Official Panasonic S60 Series Discussion Thread - Page 217 - AVS Forum
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post #6481 of 7068 Old 02-17-2014, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by xenon9887 View Post

Plasmas put out a fair amount of radio interference.

Is that why every time I turn on my plasma the garage won't open?biggrin.gif
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The only way to fix the issue is to either purchase more heavily shielded cables or add your own shielding to your existing ones.

http://www.parts-express.com/dayton-audio-rgb-6b-component-video-cable-6-ft-bulk-5-pcs--181-672b


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post #6482 of 7068 Old 02-17-2014, 11:55 AM
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Is that why every time I turn on my plasma the garage won't open?biggrin.gif

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Can't tell if this is sarcasm or just a joke, but try listening to an AM radio station anywhere near your plasma when it is turned on. It doesn't go well.
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post #6483 of 7068 Old 02-17-2014, 11:58 AM
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Can't tell if this is sarcasm or just a joke, but try listening to an AM radio station anywhere near your plasma when it is turned on. It doesn't go well.

That's why I recommended those cables. wink.gif


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post #6484 of 7068 Old 02-23-2014, 11:09 PM
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Yellows look a bit greenish, any tips on correcting this?
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post #6485 of 7068 Old 02-24-2014, 06:08 AM
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Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

Yellows look a bit greenish, any tips on correcting this?

Blue and Green will appear to combine as yellow, so dial up the Blue or down the Green a bit and see how that goes.
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post #6486 of 7068 Old 02-25-2014, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by xenon9887 View Post

Blue and Green will appear to combine as yellow, so dial up the Blue or down the Green a bit and see how that goes.

Are you talking about the W/B(high or low?) settings or hue?
And it's too bad the whites are dirty/warm in warm2, since Warm2 seems to produces the best color representation for movies, or most accurate compared to my CRT. I tried warm 1, which whitened up the whites(still not white enough, but an improvement) but the colors didn't look warm enough.
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post #6487 of 7068 Old 02-27-2014, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

Are you talking about the W/B(high or low?) settings or hue?
And it's too bad the whites are dirty/warm in warm2, since Warm2 seems to produces the best color representation for movies, or most accurate compared to my CRT. I tried warm 1, which whitened up the whites(still not white enough, but an improvement) but the colors didn't look warm enough.

I am honestly not sure. I'd be lying if I said I knew what all of those settings did. I'd just play with all of them and see what helps and what hurts.
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post #6488 of 7068 Old 02-27-2014, 11:57 AM
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I guess I'm a bit late to the party... I just bought a new in box 55" S60. It's shipping from over 3000km away, should be here by Monday...

Sent from my RM-820_nam_canada_246 using Tapatalk
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post #6489 of 7068 Old 02-27-2014, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by groovejumper View Post

I guess I'm a bit late to the party... I just bought a new in box 55" S60. It's shipping from over 3000km away, should be here by Monday...

Sent from my RM-820_nam_canada_246 using Tapatalk

Congratulations! and be sure to inspect for any cracks on the glass first hand. My 65 inch one from Sam's Club auction was arrived damaged like that. This goes to everyone. Take a very good care when transporting plasmas!
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post #6490 of 7068 Old 02-27-2014, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by xenon9887 View Post

I am honestly not sure. I'd be lying if I said I knew what all of those settings did. I'd just play with all of them and see what helps and what hurts.

it seems like lowering the Low & high greens gets rid of the greenish puke tint this set originally exibits in custom mode out of the box. that i always knew, but raising and lowering the High and low blue's seems to help as well, basically whitening the dirty whites in Warm2(that or i'd plunk it in warm 1, but warm 1's color doesnt seem quite warm enough) and correcting the greenish yellows and making them more towards the orange side, with the picture overall looking more neutral as opposed to looking greenish yellow.

My CRT also seems to have red's that have a slight orange tinge to them which i prefer over the S60's Rosey reds, that's another i'd like to figure out how to tinker with.

Do you guys set your Warm to 1 or 2? I feel that warm 1 produces more realistic blues, where as warm 2 makes a blue sky look reddish. Still playing around with both
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post #6491 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 02:59 AM
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Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

it seems like lowering the Low & high greens gets rid of the greenish puke tint this set originally exibits in custom mode out of the box. that i always knew, but raising and lowering the High and low blue's seems to help as well, basically whitening the dirty whites in Warm2(that or i'd plunk it in warm 1, but warm 1's color doesnt seem quite warm enough) and correcting the greenish yellows and making them more towards the orange side, with the picture overall looking more neutral as opposed to looking greenish yellow.

