Official Panasonic S60 Series Discussion Thread - Page 238 - AVS Forum
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post #7111 of 7199 Old 08-14-2014, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by traps View Post
Is this a normal occurrence on these sets? One column has yellow pixels and one column has purple pixels. Pictures are in this thread.

Panasonic S64 at Costco
Yes, it's how the display is driven. lots of little lights and they blend colors to make others.


65vt60 cell phone shot of white broadcast
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post #7112 of 7199 Old 08-14-2014, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post
There have been other people here who bought "New In Box" Panasonics from Sears Outlet only to discover they weren't really new and were either returns or display units with hundred of hours on them.

Did you check the TV's Hours when you first got it? Was it zero?



.
Yep it was zero and untouched I guess it was sitting back in the warehouse manufacturing date is October 2013.
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post #7113 of 7199 Old 08-14-2014, 08:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by traps View Post
Yep it was zero and untouched I guess it was sitting back in the warehouse manufacturing date is October 2013.
Wow, that's a great score !

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post #7114 of 7199 Old 08-14-2014, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whipit View Post
Yes, it's how the display is driven. lots of little lights and they blend colors to make others.


65vt60 cell phone shot of white broadcast
Attachment 212417 Attachment 212441
Do you guys wear magnifying glasses when watching these sets?


Ian
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post #7115 of 7199 Old 08-14-2014, 10:52 PM
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Originally Posted by whipit View Post
Yes, it's how the display is driven. lots of little lights and they blend colors to make others.


65vt60 cell phone shot of white broadcast
Attachment 212417 Attachment 212441
I have a lead on a s64. What should I look for? What is a good price?

Better to just buy a new Samsung plasma 5300?

Thanks
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post #7116 of 7199 Old 08-15-2014, 06:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Reed View Post
I have a lead on a s64. What should I look for? What is a good price?

Better to just buy a new Samsung plasma 5300?

Thanks
It depends. Which size? The S64 came in two sizes. New? Used? Floor model? Individual? How many hours (details on how, see page 1)? How much are you willing to pay? I own the 65" S64, which I bought at Sam's for $1288 new, which was down from the retail price of about $1500 IIRC. The sets later dropped $150 and the floor model sold for $900-something. I may have posted details in this thread last August or September. Hopefully this gives you some information to help with your decision.

As for the F5300, there are several threads for that set, so you can ask questions about it there. My understanding is that it is a good set. Unless you're getting a good deal on a used S64 with few hours on it, say, less than 3000 or so, I'd go with a new Samsung F5300. Just be aware that the 60" F5300 has a pentile display, the 51" and 64" sets apparently do not, but the 64" F5300 is not easy to find in stores from what I have read and experienced in my area. Pentile displays aren't necessarily bad, but some people do not like them because they can look more "pixelated" or have a "screen door" look to them. The folks in the thread can help you out, but there is a lot of info about this and the set in general over there.

Good luck!
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post #7117 of 7199 Old 08-15-2014, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToonMasterTim View Post
It depends. Which size? The S64 came in two sizes. New? Used? Floor model? Individual? How many hours (details on how, see page 1)? How much are you willing to pay? I own the 65" S64, which I bought at Sam's for $1288 new, which was down from the retail price of about $1500 IIRC. The sets later dropped $150 and the floor model sold for $900-something. I may have posted details in this thread last August or September. Hopefully this gives you some information to help with your decision.

As for the F5300, there are several threads for that set, so you can ask questions about it there. My understanding is that it is a good set. Unless you're getting a good deal on a used S64 with few hours on it, say, less than 3000 or so, I'd go with a new Samsung F5300. Just be aware that the 60" F5300 has a pentile display, the 51" and 64" sets apparently do not, but the 64" F5300 is not easy to find in stores from what I have read and experienced in my area. Pentile displays aren't necessarily bad, but some people do not like them because they can look more "pixelated" or have a "screen door" look to them. The folks in the thread can help you out, but there is a lot of info about this and the set in general over there.

Good luck!
And the 60" suffers from a pink hue issue as well. If the S64 is a 64", and in the hour range Tim said, get it. It is a much better TV.

