AVS Forum banner
1M views 15K replies 1K participants last post by  John Hooper 
#1 ·
With the 2013 CES announcement of the new plasmas, i would start a thread to address questions regarding the likely popular st60 series plasma sets available in 50, 55, 60, and 65 inch sizes.

http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model/TC-P50st60
 
#11,377 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260302


Thanks for the links, I'll try to study that. Are you (and 10k) implying that setting the nvidia driver to Limited output still results in crushed blacks for desktop apps? Well I don't mind that much if video is ok but I thought the video card would just rescale as needed to the standard range. I'll have to try with a non-video contrast/brightness test image. And thanks also, I just saw there's an RGB range setting in XBMC Gotham thanks to your post.

The Nvidia Video Dynamic Range option doesn't affect the desktop, only video, and even then it's highly player-dependent. There is no way to make an Nvidia card compress PC levels to Video levels to make the desktop look more correct when the display is set for Video levels. I may have read that AMD cards have that capability.
 
#11,378 ·
Left the TV running D-Nice's break-in slides after lunch today - just wanted to confirm something. I left the picture mode set to "Custom" which has the contrast setting cranked to 100 - is that right?


For TV and Movie watching I have Cnet's settings, except I dialed down the contrast to 50 until I get some hours in. I'll be careful to avoid static graphics, logos, and black bars during the first ~300 hours. I'll be watching real content while I'm home, and the slides overnight and during the work day.


Solid plan? Anything I should do differently?
 
#11,380 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260418


The Nvidia Video Dynamic Range option doesn't affect the desktop, only video, and even then it's highly player-dependent. There is no way to make an Nvidia card compress PC levels to Video levels to make the desktop look more correct when the display is set for Video levels. I may have read that AMD cards have that capability.
Well that sucks. However I'm not using my 60ST60 to perform precision photoshopping... I don't mind much color clipping outside of video or gaming. I think one of the links you provided had a post stating that gaming typically outputs standard range... is that true?
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2therock  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260668


Hi Folks, I am contemplating a TC-P50ST60 but want to ask, "Is it true every time one turns the TV on he has to navigate through an App Screen, and disable Adds?

Err nope. I for one set my "home screen" to full-screen TV, and you can turn off the top menu that briefly appears (no ad there anyway). Just like a normal, vanilla display. When you press the Apps button they you go to the smart apps menu... I haven't seen ads there but I guess you can turn them off if there's any.
 
#11,381 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2therock  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260668


Hi Folks, I am contemplating a TC-P50ST60 but want to ask, "Is it true every time one turns the TV on he has to navigate through an App Screen, and disable Adds?


Thanks!

Nope. That is the default setting, but you can go into the setup menus and turn that off. (I don't remember exactly where you do that, but it has been discussed in this thread....just search.) On my P60ST60, every time I turn it on now, it shows a banner briefly across the top reminding me of what is available, but that disappears after a couple of seconds and then it is just on whatever input I have it set to. No apps screen shows up at all unless I press the Apps button on the remote.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2therock
#11,382 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpc  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24259361


This is for my friends 65ST60. I just wondered where it was best to start. I actually have D-nice settings on my own 60ST30 ...I put them in 2 years ago after D-nice slide prep and they look ok, but...I think all of our sets would look best with a calibration. Guess I'll just start tinkering away on my set and help my friend with his. Although since I asked this question, he has said he is happy switching between the D-nice and Cnet settings. Hasn't decided which he likes best yet. Anyways, I hear what you're saying.

Well let's put tis way, finding a picture that you can be happy with and having a proper calibration is comparable to the old apples/oranges scenario. There is simply no replacement for an accurate calibration,,, period.


Example, for the last 9 months I've been totally happy with the 79/81 contrast setting of DNice & CNET. I have just had my 50ST60 accurately calibrated and my contrast is now set at 50 with tyhe brightnss of +6 and I'm not missing that extra brightness in the least while having the peace of mind that my plasma will be lasting longer with zero probability of IR. If I have any regrets, it's the fact I had to wait til 3800 running time before I had the funds to afford what this plasma should have had after 300-500 hours.


And the calibrated 3D picture is off the charts too. Get a ISF certified calibration!
 
#11,383 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCCaniac  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260723


Nope. That is the default setting, but you can go into the setup menus and turn that off. (I don't remember exactly where you do that, but it has been discussed in this thread....just search.) On my P60ST60, every time I turn it on now, it shows a banner briefly across the top reminding me of what is available, but that disappears after a couple of seconds and then it is just on whatever input I have it set to. No apps screen shows up at all unless I press the Apps button on the remote.

Thanks, I'm shopping and they are not readily available, but Sears has them for 999. Any tips or sources would be great. 50-inch.
 
#11,384 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2therock  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24261923


Thanks, I'm shopping and they are not readily available, but Sears has them for 999. Any tips or sources would be great. 50-inch.