My CRT also seems to have red's that have a slight orange tinge to them which i prefer over the S60's Rosey reds, that's another i'd like to figure out how to tinker with.

Do you guys set your Warm to 1 or 2? I feel that warm 1 produces more realistic blues, where as warm 2 makes a blue sky look reddish. Still playing around with both

How do you simultaneously raise and lower the blue white balance adjustments? Or did you mean raise the High and lower the Low?

I'm finding getting the balance of this tv a bit frustrating between trying to manage the noise and get the colors right. Every setting effects another one...so when I use one of Fairchilds as a base, but have to adjust the gamma a bit lower to get the blacks to not crush and have to lower the brightness a bit to manage the dithering...the color is then thrown off a bit.

I don't care about having a super-bright image over-all, but I'm getting a lot of black crush/loss of shadow detail in the recommended settings of contrast around 80, brightness around 0 and gamma at 2.4. I've had to raise the gamma to 2.2, it's much better in some aspects, but slightly more washed out in brighter scenes. The Cnet calibration uses 2.2, but has the panel brightness on Low, which I can't use because it increases dithering to unwatchable amounts. I'm also noticing a general loss of color fidelity and a "mottled" appearance in low lit scenes. Some aspects of this tv look amazing, while others have me wondering if I have a bum set. I'm mostly watching streamed content though, so that could be part of the issue.

As for the green tint...I lowered the High green to -4 and the Low green to -6. This is using Fairchilds settings linked in his sig...the second set of them that uses the 2.4 gamma, but I use 2.2. He also refers to another set of calibrations that he says still work, but they aren't listed there. All I found was a really early on calibration that doesn't change things too drastically, color wise, from defaults. I found these to be so bad I couldn't believe it was a calibration. In the post he said that he had trouble getting it to calibrate, so not sure if that's the one that was being referenced as still good or not?
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post #6492 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 03:32 AM
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My issues with the S60 aside from being very dim, is that it has a bit of a flat picture. the grooves in clothing, objects and shadows are too light, or are on the light side which ends up making the picture look as if it lacks sculpt/definition. raising the black extension to 5 helps, but then you're artificially darkening other things that don't quite look right. it gives you an idea though.

I've been tinkering with my S60 all night trying to get the colors similar to my FD sony wega crt and for the most part i have succeeded! The green saturation needs to be knocked back practically all the way down to -50, or around that. I got the reds looking less 'rosey' and slightly more orange(like my CRT, that's the way i like it), added more saturation to the reds and knocked the Low Blue all the way to -50 to match the blues on my CRT. Getting rid of the greenish pukey hue involves pushing back both the High and low green, to about -10 for each, going back too much will result in the picture looking too red ect ect.

And the AGC is a real pain to use....I can't find a winning combination when using it with Black extension. :P I'm at a point now where i'd rather watch movies on my CRT until i make the switch to either the 8500 or H7000....the dim picture is really killing a lot of movie experiences for me that were super contrasty, had sculpt and looked vibrant and alive on my previous CRT's....Mirror mask looks lifeless on bluray. Even using the AGC at lets say 7 can't get to the brightness that i like....It's a nice step up over '0' but then you have to deal with a artifical-ish looking picture, inaccurate color(which you have to reduce) and using the BE is either too light or too dark.

Also, knocking brightness to LOW helps darken those light grooves, shadows(ect) that i mentioned previously, but then the picture looks wayyyyy too dim. MED is the sweet spot. And gamma differs on size for the S60, they say the 60" for example should be set to 2.4(which is REALLY closer to 2.2)

and if i were you i'd max the contrast on this baby, and plunk brightness at -3. I can't deal with it at 80, this set is already dim as it is. tongue.gif
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post #6493 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

My issues with the S60 aside from being very dim, is that it has a bit of a flat picture. the grooves in clothing, objects and shadows are too light, or are on the light side which ends up making the picture look as if it lacks sculpt/definition. raising the black extension to 5 helps, but then you're artificially darkening other things that don't quite look right. it gives you an idea though.