Last edited by dmtaub; 08-18-2014 at 11:16 AM.
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post #7118 of 7199 Old 08-16-2014, 07:00 AM
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Originally Posted by RandyWalters View Post
Wow, that's a great score !
Yeah thanks I ended up returning the 60 inch LG plasma I got even though I downgraded in size picture quality is much better plus I only sit 7-8 feet so 50" is plenty.

I made a mistake I did order from Sears Outlet but it didn't come from the outlet. I clicked on Non-Outlet items so it was actually from a Sears Department store you have to put in your zip code and see what's in stock in your area I saw a P55ST60 on there for $899 also new and it was gone in less then a day after being listed.
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post #7119 of 7199 Old 08-16-2014, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by traps View Post
Yeah thanks I ended up returning the 60 inch LG plasma I got even though I downgraded in size picture quality is much better plus I only sit 7-8 feet so 50" is plenty.

I made a mistake I did order from Sears Outlet but it didn't come from the outlet. I clicked on Non-Outlet items so it was actually from a Sears Department store you have to put in your zip code and see what's in stock in your area I saw a P55ST60 on there for $899 also new and it was gone in less then a day after being listed.
It seems like they are clearing out their old inventory. They will need to re-stock for the upcoming holiday season and Fall. When I think about it, late last November Sears had the P50S60 on sale for $599.00 which also included delivery and set up. What amazes me is that they still have new models of a set that was discontinued nearly eight months ago.


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post #7120 of 7199 Old 08-16-2014, 05:36 PM
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If i had the disposable funds. I would track down one of these S60 or ST60 units... even if it was only a 50" and just keep it as a spare, or put it in my bedroom and piss off my wife for mounting a ginormous tv 7" from our pillows.

There will NOT be an equivalently nice tv in terms of PQ for the dollar as these Panasonic units for a very long time.. Even if and when OLED becomes dominant and surpasses plasma in terms of PQ, highly doubt you'll be able to buy a 50" OLED of any quality for $600 in the next decade.
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post #7121 of 7199 Old 08-18-2014, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasondjulian View Post
If i had the disposable funds. I would track down one of these S60 or ST60 units... even if it was only a 50" and just keep it as a spare, or put it in my bedroom and piss off my wife for mounting a ginormous tv 7" from our pillows.

There will NOT be an equivalently nice tv in terms of PQ for the dollar as these Panasonic units for a very long time.. Even if and when OLED becomes dominant and surpasses plasma in terms of PQ, highly doubt you'll be able to buy a 50" OLED of any quality for $600 in the next decade.
That is why I am babying this set. Hopefully it lasts 6-10 years for me!
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post #7122 of 7199 Old 08-18-2014, 01:23 PM
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That is why I am babying this set. Hopefully it lasts 6-10 years for me!
Then I guess you'll be 'milking' it for all it's worth.


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post #7123 of 7199 Old 08-18-2014, 02:50 PM
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That is why I am babying this set. Hopefully it lasts 6-10 years for me!

Yes, I'm definitely babying mine for this reason. I just fear it breaking and being irreplaceable.
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post #7124 of 7199 Old 08-19-2014, 12:23 PM
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Yes, I'm definitely babying mine for this reason. I just fear it breaking and being irreplaceable.

Yeah I bought the Squaretrade but knowing that if it dies and the repair guy cant fix it I will have to shop around for something different.
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post #7125 of 7199 Old 08-21-2014, 07:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post
Do you guys wear magnifying glasses when watching these sets?


Ian
I have another issue I noticed and it's dithering. I notice red/green "snow" on black/dark gray scenes. When it's pure black there is no dithering it mainly happens on lighter black/darker gray scenes. I noticed it when watching Gravity on blu-ray and sitting 8 feet away I can't notice but when I moved up to ~5 feet I could notice the image is not as clean and smooth looking as it was watching on a Samsung LED tv. The colors, contrast, and everything else is better on Plasma but its not as "smooth" or clean looking. I have about 60 hours on it. I tried different hdmi cable and hdmi 2 input and still the same thing. I noticed when I put brightness on -2 that the dithering almost disappears entirely but I lose detail in dark scenes. I am using cnets settings.

