Official Panasonic TC-PxxST60 Series thread - Page 73 - AVS Forum
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post #2161 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by biggweeziehd View Post

Seems to me that half these post have d-nice's name in them. But d-nice only posts very rarely. I'm sure he is as just as obsessed with tech as all of us but is too busy(my assumption) making money to spend all day arguing the validity of his process. That in itself leans me towards... This guy prob knows what he's talking about. And after not being home all day and coming home to my sons watching playoffs on my new "d-niced" 60st60 I'VE NEVER SEEN A SET LOOK LIKE THAT, AMAZING! So I'm a super skeptic but this guy knows his sh@t.

Sweet. How much does d-nice charge for calibration?
also congrats on the beautiful picture quality you have!
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post #2162 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

That's not really true, people saying burn in is irrelevant to them. Getting some hours on the plasma does reduce burn in. That is not the point of any slides, in this case, but it still would help with it, or speed up when the tv becoems "safer".
They dont reduce burn in. Nothing will. They reduce the likelihood of getting burn in. And, as you pointed out, so does anything that will put some hours on the panel when you first get it.

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post #2163 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 09:01 PM
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I agree. I find dnice setting has too much red and gamma 2.6 crushes shadow detail.
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Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

Plugged in settings from CNET in Cinema Mode, so now I'm toggling between Cinema and Custom (D-Nice's settings). I gotta say they look very similar. Like another poster mentioned earlier D-Nice gives better blacks but CNET gives more shadow detail. I like both but so far with limited viewing I'm leaning more towards CNET's settings in Cinema Mode. Very very impressed so far with the picture quality of the ST60, especially when the room is dark cool.gif

Still running the slides, but watching a few hours a day of full screen content.. movies, hockey, baseball..
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post #2164 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 09:12 PM
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Originally Posted by openwheelracing View Post

I agree. I find dnice setting has too much red and gamma 2.6 crushes shadow detail.


I adjusted the gamma to 2.2 and like it a lot better, the CNET settings I found put to much of like a white haze over the entire picture. I like d-nice settings with a few adjustments of my own, it may not be "correct" but it looks good to my eyes and that's all that matters in the end.
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post #2165 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 09:25 PM
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You are the one in the best position to prevent IR from becoming an issue. Unless you to away for a few weeks, leaving your TV on ESPN, than burn-in isn't relevant. biggrin.gif
I understand where youre coming from but I think "a few weeks" might be stretching reality.
Don't make me ask you for a link to prove that. wink.gif
Do you think someone has tested constant ESPN for time to burn-in? That would lead to all kinds of questions like how long would one need to run remedial source material before conceding that what was present is actual burn-in? wink.gif

Think of it as a crude metaphor, in the hope of attracting attention to the difference between the definition of IR and the definition of burn-in.
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post #2166 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by hotskins View Post

Sweet. How much does d-nice charge for calibration?
also congrats on the beautiful picture quality you have!
You should ask D-Nice that. I imagine that it's less if you live in his home area. Generally the cost of travel for a tour is spread over the number of calibrations that can be done on a tour. If there aren't enough customers then tours get canceled because the cost would be too high. Each calibrator handles his travel expenses differently.
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post #2167 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 09:34 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

They dont reduce burn in. Nothing will. They reduce the likelihood of getting burn in. And, as you pointed out, so does anything that will put some hours on the panel when you first get it.
That's what I meant. But if someone uses slides, they are more likely to be having the tv on for x hours in a lot fewer days than if they just watch normal content on it, so it speeds it up.
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post #2168 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 09:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post

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Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

That's not really true, people saying burn in is irrelevant to them. Getting some hours on the plasma does reduce burn in. That is not the point of any slides, in this case, but it still would help with it, or speed up when the tv becoems "safer".
They dont reduce burn in. Nothing will. They reduce the likelihood of getting burn in. And, as you pointed out, so does anything that will put some hours on the panel when you first get it.
If a TV is used normally, that's with at least some kind of mix of source material so that the same fixed image isn't constantly on the screen, then burn-in can be irrelevant. Burn-in is permanent damage that can't be fixed.

Image retention (IR), on the other hand, is much more common, and can be reversed. Some people's normal TV habits are such that they never see IR. Others with different habits need to be more on guard. A person who might be better off with a LCD display would be the guy who liked to keep ESPN on all day, ,every day, as back ground company, but watched other material at night. Another guy who gets fixated on the same game to the exclusion of everything else might be the rare candidate for burn-in.

The older a set is, in hours of use, the less likely it is to have either problem.

My personal fixation is trying to keep the definition of IR and burn-in clear and distinct. eek.gif
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post #2169 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 09:57 PM
 
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yeah I have seen IR in ALL plasmas I've tried. Except possibly not in the samsung D7000 plasma. I don't recall it in that, but any time I turend off an ST30, ST50, or the kuro, I would see it. Luckily I don't think I've ever had to deal with actual burn in though.
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post #2170 of 12662 Old 04-21-2013, 10:35 PM
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I definitely notice a good bit of horizontal line bleed on my ST60
Do you see it in normal programming or just screen credits and ads with static colored backgrounds and type? How often do you see it?