I've been tinkering with my S60 all night trying to get the colors similar to my FD sony wega crt and for the most part i have succeeded! The green saturation needs to be knocked back practically all the way down to -50, or around that. I got the reds looking less 'rosey' and slightly more orange(like my CRT, that's the way i like it), added more saturation to the reds and knocked the Low Blue all the way to -50 to match the blues on my CRT. Getting rid of the greenish pukey hue involves pushing back both the High and low green, to about -10 for each, going back too much will result in the picture looking too red ect ect.

And the AGC is a real pain to use....I can't find a winning combination when using it with Black extension. :P I'm at a point now where i'd rather watch movies on my CRT until i make the switch to either the 8500 or H7000....the dim picture is really killing a lot of movie experiences for me that were super contrasty, had sculpt and looked vibrant and alive on my previous CRT's....Mirror mask looks lifeless on bluray. Even using the AGC at lets say 7 can't get to the brightness that i like....It's a nice step up over '0' but then you have to deal with a artifical-ish looking picture, inaccurate color(which you have to reduce) and using the BE is either too light or too dark.

Also, knocking brightness to LOW helps darken those light grooves, shadows(ect) that i mentioned previously, but then the picture looks wayyyyy too dim. MED is the sweet spot. And gamma differs on size for the S60, they say the 60" for example should be set to 2.4(which is REALLY closer to 2.2)

and if i were you i'd max the contrast on this baby, and plunk brightness at -3. I can't deal with it at 80, this set is already dim as it is. tongue.gif

eek.gif


Seriously? I'm using CNETS Cinema mode settings with some minor tweaking and it has excellent picture detail, definition and color accuracy. Read the reviews. I've had two plasmas and since I have a room with controlled lighting, they don't look much dimmer then my LCD. If you keep trying to adjust your display so it performs similar to an LCD, your picture settings will never provide you with the best picture quality.


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post #6494 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 02:06 PM
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eek.gif


Seriously? I'm using CNETS Cinema mode settings with some minor tweaking and it has excellent picture detail, definition and color accuracy. Read the reviews. I've had two plasmas and since I have a room with controlled lighting, they don't look much dimmer then my LCD. If you keep trying to adjust your display so it performs similar to an LCD, your picture settings will never provide you with the best picture quality.


Ian


I've tried CNET's cinema mode settings, and the picture looks, dim, flat & lifeless(Perhaps this has something to do with the greyscale not calibrated? i have no idea), i'm just too used to the contrasty pop of CRT...This has been the same exact problem i've had with every single panasonic(mind you they were always mid range entry levels)plasma i've owned over the years. My settings? Are a big step up, at least in my eyes. i finallly got the color & whites looking similar to my CRT last night which makes me pretty darn happy. Still doesn't have the darker shadows, ridges and grooves in clothing, objects(ect) of my wega even when i dim down the picture to the S60's level of brightness to match it. I like a contrasty picture and you just can't get that with the S60, nor can you get the sculpt, at least with a set that hasn't been calibrated. Shadows,grooves and what have you are lighter, which creates a flatter image. Lowering the brightness to low improves on this, but then the picture is just fatally dim haha.

"I've had two plasmas and since i have a room with controlled lighting, they don't look much dimmer then my LCD"

Really? i find this hard to believe, that or your LCD is a dim set. I've owned a couple LCD's, the LK450(terrible blacks and motion) but the brightness was absolutely amazing on that set, of course i only had the brightness at about 60-70% when watching movies which was bright enough, your eyes would pop out of your skull if you watched movies with contrast to 100 on that sucker, nobody in their right mind would do that unless you're watching content in a super bright room. Either way, the blur and grey blacks made viewing material unwatchable.

I just want a set that can get close to being bright as my CRT and that has great motion, and the 8500 and H7000 look to be it.

I'm currently tinkering with the AGC and BE for movies, trying to find a decent combination with the two.


BTW CNET's cinema settings are a bit iffy, the picture has too much of a yelllowish green tint going on, the blues are slightly desaturated, and the whites are on the dirty side making Blue skies look redish(ect) since since they barely did anything with the high blues ect ect. Still, who knows if my FD wega is even perfectly accurate in color, to my eyes it looks pretty fantastic and far more natural, amazing actually and it's what i've been using for years(since 2005) with disappointing HDTV's bought along the way, which all started back in 2011. tongue.gif
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post #6495 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 03:15 PM
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To be honest with you Waveboy, based on your tastes, except for maybe gaming, you would probably be happier with an LCD. I've been watching plasma TV's for nearly 5 years now and I love the PQ of the S60.