They said they had 130 hours on their display before applying the settings but that there was no need to break it in similarly so I waiting about half the hours.

-Picture menu
Picture mode: Cinema
Contrast: 83
Brightness: 0
Color: 50
Tint: 0
Sharpness: 0
Color temp: Warm 2
Vivid Color: Off
C.A.T.S.: Off
Video NR: Off
MPEG NR: Off

-- Pro settings submenu
Panel brightness: Low
AGC: 0
Black extension: 0
Color Gamut: Normal

W/B detail adjustment menu:
W/B high R: -4
W/B high G: -2
W/B high B: 0
W/B low R: 0
W/B low G: 0
W/B low B: -6

Color detail adjustment menu:
Red hue: -1
Red Saturation: 5
Red luminance: -8
Green hue: 4
Green Saturation: -9
Green luminance: -4
Blue hue: 3
Blue Saturation: 30
Blue luminance: -10

Gamma detail adjustment menu:
Gamma: 2.2

--Advanced picture submenu
Game mode: Off
24p Direct in: 60Hz
3:2 pulldown: On [often grayed out depending on source]
1080p pixel direct: Off [often grayed out depending on source]
HDMI content type: [all Off]
HDMI/DVI RGB range: [all Standard (16-235)]
Black level: Light
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post #7126 of 7199 Old 08-21-2014, 08:58 PM
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There will always be some dithering near black on these TVs. It's the same on the Samsung plasmas (though perhaps a bit more noticeable on the Pannies, because they use more aggressive line dithering to deepen the blacks).

Panel Brightness in the Pro settings does have some effect on the amount of dithering near black. It's been awhile since I played with an S60, but I think the High Panel Brightness setting produced the most dithering noise near blacks. I think I used the middle setting.

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post #7127 of 7199 Old 08-21-2014, 09:39 PM
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Lightbulb CNET Settings

Quote:
Originally Posted by traps View Post
I have another issue I noticed and it's dithering. I notice red/green "snow" on black/dark gray scenes. When it's pure black there is no dithering it mainly happens on lighter black/darker gray scenes. I noticed it when watching Gravity on blu-ray and sitting 8 feet away I can't notice but when I moved up to ~5 feet I could notice the image is not as clean and smooth looking as it was watching on a Samsung LED tv. The colors, contrast, and everything else is better on Plasma but its not as "smooth" or clean looking. I have about 60 hours on it. I tried different hdmi cable and hdmi 2 input and still the same thing. I noticed when I put brightness on -2 that the dithering almost disappears entirely but I lose detail in dark scenes. I am using cnets settings.

They said they had 130 hours on their display before applying the settings but that there was no need to break it in similarly so I waiting about half the hours.
I use the CNET settings as well and although there is some normal dithering, it isn't an issue for me. I recommend using the default for color detail and white balance (0) since these adjustments are more critical and can vary from panel to panel. To set them correctly, you would need a test pattern and light meter. Try setting the color temp to warm 1 instead. It will reduce the red push which is common on these sets. After break-in you may also want to bump up the panel brightness to mid. As the set gets more hours on it, the pixels will settle down a bit, the PQ will improve, and there should be less noticeable artifacts.

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post #7128 of 7199 Old 08-22-2014, 04:45 PM
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Keeping a couple extra lights on in the room, especially behind or next to the display will also make the dithering near black harder to see.

If you're trying to watch these TVs in a completely dark room, then the dithering near black will stand out like a sore thumb.

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post #7129 of 7199 Old 08-23-2014, 09:28 PM
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Hey all, my son broke my 60" ST30 that I LOVED. Luckily, I just scored a brand new 65" S64 for $1299. 0 hours.

The unit and detailed image is gorgeous but I have tried the CNET, settings in this thread and settings on my own. In a DARK room with no windows, the image is dim, dull and definitely impressive unless I crank up the contrast to at least 88-92. There is just little no "brightness" to the image unless I go with that higher contrast.

Any ideas or am I missing something?

