matches what the input lag testers are getting with other sites) with game mode on and 1080p pixel direct off. With 1080p direct on it adds about an extra 20 to 30 ms, or it could simply a fluke estimation from deciphering motion blur stop watch numbers. Game mode really seems to disable motion smoothing, kind of a worthless option if you ask me since you could you know, just turn off motion smoothing and disables 24 Hrz mode. That's ALL game mode does. It does not turn off any other processing, it just automatically disables motion smoothing and 24 Hz playback. Edit: Forgot to mention that I tested both game mode on and off, and it really didn't seem to make a difference for input lag.

One final note: My final picture that I took was crystal clear and no numbers were motion blur changing, and the final input lag with Game mode on was 107 ms.

I'm rather disappointed. How could the input lag double and nearly triple from last year? I mean seriously, that's just awful. If my final photo is truly accurate then we're talking between 6 and 7 frames of input lag vs 2 and 3. Granted, it doesn't feel that bad and games are still playable, but that's seriously disappointing. I wonder if it has to do with all the apps running in the background to be brought up at any given moment? I couldn't care less about that stuff, and I hate that when I turn the TV on I get that dumb menu on the top.

I wonder if it's possible to create a custom firmware that eliminates all the apps and crap and only leaves us with picture mode. Then, I wonder, what would be the input lag without all the extra processes running in the background. I'm really starting to think the firmware is completely bugged, service menu takes forever to load, service menu has huge amounts of overscan for no reason, service menu goes into torch mode, and game mode just doesn't do anything at all. Edit: I also forgot to mention, that during 3D, the left side of the screen gets cut off, for example the windows start orb. Why?

Did you try manually turning off other processes (DNR, Mosquito NR, etc.)?
Stump909 is offline  
post #1160 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:51 AM
Advanced Member
 
Moonchilde's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 104
LOL, you guys wanna see something terrible? Check this: Download the provided test image, save it to your desktop. Then double click it and view it in windows photo viewer. Zoom out all the way, it makes your TV spazz the hell out. The more you zoom out, the worse it gets, as you zoom in, it becomes less a problem. I created the image to test image geometry and see how ABL craps out on the UT50. ABL must be killing it on the ST60, it all of a sudden starts going dither crazy. Wanna see, try it out for yourselves. Or, check this image.



Here is the image that causes ABL/Dither spazzing. It's a 1920x1080 with alternating black/white lines 2 pixels thick.

Moonchilde is offline  
post #1161 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:53 AM
Advanced Member
 
Moonchilde's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 557
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 104
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

Did you try manually turning off other processes (DNR, Mosquito NR, etc.)?

Yep, all that stuff was off. I'm not sure how I feel about it yet. If Samsung's 2013 line up with an equivalent model to the ST60 has less input lag, I may just exchange it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by moshock View Post

Thank you for sharing your findings. I had a feeling Game Mode did not do anything short of disabling a few things (such as pixel direct and 24 hz mode) as well, so I share your opinion, but I wonder if a calibrator or someone with a little more Panny knowledge can comment. The results of the input lag are disappointing to say the least. And lastly, I too wonder if a software update can fix anything...

Pixel direct can still be turned on even with Game mode on. So Game mode isn't doing anything there, either. All I think Game mode is doing, is disabling stuff that will add significant amounts of additional lag like Motion smoothing, although I don't understand why it disables 24 Hz playback considering any content NOT 24 Hz won't have that option enabled anyway, yet pixel direction and other noise removal options are enabled. I'm not even sure Pixel direct adds any additional lag, since the person who tested it used a camera method and me using that same method, I'm getting anywhere from 78 ms of input lag to 107 ms. I tested with Game mode on and off, so I think maybe it's just the test method is too inaccurate to really gauge it, but we can get an idea that the set has very high input lag at the moment.

Calibration isn't going to do anything, and I've done a quick and dirty calibration using a meter as is.
Moonchilde is offline  
post #1162 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 08:59 AM
Member
 
Dabois09's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 154
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by xcloudx82 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabois09 View Post

You mention PC usage... I don't know why anyone would buy a HDTV let alone a plasma to use it as a monitor.

i'm referring to PC usage with videogames: I can assure you that playing PC videogames on a plasma is fantastic: perfect 60hz motion, no motion blur caused by LCD light, and so on. I owned an ST30 for over a month and with his 16ms of input lag gaming was a way much better than playing on my 2 LCD PC monitors...


I've read many times that plasma are not for pc gaming, but as long as they have low input lag, for me they are the best.

Now, the problem is ST60 hasn't 16ms but much more, and i suspect this could be a problem.... (i can't say it for sure, i should try ! but i think the only way to do that is buying the set!).

So you have yet to try the set yet are trying to disprove others that have? It really isn't that bad man; trust me I have tried it. Again I understand what input lag is. I played on this set for an hour and a half, and it felt good.