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post #6496 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 03:31 PM
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To be honest with you Waveboy, based on your tastes, except for maybe gaming, you would probably be happier with an LCD. I've been watching plasma TV's for nearly 5 years now and I love the PQ of the S60.


Ian wink.gif


Based on my tastes, i'm better off with CRT.tongue.gif like i've pointed out many times the motion smearing nature of LCD's completely put me off. I'm sure some of these higher end 2014 LEDs may actually bust out some pretty decent black levels, but even with back light scanning enabled which reduces blur, will probably knock down the brightness by a land slide which ends up probably being dimmer than a run of the mill plasma, or at least on par...Not too sure, but i'll wait for reviews. As far as LED goes, I have my eye on the Vizio M series, normally i'd go with the P series, but it's 4k....And 720p & 1080p content will look worse when being blown up to that resolution. 8500 & H7000 are the only two plasma's i'd ever buy, it's just a matter of finding out if the input lag can get to around 35ms on either set at this point. i'd totaly take one of those over the M series no question. After all they have super contrast, which can get almost as bright as an LED and better motion than the S60, PLUS 3D.
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post #6497 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 06:58 PM
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What about getting it calibrated by a pro.i personally would only do it if it came with a few yrs warranty.Or phone a tv repair shop and see if they could set it up for a small price.That would depend on how qualified the person is.Even pro calibrated you'll find something..Tvs are just about perfect at times ,but when abl is high it affects the picture.Just like cable tv it looks great often,but sit close to tv with a poor picture quality program with lots of cable compression and it shows.
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post #6498 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 07:30 PM
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The 1080p pixel direct is...what exactly?
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post #6499 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 08:26 PM
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What about getting it calibrated by a pro.i personally would only do it if it came with a few yrs warranty.Or phone a tv repair shop and see if they could set it up for a small price.That would depend on how qualified the person is.Even pro calibrated you'll find something..Tvs are just about perfect at times ,but when abl is high it affects the picture.Just like cable tv it looks great often,but sit close to tv with a poor picture quality program with lots of cable compression and it shows.

I don't think a pro calibration would be worth it seeing as how there's a pretty solid chance i'll be upgrading to the 8500, or even the H7000 this year OR a 1080p LED. :P
Perhaps the lighter shadows, clothing grooves(ect ect) appears lighter on my 60" S60 because i have gamma set to 2.4(which is actually closer to 2.2 on the 60" where as selecting 2.6 is around 2.4) and brightness set to MED? Maybe my CRT's gamma is actually slightly higher than 2.4. I wouldn't mind finding out the true gamma on my 27" Sony wega, then i could get a better of why things appear lighter on the S60.
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post #6500 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 09:03 PM
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I don't think a pro calibration would be worth it seeing as how there's a pretty solid chance i'll be upgrading to the 8500, or even the H7000 this year OR a 1080p LED. :P
Perhaps the lighter shadows, clothing grooves(ect ect) appears lighter on my 60" S60 because i have gamma set to 2.4(which is actually closer to 2.2 on the 60" where as selecting 2.6 is around 2.4) and brightness set to MED? Maybe my CRT's gamma is actually slightly higher than 2.4. I wouldn't mind finding out the true gamma on my 27" Sony wega, then i could get a better of why things appear lighter on the S60.

Also, the bigger the screen the lower the luminance output. (My set's only a 50''). A pro calibration won't brighten the picture or reduce the ABL. You can't change the technology. The 8500 is as close as you will get to LCD levels, however, it will cost you a pretty penny.


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post #6501 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 09:07 PM
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The 1080p pixel direct is...what exactly?

4:4:4

It used to have ringing when turned on, rendering it useless, but with current firmware, it seems to be fixed with little issues, so I use it when I use my S60 with my HTPC. (ok, more like a gaming PC biggrin.gif )
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post #6502 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 09:13 PM
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Also, the bigger the screen the lower the luminance output. (My set's only a 50''). A pro calibration won't brighten the picture or reduce the ABL. You can't change the technology, but the 8500 is as close as you will get to LCD levels. However, it will cost you a pretty penny.