Just depends really. One a scene of Justified I seen Raylans tan Cowboy hat bleed over onto a dark wall a good foot from where his hat actually was. I also notice it a good deal on the Xbox 360 dashboard as well.
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post #2171 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

yeah I have seen IR in ALL plasmas I've tried. Except possibly not in the samsung D7000 plasma. I don't recall it in that, but any time I turend off an ST30, ST50, or the kuro, I would see it. Luckily I don't think I've ever had to deal with actual burn in though.
I understand that what one sees at the moment you turn a set off is something different than the IR that you can see from a previous source when you've bee watching a new source for a short while. For instance, watching Fox News and still seeing the Fox logo after switching to MSNBC. wink.gif
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post #2172 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 03:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Esteban Medaglia View Post

Just came back from my local Best Buy (for the third time in the last two weeks) and they still have NO 2013 Panasonic model in the store. They mentioned a June availability date for the VTs, ZTs and (this was a surprise) also the 65ST60, which is the one I am interested in. Of course I took this with a grain of salt. They had the 60ST "in the system", but none actually on the floor. I'm in South FL. Anybody else having better luck finding any of these sets on display at any Best Buy?

Saturday night, Florida Mall BestBuy in Orlando had just gotten the 60" 60VT and 60ST in stock, so I would say they are coming. On the 65", I found one in stock next door at H.H.Gregg, so you might want to look there.
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post #2173 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 04:10 AM
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Saturday night, Florida Mall BestBuy in Orlando had just gotten the 60" 60VT and 60ST in stock, so I would say they are coming. On the 65", I found one in stock next door at H.H.Gregg, so you might want to look there.

Thanks for the heads up! I will stop by my local HH Gregg to at least see these sets in person. I'd have to wait until Best Buy has them in stock, though, since I am Silver Rewards member and you can never go wrong with the extra points and the 45-day return window. Thanks again!
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post #2174 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 05:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Blu_One View Post

Plugged in settings from CNET in Cinema Mode, so now I'm toggling between Cinema and Custom (D-Nice's settings). I gotta say they look very similar. Like another poster mentioned earlier D-Nice gives better blacks but CNET gives more shadow detail. I like both but so far with limited viewing I'm leaning more towards CNET's settings in Cinema Mode. Very very impressed so far with the picture quality of the ST60, especially when the room is dark cool.gif

Still running the slides, but watching a few hours a day of full screen content.. movies, hockey, baseball..

In agreement with you on this...except I prefer the D'Nice settings. I am still toggling between the 2 as well.
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post #2175 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 05:34 AM
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Originally Posted by htwaits View Post

Do you think someone has tested constant ESPN for time to burn-in? That would lead to all kinds of questions like how long would one need to run remedial source material before conceding that what was present is actual burn-in? wink.gif

Think of it as a crude metaphor, in the hope of attracting attention to the difference between the definition of IR and the definition of burn-in.

My local abc warehouse has espn running all day everyday on all their sets. I was watching an 55st50 and was pretty sure it was burnt. Progressive commercial came on and that espn stuff was DEEP on there. This would be far from normal but I think if you try you can burn-in.
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post #2176 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 06:33 AM
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Originally Posted by somelogin View Post

yeah I have seen IR in ALL plasmas I've tried. Except possibly not in the samsung D7000 plasma. I don't recall it in that, but any time I turend off an ST30, ST50, or the kuro, I would see it. Luckily I don't think I've ever had to deal with actual burn in though.

If you see any ghost-like after-images on the screen AFTER TURNING the TV OFF (or on a blank no-input screen) then that is NOT IR, it's residual charge or phosphorescence which is normal on any phosphor-based TV (all my Tube TVs did this as well). It's not a problem and is not an issue.

IR can only be seen if the TV is on and displaying content on the screen. IR on all my Plasmas goes away within several seconds.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1058994/what-happened-to-my-pansonic-px42-plasma-burn-in#post_14496410

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post #2177 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 06:47 AM
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Looks like ill be going from my 70" Sharp to the 60" ST60..

I already made the sale and the guys comming to pick it up tommorow. Hoping once hes gone I'll have time to run to best buy and pick up the Panasonic

I was going to get the 65 S64/S60 but no place locally has either of them in stock and I kind of shot myself in the foot after asking someone and them telling me they would so I went ahead and sold my SHarp. Waiting over a week for a TV with a 4 year old child in the house isnt realistic. Pretty sure my wife would want to kill herself as well..

Taking a big dive in screen size, but everything happens for a reason right? I guess I can sacrifice 10" for leaps and bounds better picture quality of the sharp.

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post #2178 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 06:52 AM
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Looks like ill be going from my 70" Sharp to the 60" ST60..
Waiting over a week for a TV with a 4 year old child in the house isnt realistic. Pretty sure my wife would want to kill herself as well..
lol biggrin.gif

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post #2179 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 06:53 AM
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I agree. I find dnice setting has too much red and gamma 2.6 crushes shadow detail.