On the initial setup, it asks what homescreen you want to use. Just select the LIVETV homescreen, and it will come up with the TV every time.


Other than Sears, check Best Buys (check the Closeout and special section, then enter your zip code and how many miles you want to search), and Amazon.com and their resellers.
 
#11,385 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2therock  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24261923



Thanks, I'm shopping and they are not readily available, but Sears has them for 999. Any tips or sources would be great. 50-inch.
If Sears has it for $999, my advice would be to grab it.  They are definitely getting scarce out there, and of course, once they're gone you'll not likely have another opportunity to own one.  I bought mine last month, and I'm very happy with it.  Good luck!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2therock
#11,386 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260718

Well that sucks. However I'm not using my 60ST60 to perform precision photoshopping... I don't mind much color clipping outside of video or gaming. I think one of the links you provided had a post stating that gaming typically outputs standard range... is that true?

PC games output PC Levels, 0-255. Don't know about consoles, but I may have read they have selectable output levels.
 
#11,387 ·
I just got a new ST60 and I entered the service menu and checked is there any abnormality in the picture.


Watching those color patterns I saw this interesting change of black.


The black is not black , if I watch very close I can see grey horizontal lines moving ONLY on the black background . There is one patter - the black BG with the smaller white square when those gray lines disappear and the black is pure black.


Can someone confirm this about the grey horizontal lines ? They are visible in normal content if you have black bars.
 
#11,388 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by sawfish  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24262671


PC games output PC Levels, 0-255. Don't know about consoles, but I may have read they have selectable output levels.

So is there any hope of getting the correct dynamic range if one is both watching videos and doing PC gaming on the same TV input?

Quote:
Originally Posted by covix  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263045


I just got a new ST60 and I entered the service menu and checked is there any abnormality in the picture.


Watching those color patterns I saw this interesting change of black.


The black is not black , if I watch very close I can see grey horizontal lines moving ONLY on the black background . There is one patter - the black BG with the smaller white square when those gray lines disappear and the black is pure black.


Can someone confirm this about the grey horizontal lines ? They are visible in normal content if you have black bars.

Are you talking about dithering? Faint, moving gray pixels on certain shades? That would be normal for shades above true black.
 
#11,389 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263094



Are you talking about dithering? Faint, moving gray pixels on certain shades? That would be normal for shades above true black.

No, Im talking about moving thin horizontal LINES not pixels. They are visible only in black BG such as black bars, or black screen.
 
#11,390 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by mykereid  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24262645


If Sears has it for $999, my advice would be to grab it.  They are definitely getting scarce out there, and of course, once they're gone you'll not likely have another opportunity to own one.  I bought mine last month, and I'm very happy with it.  Good luck!

Well, Looks like I will have to relax and wait for LED/LCD to catch up. Sears has one in Augusta GA for pick up only, 200 miles one way. I'm not that hot to trot.


I have to table mount @ no wider than 47 total width across. I have a 2005 1080i Hitachi 42HDT52A that is nothing less than awesome and with its electric swivel base it would be missed.

I was just going to pick up one of these before the tech goes away.


Thanks
 
#11,391 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263094


So is there any hope of getting the correct dynamic range if one is both watching videos and doing PC gaming on the same TV input?


.

Sure. Set the TV to use expanded range (I forget what they call it in the menu), so that it will always expect 0-255 range input.


In the PC video card, set the pixel format to RGB Full (0-255). This will force video color space to be expanded to full range. On AMD cards, this is in the control center's "Pixel Format" section.


Desktop stuff I believe is always output full, same with games, I believe.


Marc
 
#11,392 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260718


I for one set my "home screen" to full-screen TV, and you can turn off the top menu that briefly appears (no ad there anyway). Just like a normal, vanilla display.

?? How do you turn off that top menu that briefly appears when you first turn the TV on? I haven't been able to find a way to eliminate that from my Full Screen TV home screen (or any other screen upon startup). Banner Ads is turned off, but that pesky top menu persists.
 
#11,393 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by covix  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263134

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263094



Are you talking about dithering? Faint, moving gray pixels on certain shades? That would be normal for shades above true black.

No, Im talking about moving thin horizontal LINES not pixels. They are visible only in black BG such as black bars, or black screen.

Could be line bleed, if they line up with other horizontal elements elsewhere on the screen (for example edges of a box, like on the green "this preview has been approved for all audiences" screen). Line bleed is normal for this kind of TV.
 
#11,394 ·
I ended up picking up a floor model ST60 for my bedroom (50 inch) from a local Best Buy last night. I was originally going to wait to see what Samsung delivered later in the year, but absolutely fell in love with the ST60. I’ve always had a love/hate relationship with Panasonic. I love their picture quality and processing, but hate dealing with IR issues/fears.