Ian

I didn't buy the F8500 not because I didn't have enough fund, but because of input lag. I'm still hoping for the H7000 to reduce input lag and once that is done, I will be selling my S60 right away for the H7000. I consider the F8500 to be 100% fullfilling direct replacement for my CRTs. My Panny is about 80%. My Sony Trinitron BVM still puts out wicked picture, so it's really hard for any modern plasmas and LCDs to really defeat it in combination of PQ, input lag, and motion performance.
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post #6503 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 09:34 PM
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I didn't buy the F8500 not because I didn't have enough fund, but because of input lag. I'm still hoping for the H7000 to reduce input lag and once that is done, I will be selling my S60 right away for the H7000. I consider the F8500 to be 100% fullfilling direct replacement for my CRTs. My Panny is about 80%. My Sony Trinitron BVM still puts out wicked picture, so it's really hard for any modern plasmas and LCDs to really defeat it in combination of PQ, input lag, and motion performance.

I thought I was having this conversation with Waveboy. confused.gif Are you following me? biggrin.gif


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post #6504 of 7068 Old 02-28-2014, 10:54 PM
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I thought I was having this conversation with Waveboy. confused.gif Are you following me? biggrin.gif


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Haha, I bet Waveboy is in complete agreement with my reply that's why I replied. biggrin.gif
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post #6505 of 7068 Old 03-01-2014, 12:24 AM
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Haha, I bet Waveboy is in complete agreement with my reply that's why I replied. biggrin.gif


You know it. wink.giftongue.gif

And you know, I wish this entire HDTV ordeal of mine which started back in 2011 never of happened. I WISH i would of just stuck with my 32" Wega CRT SDTV(using component cables instead. I now have the 27" version for retro purposes + dvd's) because i refused to game and even watch a lot of movies on the LCD's and plasma's i've owned throughout these last 3 years...If there's anything good that came out of it it would be that it's basically made me a lot more knowledgeable about input lag and the streangths and weakness of both LCD & Plasma. But it's caused me to miss out on a lot of movies and video games during that span. Thank goody i now have a 27" CRT on the side which i use the most anyways. I find it hard to appreciate movies on the S60 because of it's dim nature.

Anyhoo, I booted up Coraline today on Bluray Vs the DVD version on my CRT(using component cables) and Coraline looked extremely contrasty with piercing beautiful bright whites, the picture looked alive. Where as on the S60 it was just lifeless in comparison....dreary to be exact, and it's frustrating because i regret buying the bloody thing now. I'll still watch blurays on it, but i'm not that tempteed to, to be honest. Raising the AGC just makes the picture look artificial and burns out color detail and ends up making skin look plastic-ish. So instead of OCDing about it and trying to combine it with raising the BE i've just turned them both off, and plunked the gamma to 2.6(which is around 2.4 on my 60") for more sculpt in the image.

The Vizio M series, the Sony W950B and Samsung 7000H plasma are my only hope at this point. tongue.gif For now, i'm just going to stick with my CRT for DVD, VHS, Wii & retro gaming purposes and use the S60 for the Wii U and Bluray, but eh...I'm not too thrilled to plunge into either with this dim dud when i know i could be getting a much brighter experience. wink.gif It's funny though, certain bluray content looks bright. I was surprised by how contrasty the incredible melting man's(bluray) picture was, while others look fatally dim on the S60. If you are used to watching movies on a CRT with a contrasty picture the S60 is NOT a good replacement.....it's just a good replacement if you've been buying nothing but the lowest entry/bottom of the barrel panasonic 1080p sets. I will say, the S60 CRIPPLES the S30. The S30 was a disgrace, worst plasma i've ever owned bare none! eek!
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post #6506 of 7068 Old 03-01-2014, 03:25 AM
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Originally Posted by WaveBoy View Post

You know it. wink.giftongue.gif

And you know, I wish this entire HDTV ordeal of mine which started back in 2011 never of happened. I WISH i would of just stuck with my 32" Wega CRT SDTV(using component cables instead. I now have the 27" version for retro purposes + dvd's) because i refused to game and even watch a lot of movies on the LCD's and plasma's i've owned throughout these last 3 years...If there's anything good that came out of it it would be that it's basically made me a lot more knowledgeable about input lag and the streangths and weakness of both LCD & Plasma. But it's caused me to miss out on a lot of movies and video games during that span. Thank goody i now have a 27" CRT on the side which i use the most anyways. I find it hard to appreciate movies on the S60 because of it's dim nature.