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In agreement with you on this...except I prefer the D'Nice settings. I am still toggling between the 2 as well.
I hope someone will post other 'tweaked' settings at some point in the near future. For example, a calibration for daytime (bright room) viewing, and another that adds more 'pop' to the D-Nice and CNET settings. A lot of people seem to like that better than a properly calibrated picture, so I assume many would use it..

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post #2180 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:00 AM
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lol biggrin.gif

Don't get me wrong.. I mean.. Could make life a little simpler.. but realistically no one is going to put up with my **** like this woman does and still bang my brains out regularly.

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post #2181 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:19 AM
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Looks like ill be going from my 70" Sharp to the 60" ST60..

I already made the sale and the guys comming to pick it up tommorow. Hoping once hes gone I'll have time to run to best buy and pick up the Panasonic

I was going to get the 65 S64/S60 but no place locally has either of them in stock and I kind of shot myself in the foot after asking someone and them telling me they would so I went ahead and sold my SHarp. Waiting over a week for a TV with a 4 year old child in the house isnt realistic. Pretty sure my wife would want to kill herself as well..

Taking a big dive in screen size, but everything happens for a reason right? I guess I can sacrifice 10" for leaps and bounds better picture quality of the sharp.
Man, that is a big jump down in screen size. The short term sacrifice of waiting might outweigh the long term sacrifice of a smaller TV. I would think about moving another TV into that room for the time being or just picking up something small for now that can be returned. Sam's club and Costco both give you 90 days.
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post #2182 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:37 AM
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Man, that is a big jump down is screen size. The short term sacrifice of waiting might outweigh the long term sacrifice of a smaller TV. I would think about moving another TV into that room for the time being or just picking up something small for now that can be returned. Sam's club and Costco both give you 90 days.

I agree ! Ten inches is a lot to give up if you're used to 70". Personally I wouldnt go down below 65".

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post #2183 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:40 AM
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Man, that is a big jump down in screen size. The short term sacrifice of waiting might outweigh the long term sacrifice of a smaller TV. I would think about moving another TV into that room for the time being or just picking up something small for now that can be returned. Sam's club and Costco both give you 90 days.

Eh I think it will be fine...

Unfortunately don't have another TV to put in the romo at the moment. Cleared out my old Rear Porjection HDTV and tube TV's a few months ago.

I measure it out on the wall. I don't think it will be all that bad, the intial shock might suck but to be honest I'd rather have top notch PQ with the 60" over the PQ of the 70"

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post #2184 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:44 AM
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Eh I think it will be fine...

Unfortunately don't have another TV to put in the romo at the moment. Cleared out my old Rear Porjection HDTV and tube TV's a few months ago.

I measure it out on the wall. I don't think it will be all that bad, the intial shock might suck but to be honest I'd rather have top notch PQ with the 60" over the PQ of the 70"

How far away are you from the display, what's your viewing distance ?

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post #2185 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:45 AM
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When you guys say don't watch the channels with logo or watch 4:3, 2.40:1 movies for too long, how long is too long? I was planning on watching Django Unchained or the Hobbit then throw in a couple of Pixar movies.
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post #2186 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:52 AM
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When you guys say don't watch the channels with logo or watch 4:3, 2.40:1 movies for too long, how long is too long? I was planning on watching Django Unchained or the Hobbit then throw in a couple of Pixar movies.

I'm glad you mentioned that I gotta go buy Dhango can't wait to see it on this beast.
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post #2187 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 07:56 AM
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I'm glad you mentioned that I gotta go buy Dhango can't wait to see it on this beast.

The Target exclusive Steel Book looks fantastic.
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post #2188 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 08:00 AM
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The Target exclusive Steel Book looks fantastic.

Thanks ill google that. Ill prob hit the $7 Walmart tub too so I can get some cheap new stuff as well

Also plugged in cnet settings on cinema while watching avatar bluray. I say d-nice has David whooped. Cnet in cinema is green flat and a little dull, although still better than presets.
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post #2189 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 08:05 AM
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The Target exclusive Steel Book looks fantastic.

Only saw exclusive steel box at BB
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post #2190 of 12662 Old 04-22-2013, 08:13 AM
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When you guys say don't watch the channels with logo or watch 4:3, 2.40:1 movies for too long, how long is too long? I was planning on watching Django Unchained or the Hobbit then throw in a couple of Pixar movies.
In my non-professional opinion I would think that watching anything with black bars is worse then watching something with a static image. When black bars are present you are not breaking in those pixels and I would think at the beginning you want to break in everything as evenly as possible. Overtime it will probably just even itself out anyway as long as you mix up viewing types though.

I do not thin there is an exact science to how long is to long. Everyone had their own opionions and everyone's TV will act differently as well. To be safe, I would run a pixle washer or something maybe every hour for a few minutes if you have a static logo on and see how the TV is handling it. Again, you ask this question to 100 different people you will get 100 different answers from 1 hour being to long to 24 hours.
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Reply Plasma Flat Panel Displays

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