No break-in slides for me. A quick slide run with my USB drive revealed no burn-in, which was my biggest fear in a floor model. The set was basically running a Viera demo all day. I also checked the hours and used that information to haggle them down on the price (3600 hours!).


I’m actually very impressed with the black-levels on this set. I used to have a VT60 in my living room before frying a HUD logo into the screen due to a 100 contrast setting (returned it to Amazon) and the blacks on this set look almost as good.


Settings are tricky for me. I’m used to THX settings, so a desire for more brightness has never been an issue with me. I’ve also found that by switching to Cinema and turning off all the enhancements, I’m mostly pleased with the overall look. The only thing that concerns me is a “safe” contrast setting.


Personally, I’ve never bought into that whole belief that sets become more IR resistant as they age. Even at 3600 hours, I clearly saw the Netflix logo in a sky scene several minutes after starting a streaming episode of Dexter (default Contrast of 80). And that logo was only up for maybe 3-4 minutes! Granted, it did go away relatively quickly (10 minutes), but after my past experience, I’m a little cautious after what happened to my VT60.


My experience has me convinced that Contrast is key with these Panasonics when it comes to controlling IR/burn-in. Cranking it to 100 is just asking for trouble, as I quickly learned. My VT60 had minimal IR in its low contrast THX mode of 60. Unfortunately, THX is not an option on the ST60.


Is anyone here using a Contrast setting of 60-70 in Cinema mode? It seems that most of you guys are doing that until your panel ages - but mine is well past that. Has anyone kept their contrast setting this low? I noticed that the guy who reviewed the set on flatpanelshd.com posted a contrast setting of 60 in his calibration of “True Cinema” (which I’m assuming is the same thing?).


I guess the question is: How low can you go (in Cinema) without losing detail in your opinions? My watching and occasional gaming are primarily in a dark room with very little light.
 
#11,395 ·
I keep my Contrast at 80, but sometimes will turn it down to 65~75 if I am doing something with static logo/hud like playing a video game for an extended period of time. At night or in a very dark room even 65~75 is still pretty bright. Just make sure to re-check your Brightness (minimum black level) setting if you adjust contrast, because they are related (will probably have to turn Brightness up a little if you turn down Contrast/max white output)
 
#11,396 ·
I had unremoveable ir occur at a contrast setting of 83. I would try to stay below 80. Then again you could have got a set that you can run in the mid 80's & have very little ir. It's been a mixed bag. Which tells me Panasonic pulled out long ago.
 
#11,397 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc_G  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263499


Sure. Set the TV to use expanded range (I forget what they call it in the menu), so that it will always expect 0-255 range input.


In the PC video card, set the pixel format to RGB Full (0-255). This will force video color space to be expanded to full range. On AMD cards, this is in the control center's "Pixel Format" section.

The full context of that was that I'm also using other sources (blu-ray player, TV) using limited (standard) RGB on the same TV input (via an AVR). It looks like the HDMI RGB range setting "Auto" doesn't really work as I get washed out images with it on limited RGB material, i.e. it's like when the TV is set on Nonstandard range.


So right now I put the TV on Standard (limited) range and try to set sources to the same if possible, but it looks like desktop and PC games will have to suffer crushed blacks...
Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyWalters  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263520


?? How do you turn off that top menu that briefly appears when you first turn the TV on? I haven't been able to find a way to eliminate that from my Full Screen TV home screen (or any other screen upon startup). Banner Ads is turned off, but that pesky top menu persists.

Sorry, I thought the "Smart Vierra Banner" setting was for that. Tried it but nope, doesn't get rid of the top menu.
 
#11,398 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterpack  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24259793


99 percent of TV users do not worry about settings, they just watch out of the box and they don't worry about breaking in their tv or avoiding for example watching sport all day.

Break-in is not required for plasma panels. On its own, it serves no purpose.
 
#11,399 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2therock  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24260668


Hi Folks, I am contemplating a TC-P50ST60 but want to ask, "Is it true every time one turns the TV on he has to navigate through an App Screen, and disable Adds?


Thanks!
The procedure is detailed on CNET. If you can't find it - let me know. I posted a reference to the site sveral months ago. Others have posted the detailed settings to accomplish this as well.
 
#11,400 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro  /t/1450484/official-panasonic-tc-pxxst60-series-thread/11370#post_24263094


So is there any hope of getting the correct dynamic range if one is both watching videos and doing PC gaming on the same TV input?

That was a major part of what we were talking about in the messages I linked to. You would have to use PC levels for everything, and if you wanted to run all devices through an AVR with a single HDMI output, you would have to set all those devices to PC levels, if that's even possible. It isn't possible for my new Sony S5100 BD player, and I gave other reasons why I don't like using PC levels on my HTPC in the message I linked to.
 
Top