Anyhoo, I booted up Coraline today on Bluray Vs the DVD version on my CRT(using component cables) and Coraline looked extremely contrasty with piercing beautiful bright whites, the picture looked alive. Where as on the S60 it was just lifeless in comparison....dreary to be exact, and it's frustrating because i regret buying the bloody thing now. I'll still watch blurays on it, but i'm not that tempteed to, to be honest. Raising the AGC just makes the picture look artificial and burns out color detail and ends up making skin look plastic-ish. So instead of OCDing about it and trying to combine it with raising the BE i've just turned them both off, and plunked the gamma to 2.6(which is around 2.4 on my 60") for more sculpt in the image.

The Vizio M series, the Sony W950B and Samsung 7000H plasma are my only hope at this point. tongue.gif For now, i'm just going to stick with my CRT for DVD, VHS, Wii & retro gaming purposes and use the S60 for the Wii U and Bluray, but eh...I'm not too thrilled to plunge into either with this dim dud when i know i could be getting a much brighter experience. wink.gif It's funny though, certain bluray content looks bright. I was surprised by how contrasty the incredible melting man's(bluray) picture was, while others look fatally dim on the S60. If you are used to watching movies on a CRT with a contrasty picture the S60 is NOT a good replacement.....it's just a good replacement if you've been buying nothing but the lowest entry/bottom of the barrel panasonic 1080p sets. I will say, the S60 CRIPPLES the S30. The S30 was a disgrace, worst plasma i've ever owned bare none! eek!

From now on, you shall never be vindicated for calling your S60 'dim'. biggrin.gif Mailiang has kindly shared us ABL informations on the S60 and the ST60 he got from Lee of Televisioninfo and I was right. At 5% ABL, the S60 has 132.65 cd/m2, the ST60 has 154.21 cd/m2, but at 100%, the S60 falls down to 25.58 cd/m2 while the ST60 keeps 43.63 cd/m2. Today, I went to a TV store and took a good look at the plasmas again, and the ST60 certaily was brighter than the S60. Too bad about the F8500 though, it's actually dimmer than when I first saw it back in May. Curse that Samsung firmware! Thank goodness its ABL was left untouched though. Either way, when I actually read this ABL falloff data for the S60, I was surprised in two ways. First, the S60 has FAR less luminance than I thought it would. Second, the fact that the Sony W950a's Motionflow Impulse STILL lost to the S60 in brightness. biggrin.gif:D:D I think it has more to do with perceived contrast ratio though. I bet that poor Sony LCD will actually feel a lot dimmer if only allowed 90 cd/m2 of brightness. Its mediocre black will make it feel much dimmer than it actually is. In that sense, I'm actually amazed with my Panasonic S60 for doing so much more with so little brightness. I'm now a firm believer in black level. biggrin.gif
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post #6507 of 7068 Old 03-01-2014, 01:16 PM
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Sorry it took so long for me to get back on this, but I finally managed to install the new 2.211 drivers this evening, and it looks like the edge-enhancement in the 1080p Pixel Direct feature is either greatly diminished, or completely gone after the installation.


However, when I turn 1080p Pixel Direct on, it also seems to be adding a noticeable green push to my HDMI YCbCr 4:4:4 source (a Sony Blu-ray player in this case). This is on HDMI input #1 btw. I can eliminate the green push though by switching my Blu-ray player's output to RGB. The 1080p Pixel Direct feature works with both the RGB and YCbCr 4:4:4 color modes on my player. It does not work with YCbCr 4:2:2 though.


If I turn the 1080p Pixel Direct feature OFF, then the green push also disappears in the YCbCr 4:4:4 mode. So the problem appears to be in that feature on the display, rather than in the player. (Or so it would seem.)


What does this feature do btw?... It looks like it might be switching the display's sub-pixel rendering off and on.

Sorry I'm a bit late on this too, but I greatly appreciate the info. I finally upgraded the firmware and indeed the edge-enhancement in 1080p direct mode appears to be gone. I'm not getting a green push, though I fully expect to have to slightly adjust my greyscale going from 4:2:2 to 4:4:4 (though there doesn't overtly appear to be much of a greyscale shift). My player is a Sony BDP-S1100. I prefer to use 1080p direct because I find the color done entirely in the player is a little better and more accurate than the TV doing it fed 4:2:2. The results probably depend on how good the player's 4:4:4 conversion is vs. the TV's ability to convert 4:2:2 or 4:2:0.