TV: Panasonic Plasma 65" TC-P65S64
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post #7130 of 7199 Old 08-23-2014, 09:47 PM
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I have spreadsheet that another member sent me with a bunch of different settings options. I'll send it over tomorrow when I get home.
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post #7131 of 7199 Old 08-23-2014, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmtaub View Post
I have spreadsheet that another member sent me with a bunch of different settings options. I'll send it over tomorrow when I get home.
Thank you! I am happy to try any settings but so far, the popular ones just look horrid on my set.

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post #7132 of 7199 Old 08-24-2014, 08:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dborgill View Post
Thank you! I am happy to try any settings but so far, the popular ones just look horrid on my set.
I assume you are using the cinema mode? What you are describing sounds more like standard. Avoid using the CNET color detail and white balance controls settings. Stick with the default (0) and set the color temp to warm 1. These settings are more critical, and can vary quite a bit from set to set. They should be done with a test pattern and light meter for proper calibration. Once the TV is broken in (150-200 hrs) set the panel brightness to mid.


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post #7133 of 7199 Old 08-24-2014, 10:41 AM
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I keep saying this but..... keep settings next to stock and then tweak by eye. Calibrate it to your eyes/brains liking-- not someone else's eyes/brian and not some fancy expensive gadgets/self proclaimed experts/certified experts who don't really know crap about your eyes/brain/perception.
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post #7134 of 7199 Old 08-24-2014, 12:25 PM
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^Not a bad thought.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dborgill View Post
Hey all, my son broke my 60" ST30 that I LOVED. Luckily, I just scored a brand new 65" S64 for $1299. 0 hours.

The unit and detailed image is gorgeous but I have tried the CNET, settings in this thread and settings on my own. In a DARK room with no windows, the image is dim, dull and definitely impressive unless I crank up the contrast to at least 88-92. There is just little no "brightness" to the image unless I go with that higher contrast.

Any ideas or am I missing something?
CNET did not review the 65S64, but they did publish their "dark room" settings for the TV here. The louvered filter on the S64 has little or no benefits in a dark room though, and may even reduce light output a bit esp. off-angle. You may get more benefits from the filter (and also deeper looking blacks) with some modest lighting behind and around the display. A lamp on either side would probably do the job. Some room lighting will also help to "hide" the dithering and image retention on darker screens.

The above link recommends a Contrast setting of 90. If you still feel the picture is too dim with that setting, then you can increase the Panel Brightness in the Pro Settings to the Middle setting (which was my preference on the S60), and you could also try using a lower Gamma setting to get more brightness from the TV.

You can also increase the Contrast above 90. But the higher you set Contrast, the more ABL you will probably get. Using higher Contrast and Panel Brightness settings will also increase the risks of burn-in when the TV is new.

Ian's suggestion of using Warm1 is also not a bad thought. CNET probably calibrates their TVs to D65 (6500K), which is technically more accurate. But it may look dull if you're used to a "cooler" looking picture with more blue in it. Switching from Warm2 to Warm1 will probably change the TV's color temp to around 7000-8000 Kelvins, which is a little cooler in appearance, and will give the whites a bit more "pop".

Cooler room lighting, which is closer to the color of daylight, will also help to bring out the color on the TV. 6500K lighting is too cool for my eyes at night, but something more in the 4000K-5000K range might be worth trying. At night, I usually keep a couple regular ~3000K incandescent lamps on in the room and use a subtle daylight fill behind my TV.

Last but not least, remember to re-check your basic Brightness setting after making any other picture changes to insure that reference black (Y'=16) screens are at the panel's MLL, with no visible dithering... to maintain max contrast on the display.

ADU

Last edited by ADU; 08-26-2014 at 08:49 PM.
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post #7135 of 7199 Old 08-26-2014, 12:27 PM
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^good stuff ADU

Quote:
Originally Posted by dborgill View Post
Hey all, my son broke my 60" ST30 that I LOVED. Luckily, I just scored a brand new 65" S64 for $1299. 0 hours.