I recommend you call your local B&M store (preferably something commission based i.e Sears). Ask if you can bring your laptop / tower in and they'll let you.
Dabois09 is online now  
post #1163 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 09:28 AM
Senior Member
 
Leon!'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 372
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonchilde View Post

Updating thread: So today I did some input lag tests (not scientific, not exactly 100% controlled) using a camera and CRT method. I'm getting average 80 ms to 100 ms (assume that it's not accurate so give or take 10 ms and it matches what the input lag testers are getting with other sites) with game mode on and 1080p pixel direct off. With 1080p direct on it adds about an extra 20 to 30 ms, or it could simply a fluke estimation from deciphering motion blur stop watch numbers. Game mode really seems to disable motion smoothing, kind of a worthless option if you ask me since you could you know, just turn off motion smoothing and disables 24 Hrz mode. That's ALL game mode does. It does not turn off any other processing, it just automatically disables motion smoothing and 24 Hz playback. Edit: Forgot to mention that I tested both game mode on and off, and it really didn't seem to make a difference for input lag.

One final note: My final picture that I took was crystal clear and no numbers were motion blur changing, and the final input lag with Game mode on was 107 ms.

I'm rather disappointed. How could the input lag double and nearly triple from last year? I mean seriously, that's just awful. If my final photo is truly accurate then we're talking between 6 and 7 frames of input lag vs 2 and 3. Granted, it doesn't feel that bad and games are still playable, but that's seriously disappointing. I wonder if it has to do with all the apps running in the background to be brought up at any given moment? I couldn't care less about that stuff, and I hate that when I turn the TV on I get that dumb menu on the top.

I wonder if it's possible to create a custom firmware that eliminates all the apps and crap and only leaves us with picture mode. Then, I wonder, what would be the input lag without all the extra processes running in the background. I'm really starting to think the firmware is completely bugged, service menu takes forever to load, service menu has huge amounts of overscan for no reason, service menu goes into torch mode, and game mode just doesn't do anything at all. Edit: I also forgot to mention, that during 3D, the left side of the screen gets cut off, for example the windows start orb. Why?

THanks for the report. If accurate, that is unfortunate (only for those of us more sensitive to it than others).

But please. Stop torturing your poor panel with those crazy test images!

eek.gif
Leon! is offline  
post #1164 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 09:31 AM
Member
 
xcloudx82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 28
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabois09 View Post

So you have yet to try the set yet are trying to disprove others that have? It really isn't that bad man; trust me I have tried it. Again I understand what input lag is. I played on this set for an hour and a half, and it felt good.


I recommend you call your local B&M store (preferably something commission based i.e Sears). Ask if you can bring your laptop / tower in and they'll let you.

i didn't mean to disprove others, i was only posting my experience with input-lag....

However here in Europe we'll have also a GT60 that from tests seems to have much less input lag than ST, so if i can't try the ST maybe i'll go for that....
xcloudx82 is offline  
post #1165 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 09:44 AM
Advanced Member
 
moshock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 819
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 27
Quote:
Originally Posted by xcloudx82 View Post

i didn't mean to disprove others, i was only posting my experience with input-lag....

However here in Europe we'll have also a GT60 that from tests seems to have much less input lag than ST, so if i can't try the ST maybe i'll go for that....

Your ST is a European model? Noted.
moshock is offline  
post #1166 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 10:13 AM
Member
 
xcloudx82's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 28
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
no i'haven't an ST60 yet...i had an ST30 ( and yes, i'm from europe) and i'm deciding if go for an ST60 or GT60
xcloudx82 is offline  
post #1167 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 10:16 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Ph8te's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,966
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 613 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by moshock View Post

Your ST is a European model? Noted.

I think you mean GT and in that case yes. GT60 is a EU model and will not be coming to the NA market...
Ph8te is offline  
post #1168 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 10:22 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
If I have the time, I will try some input lag testing on my US spec 50" ST60 this evening or next.
Phatal One is offline  
post #1169 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 10:32 AM
Senior Member
 
Stump909's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 212
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phatal One View Post

If I have the time, I will try some input lag testing on my US spec 50" ST60 this evening or next.

That'd be great. The more samples the better. Do you happen to own Rockband or Guitar Hero?
Stump909 is offline  
post #1170 of 12915 Old 04-08-2013, 10:37 AM
Member
 
Phatal One's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stump909 View Post

That'd be great. The more samples the better. Do you happen to own Rockband or Guitar Hero?

I have an old PS3 copy of GH3 lying around. I can definitely hook it up and run the calibration on it again.
Phatal One is offline  
Reply Plasma Flat Panel Displays

Tags
Panasonic Tc P55st60 55 Inch 1080p 600hz 3d Smart Plasma Hdtv , Panasonic Tc P60st60 60 Inch 3d Smart Plasma Hdtv , Panasonic Tc P65st60 65 Inch 3d Smart Plasma Hdtv , Panasonic Viera Tc P55vt50 , Sony Bravia Xbr52hx909 52 Lcd Tv Direct Led
Gear in this thread - P55st60 by PriceGrabber.com

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off