Edit: I would also say the picture seems to be a bit more dynamic and clear running in 1080p direct mode, so I definitely recommend using it. The blacks also seems slightly darker after I re-calibrated black level, though it's unclear whether this is due to the firmware upgrade or the 1080p direct mode itself. At any rate, I feel the overall image quality has improved by about 5-10%. Not huge but worth doing for sure, IMO.
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post #6508 of 7068 Old 03-01-2014, 01:17 PM
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If anyone wants to update the firmware, you can download it and the instructions here for free:

http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model/tc-p50s60?t=downloads&support
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post #6509 of 7068 Old 03-02-2014, 02:14 AM
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From now on, you shall never be vindicated for calling your S60 'dim'. biggrin.gif Mailiang has kindly shared us ABL informations on the S60 and the ST60 he got from Lee of Televisioninfo and I was right. At 5% ABL, the S60 has 132.65 cd/m2, the ST60 has 154.21 cd/m2, but at 100%, the S60 falls down to 25.58 cd/m2 while the ST60 keeps 43.63 cd/m2. Today, I went to a TV store and took a good look at the plasmas again, and the ST60 certaily was brighter than the S60. Too bad about the F8500 though, it's actually dimmer than when I first saw it back in May. Curse that Samsung firmware! Thank goodness its ABL was left untouched though. Either way, when I actually read this ABL falloff data for the S60, I was surprised in two ways. First, the S60 has FAR less luminance than I thought it would. Second, the fact that the Sony W950a's Motionflow Impulse STILL lost to the S60 in brightness. biggrin.gif:D:D I think it has more to do with perceived contrast ratio though. I bet that poor Sony LCD will actually feel a lot dimmer if only allowed 90 cd/m2 of brightness. Its mediocre black will make it feel much dimmer than it actually is. In that sense, I'm actually amazed with my Panasonic S60 for doing so much more with so little brightness. I'm now a firm believer in black level. biggrin.gif

Intresting, yet i didn't realise that my already dim S60 plummets to 25.58 cd/m2 when ABL is kicking in at 100%, holy batman that's bad! So much for picture stability, then again there is NO such thing as PQ stability in the world of HDTV's, CRT is the only tech as of now that has it. Weather you're dealing with ABL, motion blur(+dithering) and viewing angles, Plasma and LCD/LED have got them.

Just a quick question, how do you think the M & P Vizio series will stack up against the S60's motion when both of their back light scanning features are enabled? Apperantly the E series is 5x worse(when not enabled it's naturally 10x worse...) than a plasma when Backlight scanning is enabled, which is...well, extremely disappointing unless you've grown accustomed to LED/LCD. The E series is also capable of 300Lits, and gets knocked down to 150 once you enable the back light scanning. The E series aint for me, and i doubt the M series will be either as i'm guessing the motion handeling will only be a little better than the E series....
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post #6510 of 7068 Old 03-02-2014, 09:05 AM
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I've tried CNET's cinema mode settings, and the picture looks, dim, flat & lifeless(Perhaps this has something to do with the greyscale not calibrated? i have no idea), i'm just too used to the contrasty pop of CRT...This has been the same exact problem i've had with every single panasonic(mind you they were always mid range entry levels)plasma i've owned over the years. My settings? Are a big step up, at least in my eyes. i finallly got the color & whites looking similar to my CRT last night which makes me pretty darn happy. Still doesn't have the darker shadows, ridges and grooves in clothing, objects(ect) of my wega even when i dim down the picture to the S60's level of brightness to match it. I like a contrasty picture and you just can't get that with the S60, nor can you get the sculpt, at least with a set that hasn't been calibrated. Shadows,grooves and what have you are lighter, which creates a flatter image. Lowering the brightness to low improves on this, but then the picture is just fatally dim haha.

Have you tried upgrading the firmware and using 1080p direct mode? I'm finding the picture is bit more dynamic and pleasing. Also, have you tried the 2.2 gamma setting (instead of the recommended 2.4 for the 60" model)? I lowered mine from 2.6 to 2.4 (on the 50" model), re-calibrated black level, upped to the contrast a few ticks and it gave me better and more natural shadow detail/shading without sacrificing too much depth.
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