The unit and detailed image is gorgeous but I have tried the CNET, settings in this thread and settings on my own. In a DARK room with no windows, the image is dim, dull and definitely impressive unless I crank up the contrast to at least 88-92. There is just little no "brightness" to the image unless I go with that higher contrast.

Any ideas or am I missing something?
Not saying you did, but many people start tweaking the "standard" (eco heavy) settings. You should immediately switch to Cinema.
I put in the Cnet it enjoyed it more by using to Warm1 and gamma to 2.0-2.2
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post #7136 of 7199 Old 08-28-2014, 10:20 AM
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Any opinion on a used 50" S60 for $350? It's a 15 minute drive away
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post #7137 of 7199 Old 08-28-2014, 10:48 AM
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The owner should be able to turn the set on to show you it is working. Verify that each input you wish to use (there are only 2 HDMI ports) is working. Check the screen for any scratches or IR, particularly station ID bugs, sports and news tickers, etc. and check the hours (see page 1 for instructions). Assuming you're happy with the price and quality of the TV, go for it. I don't know what the 50" set sold for originally, so I can't speak to the value. As for hours, obviously everyone's viewing habits vary, but after a year my S64 has just over 1800 hours on it, IIRC, which is an average of about 5 hrs per day...I really thought mine would be lower, but my wife hasn't been working and watches TV during the day.

Edit: Page 1 of this thread states that original retail for the 50" S60 was $899 ($829 at the time of the post), and it dropped lower. I'd say $350 is a good price, but examine it to be sure it is in good working condition first. Let us know what you decide.

Last edited by ToonMasterTim; 08-28-2014 at 10:58 AM. Reason: Adding price to the original post, which I had not included.
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post #7138 of 7199 Old 08-28-2014, 10:54 AM
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FYI for S60/S64 owners, a new firmware update is available.

http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model...s&support#tabs

Released 8/21/14 and "Improves System Stability" according to Panasonic.

I have had some app crashes with Netflix and YouTube recently, so I am hoping this addresses those problems. If we got some app updates (e.g. Hulu and Netflix) that would be sweet, but I don't expect that to be the case.

I will install it tonight if I have time. The Internet update option through the TV hasn't worked for me in the past so I intend to update my S64 via the flash drive method.
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post #7139 of 7199 Old 08-28-2014, 11:19 AM
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Thanks. I don't use any of those features as I have an Xbox 360 and an XBox ONE that have all of those apps but it is good to know.
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post #7140 of 7199 Old 08-28-2014, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToonMasterTim View Post
The owner should be able to turn the set on to show you it is working. Verify that each input you wish to use (there are only 2 HDMI ports) is working. Check the screen for any scratches or IR, particularly station ID bugs, sports and news tickers, etc. and check the hours (see page 1 for instructions). Assuming you're happy with the price and quality of the TV, go for it. I don't know what the 50" set sold for originally, so I can't speak to the value. As for hours, obviously everyone's viewing habits vary, but after a year my S64 has just over 1800 hours on it, IIRC, which is an average of about 5 hrs per day...I really thought mine would be lower, but my wife hasn't been working and watches TV during the day.

Edit: Page 1 of this thread states that original retail for the 50" S60 was $899 ($829 at the time of the post), and it dropped lower. I'd say $350 is a good price, but examine it to be sure it is in good working condition first. Let us know what you decide.
What he said! I paid $399 for my 50" S60 with 2200 hours on it. It had no IR or burn in, everything worked great, came with remote and stand, and since I bought it from a retailer, 15 day no questions asked return policy. For $350, assuming everything above is on par, go for it.

Also, if you are lucky, you can find a sears refurb for around $600 or on amazon for around $800, so $350 looks pretty good.

Last edited by dmtaub; 08-28-2014 at 12:13 PM.
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Reply Plasma Flat Panel Displays

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Panasonic Tc P65s60 65 Inch 1080p 600hz Plasma Hdtv , Panasonic 60 Inch Plasma Hdtv Tc P60s60 , Panasonic Tc P55s60 55 Inch 1080p 600hz Plasma Hdtv , Panasonic Tc P50s60 50 Inch Plasma Hdtv , Panasonic 42 Inch Plasma Hdtv Tc P42s60
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